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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861

Update suggestion/idea for Veteran dungeons to bring competitively for endgame players.

Akagami94
Akagami94
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Introduction:
For the new upcoming Dragonbones DLC, Zenimax will add new 2 new dungeons. These 2 dungeons will be played alot for the first few days/weeks. But after that they'll become dungeons for players just to farm item sets in normal modes or completely ignored by most average players. That counts for all the dungeons. For PvP players like me and alot of Pve players, these dungeons are becoming just another grind to get the undaunted skill to 9. These dungeons are actually fun content to do regularly but Zenimax doesn't add much competitively to the players. So i have a idea that maybe work to add this competitively.

My Idea:
So to add competitively in these dungeon, We can showcase the fastest time that they clear the dungeon on Veteran HM difficulty. The time and by whom players are displayed on the dungeon finder menu when u select a specific dungeon, with the Guild who cleared the dungeon and the players with their @names (Character names, like in the friendlists) and roles they used to to clear dungeon and how many time's they died (Each death should give a 5 seconds penalty) This is to prevent players will skip all the adds in order to get the fastest time.)
When the fastest time is achieved by a guild, there will be a system announcement for example [Dungeon clear! Ruins of Mazzatun has been cleared by ''Guild name'' with the time of 17:23.97 seconds!] So that everyone can check in the dungeon finder witch players achieved the time. (to add a little fame for players) Same announcement could be implemented for the nr1 spots for Mealstrom Arena and veteran Trials.
How does this work? The timer starts at the same time as the speed challenges achievements and end when the final boss dies. After looting the boss or chest a popup will showup for the Group leader. he can select witch guild has cleared the dungeon. And Selects the rolls for each players. (This is because in some dungeons, there's no need to bring a healer) and after submit, the announcement will show in chat and/or on screen.

To add more depths into the times, zenimax can also add how much dmg they've done, how much healing and how much damage they've been taken. They can also add how fast they killed each boss, and to add some flavor they can show a picture of the bosses with the imposing results.

Conclusion

I'd really think this would bring more competitively into the game. But also for guilds that already achieved world records, would like the idea. At this time, they'll have to post the results on the forums and Youtube, for a few people to see but with this all of eso community will be notified of their achievement.

  • Kel
    Kel
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    This would be good for a handful of players/guilds, but not for a vast majority of players. For 98% of players, nothing about the grind of these dungeons would change, and those chasing world record times are already doing so.
    Edited by Kel on January 22, 2018 9:00PM
  • Akagami94
    Akagami94
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    Dungeons mechanics isn't that hard like veteran Trials that only exclusive people can participate.
  • LiquidPony
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    I'd love to see Dungeon Leaderboards, just like Trials leaderboards. WoW has 'em!

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/pve/leaderboards/
  • disintegr8
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    Agree with @jabrone77 on this, only a few players would see this as good. The only reason I currently have for completing any vet dungeon more than once would be to have tanked, healed and DPS's them all.

    For me, now that all vet dungeons have a normal version, which drops the same gear, any desire to do vet dungeons more that once is minimal. The move away from bronze, silver and gold keys even further reduced any desire I have for Vet Hard Mode. Now that we have transmutation, one run for one helm may see no further reason to run vet at all.

    I'd suggest that having vet dungeons drop different gear, or gear with significantly greater benefits/specs, would be the only way to get me to run Vet more frequently. Maybe gold jewelry with significantly higher specs, or increased chances of getting the jewelry.

    I have well over 60 monster helms and more than 60 shoulders, nearly all in either divines or impenetrable (non transmuted), all others have been deconstructed (I know it is more than 60 of each because I checked to see if they are going to all fit in the new storage chests). I also have nearly 500 unused keys, most collected simply by leveling characters through the undaunted skill line.

    I see very little reason to repeatedly run vet dungeons and no reason at all to run any in hard mode.
    Australian on PS4 NA server.
    Everyone's entitled to an opinion.
  • Mic1007
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    What we need are more 4-Player Arenas. And a 2-Player Arena. And a 6-Player Arena.
    @Mic1007
    Champion Rank 900+
    DC/AD/EP
    PC NA

    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
  • Akagami94
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    Well @disintegr8 What about this by completing Veteran Hm dungeons, they will have change to get an outfit like the treasure hunter. What they did last year with the dungeon event. (witch was mostly broke) Or having rewarded with Undaunted plunder 5k gold instead of the 10k in Trials. To make for the average player worthwhile to do veteran hm dungeons.

