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Block casting in 2018 has only gotten worst.
It’s 2018 and block casting is still a problem, if not, then it has only gotten worst. While ESO has made a tremendous amount of improvements over the years since day one, it’s still not at a point where builds can be diverse. All the potential is available, but block casting hinders diversification and player skill in PVP.
Since day one block casting has existed, however before there was maybe one or two players in cyrodiil at a time that utilized it. Four years later, whole Zerg balls of Dks, Templars, and wardens abuse block casting shamelessly.
Going through the threads you would be convinced that the general player base was ok with block casting and you maybe correct. To be honest even I have two block casting builds a stam warden and a mag DK, and I can even say for myself that I can see the seduction to use it. On my Stam warden when I reach execution range I hold block and use healing spores to replenish my health unmolested. On my DK most of my rotation can be used while blocking allowing me to deal maximum dps on another player with ease. In both instances I have improved my characters survivability at the cost of stamina but, no skill or strategy to be used. The pros and cons are imbalanced I can’t be CC’d, I take a reduction in damage, and the buff to block cost last patch has only made it better. Even though I can be dotted I still have burst heals that make the idea laughable.
Block casting is so effective most people in cyrodiil are using it. If you are one of those players not using block cast you are either skilled and or giving other players a handicap. Playing on XBox pvp Vivec campaign you could see whole Zerg balls running around mostly made up of block casting builds. You could argue that it is just a well put together team, but in reality it goes against ZOS’s intent for more spread out and skill based pvp. In reality these are one button warriors using each other as a crutch. They are still a Zerg.
If block cast remains I honestly don’t see eso becoming balanced, so it is time for block casting to go. If anything healers should be restricted from casting heals like breath of life while blocking in order to add more strategy to group play in cyrodiil.
I am writing this because I love eso and I would like to see eso grow, but I don’t see this block casting trend keeping PVP alive for much longer and all the day one players I know still play the game for pvp content. Most if not all pver’s I knew are gone. So it would be in ZOS’s best interest to give it an honest thought. Let’s be done with block casting once and for all.
Edited by Smithernest54 on March 7, 2018 4:43AM Since day one block casting has existed, however before there was maybe one or two players in cyrodiil at a time that utilized it. Four years later, whole Zerg balls of Dks, Templars, and wardens abuse block casting shamelessly.
Going through the threads you would be convinced that the general player base was ok with block casting and you maybe correct. To be honest even I have two block casting builds a stam warden and a mag DK, and I can even say for myself that I can see the seduction to use it. On my Stam warden when I reach execution range I hold block and use healing spores to replenish my health unmolested. On my DK most of my rotation can be used while blocking allowing me to deal maximum dps on another player with ease. In both instances I have improved my characters survivability at the cost of stamina but, no skill or strategy to be used. The pros and cons are imbalanced I can’t be CC’d, I take a reduction in damage, and the buff to block cost last patch has only made it better. Even though I can be dotted I still have burst heals that make the idea laughable.
Block casting is so effective most people in cyrodiil are using it. If you are one of those players not using block cast you are either skilled and or giving other players a handicap. Playing on XBox pvp Vivec campaign you could see whole Zerg balls running around mostly made up of block casting builds. You could argue that it is just a well put together team, but in reality it goes against ZOS’s intent for more spread out and skill based pvp. In reality these are one button warriors using each other as a crutch. They are still a Zerg.
If block cast remains I honestly don’t see eso becoming balanced, so it is time for block casting to go. If anything healers should be restricted from casting heals like breath of life while blocking in order to add more strategy to group play in cyrodiil.
I am writing this because I love eso and I would like to see eso grow, but I don’t see this block casting trend keeping PVP alive for much longer and all the day one players I know still play the game for pvp content. Most if not all pver’s I knew are gone. So it would be in ZOS’s best interest to give it an honest thought. Let’s be done with block casting once and for all.
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Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Didn't they just give nightblades, sorcs and DKs unblockable CC?
Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual18 -
Didn't they just give nightblades, sorcs and DKs unblockable CC?
