The Consequences of Costumes
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Thannazzar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Aedan wrote:Early on, I saw the roadmap ahead. A newly established adventurer, I yearned to be counted among the strongest of champions, like that of King Emeric and his royal guard. After defeating countless foes, I became one of the strongest fighters in all the realm. Yet as I roamed the wilds, my comrades did not fear me - for I appeared just as those who were untested in the trials of Tamriel. I am unable to identify the strength of my foes until the first blow. Name alone sets me apart from my rivals.
These are the consequences of a costume system that does not reflect player progress and class.
Positive Identification
Costumes are great, until everyone is wearing the same costume as you. And for what reason? Clothes in modern times are a form of self expression, but in a game inspired by medieval customs, they serve to identify rank, nobility, or wealth. A level 1 character should not look like King Emeric, and vice versa.
Indistinguishable player classes.
In player versus player (PvP) battles, understanding your foe puts you a step ahead. Consider these steps: Evaluate. Prepare. Engage. Players need a system to calculate opponents' strengths and weaknesses and then prepare for engagement. Imagery in the form of gear styles and sets is the foremost visual aid, for it is actually easier to batch process mentally than listed class icons and levels. When is the last time you were able to quickly identify the composition of a large (20+) group in Cyrodil?
Degradation of Player Progress
A max level champion is desired for their passive stat bonuses and powers. This is reflected via a flat champion level in Elder Scrolls Online, rather than the nonlinear progression of novice to advanced gear sets. This is one of the main reasons for intensified calls for the rebirth of Vanilla (Classic) World of Warcraft. Player progress was cleverly defined by unique gear sets at max level, but not so clearly defined as to systematically rank and exclude players based on a champion number.
Nothing Worthwhile is Ever Easy
The mightiest sorcerer in the realm should look the part. Players desire measured progress, with more intricate systems than flat numbers. Purchasing an outfit is neither hard nor fun. A player should be able to look back and say look how far I have come and broadcast that to their fellow players. Developers know this, which is why consistently MMORPGs (Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Games) release without a costume system, until the developers unintentionally destroy it, hungry for cosmetic revenue and catering to the wishes of the freshman class’ call for a costume simulator.
Ah the inevitable pvp winge.......0 -
Acrolas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't read every single person's post history before arguing with them in Forum PVP.
I just know that if I need to win, I'll need to pull out a stronger weapon like Quotes or Factual Evidence.
The game's not much different, except there's Shadow Cloak instead of Distracting Cat GIF if you suddenly find yourself in an unwinnable situation.signing off0 -
jaschacasadiob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭You can see how much health an opponent has in PvP (which is ridicolous). What else would you like to know? If she's dating someone?"Yesterday while searching a barrel in vVoM I found a lemon. Best drop of the whole run."
Protect the weak. Heal the sick.
Treasure the gifts of friendship. Seek joy and inspiration in the mysteries of love.
Honor the Earth, its creatures, and the spirits. Use Nature's gifts wisely. Respect her power. Fear her fury.1 -
Zordrage✭✭✭✭✭Yeah i TOTALLY gonna look what gear that NB is wearing that is coming to me stealthed and murdering me out of nowhere....
or what that 20+ people in the enemy zerg wears while they shoot a billion stuff to my way......
ALSO COSTUMES !!!!!!Edited by Zordrage on January 6, 2018 12:39AM3 -
Magdalina✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I have no idea what you're talking about but it definitely doesn't sound like ESO. In any of the parts, in fact. Are you sure you're on the right forum?
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jssriot✭✭✭✭✭
✭PVE: Who cares? It's a MMO-RPG game, let people play their toons as they want. If you need status symbols then flaunt your monster sets and trial-drop gear. No one cares.
PVP: If you're playing more attention to enemy's chest pieces and robes than what skills they are using, you're doing it wrong.
I started ESO on stam toons running med armor. Have you seen most med armor? Especially for female toons? It's horrible. So horrible. Especially the pants--omg. If it's not flat out fugly, then it won't dye nicely like light or heavy armor. In fact I hate most the motifs in this game. They all were designed by people with very different ideas of what looks cool for an Elder Scrolls game than I have. Costumes are a godsend.PC-NA since 2015. Tired and unimpressed.2 -
DieAlteHexe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭PVE: Who cares? It's a MMO-RPG game, let people play their toons as they want. If you need status symbols then flaunt your monster sets and trial-drop gear. No one cares.
PVP: If you're playing more attention to enemy's chest pieces and robes than what skills they are using, you're doing it wrong.
