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The Fun Factor of ESO

Ch4mpTW
Ch4mpTW
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There is something that I have been thinking about for a few months now, and was curious if you all had picked up on it too. And that is in regards to ESO’s fun factor. You see, ESO is a wonderful game. It has its ups, it has its downs, and it has its points in the middle where you’re playing and just are going along for the ride. But 1 thing in particular that has always stood out to me was out I tend to have more fun playing this game solo. As that tends to be where I find the vast majority of my entertainment regarding this game. Playing by myself.

Now then. A few polls both in the past and as of recently have come up asking if players tend to play this game by themselves, with others, or a mix of the 2. And the results of these said polls always seem to indicate that players usually find themselves playing this game solo for the most part. With a mix of playing with others and solo coming in second, and playing strictly with others last. This should be very informative to the devs when these types of polls arise, and said results reveal themselves. Why? Because it should in a sense assist with helping the devs come to a decision about how to create and steer their content to come. After all, you do want to make the most amount of cash as a developer. Yes? You do want to keep people playing your game, and hopefully get others to get their friends to join in on the game. Yes? You play into the hands that show to be the most favorable, and then gather the profits of said successful dealings with said hands.

But! Here is what has me confused... If the devs are truly paying attention to said polls, and studying the data provided by said in-game samples gathered... Why are we not seeing more things that deal into players playing by themselves? Now yes, I’m fully aware that this is a pseudo-MMO game. Or as a few players I’ve heard say, “An online version of Skyrim.” But still, wouldn’t you want to as a dev make more and more content that appeals to solo players? Maelstrom Arena was a good thing, but the problems then came from the content being far too long and a tad bit new challenging for casual player. Throw in lag and glitches, and the content left a bad taste in a lot of player’s mouths. But then on the other side of the coin, you have overland content which is far too easy (with the exception of certain World Bosses) for even the most casual of players. And don’t reallt engage players as a whole. This results in the content at hand being viewed as a place to just grind toons and farm gear. Not as something to be thoroughly embraced and absorbed.

So in analyzing all of this, I have come to a solution of sorts to propose. A solution that has actually been provided numerous times, but tweaked upon a bit. The concept of a “difficulty slider”. Similar to how we can choose between normal and veteran difficulties, why not have another option that is labeled as “solo” for enabling dungeons and trials to be solo’d that aren’t soloable. Thus completely eliminating the whole stress and unpleasant aspects of PUGs. But, still leaving a tad bit of challenge from the veteran versions of dungeons to a degree. But toned down a bit. Mobs having less resistances and less damage output than the group veteran versions. While still not being a complete snooze-fest like the normal versions of dungeons and trials. Of course this will be in tandem with the previous normal and veteran versions still in existence for those who are passionate about playing the given content at hand with their peers. As for the overland content, why not give a slight boost in difficulty? Or artificial difficulty I suppose. Make things have a tad bit more resistances (like VMA resistances), and hit a tad bit harder as well. Maybe not as hard as VMA, or maybe as hard. I don’t know. I suppose some internal testing can find a nice balance of the 2.

What are you all’s ideas about this? Because the money is definitely in making content accessible to everyone. Why? Because it is being proven time after time that players enjoy spending the vast majority of their time alone. Or a mix of between being alone and with others. So why not play into that? I mean ZOS has already shown they can mix things up with the launches of both 1T and Morrowind. Introduce solo options for players with the Orsinium DLC. And so on. Why not take it all to the next level, and finally complete the trinity that is just waiting to be finished?
  • Kali_Despoine
    Kali_Despoine
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    The fun factor of solo play is abysmal as the 1T patch ruined it all. Overland is soft and squishy
    I had to start a new account to confront this as if I played with my main 690cp I can almost just stare at the enemy and they fall dead in fright.

    Edit: If they added a vet mode to overland then it might be fun as of now there is no challenge.
    Edited by Kali_Despoine on November 27, 2017 4:28PM
  • Ratzkifal
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    The fun factor of solo play is abysmal as the 1T patch ruined it all. Overland is soft and squishy
    I had to start a new account to confront this as if I played with my main 690cp I can almost just stare at the enemy and they fall dead in fright.