    Otherwise Veteran Hm will dead content soon.

    And @LiquidPony Yeah something like that.
    Edited by Akagami94 on January 22, 2018 9:30PM
  • Kel
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    LiquidPony wrote: »
    I'd love to see Dungeon Leaderboards, just like Trials leaderboards. WoW has 'em!

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/pve/leaderboards/

    They also have major rewards that give very high ilevel gear for doing higher content. It's not just to see how high you get, it has in game rewards.
    And the way ESO has its gear system set up, it wouldn't work the same.
    It only works if the carrot on the end of the stick is worth chasing.
  • duendology
    duendology
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    More competitive? It's competitive enough.

    If anything, if you really want it so badly, add a super hard mode of already hard mode of dungeons, whatever.

    Ultimately, you'll have a hard mode of a hard mode of already a hard mode of a hard mode vet dungeon....
    PC/NA
    - Redguard StamBlade dps ["bowtard" crafty girl who likes spinning with daggers too.]
    - Breton SorcMag dps [She's got an identity crisis, but I believe in her.]
    - Dunmer Templar dps/healer [she's a healer, then again she likes inferno staff too...]
    And..
    - High Elf SorcMag dps [It's quite possible his daddy was a Nord.]

    I am an old-fashioned Goth
  • disintegr8
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    Costumes, if they were decent, could be something they can add @Akagami94, but any gold reward would really have to be fairly decent to entice me - say 50k plus. I have over 7 million gold and every house that is gold purchasable except one, which funnily enough requires vet completion of two DLC dungeons before I can buy it (HotR I think) - which I am yet to do.

    As someone who uses group finder, getting a random pug that can complete the DLC dungeons in vet mode is not easy to do. Because of this, I cannot endorse making these dungeons more difficult, unless you remove them from dungeon finder and force people to make their own groups.
    Australian on PS4 NA server.
    Everyone's entitled to an opinion.
  • Akagami94
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    @disintegr8 The dungeons don't have to become harder than what they already are
  • LiquidPony
    LiquidPony
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    jabrone77 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    I'd love to see Dungeon Leaderboards, just like Trials leaderboards. WoW has 'em!

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/pve/leaderboards/

    They also have major rewards that give very high ilevel gear for doing higher content. It's not just to see how high you get, it has in game rewards.
    And the way ESO has its gear system set up, it wouldn't work the same.
    It only works if the carrot on the end of the stick is worth chasing.

    What's the carrot on the end of the stick for vet Trial leaderboards? More of the same gear we already got running the Trial 100s of times to get to the point where we can get on the leaderboards? Great, I'm super excited about my gold well-fitted Gauntlets of Automated Defense and my gold sharpened Moondancer Ice Staff.

    If a reward is necessary, drop gold jewelry from the dungeon for leaderboard rewards.

    But I don't think a special reward is necessary anyway. The reward is your name on the leaderboard.
    Edited by LiquidPony on January 23, 2018 12:27AM
  • Vermintide
    Vermintide
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    Meh.

    There needs to be "endless" content. I would love a survival mode- You don't win, you just see how long or how many waves you can complete before the squad wipes. MMO mechanics would be perfect for this.

    What rewards do you get? Fun.

    Rewards are probably part of the problem. Loot is integral to the RPG appeal, but you can't focus on better gear and better loot forever, because sooner or later you will have BiS everything and then you find that actually, you don't even enjoy the game. You are just a kleptomaniac.
    Edited by Vermintide on January 23, 2018 12:59AM
  • Kel
    Kel
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    LiquidPony wrote: »
    jabrone77 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    I'd love to see Dungeon Leaderboards, just like Trials leaderboards. WoW has 'em!

    https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/pve/leaderboards/

    They also have major rewards that give very high ilevel gear for doing higher content. It's not just to see how high you get, it has in game rewards.
    And the way ESO has its gear system set up, it wouldn't work the same.
    It only works if the carrot on the end of the stick is worth chasing.

