sustain
Syiccal
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I've recently started playing again after leaving just before morrowind..and no matter what class I play I can't sustain for toffee at the minuet..i know cp has changed and reduce cost has gone but can't even fight off one player now with out running empty.what am I missing?
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HatchetHaro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Sustain has been hit really hard for Morrowind, and it took quite a while for people to adapt and find completely new playstyles. However, it's Clockwork City now, with plenty of time since Morrowind. If you look around, I'm certain that you'll find a good guide for what you're trying to do.
Here's a quick tip to get you started: for PvE, work some heavy attacks into your rotations; for PvP, go with extra regen which you can get from many sources.Edited by HatchetHaro on December 21, 2017 6:17AMBest Argonian NA and I will fight anyone for it
20 Argonians
6x IR, 7x GH, 7x TTT, 5x GS, 6x DB, 1x PB, 4x SBS, 1x MM, 1x US, 2x CB, 1x Unchained1 -
Zordrage✭✭✭✭✭As a Magplar i either hide behind like a coward and beam dot people...
or
puncturing Strikes
puncturing Strikes
puncturing Strikes
puncturing Strikes
puncturing Strikes
puncturing Strikes
puncturing StrikesEdited by Zordrage on December 17, 2017 12:41PM0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I used to never use potions, now I pop them like candy.
Two easy things to do that don't change up your build or gear all that much.
1. Put Skill Cost Reduction glyphs on your Jewelry, 2 should be good, leave the other one a Damage Glyph
2. Weave in Fully Charged heavy attacks, if you have points in Tenacity, this can recharge you in two or three attacks.Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"3 -
Morvane✭✭✭✭I used to never use potions, now I pop them like candy.
Two easy things to do that don't change up your build or gear all that much.
1. Put Skill Cost Reduction glyphs on your Jewelry, 2 should be good, leave the other one a Damage Glyph
2. Weave in Fully Charged heavy attacks, if you have points in Tenacity, this can recharge you in two or three attacks.
never put cost red glyphs on your jewelry in Pve. NEVER (if u dont want stuck in dolmen's and normals content)DC Dunmer Sorcerer since 2014
@morvayn54, PC/EU1 -
Insandros✭✭✭✭I've recently started playing again after leaving just before morrowind..and no matter what class I play I can't sustain for toffee at the minuet..i know cp has changed and reduce cost has gone but can't even fight off one player now with out running empty.what am I missing?
Yep it's harder to, but with ajustement you should be able to overcome, just need to work your things out to fits your need and gameplay, only toon i couldn't, so stoped playing it, was my Magicka NB... found the solution instead of letting him rot, converted to Stam, My Mag Sorc had no issues on sustain but didn't liked the DPS lot and no way i'll play a pet build, so he also went Stam... no sustain issues on none, nor my Magika Templar and Warden Healers, my Magika Warden needed a few ajustement to sustian but i can.... of course sustain on dummy is always harder than in real situation but besides my Mag NB, no issues... Just need to think a bit different than before. As for adjustment you might need a bit more recovery things, as some glyphs on jewls or food with regen, while you adpat, after a while you might get the dance and know what do to and not to do, or when to do others thigns, and after a while you can switch back for dmg jewls or normal bi-stats food when you get the hang of it...that's what happenned to me..0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
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never put cost red glyphs on your jewelry in Pve. NEVER (if u dont want stuck in dolmen's and normals content)
Why? I can solo any dolmen in the game, most normal Group Dungeons too. Never got stuck in a dolmen or a delve or a dungeon. And I do this on all my alts.
So, what is this reason that putting a skill cost reduction on my jewelry is the end of the world and the death of my gaming?
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"0 -
Ladislao✭✭✭✭✭
never put cost red glyphs on your jewelry in Pve. NEVER (if u dont want stuck in dolmen's and normals content)
Why? I can solo any dolmen in the game, most normal Group Dungeons too. Never got stuck in a dolmen or a delve or a dungeon. And I do this on all my alts.
So, what is this reason that putting a skill cost reduction on my jewelry is the end of the world and the death of my gaming?
Not META
Edited by Ladislao on December 18, 2017 9:16PMEverything is viable3 -
ol_BANK_lo✭✭✭✭✭The Morrowind sustain changes are the dumbest thing ZOS has done. I assume it was aimed at PVP, which I get. But it makes for the most boring PVE end-game play-style. I left when Morrowind came out. When I came back a couple of months later, I find myself spending a lot more time in PVP and not doing as much in the trial setting. It just isn't fun. ZOS has been beat up repeatedly on this subject by the public, Alcast, Gilliam and others. They don't care. IMO, it was a waste of resources to make these changes, and they went way overboard. I can sustain on my PVP character without too many heavy attacks, but need regen stuff. I can sustain on PVE characters with heavy attacks, but it's stupid.5
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DarkAedin✭✭✭✭✭1 cost reduction glyph is better if ur a spammer, the 2nd cost reduction loses potency due to diminishing returns. And yes. It goes further then regen IF u dont heavy attack often.