    Edit: If they added a vet mode to overland then it might be fun as of now there is no challenge.

    I would argue that before 1T Overland was too squishy. Once you had outleveled a zone it was time to move on even if you had quests unfinished. Oneshotting every enemy with force shock, killing Sinmur in two hits. Really a lot of depth there. Nowadays no Overland content is "hard" but at least people at the level cap get to enjoy old zones again.
    I am certain that every player who did a lot of pvp before 1T knows exactly what I am talking about. Coming back to pve after reaching lvl50 just wasn't satisfying and left most of the alliance zones unenjoyably easy.
    This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.
  • Bax
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    The fun factor of solo play is abysmal as the 1T patch ruined it all. Overland is soft and squishy
    I had to start a new account to confront this as if I played with my main 690cp I can almost just stare at the enemy and they fall dead in fright.

    Edit: If they added a vet mode to overland then it might be fun as of now there is no challenge.

    That depends. Basic content must be designed the way it is doable and enjoyable for all classes, roles and levels. Also ESO is super careful about being able to solo most of the content.

    But it's true they could maybe bring more challenging things also for solo players, more places like MA. But when it comes to general zones, the major problem is that games focuses on being suitable for everyone so I wouldn't expect any challenge there.

    Maybe what could help would be added difficulty, which would affect how mobs scales for you. Current scaling would be "normal level" and everyone could also pick "hard level". Mobs already scales for everyone differently so I don't see a problem in having also different power levels available to everyone.
  • randomkeyhits
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    fun isn't always about challenge or difficulty but also about engagement.

    I had a good chuckle over the Orzorga recipes mini quest line in Wrothgar, I considered it fun.

    In terms of challenge, the overworld stuff has to be accessible to the average player. If you are skilled then you will simply be too good for the majority of it. That is just how it is.
    EU PS4
  • Lokryn
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    I do think that ESO has a fun problem. I find the quest system in ESO is too far behind the times. Too many fetch quests for my tastes. A difficulty slider might help but I think the game needs new gameplay systems like spellcrafting as an example. I also would like to see the physics/animation systems upgraded (more upgrades like inverse kinetics). An example I hate when it comes to physics is how we slide off buildings or rocks while holding the same animation, it's stiff and clunky.
  • Ratzkifal
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    Lokryn wrote: »
    I do think that ESO has a fun problem. I find the quest system in ESO is too far behind the times. Too many fetch quests for my tastes. A difficulty slider might help but I think the game needs new gameplay systems like spellcrafting as an example. I also would like to see the physics/animation systems upgraded (more upgrades like inverse kinetics). An example I hate when it comes to physics is how we slide off buildings or rocks while holding the same animation, it's stiff and clunky.

    I can only agree. A fresh breath of air would be nice to have. I am happy that there aren't nearly as many kill quests though.
    About the physics though, we need to remember that it will all potentially cause lag. If every surface is treated differently/appropriately a small group of people can probably cause quite a lot of havoc on the system. Just how water in minecraft can make your game crash if you have too many shaders active.
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  • Balamoor
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    meh I honestly can'r see how anyone can play MMO's solo....my guild is a huge part of the fun factor for me...it's proabably why I have so few gripes about the game
  • Lokryn
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    Ratzkifal wrote: »
    Lokryn wrote: »
    I do think that ESO has a fun problem. I find the quest system in ESO is too far behind the times. Too many fetch quests for my tastes. A difficulty slider might help but I think the game needs new gameplay systems like spellcrafting as an example. I also would like to see the physics/animation systems upgraded (more upgrades like inverse kinetics). An example I hate when it comes to physics is how we slide off buildings or rocks while holding the same animation, it's stiff and clunky.

    I can only agree. A fresh breath of air would be nice to have. I am happy that there aren't nearly as many kill quests though.
    About the physics though, we need to remember that it will all potentially cause lag. If every surface is treated differently/appropriately a small group of people can probably cause quite a lot of havoc on the system. Just how water in minecraft can make your game crash if you have too many shaders active.