Nightblades have fear, giving players a window to do damage, but if there are other healers in the group then it is for nothing. My point is pvp groups are full of healers and tanks with bombers on the side. There has got to be more to pvp than this.3 -
lazerlaz✭✭✭Didn't they just give nightblades, sorcs and DKs unblockable CC?
Yea but it's lack luster in terms of affect vs any decent block casting build nowadays. They just break free and have enough time during CC immunity to regen their stam for more block and break free.
Most of the time you don't have enough time to burst them down in such a short period of time between CC and break free. Especially when other enemies are around.
And even if you catch someone who is mag sword and shield the second they're in trouble with their stam pool they hit mist form.
Mist form is a whole other issue in and of itself.
I just hate how long the majority of fights take now in PvP or duels against sword and shield.
And it's cool if you're tanky or a healer.... But then you shouldnt be able to also have glass cannon like burst.
Just doesn't make any sense...
This game has gone from fast paced to snail paced in PvP.
ZoS always prided themselves is saying ESO has fast paced PVP combat... What the HECK happened?
Edited by lazerlaz on March 7, 2018 4:57AM4 -
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IZZEFlameLash✭✭✭✭✭
✭And take away block casting? Then what's a class like DK and Templar supposed to do? Blocking is already penalized enough when you do not invest heavily into block cost reductions and stacking with block cost enchant is no longer be the most efficient way to reduce the block cost. People do not block cast anymore because of 0 stam regen while blocking and if they do so and it is not on s/b, which penalizes your offensive capacity, then RIP them. Because they just are going to be out of resources soon.
Oh and yeah, unblockable ccs are there to use. Blocking is not as powerful as before. And people know it. I only see timed blocks being used in most cases when the opponent isn't using s/b (dks and templars are mostly forced into this as their main source of mitigation) for things like meteors and other ult dumps. Even in XvX, block casting is not really a thing. There's a reason why it is not really recommended to use block canceling often in both pve and pvp.Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel8 -
IZZESparkling wrote: »And take away block casting? Then what's a class like DK and Templar supposed to do? Blocking is already penalized enough when you do not invest heavily into block cost reductions and stacking with block cost enchant is no longer be the most efficient way to reduce the block cost. People do not block cast anymore because of 0 stam regen while blocking and if they do so and it is not on s/b, which penalizes your offensive capacity, then RIP them. Because they just are going to be out of resources soon.
Oh and yeah, unblockable ccs are there to use. Blocking is not as powerful as before. And people know it. I only see timed blocks being used in most cases when the opponent isn't using s/b (dks and templars are mostly forced into this as their main source of mitigation) for things like meteors and other ult dumps. Even in XvX, block casting is not really a thing. There's a reason why it is not really recommended to use block canceling often in both pve and pvp.
If Dks and Templars are “forced” into block casting it only proves my point. I play as a dk at times without block casting and it is do able. If people relied on block casting then what is the point of damage mitigation sets. On most of my classes that is what I normally use, damage mitigation or self healing. I use to play a heavily armor healer without block cast and still was effective, however I was killable. If you are a healer in a group then it is to your team to keep you alive, to take of pressure off you. However, at the games current state healers are more effective and almost unkillable that it is absent thought as a team to protect the healer. In fact healers and tanks are used as bait for bombs. Lastly I only said take away block casting, not blocking, so you can still block and be healed but you can’t heal yourself and your team.1 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sometimes you can tell from a post that the author spends more time parroting vague complaints on these forums rather than actually playing the game.Edited by Joy_Division on March 7, 2018 5:50AMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.26 -
There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.0
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Joy_Division wrote: »Sometimes you can tell from a post that the author spends more time parroting vague complaints on these forums rather than actually playing the game.
I am at work and got nothing else better to do. Lol0 -
DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.Vyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
Vir Cor | Stamina Dragonknight | DC
Latest Videos:
Magicka Dragonknight: Vyr Cor | "A Dragon's Fury" | Magicka Dragonknight PvP
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Youtube: CorGaming4 -
Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.