It is known0 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I used to never use potions, now I pop them like candy.
Two easy things to do that don't change up your build or gear all that much.
1. Put Skill Cost Reduction glyphs on your Jewelry, 2 should be good, leave the other one a Damage Glyph
2. Weave in Fully Charged heavy attacks, if you have points in Tenacity, this can recharge you in two or three attacks.
Cost reduction won’t help you in a protracted fight, since it will take longer for your tank to fill. Ppl need to invest in actual Regen a smidge.0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Cost reduction won’t help you in a protracted fight, since it will take longer for your tank to fill. Ppl need to invest in actual Regen a smidge.
I have cranked up Regen to some good levels and it does not fill my tank up during a fight all that well. I use Heavy Attacks for that. Maybe PvP is different. But I have tested both Regen and Cost Reduction, and I run out of magic faster with Regen on my jewelry than if I have cost reduction.
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"1 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Cost reduction won’t help you in a protracted fight, since it will take longer for your tank to fill. Ppl need to invest in actual Regen a smidge.
I have cranked up Regen to some good levels and it does not fill my tank up during a fight all that well. I use Heavy Attacks for that. Maybe PvP is different. But I have tested both Regen and Cost Reduction, and I run out of magic faster with Regen on my jewelry than if I have cost reduction.
What threshold though? At 1500+ Regen and with weaving attacks, you should never run out of resources. And that’s usually only with 1 regen/ 1 spell or weapon power/ 1 reduction. That’s the best setup I’ve found for tanks, healers and dps.0 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Do more Heavy Attacks, drink more Pots, and spend a lot more time between fights waiting around and doing nothing enjoyable."A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »
What threshold though? At 1500+ Regen and with weaving attacks, you should never run out of resources. And that’s usually only with 1 regen/ 1 spell or weapon power/ 1 reduction. That’s the best setup I’ve found for tanks, healers and dps.
Last time I tried this, it was at 1900 Regen.
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"0 -
Armatesz✭✭✭✭✭I'm wondering which sustain, health mag or stam? I know as a magplar running heavy for mag and health if it is crowds try to herd them and hit them with radiant aura and puncturing sweep them. Don't run out of mag and health barely takes a hit. Still am unsure how stam sustains work though. Pros about running heavy is allowing yourself to get hit for sustain too.Ärmätèsz
Xbox NA
Guildless (by choice)0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Here's the funny part. Sustain was nerfed into the ground to try to prevent infinite resources in Cyrodiil. 6 months later, my PVP sustain couldnt be better. I use witchmothers and one magic recovery glyph. Meanwhile, in PVE land, sustain is still garbage, even though nobody was complaining about PVE sustain in the first place.
In PVP, one of your gear sets should be about recovery for most builds. Stacking straight damage can be tough to manage. You also need to work in your heavy attacks, and consider witchmothers (magic) or dubious camoran throne (stamina) for food. If you were getting away with no recovery/reduction glyphs in the past, consider adding at least one. Also consider the attro and serpent mundus stones.
In PVE, you need to rethink things from the ground up. The idea of being able to perform your rotation with no thought to your resource pull is out the window.
-On stamina, its easy, 2-3 heavy attacks per rotation is all you need. Stamina sustain and DPS is as good as its ever been if you adapt your rotation slightly. As DW HAs are really fast, it's easy to incorporate.
-For magic, its a little harder. Heavy Attacks are much longer and harder to work into a traditional rotation. Most magic builds have gone to witchmothers for food, and many are going to an infused absorb magic enchant on their front bar. It does wonders for sustain. A lot of builds have gone away from a spammable in favor of an extra heavy attack or two. The only magic class I know that can get away from heavy attacks is Magic Nighblade. Their spammable is cheap and siphoning attacks does wonders for regen. I would personally only suggest adjusting your mundus stone or jewelry enchants as a last resort, but one recovery/cost reduction glyph is certainly not the end of the world.0 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Cost reduction won’t help you in a protracted fight, since it will take longer for your tank to fill. Ppl need to invest in actual Regen a smidge.
I have cranked up Regen to some good levels and it does not fill my tank up during a fight all that well. I use Heavy Attacks for that. Maybe PvP is different. But I have tested both Regen and Cost Reduction, and I run out of magic faster with Regen on my jewelry than if I have cost reduction.
If you’re at 2k Regen and you can’t sustain with weaving then it’s time to look at your skill bar, sets and roataions. I mean that’s like healer levels of high. Maybe look for sets that sustain you: withered hand, lich.0 -
Saturn✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've recently started playing again after leaving just before morrowind..and no matter what class I play I can't sustain for toffee at the minuet..i know cp has changed and reduce cost has gone but can't even fight off one player now with out running empty.what am I missing?
