Are you KIDDING me?! I am 100% DONE with these developers and their diluted, unrewarding events.

Mettaricana · December 2017

Phage wrote: »

This event was very poorly handled.
It shouldn't have been tied to the Random Dungeon Finder at all, given the numerous problems it has.

It shouldn't have been tied to Random Dungeons at all, but rather just any Dungeon. People mostly ran part 1 Normals anyway.

It shouldn't have been 1 per character, but made grindable so that putting the time into the event was actually rewarded, and people could more or less get what they came for.

It shouldn't have included trash such as lockpicks, treasure maps, single motif stones, etc. Those aren't rewards. Those are insults.

It shouldn't have let you pull duplicate drops. Gina literally said duplicate drops wouldn't happen: Well the loot log doesn't lie. They happened.

It definitely shouldn't have been ran at the same time as a Free Play Weekend. The servers are under lots of stress during normal events, adding Free Play onto that is just asking for *** to happen.

Nothing about this event was rewarding. It was frustrating as *** to queue into (if you could even), and once you got the box it was a huge disappointment 99% of the time.

Learn from this abysmal mistake, ZOS.

Never run an event this way again. Do it right.

Never seen truer words ever

GreenhaloX · December 2017

I don't even know what the hell is this dark shaman costume or what it looks like, or do I care. However, I understand completely about the frustration (as you are exhibiting) from trying so hard to get something, and you never get it. Yeah, I curse those Powerball and all those other lottery retailers each and every week.. Son-of-a-beaches.. aaarrgggghhhhh!!!

MornaBaine · December 2017

Phage wrote: »

This event was very poorly handled.
It shouldn't have been tied to the Random Dungeon Finder at all, given the numerous problems it has.

It shouldn't have been tied to Random Dungeons at all, but rather just any Dungeon. People mostly ran part 1 Normals anyway.

It shouldn't have been 1 per character, but made grindable so that putting the time into the event was actually rewarded, and people could more or less get what they came for.

It shouldn't have included trash such as lockpicks, treasure maps, single motif stones, etc. Those aren't rewards. Those are insults.

It shouldn't have let you pull duplicate drops. Gina literally said duplicate drops wouldn't happen: Well the loot log doesn't lie. They happened.

It definitely shouldn't have been ran at the same time as a Free Play Weekend. The servers are under lots of stress during normal events, adding Free Play onto that is just asking for *** to happen.

Nothing about this event was rewarding. It was frustrating as *** to queue into (if you could even), and once you got the box it was a huge disappointment 99% of the time.

Learn from this abysmal mistake, ZOS.

Never run an event this way again. Do it right.

All of this. NO ONE actually likes RNG. Because I knew I'd be disappointed I've only half-heartedly participated. I didn't bother over the weekend and I have run the dungeons twice a day otherwise. All I've gotten is trash. I'm not gnashing my teeth over not scoring the big houses or mounts packages (tho those are nice) but I reallllly wanted the white war hound. I have 2 other versions of that dog and would have loved to add him to my "kennel" in housing! lol Anyway, ZOS knows we hate their RNG... they also know dangling shiny bait before our noses will get us to log in and make the game look super successful. It's not nice and I don't appreciate it. And I do feel kinda bad for people who are never going to be able to get certain things they want. There definitely SHOULD have been gems of some sort with which you could have bought individual items even if they kept the big multi item packages separate.

Kel · December 2017

zyk wrote: »

I think events like this hurt the game in the long run. I did maybe 20 runs total and I can't say I or anyone else seemed to enjoy it.

In the end, it was a complete waste of time for me. I only have myself to blame because I chose to do something I do not enjoy anymore for the chance at some compelling loot, but nonetheless it negatively impacts my view of the game.

I despise the RNG in this game. I dislike ZOS for implementing it so thoroughly because I know they know it's psychologically exploitative.

Whatever you do, stay away from World of Warcraft, then. They didn't just double down on RNG in Legion, they quadruple downed on it. And more coming in the new expansion.
Honestly, I can't think of one single MMO that has no RNG whatsoever, to some degree. ESO has far less then others, even with this event.

mirta000b16_ESO · December 2017

GreenhaloX wrote: »

I don't even know what the hell is this dark shaman costume or what it looks like, or do I care. However, I understand completely about the frustration (as you are exhibiting) from trying so hard to get something, and you never get it. Yeah, I curse those Powerball and all those other lottery retailers each and every week.. Son-of-a-beaches.. aaarrgggghhhhh!!!

