Am i aggroing or is the tank just useless??

ReachHalo · November 2017

The other night running Vet City of Ash, the tank in my pug kept [snip] that i was aggroing the bosses, even when he was using his taunts.

Now, is this possible?? Im just a magplar, your typical skills, lightining and restro staff set up. Never used a taunt, wouldn't even know how, but this tank was adamant that i was trying to steal his thunder and take the boss's aggro away from him.

Needless to say, it was the least enjoyable vet pledge i have been part of. But is is possible that he was right? Is there a way that a standard magplar with standard skills could have been doing this?? Or was the tank just a 660cp ***??

Froil · November 2017

Unless you had an ice staff with the first passive and were heavy attacking, were using Puncture or Inner Fire or using a charge ability while wearing five piece of the Tormentor set, then it may have just been him not reapplying the taunt fast enough.

I can't remember any other forms of taunting in the game right now...

Waffennacht · November 2017

He's... Um... Let's go with... uninformed

WrathOfInnos · November 2017

Froil wrote: »

Unless you had an ice staff with the first passive and were heavy attacking, were using Puncture or Inner Fire or using a charge ability while wearing five piece of the Tormentor set, then it may have just been him not reapplying the taunt fast enough.

I can't remember any other forms of taunting in the game right now...

I believe you covered them all. These are the only 4 taunts I'm aware of.

vovus69 · November 2017

well, my guess your tank is a ***. If you are not using frost destro HA or inner fire, you cannot taunt. Only if tank is not taunting and your DPS is the top on the list.

-vovus

WhiteNoiseMaker · November 2017

Actually, as a DK tank that recently started playing a Templar, I feel I should point out there is ONE ability that I discovered that is as damned close to a Mass-Taunt as ESO can get... Radiant Aura. It's not a true Taunt, but it's almost guaranteed to draw aggro from nearly everything on a map, even neighboring rooms if in a tight dungeon. A Tank can recover by Taunting individual spawns, but I admit it can be annoying if hordes of adds are swarming away.

But by and large, the others are right in that unless you're using Frost Staff or Inner Fire, you really oughtn't be drawing any Taunt away...

Curragraigue · November 2017

Were you attacking/using a skill on the boss before him? Otherwise as others have said to taunt an already taunted boss requires one of the skills or the set mentioned

VaranisArano · November 2017

I main a tank, so I've seen taunts used by other players.

The tank may have been confused because the boss wasn't 100% on him. Nearly every boss has mechanics that ignore the tank and focus on the DPS or healer instead. As a more experienced tank, I've learned to recognize which abilities are my problem (Stuff I need to block/bash/interrupt) and which abilities are the boss deciding to ignore me to attack someone else (not my problem), and what happens when my taunt drops off and the boss goes full bear on someone else so I need to taunt fast.

Hint for PC tanks, the Untaunted addon has been really helpful, though I'm sure there are other taunt counters.

Someone else taunting the boss looks very similar to the boss turning and whaling on another player that isn't me. If that happens repeatedly, I start looking for an Ice staff because that's the main offender. (Though once I did have a DPS using S&B Puncture, that was interesting.) After the fight, I'll point out what they are taunting the boss with. Usually, they don't know and fix the problem. If they don't. the next time they taunt, they get to tank it.

From the DPS and Healer side, when a tank doesn't taunt the boss, it looks like the boss is following and whaling on everyone but the tank. If the boss is fixated on you for long periods of the fight, the tank is not taunting properly. Usually boss mechanics that focus on other people are quick attacks and the boss quickly goes back to the tank.

kyle.wilson · November 2017

He could have been losing agro in an over-taunt situation.

VaranisArano · November 2017

kyle.wilson wrote: »

He could have been losing agro in an over-taunt situation.

You can't over-taunt anymore. There are a couple of bosses that ignore taunt, but none of them are in the City of Ash dungeons.

MissBizz · November 2017

VaranisArano wrote: »

kyle.wilson wrote: »

He could have been losing agro in an over-taunt situation.

You can't over-taunt anymore. There are a couple of bosses that ignore taunt, but none of them are in the City of Ash dungeons.

As long as only 1 person is taunting, there is no longer an overtaunt.

Armatesz · November 2017

I run a heavy magplar and I have found that there is ways that you can pull over a tanks taught outside of sets. Backlash and one more purifying light has a potential to be able to pull agro if enough damages are pulled out on the enemy. Use with care as they say. Still that light does help people know what to hit.

kringled_1 · November 2017

I'm not a very experienced tank, but in the last 3-4 days of doing 1-2 random normals a day, I've seen both what VaranisArano describes (boss shifts attention from me to someone else, then back again), but I've also had a couple of times where it went above that. In one case the one dps was using S+B so may have been using the Pierce Armor skill, and in the other the healer was later talking in group chat about loving the visual effect of Inner Fire. I just took that as the hazards of the group finder.

phileunderx2 · November 2017

I will second the use of purifying light will draw aggro. Have had it happen several times.

