Rework please Durok's Bane set

Anethum · February 2018

Skoomah wrote: »

I completely agree with your sentiment regarding the sacrifices which one has to make, to become a Defile-bot.

I'm worrying most about battlegrounds, where durok's completly broke the fights.
1 person in 1 of the 3 groups now is a usual thing because of that.
Durok's user doesn't require to have own nice dps, he just should run with 2-3 others, who will do his job for him.
New monster set+durok's...welcome to hell.
NIce only that cp are not enable now in battlegrounds, that could be hell*2.
in duels, your sacrifice of some damage in exchange for this defile is not sacrifice.
Absolutly constant major defile...u gain more than sacrifice on mana character.

On stamina snb allow u to defile target without set.
But, there at least exists counterplay, stamina is not endless, u spend resourses there and reverb is also your cc, which u use in order your rotation require not every second.

If Zenimax want this set work on a hordes, ok, let it work with coldown separately to each target.
1 time each 10 seconds with 10 seconds duration, or each 5 seconds for 5 seconds duration.but not freaking every 1 second for 10 seconds. It will be still very overpowered but at least not so stupidly as now.

BohnT · February 2018

Do people actually play PvP in this game or are they sitting in deshaan crying that they lost 400 DPS which killed their character in pve although they aren't even any close to the ceiling.

Defiles and Befoul are completely broken in PvP.
1. You need to stack points into healing to survive even if there are no Defiles applied to you. A normal build that hasn't put any points into healing received will get completely nuked in every fight against decent opponents
2. Major Healing Buffs like Mending or Vitality have a pitiful uptime when compared to Defiles which have an easy 100% uptime on most good builds.
3. The opportunity costs for increased healing are huge as you lose both damage and mitigation when putting points into them while Befoul is in the green tree where you can easily spend 42 points without worrying as you already got everything you needed there

If you look at cyro a stambuild with major mending, good weapon damage, points into healing received/ given etc. Gets Vigor ticks of about 3.5k
With major Defile (no befoul) on him that gets already reduced to 2.3k.
With major and minor Defile (no befoul) he's looking at a 1.75k heal per vigor tick

If you factor in befoul in an appropriate amount he sits at a 1.3k heal
Meaning that anyone can easily outdamages the healing of the main healing ability with 2 dots or LA weaving.
No matter how bad he is.

Major defile needs to be reduced to 20% and minor to 10%. You can easily kill people without defiles and most "unkillable" builds took a huge hit with block cost increase

Ragnarock41 · February 2018

BohnT wrote: »

Do people actually play PvP in this game or are they sitting in deshaan crying that they lost 400 DPS which killed their character in pve although they aren't even any close to the ceiling.

Defiles and Befoul are completely broken in PvP.
1. You need to stack points into healing to survive even if there are no Defiles applied to you. A normal build that hasn't put any points into healing received will get completely nuked in every fight against decent opponents
2. Major Healing Buffs like Mending or Vitality have a pitiful uptime when compared to Defiles which have an easy 100% uptime on most good builds.
3. The opportunity costs for increased healing are huge as you lose both damage and mitigation when putting points into them while Befoul is in the green tree where you can easily spend 42 points without worrying as you already got everything you needed there

If you look at cyro a stambuild with major mending, good weapon damage, points into healing received/ given etc. Gets Vigor ticks of about 3.5k
With major Defile (no befoul) on him that gets already reduced to 2.3k.
With major and minor Defile (no befoul) he's looking at a 1.75k heal per vigor tick

If you factor in befoul in an appropriate amount he sits at a 1.3k heal
Meaning that anyone can easily outdamages the healing of the main healing ability with 2 dots or LA weaving.
No matter how bad he is.

Major defile needs to be reduced to 20% and minor to 10%. You can easily kill people without defiles and most "unkillable" builds took a huge hit with block cost increase

To be honest defile itself is fine, I mostly play on no-cp anyways, and I don't have a problem with defile in no-cp. Problems start with befoul.
You don't even need to spend 100 points into it. Just put like 40-50 points into befoul and you're getting a lot of extra pressure from it.

The only case where a defile build really hurts me in no-cp is against bleed builds, mainly played by dual wield nightblades, and thats more to do with the %20 damage taken debuff from their incap, and not the defile itself. (incap is a busted op skill anyways, Its only balanced by the fact that its single target, but even then compared to its alternative, 2h ult, Its miles ahead.)