It's a special kind of lottery that thanks you for engaging in it for years, then asks you to dedicate 30 minutes per filling out each lottery ticket, however you only get as many lottery tickets as many hours you invest grinding preparing for this lottery. Maximum lottery tickets per day are 14. Also despite promising this awesome stuff, it gives you empty paper cups every time when you're finished filling out the ticket. Oh and those awesome rewards that you see? Not for sale. Oh and the lottery is gone in 5 days, so you didn't win? Too bad.

j3crow · December 2017

Phage wrote: »

This event was very poorly handled.
It shouldn't have been tied to the Random Dungeon Finder at all, given the numerous problems it has.

It shouldn't have been tied to Random Dungeons at all, but rather just any Dungeon. People mostly ran part 1 Normals anyway.

It shouldn't have been 1 per character, but made grindable so that putting the time into the event was actually rewarded, and people could more or less get what they came for.

It shouldn't have included trash such as lockpicks, treasure maps, single motif stones, etc. Those aren't rewards. Those are insults.

It shouldn't have let you pull duplicate drops. Gina literally said duplicate drops wouldn't happen: Well the loot log doesn't lie. They happened.

It definitely shouldn't have been ran at the same time as a Free Play Weekend. The servers are under lots of stress during normal events, adding Free Play onto that is just asking for *** to happen.

Nothing about this event was rewarding. It was frustrating as *** to queue into (if you could even), and once you got the box it was a huge disappointment 99% of the time.

Learn from this abysmal mistake, ZOS.

Never run an event this way again. Do it right.

I agree completely. They naively believed they were creating the "thrill of the chase". It did not. It gave people an aspiration for whatever it is they wanted, but than no other mechanism to achieve it other than "blind luck".

So ultimately, folks qued for content that became brutally monotonous, raced through it as fast as they could so that it became a chore, and than were disappointed and frustrated in the end and basically told, "your personal efforts to achieve what you wanted are pointless and futile. Its random and you have no control over it. Oh, there is no other way to get that thing you were looking for. Too bad for you"

Good job ZoS. As if people don't already feel that enough in their real lives. You naively think that it will be good for your game environment to manipulate and disappoint your player's expectations... Just wow

Instead of creating the positive psychological feedback loop of been shown something that you wanted, and than be given a clear tangible method to achieve it, ZoS chose to create a psychological mechanism of defeat where your efforts for the reward you wanted didn't matter. So, when folks see others with whatever it is that they wanted, it does nothing but add salt to the wound, because it was all based on RNG and not on one's own personal efforts.

It demonstrates to me that the development team does not understand player psychology, and makes some real uneducated assumptions.

ZoS makes a great single player game, with a co-op function. But when it comes to understanding how to maintain and meet healthy expectations with an MMO player base, they are clueless.

It also shows that ZoS doesn't value Business Intelligence. I'm not talking about any high-end corporate espionage here. I mean the basic things like understanding what other titles have tried and what has failed and what they had to change.

A really cursory look at their competitors would easily reveal that pretty much to a game, they understand the caustic effect of dangling something that someone one wants in front of their face, and than telling them "Oh, you can't have this. Its completely random, so that guy over there who didn't even really care about it, we'll give it to him. But, not you. And we're also not giving you any other way to get it.. its all random.... Have fun!"

Even titles that are clearly exploitative opportunist, that have a clear P2W model, understand that for episodic events like this, they need some kind of currency or some other mechanism for players to "work toward a goal like getting a certain cosmetic, and than be able to achieve it through some means that they, themselves control".

I mean for Pete's sake, even Cryptic understands this model and that they need to reward tangible efforts, with tangible successes.

zyk · December 2017

The sad part is that ZOS execs are receiving reports that show what an AMAZING SUCCESS the event was based purely basic metrics like overall participation.

I think ZOS operates like:

How Sheet Happens

In the Beginning was The Plan
And then came the Assumptions
And the Assumptions were without form
And the Plan was completely without substance
And the darkness was upon the face of the Workers
And the Workers spoke amongst themselves, saying
"It is a crock of sheet, and it stinketh."

And the Workers went unto their Supervisors and sayeth,
"It is a pail of dung and none may abide the odor thereof."

And the Supervisors went unto their Managers and sayeth unto them,
"It is a container of excrement and it is very strong,
such that none may abide by it."

And the Managers went unto their Directors and sayeth,
"It is a vessel of fertilizer, and none may abide its strength."

And the Directors spoke among themselves, saying one to another,
"It contains that which aids plant growth, and it is very strong."