I started ESO on stam toons running med armor. Have you seen most med armor? Especially for female toons? It's horrible. So horrible. Especially the pants--omg. If it's not flat out fugly, then it won't dye nicely like light or heavy armor. In fact I hate most the motifs in this game. They all were designed by people with very different ideas of what looks cool for an Elder Scrolls game than I have. Costumes are a godsend.
So much this. I never have cared for the armor design and when costumes came about I was over the moon. Between the flappy hip thingamabobs (faulds) and the way leather looks on so many styles...just ugh.
Dirty, filthy casual aka Nancy, the Wallet Warrior Carebear Potato Whale Snowflake0 -
MehrunesFlagon✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't care for transmog but get there are some that do.
I don't care as I wear costumes and have been wearing costumes in cyrodil for the longest time. Most I've played with have. as for rapidly identifying I don't look at what someone's wearing I look at the symbol next to there name I can recognise there rank. If I'm in stealth I can see that and there health number and decide if I want to engage. If it's a Zerg I'm just looking to avoid them. I'm not noticing a thing.
As for worth as a character - people look at titles More than clothes. I personally dislike that people treat me different most of the time. you will rarely catch me with stormproof on unless I've just got in a group and used it for that. Because I make more friends without it get prioritised in pvp and asked to duel more and I don't like duelling. But there are ways to measure worth beyond what you wear. And ways to hide it.
Transmog is not my thing but i don't think it's going to destroy the game.
well from what I understand it will allow us to use lower level looks too,which of course we know some of those offer skimpier variants of their ruby counterparts.0 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
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It depends if they can fight or if their about to have a zoolander walk off .0 -
Lylith✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »
besides, it's good to have choices.
who wants to wear the same thing day/week/year in day/week/year out?
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VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The new Outfit system won't change anything that wasn't already present in game from:- Disguises (before they were disabled in Cyrodiil anyways) - tell me, how do you tell what class a goblin is? This was a very common way for players to hide their armor. A heavy armor tank might wear a Bloodthorn Cultist's robe, for example.
- Polymorphs
- Costumes -again, a very common way for players to hide their armor weight.
So the Outfits won't change anything that wasn't already allowed by the game in PVP. In PVE, special-looking gear also doesn't matter much when my CP 690 crafter can make super snazzy training gear for my Level 4 character fresh off of the Morrowind slave ship.
Fun story about using a polymorph to disguise my appearance in PVP: I'm an EP player going to fish in the Imperial City. So I pull out my Xivkyn Augur polymorph and settle down for some fishing. Now, most PVP players will have the shield symbols active, so its not likely to be an effective disguise, but hey I figure I'll give it a shot.
Well, I fooled someone, but not how I expected. I'm fishing near an EP owned flag looking like a Xivkyn spellcaster when an EP player leaps down and starts swinging wildly at me. When I didn't take any damage, they stopped, looked at me for a bit. I waved and they ran off.2 -
Kiralyn2000✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Positive Identification
Costumes are great, until everyone is wearing the same costume as you. And for what reason? Clothes in modern times are a form of self expression, but in a game inspired by medieval customs, they serve to identify rank, nobility, or wealth. A level 1 character should not look like King Emeric, and vice versa.
Indistinguishable player classes.
In player versus player (PvP) battles, understanding your foe puts you a step ahead. Consider these steps: Evaluate. Prepare. Engage. Players need a system to calculate opponents' strengths and weaknesses and then prepare for engagement. Imagery in the form of gear styles and sets is the foremost visual aid, for it is actually easier to batch process mentally than listed class icons and levels. When is the last time you were able to quickly identify the composition of a large (20+) group in Cyrodil?
There's like 6000 motifs, usable in all armor weights. And any "class" can wear any armor weight, and frequently wear a mix. Even without costumes, how exactly are you going to glance across a group and tell what they all are? Thankfully, the days of early WoW's "there's OK PvP Set and Great PvP Set, and you can tell by what color the shoulder flames are" are long gone, even from WoW.
...also, you talk like MMO pvp somehow matters.
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monktoasty✭✭✭✭✭There's nothing W9RSE then lvl based clothes lol..you can tell every9bes lvl just by the crap they are wearing. Much better for variety l. Noone cares that you are good at the game0
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seaef✭✭✭✭✭I am much more interested in making my characters look exactly the way I want them to than I am in satisfying any of your above desires to identify other players in various specific ways.
Nowhere did I say costumes are bad. I am only hoping to educate everyone of the negative side effects.
Regurgitating your opinion across a thread is NOT educating."The Illuminati are very achievement focused. It's like Xbox - only everything is hardcore."
- Kirsten Geary2