What we need instead of befoul is a way to counter the stupid op purge. Its a toxic skill, that lets people survive for far too long in PvP, and Its the main reason people can be unkillable tanks even in no-CP campaign.

ak_pvp · February 2018

BroanBeast1215 wrote: »

Dreth wrote: »

Skoomah wrote: »

Healing/Mitigation in PVP is way too strong. Templars can purge and heal right through Duroks and loads of damage. NBs just cloak infinitely and run you out of resources. Sorcs can run circles around you or shield stack infinitely. Wardens can run circles around you and heal right through loads of damage as they pop their tree ults every 20 seconds. DKs can lock you down/immobilize you infinitely.

Every class has defensive mechanics that allow them to turtle up and require at least two people to kill them.

So really, defile by itself is not enough to kill a high skill level player. It takes executing a series of combos that add up to enough total pressure to earn the kill.

We really need to focus on how tanky players have gotten. Time to kill is way up, and if you don't have enough burst damage, then the fight resets and you start your combo progression all over again. The tanky meta is why it is so much harder to 1vX now.

It's important to have anti-tank sets in the game, or anti-tank mechanics or options in general. Be careful with what kind of nerfs as a community we ask for.

Wizards Riposte, in contrast, makes players super tanks because they take so much less damage, while Duroks tries to make players more killable.

This entire thread is an l2p issue.

I like how you come into almost every thread and try to discredit others discussions with things like "L2P" and other strawman arguments; if you cant argue your point without ad hominem attacks and other logical fallacies, just don't post? this board is meant to be constructive discussions and debates your toxicity is unwelcome.

Hmm... Isn't that what you did in the DK thread?

Anyway. This is a stretch, but I say change defile and maim etc to only work for those casting it IN PvP. I.e. maim would lower a targets damage by 15% only to the caster. Thus riposte would be good for solo and not free debuffs for your group. Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot.

Anethum · February 2018

ak_pvp wrote: »

Anyway. This is a stretch, but I say change defile and maim etc to only work for those casting it IN PvP. I.e. maim would lower a targets damage by 15% only to the caster. Thus riposte would be good for solo and not free debuffs for your group. Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot.

This idea is maybe not bad if to say about MInor Maim or debuffs which protect his opponents like, but if to say about Major Defile and debuffs working similar...what is your vision?

Jamini · February 2018

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

But the problem is, cloak spam, shield spam won't get any nerfs because of our heavily biased community.

"Nerf Rock, Paper is fine" ~Scissors. 02/14/2018

Qbiken · February 2018

ak_pvp wrote: »

BroanBeast1215 wrote: »

Dreth wrote: »

Skoomah wrote: »

Healing/Mitigation in PVP is way too strong. Templars can purge and heal right through Duroks and loads of damage. NBs just cloak infinitely and run you out of resources. Sorcs can run circles around you or shield stack infinitely. Wardens can run circles around you and heal right through loads of damage as they pop their tree ults every 20 seconds. DKs can lock you down/immobilize you infinitely.

Every class has defensive mechanics that allow them to turtle up and require at least two people to kill them.

So really, defile by itself is not enough to kill a high skill level player. It takes executing a series of combos that add up to enough total pressure to earn the kill.

We really need to focus on how tanky players have gotten. Time to kill is way up, and if you don't have enough burst damage, then the fight resets and you start your combo progression all over again. The tanky meta is why it is so much harder to 1vX now.

It's important to have anti-tank sets in the game, or anti-tank mechanics or options in general. Be careful with what kind of nerfs as a community we ask for.

Wizards Riposte, in contrast, makes players super tanks because they take so much less damage, while Duroks tries to make players more killable.

This entire thread is an l2p issue.

I like how you come into almost every thread and try to discredit others discussions with things like "L2P" and other strawman arguments; if you cant argue your point without ad hominem attacks and other logical fallacies, just don't post? this board is meant to be constructive discussions and debates your toxicity is unwelcome.

Hmm... Isn't that what you did in the DK thread?

Anyway. This is a stretch, but I say change defile and maim etc to only work for those casting it IN PvP. I.e. maim would lower a targets damage by 15% only to the caster. Thus riposte would be good for solo and not free debuffs for your group. Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot.