And the Directors went unto the Vice Presidents and sayeth unto them,
"It promotes growth and is very powerful."

And the Vice Presidents went unto the President and sayeth unto him,
"This new Plan will actively promote the growth and efficiency of this
Company, and in these Areas in particular."
And the President looked upon The Plan,
And saw that it was good, and The Plan became Policy.
And this is how Sheet Happens.

Palidon · December 2017

I have to salute many of the players who put some serious thought into their posts on this thread. A lot that was said made sense. I hope ZOS takes note of the many comments about this event and makes some changes if they decide to run it again.

I however, could sum this event up in two words. IT STUNK.

j3crow · December 2017

For those of you belittling the anger of those that are disappointed, you are as clueless as ZoS on the issue. its not even about the items themselves. Its about people having something they wanted shown to them, and being told regardless of their efforts.... and hours... that it doesn't matter, and there is no clearly defined way for them to achieve their goals and its all random. Oh, and there is no other recourse either.. It creates a mental state of frustration.. Not fun

Some of these items were data-mined literally months ago, and some of us have been waiting all of this time for them to show up in-game.

Maybe some of you just can't get the point. But as a consumer,, I certainly do. A lot of you are F2P, and that's fine. But there are many of us who support this game financially. (Thanks ZoS, for all of those dye stamps I can't actually use, because I am still giving you money)

I'm certainly not going to continue to pay for things and give money to a game that just sets me up for frustration and disappointment. Many of you are right. Its just a game. And there are plenty of other titles that understand managing player expectations, and creating the mechanisms for the positive feedback loops that keep people playing their games. Maybe I am putting my money in the wrong place

idk · December 2017

If OP is done with the game until he can get the Dark Shaman costume how will he know when he can get it?

Carbonised · December 2017

j3crow wrote: »

For those of you belittling the anger of those that are disappointed, you are as clueless as ZoS on the issue. its not even about the items themselves. Its about people having something they wanted shown to them, and being told regardless of their efforts.... and hours... that it doesn't matter, and there is no clearly defined way for them to achieve their goals and its all random. Oh, and there is no other recourse either.. It creates a mental state of frustration.. Not fun

This is what many people (and ZOS) seem to fail to grasp. While random ratio rewards are indeed powerful for creating addictive behaviour, they have a huge drawback - they aren't fun. Especially once they are so rare and infrequent that many will miss out on them.

And we also know that dangling something sweet in front of someone, just to yank it away again at the last minute, that only creates anger, frustration and hostility (point in case this thread and some of the comments).

Aurielle · December 2017

Waseem wrote: »

Why is everyone mad on the ugliest costume ever released

It's so that they can show off their e-pe... er, their trial skins.

OP, I get it that RNG reward systems are frustrating. I'm not a fan of them either, which is why I didn't go above and beyond to increase my chances of getting that 20 mount pack (that clouded senche has long been on my list of things I reaaaaaally want in this game). It's also the reason why I haven't gone above and beyond my financial means to try to get the frost atronach mount, even though it would be perfect for one of my characters. At the end of the day, I'm able to recognize that they are just fancy art assets that have no impact on my ability to enjoy the game.

I just want to underscore the fact that you ran dungeons 63 times to get a single free cosmetic item, and are producing veritable buckets of salt right now because you did not get it. Does your enjoyment of this game truly hinge upon being able to wear the Dark Shaman costume? Why would you subject yourself to doing something you clearly don't enjoy over and over again, just for a shot at some pixels?

DMuehlhausen · December 2017

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

I’m really glad I didn’t renew my sub for December. All I wanted was the Dark Shaman costume. THAT’S IT. That’s all I’ve wanted for the past five months. Some people have wanted it even longer than me. I put in roughly 63 characters of work towards getting it. This was supposed to be a 10 million players celebration event, right? Part of the reason that’s significant is because of the TIME people put into the game. If nobody played the game, there’d be nothing to celebrate. So why am I sitting here more annoyed with the game than I’ve ever been instead of being fulfilled by an event celebrating such a “monumental” occasion? Why was the time I put into this event rewarded with garbage?

Some of you will think I’m exaggerating, but consider the principle of the matter too. There should’ve been a currency that you had to grind to purchase the items, with the 20-item “jackpots” being left up to the terrible RNG. I don’t like having things dangled over my head like I’m some dog (I wouldn’t even do this to my dog. If he worked for that treat, he’s going to get it). And really, this is just that final cherry on top that just destroyed this game for me. Crown Crates, “Radiant” Apex mounts, “Chapters”, absurdly overpriced homes that are ultimately useless, ridiculously long loading screens for my wife on PS4, bringing back the old crown crates without the gem option, and now this?! After having my hopes crushed at least 63 consecutive times for no good reason, I’m just done. Can’t do it. Just thinking about this game makes me sick.