Welcome to the new and improved ESO experience. Do you like heavy attacking? No? Well, too bad! That's all you can do now! Hahahahahahahaha... No, but seriously, that's literally all combat is now. ZOS still somehow manages to call it "fast-paced" though, which means they haven't playtested these changes themselves I imagine. But yeah, the combat is ***.. I'm hoping that once they lose enough players they'll actually begin to listen to their audience again, but for now they are just ruining a once-beautiful game with terrible ideas and untested implementations..
[minor edit for profanity masking]Edited by ZOS_CoriJ on December 19, 2017 6:37PM0 -
Armatesz✭✭✭✭✭Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Here's the funny part. Sustain was nerfed into the ground to try to prevent infinite resources in Cyrodiil. 6 months later, my PVP sustain couldnt be better. I use witchmothers and one magic recovery glyph. Meanwhile, in PVE land, sustain is still garbage, even though nobody was complaining about PVE sustain in the first place.
In PVP, one of your gear sets should be about recovery for most builds. Stacking straight damage can be tough to manage. You also need to work in your heavy attacks, and consider witchmothers (magic) or dubious camoran throne (stamina) for food. If you were getting away with no recovery/reduction glyphs in the past, consider adding at least one. Also consider the attro and serpent mundus stones.
In PVE, you need to rethink things from the ground up. The idea of being able to perform your rotation with no thought to your resource pull is out the window.
-On stamina, its easy, 2-3 heavy attacks per rotation is all you need. Stamina sustain and DPS is as good as its ever been if you adapt your rotation slightly. As DW HAs are really fast, it's easy to incorporate.
-For magic, its a little harder. Heavy Attacks are much longer and harder to work into a traditional rotation. Most magic builds have gone to witchmothers for food, and many are going to an infused absorb magic enchant on their front bar. It does wonders for sustain. A lot of builds have gone away from a spammable in favor of an extra heavy attack or two. The only magic class I know that can get away from heavy attacks is Magic Nighblade. Their spammable is cheap and siphoning attacks does wonders for regen. I would personally only suggest adjusting your mundus stone or jewelry enchants as a last resort, but one recovery/cost reduction glyph is certainly not the end of the world.
I run as a heavy magplar and for heavy attacks if I need to recover magic is 2 or 3 tops typically. Another interesting point of running as a heavy is allowing yourself to get hit by elemental attacks. You would be surprised at some of the chains you can do that help you recover. I will say it is easier for templars for recovery because of radiant aura applying magic steal to all enemies around.Ärmätèsz
Xbox NA
Guildless (by choice)0 -
Banana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If you stink like me you need a resto staff. If ya magicEdited by Banana on December 19, 2017 7:19AM0 -
SydneyGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The changes to sustain was an awful move. It just made the game less fun, in my opinion.
I have several stamina characters. A couple of them are Orcs, and wow, their sustain is SO MUCH CRAPPIER than the stam sustain on Redguards and Bosmers. It's not even close. As much as I'd love to play an Orc, it's just not worth it to take them into dungeons. All it means is I have to take long pauses between fights until my stamina builds back up, and that's NOT FUN ZOS. It doesn't make it challenging. It just makes it less fun.
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Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »
If you’re at 2k Regen and you can’t sustain with weaving then it’s time to look at your skill bar, sets and roataions. I mean that’s like healer levels of high. Maybe look for sets that sustain you: withered hand, lich.
My whole point that started this string within a thread was using Skill Cost Reductions is way to deal with the Sustain changes with no real changes to the build. I still stand by that.
My Sustain is just fine with my current set up. The only change I made was to use the Cost Reduction Glyphs.
It seems others agree with me. However it all comes down to how people play. Which is why the Meta is Myth. The Meta is a source of ideas on how to play the game, but the best build for a player is the build that works for them, not someone else.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/386064/spell-cost-passive-and-glyph-discussion
Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"0 -
Dawnblade✭✭✭✭✭
never put cost red glyphs on your jewelry in Pve. NEVER (if u dont want stuck in dolmen's and normals content)
Why? I can solo any dolmen in the game, most normal Group Dungeons too. Never got stuck in a dolmen or a delve or a dungeon. And I do this on all my alts.
So, what is this reason that putting a skill cost reduction on my jewelry is the end of the world and the death of my gaming?
Not META
Just curious - but I wonder how many of the 'meta' followers can actually quantify the difference between the 'meta' choice and anything else (race, glyph, skills, rotation, gear set, etc).
Even more curious - how many of the 'meta' followers are like the fat man in a bike store spending hundreds for light weight titanium or carbon parts to save an ounce or two in total weight, yet carrying many extra pounds on their own frame.0 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm so glad I play stam NB and I have my wonderful ability that gives back stam as well as 38k max and 3.5k recovery TY zos0