Templars are amazing healers and have ability to mitigate damage, dks don’t have great healing even though I have seen DK healers, but there is a reason Dk’s excel as tanks. However, that is why we are suppose to pay close attention to our builds, skill, and cp allocation. I am in a guild with some pretty amazing duelers most in which do not use or like block casting, there are people with DK and Templar builds that do not use block casting at all. They use sets that heal or reduce damage. They use abilities that heal and grant damage shields. The proper tools are already in the game, that is a fact.
I am going to say that is incorrect there are dks and Templars that do not need to block cast and still tear up. Mobility/escape.... what about healing and damage mitigation? Do we lack the ability to critically think?Edited by Smithernest54 on March 7, 2018 9:01AM1 -
DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.
Templars are amazing healers and have ability to mitigate damage, dks don’t have great healing even though I have seen DK healers, but there is a reason Dk’s excel as tanks. However, that is why we are suppose to pay close attention to our builds, skill, and cp allocation. I am in a guild with some pretty amazing duelers most in which do not use or like block casting, there are people with DK’s and Templar builds that do not use block casting at all. They use sets that heal or reduce damage. They use abilities that heal and grant damage shields.
I am going to say that is incorrect there are dk’s and Templars that do not need to block cast and still tear up. Mobility/escape.... what about healing and damage mitigation? Do we lack the ability to critical think?
And how do those DK tank's tank? Blocking.
Dueling is no measure of anything because dueling is the only time you fight someone 1v1. The luxury of duels is that you only need to fight 1 person. You dont need to block all the time in duels because you only have to think about 1 source of incoming damage. There are setups made for dueling and setups made for open world, there is a big difference.Vyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
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Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.
Templars are amazing healers and have ability to mitigate damage, dks don’t have great healing even though I have seen DK healers, but there is a reason Dk’s excel as tanks. However, that is why we are suppose to pay close attention to our builds, skill, and cp allocation. I am in a guild with some pretty amazing duelers most in which do not use or like block casting, there are people with DK’s and Templar builds that do not use block casting at all. They use sets that heal or reduce damage. They use abilities that heal and grant damage shields.
I am going to say that is incorrect there are dk’s and Templars that do not need to block cast and still tear up. Mobility/escape.... what about healing and damage mitigation? Do we lack the ability to critical think?
And how do those DK tank's tank? Blocking.
Dueling is no measure of anything because dueling is the only time you fight someone 1v1. The luxury of duels is that you only need to fight 1 person. You dont need to block all the time in duels because you only have to think about 1 source of incoming damage. There are setups made for dueling and setups made for open world, there is a big difference.
Agreed, but for a single mechanic such as blocking to have so many benefits one most of all to Attack, defend, and heal simultaneously is imbalanced.
If that were fair how come my nightblade can’t cloak and attack or my mag sorc cast a shield and attack or my stam sorc run and attack? If block casting is an intended balance form of survivability that is equal why does block casting achieve all of attacking, defending, and healing simultaneously?
Because it is a one button warriors go to. Hold down block and attack or heal. No skill or tactics required. I know because I have used it and from experience I know this is broken. Just like animation cancelling, just like proc sets, and just like high damage heavy armor. It can not stay in the game. Just like every other survival mechanic you should be able to do one or the other not both. Or this block casting trend is only going to increase in popularity.
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DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.
Templars are amazing healers and have ability to mitigate damage, dks don’t have great healing even though I have seen DK healers, but there is a reason Dk’s excel as tanks. However, that is why we are suppose to pay close attention to our builds, skill, and cp allocation. I am in a guild with some pretty amazing duelers most in which do not use or like block casting, there are people with DK’s and Templar builds that do not use block casting at all. They use sets that heal or reduce damage. They use abilities that heal and grant damage shields.
I am going to say that is incorrect there are dk’s and Templars that do not need to block cast and still tear up. Mobility/escape.... what about healing and damage mitigation? Do we lack the ability to critical think?
And how do those DK tank's tank? Blocking.
Dueling is no measure of anything because dueling is the only time you fight someone 1v1. The luxury of duels is that you only need to fight 1 person. You dont need to block all the time in duels because you only have to think about 1 source of incoming damage. There are setups made for dueling and setups made for open world, there is a big difference.