Asardes · November 2017

Ground based DoTs are the closest thing to a taunt. I always open trash pulls with Cinder Storm on my DK and it never fails to make the trash focus me while I taunt the bigger ones with Pierce Armor. Also Relentless Grip works as ranged taunt for a few seconds on pull immune enemies so I scarcely use Inner Rage. I've seen that things like Ritual of Retribution and Elemental Blockade will aggro enemies that are not taunted pretty reliably since they are also ground based DoTs; I can also confirm that Radiant Aura pulls aggro though It does no damage while Elemental Drain which is basically the same effect does not.

So it was the tank's fault for not opening the pull properly. Also COA1 is one of the dungeons that can be run by 4 DDs. There's also one boss in there that will jump at random players even if taunted: Warden of the Shrine, the one you kill upstairs then jump down. Also the end boss doesn't have a particularly strong aggro.

Mancombe_Nosehair · November 2017

Yes I have found that the templar skill reflective light does agro if it is the first attack. As I am now a tank, I use it while I am charging in to taunt sometimes. It doesn't taunt though.

ssewallb14_ESO · November 2017

If you're not running a taunt, and not running in before the tank can pull agro, then your tank is a bad.

Autumnhart · November 2017

VaranisArano wrote: »

(Though once I did have a DPS using S&B Puncture, that was interesting.)

SoLooney · November 2017

umm no, your tank sucks or he was a dps as a tank

tommalmm · November 2017

WhiteNoiseMaker wrote: »

Actually, as a DK tank that recently started playing a Templar, I feel I should point out there is ONE ability that I discovered that is as damned close to a Mass-Taunt as ESO can get... Radiant Aura. It's not a true Taunt, but it's almost guaranteed to draw aggro from nearly everything on a map, even neighboring rooms if in a tight dungeon. A Tank can recover by Taunting individual spawns, but I admit it can be annoying if hordes of adds are swarming away.

But by and large, the others are right in that unless you're using Frost Staff or Inner Fire, you really oughtn't be drawing any Taunt away...

That's why I love this skill both as a DK tank and a templar healer. I just stack on a tank and use it, tank talons everything, DDs are happy, tank is happy. I love when healers do that when I'm tanking, not so much when they're kiting the mobs instead of stacking on me and THEN walking away. You can use caltrops on a tank or kite the mob ball for a while to get everything and then settle (DDs misinterpret it as bad tanking, but that's just a battlefield preparation when they should just wait for 5 seconds and refrain from damaging, otherwise they might ruin everything.... which happens in like 90% of cases, which is why I avoid that approach unless on a non DK tank) but aura is so much more efficient.

Aaaand on top of that it's an AOE minor magickasteal. I still can't fathom why some dungeon templar healers prefer ele drain over it. If a tank uses ransack, just kick the damn tank. Trials are different... You really want to keep the aggro out of you

.

SugaComa · November 2017

Were you using restoring aura to help with your sustain if so then yes you were agroing the mobs

techprince · November 2017

If are using shadowrend monster set, clanfear taunts the target randomly.

idk · November 2017

Nothing overrides a taunt in this game and a taunt is the only reliable means to keep agro on the boss.

The only time I see a boss walk away from me someone has just done a HA with an ice staff. There is no doubt when this happens because taunt the target ends up with taunt immunity.

I_B_Squishy · November 2017

tommalmm wrote: »

Aaaand on top of that it's an AOE minor magickasteal. I still can't fathom why some dungeon templar healers prefer ele drain over it. If a tank uses ransack, just kick the damn tank. Trials are different... You really want to keep the aggro out of you .

Because ele drain has no magicka cost at all vs 3440 magicka cost for radiant aura, debuffs spell resist and doesn't agro?

While theorectically more efficient than ele drain at magicka and resource recovery, even vet packs are rarely alive long enough for resource recovery to be an important factor.........only long boss fights with multiple adds is where it would be practical, preferably with a Templar tank and not a healer or DD.........

tommalmm · November 2017

I_B_Squishy wrote: »

tommalmm wrote: »

Aaaand on top of that it's an AOE minor magickasteal. I still can't fathom why some dungeon templar healers prefer ele drain over it. If a tank uses ransack, just kick the damn tank. Trials are different... You really want to keep the aggro out of you .

Because ele drain has no magicka cost at all vs 3440 magicka cost for radiant aura, debuffs spell resist and doesn't agro?