Good suggestion

Thogard · February 2018

raasdal wrote: »

Dyride wrote: »

Durok's requires sacrificing a 5 pc set for the high uptime on a important debuff. The 2-4 pc bonuses are negligible boosts even for a tank.

Befoul has diminishing returns considering there are lots of other useful Green CP trees.

It isn't hard to get an extra 33% heal debuff from Befoul however (My minor defile poisons are 20% and Major Defile is 40% heal debuff). It makes for an effective combo that people like @Lexxypwns have been pointing out for a while.

I completely agree with your sentiment regarding the sacrifices which one has to make, to become a Defile-bot.

But that claimed 33% Heal Debuff hurts my eyes. That number is impossible. Just for clarity, below are the total Defile numbers, with different setups. These numbers however, assume totally unbuffed opponent, without Mending or Healing Received bonuses, of which the latter will directly impact the relative effectiveness of befoul / defile;

Minor Defile = 15% (23,25% with Befoul 100 CP)
Major Defile = 30% (46,5% with Befoul 100 CP)
Minor Defile + Major Defile = 40,5% (58,9% with 100 CP Befoul)

So, the maximum possible Healing Reduction achievable is 58,9%, and the maximum added value by Befoul star is 18,4% Defile. That is a LOOOOOONG way from 33%.

EDIT... Ahhh. Sorry. After rereading, i just realize that the 33% was most probably referring to the percentage of Befoul star (0-55%). In that case, your post is 100% accurate, and i agree. Just for the sake of the numbers, i will however leave the numbers i took the time to quickly calculate.

Minor defile and major defile are multiplicative, not additive.

If major is 40% and minor is 20%,
, the total debuff would be (1-(1-.4)x(1.-.2)= 52%

ak_pvp · February 2018

diplomatt wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

Anyway. This is a stretch, but I say change defile and maim etc to only work for those casting it IN PvP. I.e. maim would lower a targets damage by 15% only to the caster. Thus riposte would be good for solo and not free debuffs for your group. Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot.

This idea is maybe not bad if to say about MInor Maim or debuffs which protect his opponents like, but if to say about Major Defile and debuffs working similar...what is your vision?

"Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot."

It would basically be a way to make their own damage more effective but in a different scope to multipliers. It'd require a massive change in the way healing is calculated,. since damage wouldn't just be damage. The way it would be done would change its effectiveness a lot.

Option A.) Healing is split in a ratio of damage done to your HP per person.

So if I get attacked for 2000 by two people, A normal and B with a major defile set, noCP, then I heal for 4000 base. I would heal 2000 normal damage from A and 1400 from the damage that is done by person B. This would mean that the effectiveness of defile would go down based on the no of people you are fighting. i.e. 3 people A 4000 normal, B 2000 normal, C 1000 defiled and your heal 4000

You would heal 2000 and 1000 from A and B, and 500 x 0.7 from C with the defile. This means that defiles effectiveness depends on the damage done, and the more people you are fighting, and subsequently taking damage from, the less it would impact since you are still getting a fuller heal, from all the damage they are giving.

Option B.)
Healing is based on most recent taken

A hits you for 1000, then B with defile hits you 1000. Your heal is 1000. If most recent is how it is, you would heal only the defiled damage, 700. These would really change the effectiveness of defile, making constant pressure more rewarding, being able to defile 100% but nullifying its effectiveness as a pure healbot completely.

This would work in a really similar but method to shields and crits. Where the healing is reduced until after the target has outhealed the defiled damage. I.e. 1000 damage from A defiled, and your heal is 2000. You would take a reduction of 30% towards the first 1000 damage, but then heal unreduced for the remaining whatever is left.

Healing could also be based on least recent, but that'd make it almost useless beyond a point.

Ragnaroek93 · February 2018

Duroks is balanced. Defile in general isn't. Even without Befoul (which is currently overperforming in my opinion) Defile is extremely powerful and would still be used, just not to the same extend as it is right now.

Calboy · February 2018

Befoul stacked defile is a mandatory component in pvp. Don't be mad because the best way to gear is by not stackng damage sets.

IZZEFlameLash · February 2018

BohnT wrote: »

Do people actually play PvP in this game or are they sitting in deshaan crying that they lost 400 DPS which killed their character in pve although they aren't even any close to the ceiling.