    Understood. I just hope new tech comes along that allows ZOS to make upgrades like this. And obviously, they don't have to add it to PVP areas.
  • CapnPhoton
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    Thank you for not making this a WoW comparison post. It's much appreciated.

    I think that as solo friendly this game is, it still needs the group only content, if nothing else to get players socialized a bit and work together.

    However, I disagree with another comment made about fetch quests. There are some, but nowhere near as many as other, older MMO games. I like the fact that many of the quests have multiple parts that have some effect on people, towns, zone, etc. This does make it similar to other single player games, but it differs it greatly from other MMOs I have played in the past.
    Xbox One NA Aldmeri Dominion
  • Ch4mpTW
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    CapnPhoton wrote: »
    Thank you for not making this a WoW comparison post. It's much appreciated.

    I think that as solo friendly this game is, it still needs the group only content, if nothing else to get players socialized a bit and work together.

    However, I disagree with another comment made about fetch quests. There are some, but nowhere near as many as other, older MMO games. I like the fact that many of the quests have multiple parts that have some effect on people, towns, zone, etc. This does make it similar to other single player games, but it differs it greatly from other MMOs I have played in the past.

    Lol, you're welcome.
  • nimander99
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    Sup @Ch4mpTW haven't seen you post in a while.

    Anyhooser, I agree. I would love to have single player versions of all dungeons and even trials... And if not that then a more GW2 approach to difficult content.

    Dark Anchors where a positive step... But literally the only one in the game and we have yet to see any sort of "event" that just auto includes players and gives out rewards to everyone who participates. There is nothing more frustrating than tackling a world boss and not getting loot because you didn't deal enough damage.

    Personally, I love GW2 for its liberal approach to events and drops. You just happen to be near a world boss when it dies and you get the chest and loot. Its a great system and hasn't gotten boring since GW2 launched.

    Just like Dark Anchors haven't gotten boring. They are one of my favorite things in this game! Hearing that rumble and horn blast, then you are off sprinting towards that Anchor to banish Daedra.

    We need more of that.
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  • victoriana-blue
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    Tangent: I think you're conflating "solo" and "alone." (The poll did too.)

    I spend most of my time solo, running around farming or questing or whatever, but I'm not alone - I'm usually chatting with people in my guilds and/or friends list, or at least reading it as it goes by. Solo play means that I can pause in place or find a safe alcove at any time (and if I'm in Cyrodiil, zerg surfing lets me peel off to go chat for a bit).

    To be completely honest, the social aspect has done more to keep me in this game than *** rng ever did.

    Group content can be a lot of fun! But when I run randoms or pugs, I have to stop watching/talking in guild chat. I've met awesome people in groups, joined guilds and added people to my friends list, but ironically my group time is less social than my solo time.

    So for me, the ratio of group:solo content in this game is pretty good, and could even continue tilting more solo. "Solo trials" could be fun, and I think more difficulty options would be awesome for other reasons (the least of which would be to ease the transition between normal and vet dungeons & trials).

    (Edited because I misread one of the op paragraphs.)
    Edited by victoriana-blue on November 27, 2017 9:23PM
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  • Kel
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    I mean, as I stated in previous threads and polls about this topic, around 90% of the content in the game can already be solo'ed, including normal dungeons. How much more content do you need designed for solo play? Leave vet dungeons and trials alone. Or, play them as they are designed...in a group.

    "But! Here is what has me confused... If the devs are truly paying attention to said polls, and studying the data provided by said in-game samples gathered... Why are we not seeing more things that deal into players playing by themselves?"

    How much more content do you need to be solo friendly? I'm honestly baffled by this question. ESO is already incredibly solo friendly. If the 10% of the game that needs grouping to be accomplished is that much of a thorn in your side, maybe a "pseudo-MMO" isn't your type of genre. Just by calling it that, you're admitting in a round about way that what I'm saying is true..it's already as solo friendly as a game can be without being single player.
    Edited by Kel on November 27, 2017 10:19PM
  • CavalryPK
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    The fun factor of solo play is abysmal as the 1T patch ruined it all. Overland is soft and squishy
    I had to start a new account to confront this as if I played with my main 690cp I can almost just stare at the enemy and they fall dead in fright.