If the Dark Shaman costume comes back again, I’ll be back I guess. Until then, congrats to anyone that really wanted it and ended up getting it.
No, you can’t have my stuff, and I’ll make sure the door doesn’t hit me on the way out.

Oh no you didn't renew your sub...well at least your crafting bag will hold the old items till they are used while you are playing for free.

Stewart1874 · December 2017

Personally, I think the low drop rate was a desire by Zenimax not to release too many high value costumes for free. I really wanted the shaman outfit too so I'm a bit miffed after 12-16 attempts all I got was a shitey dog.

I was also annoyed with dye stamps being included, the very definition of a stocking filler. Why not just give us provisioning items ? They'd actually have more use.

It was overall a worthwhile event that brought me back to the game, but I was underwhelmed by the clockwork city, a bit disappointed with 10m stories.I really hope the Christmas event pulls something out the bag.

nolangrady · December 2017

I have never witnessed so much blathering about free stuff in all my life

Aurielle · December 2017

Arv_Morvis wrote: »

I'm a new player, i was aware of the event but did not partake.. not really annoyed i didn't get to join as from what i learned i had to do dungeon runs which i have absolutely no clue about and was not really interested in doing. To me its neat that the devs are celebrating such a milestone and from my short time here i can't fathom how people are so obsessed over costumes to the point of fanatical.... but as i said i'm new.

Welcome! This is the right attitude to have. Going absolutely bonkers over a dungeon event because you didn't get a FREE COSTUME is pretty much the definition of entitlement. I enjoyed this event because it had been a while since I'd done any dungeons (I mostly PVP these days). I had a lot of fun brushing up on my PVE DPS/healing and helping out newer players. There were runs that nearly went pear-shaped multiple times (I'm looking at you Cradle of Shadows), but it was really enjoyable to teach people the mechanics and see the group succeed. I even gave tanking a whirl for the first time with a character I created recently, and now have something new to focus on for the next little while.

I think people lose sight of the big picture sometimes because they're so obsessed with getting their cosmetic rewards that, at the end of the day, don't really mean a lot in the greater scheme of things.

kojou · December 2017

I sympathize with the OP on not getting the desired costume. I also think the amount of random normal dungeons to get the rewards should have been more than 1 per character. I was also hoping for the dark shaman costume and got it the second day.

I have 10 of my 14 characters ready for dungeons (gear, skill lines, etc) so I could run random normal dungeons until I was sick of it and basically did, but is it fair that a player with as many characters as me had that many more chances? Probably not, but its not like I didn't put in my time to have all those characters in the first place...

What was my point... I don't remember... I hope ZoS found some bugs that they will fix with their dungeon finder stress test event.

kojou · December 2017

Phage wrote: »

This event was very poorly handled.
It shouldn't have been tied to the Random Dungeon Finder at all, given the numerous problems it has.

It shouldn't have been tied to Random Dungeons at all, but rather just any Dungeon. People mostly ran part 1 Normals anyway.

It shouldn't have been 1 per character, but made grindable so that putting the time into the event was actually rewarded, and people could more or less get what they came for.

It shouldn't have included trash such as lockpicks, treasure maps, single motif stones, etc. Those aren't rewards. Those are insults.

It shouldn't have let you pull duplicate drops. Gina literally said duplicate drops wouldn't happen: Well the loot log doesn't lie. They happened.

It definitely shouldn't have been ran at the same time as a Free Play Weekend. The servers are under lots of stress during normal events, adding Free Play onto that is just asking for *** to happen.

Nothing about this event was rewarding. It was frustrating as *** to queue into (if you could even), and once you got the box it was a huge disappointment 99% of the time.

Learn from this abysmal mistake, ZOS.

Never run an event this way again. Do it right.

I think they should fix the bugs they found and run the event again the exact same way to test the fixes.

DieAlteHexe · December 2017

Arv_Morvis wrote: »

I'm a new player, i was aware of the event but did not partake.. not really annoyed i didn't get to join as from what i learned i had to do dungeon runs which i have absolutely no clue about and was not really interested in doing. To me its neat that the devs are celebrating such a milestone and from my short time here i can't fathom how people are so obsessed over costumes to the point of fanatical.... but as i said i'm new.