Defiles and Befoul are completely broken in PvP.
1. You need to stack points into healing to survive even if there are no Defiles applied to you. A normal build that hasn't put any points into healing received will get completely nuked in every fight against decent opponents
2. Major Healing Buffs like Mending or Vitality have a pitiful uptime when compared to Defiles which have an easy 100% uptime on most good builds.
3. The opportunity costs for increased healing are huge as you lose both damage and mitigation when putting points into them while Befoul is in the green tree where you can easily spend 42 points without worrying as you already got everything you needed there

If you look at cyro a stambuild with major mending, good weapon damage, points into healing received/ given etc. Gets Vigor ticks of about 3.5k
With major Defile (no befoul) on him that gets already reduced to 2.3k.
With major and minor Defile (no befoul) he's looking at a 1.75k heal per vigor tick

If you factor in befoul in an appropriate amount he sits at a 1.3k heal
Meaning that anyone can easily outdamages the healing of the main healing ability with 2 dots or LA weaving.
No matter how bad he is.

Major defile needs to be reduced to 20% and minor to 10%. You can easily kill people without defiles and most "unkillable" builds took a huge hit with block cost increase

If they had 3.5k heals per tick, then what's the problem of it getting reduced by half because that 3.5k per tick healing alone makes them virtually unkillable with great damage and sustain as is.

3.5k per tick would need a counter and people who do get 3.5k per tick also tend to have strong resistance too. So... they easily outheal the damage either after CC or after cloak. So defile is needed and should be a group component.

Usually, counter would be kill the defile bot first or kill everyone else around it and not attacking it and then kill it. It's been done before. I am sure it can be done again and this do happen.

BohnT · February 2018

IZZESparkling wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Do people actually play PvP in this game or are they sitting in deshaan crying that they lost 400 DPS which killed their character in pve although they aren't even any close to the ceiling.

Defiles and Befoul are completely broken in PvP.
1. You need to stack points into healing to survive even if there are no Defiles applied to you. A normal build that hasn't put any points into healing received will get completely nuked in every fight against decent opponents
2. Major Healing Buffs like Mending or Vitality have a pitiful uptime when compared to Defiles which have an easy 100% uptime on most good builds.
3. The opportunity costs for increased healing are huge as you lose both damage and mitigation when putting points into them while Befoul is in the green tree where you can easily spend 42 points without worrying as you already got everything you needed there

If you look at cyro a stambuild with major mending, good weapon damage, points into healing received/ given etc. Gets Vigor ticks of about 3.5k
With major Defile (no befoul) on him that gets already reduced to 2.3k.
With major and minor Defile (no befoul) he's looking at a 1.75k heal per vigor tick

If you factor in befoul in an appropriate amount he sits at a 1.3k heal
Meaning that anyone can easily outdamages the healing of the main healing ability with 2 dots or LA weaving.
No matter how bad he is.

Major defile needs to be reduced to 20% and minor to 10%. You can easily kill people without defiles and most "unkillable" builds took a huge hit with block cost increase

If they had 3.5k heals per tick, then what's the problem of it getting reduced by half because that 3.5k per tick healing alone makes them virtually unkillable with great damage and sustain as is.

3.5k per tick would need a counter and people who do get 3.5k per tick also tend to have strong resistance too. So... they easily outheal the damage either after CC or after cloak. So defile is needed and should be a group component.

Usually, counter would be kill the defile bot first or kill everyone else around it and not attacking it and then kill it. It's been done before. I am sure it can be done again and this do happen.

Because a 3.5 k vigor tick isn't what they have throughout the fight. For most builds that's Major Mending + Crit + Fully buffed.
Most of the time most builds have average vigor ticks of 2k-2.5k and those are reduced to below 1k.

When i fight on my argonian stamplar with 4.6k wpn damage, 35k stam and 40+ points into healing done + received i still have occasions Where my vigor gets reduced to 1.4k crits. Everyone can easily do more than 1.4k damage and negate that heal.

Defiles with Befoul are simply too powerful. You can easily make builds which will win every fight against magdk, stamdk, stamsorcs, stamplars due to Defiles

Skoomah · February 2018

Who are you guys fighting in pvp? I run across hardcore pvp'ers all the time and without defile, the enemy player can just out mitigate your damage right through the defile. I have to make sure I'm fully buffed and that I've applied a whole list of debuffs onto the enemy to soften them up before I can get the kill.