    Edit: If they added a vet mode to overland then it might be fun as of now there is no challenge.

    I think they need to make death in overland mean something (something scary). and when you see more then 1 enemy bunched up together should be a certain death if you just charge head on.
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  • Kali_Despoine
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    Ratzkifal wrote: »
    I would argue that before 1T Overland was too squishy. Once you had outleveled a zone it was time to move on even if you had quests unfinished. Oneshotting every enemy with force shock, killing Sinmur in two hits. Really a lot of depth there. Nowadays no Overland content is "hard" but at least people at the level cap get to enjoy old zones again.
    I am certain that every player who did a lot of pvp before 1T knows exactly what I am talking about. Coming back to pve after reaching lvl50 just wasn't satisfying and left most of the alliance zones unenjoyably easy.
    You sir/mam/thing are correct. But we did have a new area to move to to keep the challenge up.
    Did you know that if you went more than 10 levels above your current you would actually miss the target a lot back then?
    Good times
    I was happy that I could finish the side missions I missed with the T1 update and the bosses acrually gave some challenge to them. Now at 660/690 it's back to the easy mode again.

  • rynth
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    bottom line is this is an MMO there is already a ton of stuff you can pretty much solo. It being an MMO well your going to have to come out of your shell and do co op stuff to get gear or experience of certain aspects of the game. ESO does a nice job of trying to balance things out, but what you are asking is unreal. They can not give content to everyone and some people on forums need to under stand that. If you want more solo stuff then you need to stick with single player games, other than that you are going to have to accept that for a game involving a social atmosphere that you need to open up and deal with the fact that your going to have to do team oriented stuff
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  • OrdoHermetica
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    Group content can be a lot of fun! But when I run randoms or pugs, I have to stop watching/talking in guild chat. I've met awesome people in groups, joined guilds and added people to my friends list, but ironically my group time is less social than my solo time.

    This sums up my experiences perfectly. When I'm doing things with my guildies or when grouped with randoms, we're doing things - dungeons, trials, world bosses, whatever. There might be some socialization, but mostly we're busy being productive and effective (or, you know, trying to carry the team when the tank decides to DPS and the healer can't keep themselves alive, much less anyone else - ah, the joys of PUG dungeons).

    Meanwhile, when I'm questing and exploring on my own, I'm chatting with guildies, giving or getting build advice, participating in auctions, etc. Or, sometimes, even having an engaging and fun conversation in zone chat. Some of my strongest social connections in this game have come from solo adventuring, both through chatting and just randomly encountering someone else exploring the same corner of the world. The many opportunities to form an impromptu group with one or two other random adventurers for the purposes of exploration and questing is one of the strongest aspects of this game, I think.

    But yeah. I do think this game is incredibly solo-friendly but with strong social elements. Which is why I play it; not actually a particularly big MMORPG fan, to be honest, but questing with buddies or just by myself while chatting with my buddies? That's pretty awesome. I wouldn't be adverse to some sort of difficulty setting for solo questing, though I'd personally want it to be pretty seamless. Maybe a simple adjustment to scaling would do it? Make things scale on a steeper curve once you hit, say, CP 160? That method would also allow dungeon and other group scaling to remain more or less intact as-is.

    Also, I know that a lot of people think it's easy to solo a normal dungeon, but speaking as a filthy casual with limited play time each day and not enough of it to create an optimal build: it's really not. I'm just about to hit CP300 and I have a reasonably good build and gear, but soloing normal dungeons - while possible - is challenging for me. I'm sure I could make it much less of a challenge if I had the time and energy and resources to farm BiS gear and practice my rotations to perfection, but I don't have any of those things, and I suspect there are a whole bunch of players in the same boat. So, from the perspective of your average everyday player, normal dungeons should probably be left alone.
    Edited by OrdoHermetica on November 27, 2017 10:34PM
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