    What's the carrot on the end of the stick for vet Trial leaderboards? More of the same gear we already got running the Trial 100s of times to get to the point where we can get on the leaderboards? Great, I'm super excited about my gold well-fitted Gauntlets of Automated Defense and my gold sharpened Moondancer Ice Staff.

    If a reward is necessary, drop gold jewelry from the dungeon for leaderboard rewards.

    But I don't think a special reward is necessary anyway. The reward is your name on the leaderboard.

    Still, that just won't appeal to anyone but the most hardcore of players. At least 90% of the playerbase probably doesn't give a.....care.
    Unless you are already doing it, what incentives would get MORE players involved in that? OP specifically talked about "average" players in his post..

    "But after that they'll become dungeons for players just to farm item sets in normal modes or completely ignored by most average players. That counts for all the dungeons. For PvP players like me and alot of Pve players, these dungeons are becoming just another grind to get the undaunted skill to 9."


    You are going to need more than just your name on the leaderboards to draw more people. Otherwise, like you say, more players would be doing it now, instead of a few.
    Edited by Kel on January 23, 2018 2:23AM
  • Iccotak
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    Honestly I don't care for competition in dungeons. That is a place everyone should be working together and support one another in order to Survive.
    I have a feeling we would see some bad teamwork if people were pressing for leaderboards and/or times.

    Maybe add a separate type of PvE content that has competition in mind? Like Arenas?
  • Kel
    Kel
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    Iccotak wrote: »
    Honestly I don't care for competition in dungeons. That is a place everyone should be working together and support one another in order to Survive.
    I have a feeling we would see some bad teamwork if people were pressing for leaderboards and/or times.

    Maybe add a separate type of PvE content that has competition in mind? Like Arenas?

    Exactly. Look how trials have become. vAA was originally set for 160cp. Now players ask for something ridiculous like 40k dps, all because they want to push for a score. Even in dungeons now, players try to kick someone who's lower then them, or sprint ahead without waiting for the group. This would just encourage that behavior.
    It's not good...
  • Splattercat_83
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    jabrone77 wrote: »
    Iccotak wrote: »
    Honestly I don't care for competition in dungeons. That is a place everyone should be working together and support one another in order to Survive.
    I have a feeling we would see some bad teamwork if people were pressing for leaderboards and/or times.

    Maybe add a separate type of PvE content that has competition in mind? Like Arenas?

    Exactly. Look how trials have become. vAA was originally set for 160cp. Now players ask for something ridiculous like 40k dps, all because they want to push for a score. Even in dungeons now, players try to kick someone who's lower then them, or sprint ahead without waiting for the group. This would just encourage that behavior.
    It's not good...

    I can see two sides to that. Its crazy that some of the top guilds set a very high bar when it comes to the DPS that they require, but that's why they are the top guilds on the leader boards. Another thing it does is it makes the run in general easier on everyone. You will either bypass mechanics (think lunar phase in VMoL) or you will see less rotation of mechanics. The more ghost splits in VAA or the big aoe the warrior does in VHRC gives more room and chances for error etc. The same goes for dungeons. Who wants wave after wave of portals in VWGT? You get good DPS in there with a good healer or tank, you can usually burn the inhibitor down before she goes to the blue phase.

    With that being said, its all up to how you wanna play the game and what you are looking to do. Sometimes I don't feel like burning through a dungeon so I que up in the activity finder or roll up in there with some of my not so "savy" friends and ride the struggle bus with them.

    I've got a guy on my friends list thats a night blade tank (not a sap tank either) and he barely has 300 cp. His brother is a 400 CP and we qued up for vet cradle of shadows. I was running as the healer. We finally beat Velidreth after the 8th wipe. I didn't fuss about it because I knew what I was getting myself into, I healed my tail off, debuffed my tail off, and tried to throw a little dot dps in there. I felt like helping out a friend. He wanted to beat VCoS as bad as I wanna beat VMoL, but he never could get into a group that could beat it (I guess I am the only geared end game content playing friend he has). For whatever little bit I helped him get in there and done that was worth the struggle after we beat it. You would have thought we just no deathed VAS.
  • Tasear
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    Akagami94 wrote: »
    Dungeons mechanics isn't that hard like veteran Trials that only exclusive people can participate.

    I will disagree some of these people in trials will never see these hardmode, speed runs and no achievements or motifs wouldn't be selling so high. Especially the new ones have been mech heavy.
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