I'm not a new player but this is basically my attitude as well. I don't get it either. To me, anything "extra" is just that..."extra". I didn't even bother with the event once I saw the angst surrounding it (both the technical glitches and the ire that folks weren't getting what they wanted).

I honestly think it's why I still enjoy the game after all this time. I dither along, exploring, crafting, smacking things and if I get something cool whilst I'm doing these things? Yaaaay me!

I learnt years back to not invest myself in any game to the point where I got irate over it. Has stood me well over the years.

ThePrinceOfBargains · December 2017

Aurielle wrote: »

This is the right attitude to have. Going absolutely bonkers over a dungeon event because you didn't get a FREE COSTUME is pretty much the definition of entitlement.

No it’s not “pretty much” anything. It doesn’t even resemble the definition.

Entitlement would be if I had not participated at all in the event because I didn’t have time (which is actually true, but I didn’t mention that because it was my poor decision and ZOS had nothing to do with it.), then claimed I should be given the costume for merely being an ESO player or plus subscriber at the time (10 million players; I’m one of them). I would believe that I inherently have a right to the rewards based on status alone, despite not participating in the event.

Wanting a specific reward in exchange for the effort I put into getting it is not entitlement. As I said, and as I’m sure people will continue to remind me unnecessarily, I know the event didn’t work like that. The point is that it really should have when you consider the occasion. Not more of these chance games with terrible RNG that everyone hates.

reiverx · December 2017

I don't think there's enough creativity in ZOS to do anything other than layers of RNG.

It's the foundation of their gamble and grind mentality.

Kel · December 2017

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

This is the right attitude to have. Going absolutely bonkers over a dungeon event because you didn't get a FREE COSTUME is pretty much the definition of entitlement.

No it’s not “pretty much” anything. It doesn’t even resemble the definition.

Entitlement would be if I had not participated at all in the event because I didn’t have time (which is actually true, but I didn’t mention that because it was my poor decision and ZOS had nothing to do with it.), then claimed I should be given the costume for merely being an ESO player or plus subscriber at the time (10 million players; I’m one of them). I would believe that I inherently have a right to the rewards based on status alone, despite not participating in the event.

Wanting a specific reward in exchange for the effort I put into getting it is not entitlement. As I said, and as I’m sure people will continue to remind me unnecessarily, I know the event didn’t work like that. The point is that it really should have when you consider the occasion. Not more of these chance games with terrible RNG that everyone hates.

How many others can say they got two out of three things they wanted out of this event?
You can..
So, I'm sorry you didn't get exactly what you wanted. But I don't empathize with your point when you got most of what you were looking for. Others got none...yes, that's entitlement. When you're complaining you didn't get everything, just most....that's the definition of entitlement.

Aurielle · December 2017

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

This is the right attitude to have. Going absolutely bonkers over a dungeon event because you didn't get a FREE COSTUME is pretty much the definition of entitlement.

No it’s not “pretty much” anything. It doesn’t even resemble the definition.

Entitlement would be if I had not participated at all in the event because I didn’t have time (which is actually true, but I didn’t mention that because it was my poor decision and ZOS had nothing to do with it.), then claimed I should be given the costume for merely being an ESO player or plus subscriber at the time (10 million players; I’m one of them). I would believe that I inherently have a right to the rewards based on status alone, despite not participating in the event.

Wanting a specific reward in exchange for the effort I put into getting it is not entitlement. As I said, and as I’m sure people will continue to remind me unnecessarily, I know the event didn’t work like that. The point is that it really should have when you consider the occasion. Not more of these chance games with terrible RNG that everyone hates.

You think this company owes you something because you put in a significant amount of time to participate in a dungeon event, knowing that your chance of getting the reward you wanted was tied to a random number generator. Entitlement. Simple.

kiLLahweSPe · December 2017

Did 84 random dailys. Got the mount in the 2nd Box, the Dark Shaman costume in the 4th and if loot log is right 7 times in total.

This event was exactly what was to be expected, ZOS owes you nothing. And the group finder worked fine for me except on the first evening.

Its RNG, you signed up for it, get over it.

ZOS_Ragnar · December 2017

We have closed this thread. While we welcome and encourage your constructive feedback on the recent event, this thread is framed as a quitting thread. As our Forum Rules state "it is our policy to read the feedback in “goodbye” and “quitting” threads and close them, regardless of whether they are constructive or not." If you would like to continue to discuss the event feel free to do so in another thread.