No good player dies from just a defile. They die because you've snared or immobile them, followed up by applying some dots, getting them low, then finishing them off with high burst direct damage execute along with animation canceling. You make sure to apply defile, maim, fracture so the total pressure on them is high enough so they eventually die.

And you also make sure you keep up your own self buffs to damage, healing, and resistances to counter the enemy's pressure.

Defile is not effective against shield stacking classes mag sorc, mag nightblade, mag warden because their mitigation comes from shields. Defile doesn't work that well against templars because they just cleanse it right off over and over again.

DKs that just sit there and turtle up/block and barely output enough damage to kill a squirrel get wrecked every time.

Nightblades just cloak and heal up if you do not have a counter to their stealth mechanic.

Stam sorcs are so fast that if they want to line of sight you and run off, you're not catching up to them.

I dont think it's fair to keep nerfing one certain aspect of the game without taking into account how the rest of the game works. We need our defiles, because options for mitigation right now are so strong.

Anethum · February 2018

Skoomah wrote: »

I dont think it's fair to keep nerfing one certain aspect of the game without taking into account how the rest of the game works. We need our defiles, because options for mitigation right now are so strong.

This thread is about Durok's bane incorrect work, not about Defiles in general, which are the part of the game and I don't think they should be reworked.
Maybe slightly adjusted, but nmd

BroanBeast1215 · February 2018

ak_pvp wrote: »

BroanBeast1215 wrote: »

Dreth wrote: »

Skoomah wrote: »

Healing/Mitigation in PVP is way too strong. Templars can purge and heal right through Duroks and loads of damage. NBs just cloak infinitely and run you out of resources. Sorcs can run circles around you or shield stack infinitely. Wardens can run circles around you and heal right through loads of damage as they pop their tree ults every 20 seconds. DKs can lock you down/immobilize you infinitely.

Every class has defensive mechanics that allow them to turtle up and require at least two people to kill them.

So really, defile by itself is not enough to kill a high skill level player. It takes executing a series of combos that add up to enough total pressure to earn the kill.

We really need to focus on how tanky players have gotten. Time to kill is way up, and if you don't have enough burst damage, then the fight resets and you start your combo progression all over again. The tanky meta is why it is so much harder to 1vX now.

It's important to have anti-tank sets in the game, or anti-tank mechanics or options in general. Be careful with what kind of nerfs as a community we ask for.

Wizards Riposte, in contrast, makes players super tanks because they take so much less damage, while Duroks tries to make players more killable.

This entire thread is an l2p issue.

I like how you come into almost every thread and try to discredit others discussions with things like "L2P" and other strawman arguments; if you cant argue your point without ad hominem attacks and other logical fallacies, just don't post? this board is meant to be constructive discussions and debates your toxicity is unwelcome.

Hmm... Isn't that what you did in the DK thread?

Anyway. This is a stretch, but I say change defile and maim etc to only work for those casting it IN PvP. I.e. maim would lower a targets damage by 15% only to the caster. Thus riposte would be good for solo and not free debuffs for your group. Same with defiles. Damage that you do to them is harder to be healed. That way its effectiveness is tied to your own offense instead of being a groups debuff healbot.

BroanBeast1215 · February 2018

Skoomah wrote: »

Who are you guys fighting in pvp? I run across hardcore pvp'ers all the time and without defile, the enemy player can just out mitigate your damage right through the defile. I have to make sure I'm fully buffed and that I've applied a whole list of debuffs onto the enemy to soften them up before I can get the kill.

No good player dies from just a defile. They die because you've snared or immobile them, followed up by applying some dots, getting them low, then finishing them off with high burst direct damage execute along with animation canceling. You make sure to apply defile, maim, fracture so the total pressure on them is high enough so they eventually die.

And you also make sure you keep up your own self buffs to damage, healing, and resistances to counter the enemy's pressure.

Defile is not effective against shield stacking classes mag sorc, mag nightblade, mag warden because their mitigation comes from shields. Defile doesn't work that well against templars because they just cleanse it right off over and over again.

DKs that just sit there and turtle up/block and barely output enough damage to kill a squirrel get wrecked every time.