While theorectically more efficient than ele drain at magicka and resource recovery, even vet packs are rarely alive long enough for resource recovery to be an important factor.........only long boss fights with multiple adds is where it would be practical, preferably with a Templar tank and not a healer or DD.........

It's actually much lower after including light armor, race and other cost reduction. Plus on a healer you're never low on resources, unless you're doing something wrong (true, I run a relatively high ~1600 unbuffed mag recovery on my templar and only ~1100 on my sorc healer).

Of what you wrote, the aggro thing is not a con, it's a pro (remember, we're talking about dungeons - you can tank most them on your healer because you're not as squishy as DDs are). As for the debuff - I keep saying it, major breach is tank's role, not healer's. Unless healer and tank agree otherwise.

Just an opinion, though. I know I won't change it to ele drain anytime soon in dungeons, it's just so much more powerful (plus I just like having it on my resto bar instead of destro - a matter of preference).

Even for vDSA I change it only for the last fight, because the tank is usually in the back entertaining adds, so I do need the breach with magicka characters (my s&b is not leveled at all).

idk · November 2017

WhiteNoiseMaker wrote: »

Actually, as a DK tank that recently started playing a Templar, I feel I should point out there is ONE ability that I discovered that is as damned close to a Mass-Taunt as ESO can get... Radiant Aura. It's not a true Taunt, but it's almost guaranteed to draw aggro from nearly everything on a map, even neighboring rooms if in a tight dungeon. A Tank can recover by Taunting individual spawns, but I admit it can be annoying if hordes of adds are swarming away.

But by and large, the others are right in that unless you're using Frost Staff or Inner Fire, you really oughtn't be drawing any Taunt away...

Should not be correct. Only a taunt can over wright another taunt. If Radiant Aura is drawing the boss away from the tank then the tank likely did not refresh his/her taunt and it expired. The moment a taunt expires the target can change targets immediately.

Now, Radiant Aura places a debuff on the targets within range of the skill and can start a pull, but that does not make it a taunt.

I_B_Squishy · November 2017

tommalmm wrote: »

Of what you wrote, the aggro thing is not a con, it's a pro (remember, we're talking about dungeons - you can tank most them on your healer because you're not as squishy as DDs are). As for the debuff - I keep saying it, major breach is tank's role, not healer's. Unless healer and tank agree otherwise.

Good points, but some don't like tanking on their DD's and healers (I sure don't!) and remember, the OP stated that he had a tough time in his group because he kept stealing agro from the tank.

And yes, major breach is tanks role, but grabbing agro is also his role, not the healers, and not the DD's.

Anyway, there are lots of different ways to play this game and if it works for you, great, but for someone else it's a good idea to communicate with your tank if you're in a PUG or you're going to have conflicts like the one the OP had. If you have a regular guild group that knows what you're doing you're a lot more free to do what you want.

VaranisArano · November 2017

OP said that the tank thought he was pulling aggro on the boss, not everything in general. The only time that should be happening is if the tank hadn't taunted yet (a DPS/healer started the encounter and now the tank has to chase the boss to taunt it with a melee taunt - I hate it when DPS or healers do this, FYI) or the tank lost taunt due to failing to reapply taunt and now the boss is chasing someone else, or the OP was using an actual taunt which does not appear to the be the case.

Nothing the OP was using should have been able to override a properly applied taunt from the tank during battle. Therefore, either the tank was mistaking the boss temporarily ignoring the tank to attack other people for taunt dropping off, or the tank was failing to keep up the taunt resulting in the boss focusing on other players.

raj72616a · November 2017

idk wrote: »

WhiteNoiseMaker wrote: »

Actually, as a DK tank that recently started playing a Templar, I feel I should point out there is ONE ability that I discovered that is as damned close to a Mass-Taunt as ESO can get... Radiant Aura. It's not a true Taunt, but it's almost guaranteed to draw aggro from nearly everything on a map, even neighboring rooms if in a tight dungeon. A Tank can recover by Taunting individual spawns, but I admit it can be annoying if hordes of adds are swarming away.

But by and large, the others are right in that unless you're using Frost Staff or Inner Fire, you really oughtn't be drawing any Taunt away...

Should not be correct. Only a taunt can over wright another taunt. If Radiant Aura is drawing the boss away from the tank then the tank likely did not refresh his/her taunt and it expired. The moment a taunt expires the target can change targets immediately.

Now, Radiant Aura places a debuff on the targets within range of the skill and can start a pull, but that does not make it a taunt.

yes we all know Radiant Aura is not a taunt, but it does feel like one if you try to use it. it aggro all the mobs in the room, in the next room, upstairs, and downstairs, get them all rush to you. very fun skill on a blazplar tank.

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Am i aggroing or is the tank just useless??

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