Just like animation cancelling
and.... im done hereVyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
Vir Cor | Stamina Dragonknight | DC
Latest Videos:
Magicka Dragonknight: Vyr Cor | "A Dragon's Fury" | Magicka Dragonknight PvP
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Zbigb4life✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »Sometimes you can tell from a post that the author spends more time parroting vague complaints on these forums rather than actually playing the game.
Sometimes you can tell from a comment that the author spends more time parroting vague complaints on these forums rather than actually playing the game
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Ariades_swe✭✭✭✭✭Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.Edited by Ariades_swe on March 7, 2018 11:53AM1
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Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »Smithernest54 wrote: »There are plenty of builds out there that do not use block casting, however the difference is, is that it is challenging to play and require skill and tactics, and rotation.
No, the difference is they were given the tools of mobility and escape. DKs and Templars don't have that luxury and hence why they go into the blocking route.
Templars are amazing healers and have ability to mitigate damage, dks don’t have great healing even though I have seen DK healers, but there is a reason Dk’s excel as tanks. However, that is why we are suppose to pay close attention to our builds, skill, and cp allocation. I am in a guild with some pretty amazing duelers most in which do not use or like block casting, there are people with DK’s and Templar builds that do not use block casting at all. They use sets that heal or reduce damage. They use abilities that heal and grant damage shields.
I am going to say that is incorrect there are dk’s and Templars that do not need to block cast and still tear up. Mobility/escape.... what about healing and damage mitigation? Do we lack the ability to critical think?
And how do those DK tank's tank? Blocking.
Dueling is no measure of anything because dueling is the only time you fight someone 1v1. The luxury of duels is that you only need to fight 1 person. You dont need to block all the time in duels because you only have to think about 1 source of incoming damage. There are setups made for dueling and setups made for open world, there is a big difference.
Just like animation cancelling
and.... im done here
?.... Okay?0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Mist form on heavy armored toon beats both of this skills. On my magplar when I used to play it I could mist into a keep without consequences. Mist form and you can't be stoped, can't be snared, negated or anything, instead of waiting to end of mist form (due to latency you can be cought with some sort of cc) roll and go mist again, then when you LoSed enemies 1-2 BoLs/HtD and youre back at full. It is possible to not go the "easy way", but it requires skills. I know few stamdks that can melt their opponents so fast that they don't need to block cast anything... Thats ok. But when they go on their block builds they can stand ground against 3-4 good players and even earn some kills. Thats not sounds very balanced to me.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.3 -
Ariades_swe✭✭✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Mist form on heavy armored toon beats both of this skills. On my magplar when I used to play it I could mist into a keep without consequences. Mist form and you can't be stoped, can't be snared, negated or anything, instead of waiting to end of mist form (due to latency you can be cought with some sort of cc) roll and go mist again, then when you LoSed enemies 1-2 BoLs/HtD and youre back at full. It is possible to not go the "easy way", but it requires skills. I know few stamdks that can melt their opponents so fast that they don't need to block cast anything... Thats ok. But when they go on their block builds they can stand ground against 3-4 good players and even earn some kills. Thats not sounds very balanced to me.
Mist form into a keep is your playstyle?
If mist form is so good how come you don't see sorcs use it over streak? Or nb use it over cloak that cost magicka too?
Even heavy armor stamblades would use cloak over mistform.
Topic wasn't about mistform anyways.
My stam nb is way more safe in solo openworld than any of my magicka classes. Stop being delusional.
Edited by Ariades_swe on March 7, 2018 1:33PM7 -
lazerlaz✭✭✭Those who say mag Templars and mag DKs are nothing without block casting clearly never played the game it's first 2 years. They were fine back then. Now it's just turned into no skill easy mode for bad players.
But go ahead, keep defending this abused mechanic.4 -
Pijng✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Uhm, how these two things are related? I dont get it cause blockcasting – is efficient way to fight while taking less damage, and cloak/streak – are escape/los mechanics.