Nightblades just cloak and heal up if you do not have a counter to their stealth mechanic.

Stam sorcs are so fast that if they want to line of sight you and run off, you're not catching up to them.

I dont think it's fair to keep nerfing one certain aspect of the game without taking into account how the rest of the game works. We need our defiles, because options for mitigation right now are so strong.

I find defile most annoying when you're having a nice smallscale group fight and some nightblade on the way outside of the fight is just spamming snipe over and over and when pressured just invis away until he can continue being a scrublord

that's just me.

also, having tested this set in duels with my buddy's stamsorc, it was the deciding factor in him winning. Having a nearly 100% uptime on healing reduction that can be tweaked to be anywhere from 30-85% isn't ok.

raasdal · February 2018

Thogard wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

Dyride wrote: »

Durok's requires sacrificing a 5 pc set for the high uptime on a important debuff. The 2-4 pc bonuses are negligible boosts even for a tank.

Befoul has diminishing returns considering there are lots of other useful Green CP trees.

It isn't hard to get an extra 33% heal debuff from Befoul however (My minor defile poisons are 20% and Major Defile is 40% heal debuff). It makes for an effective combo that people like @Lexxypwns have been pointing out for a while.

I completely agree with your sentiment regarding the sacrifices which one has to make, to become a Defile-bot.

But that claimed 33% Heal Debuff hurts my eyes. That number is impossible. Just for clarity, below are the total Defile numbers, with different setups. These numbers however, assume totally unbuffed opponent, without Mending or Healing Received bonuses, of which the latter will directly impact the relative effectiveness of befoul / defile;

Minor Defile = 15% (23,25% with Befoul 100 CP)
Major Defile = 30% (46,5% with Befoul 100 CP)
Minor Defile + Major Defile = 40,5% (58,9% with 100 CP Befoul)

So, the maximum possible Healing Reduction achievable is 58,9%, and the maximum added value by Befoul star is 18,4% Defile. That is a LOOOOOONG way from 33%.

EDIT... Ahhh. Sorry. After rereading, i just realize that the 33% was most probably referring to the percentage of Befoul star (0-55%). In that case, your post is 100% accurate, and i agree. Just for the sake of the numbers, i will however leave the numbers i took the time to quickly calculate.

Minor defile and major defile are multiplicative, not additive.

If major is 40% and minor is 20%,
, the total debuff would be (1-(1-.4)x(1.-.2)= 52%

Yes? My calculation is also Multiplicative. You are reaching 52% because you are using 40% and 20%. Use 15 and 30 or 23,25 and 46,5, like in my calculation (which is correct for 0 and 100 points in Befoul), and you still get the same numbers.

(1-(1-.3)x(1.-.15)= 40,5%
etc.

Anethum · March 2018

And now Durok's Bane + Thurvokun... Adjust Durok's bane set at least @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Minno · March 2018

Qbiken wrote: »

The problems with Durok´s Bane is:
a) The duration
b) Its cooldown

I personally think Durok´s Bane should work like a defensive version of Cyrodil´s crest.

(2 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(3 items) Adds 1206 Max Health
(4 items) Adds 4% Healing Taken
(5 items) When you deal melee damage, you apply Major Defile to the enemy for 5 seconds, reducing their healing received by 30%. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.

Durok´s Bane together with sets like Wizard´s Riposte have way to long duration. Reduce the duration and give it an increased cooldown.

I agree with this. Proc only on melee DMG

Anethum · March 2018

up

Domander · March 2018

diplomatt wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

Well, now you are just mixed everything together, and making assumptions that are just flat out wrong. You can easily increase healing by 70%, and your numbers for Debuff are just incorrect.

Uff, issue is absolutly not how strong is defile or healing recieved.
Issue is how Duroc's Bane works.

1 second cooldown man, on anyone who atacked durok's user...
For example, half-offencive set Cirodiil crest (which also provides major defile but on your target) even not close to this effect, it have 5 seconds cooldown, defile duration is 5 seconds and it works only on one target. U can't defile everyone. 1 target each 5 seconds. Fair, works pretty nice, i've done build on stamdk with that set to fill the gap if u want avoid using snb
But Durok's... Thats why it so op... made by Wrobel to get more "likes" idk

And It breaks nightblade's stealth if nb put a dot on duroc's user, every second which is a cherry on the piece of...let it cake.