Edited by Pijng on March 7, 2018 1:37PM1 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Mist form on heavy armored toon beats both of this skills. On my magplar when I used to play it I could mist into a keep without consequences. Mist form and you can't be stoped, can't be snared, negated or anything, instead of waiting to end of mist form (due to latency you can be cought with some sort of cc) roll and go mist again, then when you LoSed enemies 1-2 BoLs/HtD and youre back at full. It is possible to not go the "easy way", but it requires skills. I know few stamdks that can melt their opponents so fast that they don't need to block cast anything... Thats ok. But when they go on their block builds they can stand ground against 3-4 good players and even earn some kills. Thats not sounds very balanced to me.
It doesn't. Not even nearly close to cloak. Nothing compares. Streak is still better than mist generally. "Mist form and you can't be stoped, can't be snared, negated or anything." Untrue. Gapclose snare, certain poisons, and even a bug with staff CC can stop you. Also random slowing. Mist is awful, no sorc/NB will trade it for theirs.Those who say mag Templars and mag DKs are nothing without block casting clearly never played the game it's first 2 years. They were fine back then. Now it's just turned into no skill easy mode for bad players.
But go ahead, keep defending this abused mechanic.
Psst, block cast was worse then, costing less, not pausing regen. But OK, give me back dynamic ult and infiniwings and you can quarter block casting damage..
To OP. L2P Dots, and dot like functions like POTL, unblockable CCs, most AoEs, oblivion etc.
Also. Here is some maths. Against enough pressure, it ticks every 0.25s, either 4ish people, or one jabs/flurry. At absolute min cost it is around 380, all sturdy and all glyphs. (AKA no damage) to sustain this you need over 3k equivalent stam regen. Without counting the base paused recovery. And no use of stam elsewhere, so no breakfrees, rolls, stam abilities etc.
AKA impossible. In 1v1 permablock is kind of possible, but not with constant CCs, shields and cloaks are just as effective there
Then look at cloak, 1 cast and you take no non AoE/ult damage for 2.5s, and become untargetable, also your dots+heals crit, and your next main attack will crit too.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.3 -
Ariades_swe✭✭✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Uhm, how these two things are related? I dont get it cause blockcasting – is efficient way to fight while taking less damage, and cloak/streak – are escape/los mechanics.
If you only use cloak to escape you're bad.
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Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Didn't they just give nightblades, sorcs and DKs unblockable CC?
Yeah but as I'm sure you remember, they also ripped away the only answer to block Templars had. That was a huge buff to block builds.0 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So, the problem is blockcasting and not the unblockable stun.
Something's wrong here... I believe the unblockable is stun way more unbalanced than blockcasting. Sure, a bunch of zerg can blockcast, but that's the consequence for AoE without caps. What is bad is when a bunch of zergs zergs a guy who must rely on blockasting to get out the situation. Just one button pressed by an anonymous zerling and the guy is dead.
At least blockcasting lets you play. Unblockable stun is a "we win" button in the hands of a zerg that, really, doesn't need it, since they already have the numbers, unless they are potatoes.Edited by Xvorg on March 7, 2018 2:11PMSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Pijng✭✭✭Ariades_swe wrote: »Ariades_swe wrote: »Give my magplar and magdk cloak or streak and I'll stop block cast.
Uhm, how these two things are related? I dont get it cause blockcasting – is efficient way to fight while taking less damage, and cloak/streak – are escape/los mechanics.
If you only use cloak to escape you're bad.
That's bad, right. Still cant see how things are related, literally different stuffs for different purposes.0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Block casting isn’t even a problem anymore.
Not only does every class but Templar have a unblockable CC, but layering DOTs, Bleeds, and double damage or cost increasing poisons wreck block casting builds.
Cost increase poisons can not be purged...so that Templar block casting BOL with a 6+ sec duration cost increase poison on him he can’t purge = rip when under pressure.
Anything in the game works when you have a pocket healer or a group. That 35k Health Reactive Block casting Templar healer is useless outside of group play.
I don’t see the problem
If block casting is such a problem, it’s probabl a weakness in your build. Either use cost increasing poisons or simply with draw and don’t pick tanks to start fights with. The game already favors dps enough as it isRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
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