I think it's ok except for the nightblade cloak bug. There are a great many sets that are complete trash, so you really can't make a good argument using another set as an example.

Anethum · March 2018

Domander wrote: »

diplomatt wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

Well, now you are just mixed everything together, and making assumptions that are just flat out wrong. You can easily increase healing by 70%, and your numbers for Debuff are just incorrect.

Uff, issue is absolutly not how strong is defile or healing recieved.
Issue is how Duroc's Bane works.

1 second cooldown man, on anyone who atacked durok's user...
For example, half-offencive set Cirodiil crest (which also provides major defile but on your target) even not close to this effect, it have 5 seconds cooldown, defile duration is 5 seconds and it works only on one target. U can't defile everyone. 1 target each 5 seconds. Fair, works pretty nice, i've done build on stamdk with that set to fill the gap if u want avoid using snb
But Durok's... Thats why it so op... made by Wrobel to get more "likes" idk

And It breaks nightblade's stealth if nb put a dot on duroc's user, every second which is a cherry on the piece of...let it cake.

I think it's ok except for the nightblade cloak bug. There are a great many sets that are complete trash, so you really can't make a good argument using another set as an example.

u've read attentively how it works now?
it's major debuff, it strongly need to to be changed into way how works Cyrodiil Crest for example

StaticWave · March 2018

raasdal wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

I don’t get why people get so worked up over a 30% heal debuff. If you cant play with Major Defile, then you need to rework your build. There are so many sources of it. Duroks Bane is fine, since you can just avoid damaging that person if 1vX. And if you cant handle it 1v1 it is a L2P issue.

%30?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Do you even play on vivec?

Its pretty obvious that you either play no-cp or you don't even pvp at all.

Yup, NO CP all the way. But even in CP, my statement remains the exact same. Major Defile is still 30%. CP system can boost yes, but it can also boost healing to the same extent, so...

So in order to match defile's cp boost, you need to use both red cp points and blue cp points? That seems like a waste imo. You only need green cp points to buff defile. Obviously, if you've dueled a bleed/dot build using durok you'll know how cancer that set is. Permanently defiled while having 5+ dots ticking on you is utterly cancer. It's not a l2p issue. It's abusing a cheese set to win, period. I have no problem with players using durok if their build isn't some cheese ass crap like bleed and dots

StaticWave · March 2018

ThulsaDoomDC wrote: »

Set is perfectly fine. You literally have to build as a debuff tank in order to properly use it in a group, which makes you viable. Just save the guy with Durok's for last. Play smarter. Just don't have the zerg mentality.

Doesnt matter if you save the guy with Durok for last. If you're using an aoe and it just happens to hit the guy with Durok you're defiled. So does that mean I can't use hurricane, volatile armor, db, leap, or any aoes? The set is dumb and should be reworked. Befoul needs to be nerfed along with permablocking and bleeds

Ragnarock41 · March 2018

I love how the community takes ages to realize what is broken.

Escape_Mentality · May 2018

Reading through this thread I got bored real fast. For me, it sounds like a bunch of whiny players who love playing sniping magblades who want to spam lethal injection and sap essence from the shadows. Whaaaaa it takes me out of stealth. Good lord. Do you even play other characters? 150 sets to choose from for you to improve your standard velidreth based build. Improve your builds or improve your skills. Just because you can't beat a set doesn't make it unbalanced.

Ragnarock41 · May 2018

Escape_Mentality wrote: »

Reading through this thread I got bored real fast. For me, it sounds like a bunch of whiny players who love playing sniping magblades who want to spam lethal injection and sap essence from the shadows. Whaaaaa it takes me out of stealth. Good lord. Do you even play other characters? 150 sets to choose from for you to improve your standard velidreth based build. Improve your builds or improve your skills. Just because you can't beat a set doesn't make it unbalanced.

Calling everyone a whiner, then whining yourself , way to go

olsborg · May 2018

Whats most op imo is how high cp into defile scales. And how easy it is to apply permanent major (and minor) defile. This needs to be looked at.

amir412 · May 2018

Dreth wrote: »

Sets fine imo. Tired of every class being a healer and fights going on for 5+ minutes. They should reduce all healing across the board regardless of what they do with duroks.

Lols, i bet ure using it with master axes bleeds dont u?