Biro123 wrote: »

I'm using ravage/cowards (with lava soup) and kraags (I need to experiment with other monster sets and weapon traits though - its still a work in prog).

Cowards 5-piece up on the s+b (defensive) bar
2-hander for offence.

Recently switched to Lava Soup (dubious comoran didn't quite give enough recov - but I then I am running imperial)

This may well work. Cowards is an option I’ve considered, but the damage loss from the 5-piece makes me not go there: you can get major expedition from pots, and major protection from ults.

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I threw my stamden build on my stamplar for like 3 pugged BGs this morning and was able to do decently well.

5 Cowards (3 jewels SnB back bar)
5 Shackle (Body)<-- I'd drop this for something else if I was going to play stamplar regularly since you don't NEED the magika or regen so much
2 troll king(I usually use BS on warden, but stamplar doesn't have a burst heal without 2h so I need a lot of hots)
DW Agility (infused axe infused sword disease/weapon damage glyphs)

I had to use flying blade to proc major brutality and I ran speed+lingering health pots. Survivability was decent as long as I was careful with positioning, but note that I didn't face any really good stamblades, and the burst and pressure were both adequate for a non-CP environment. Cheesed a CTR match with cowards and dominated a Deathmatch, I had a rough time in DOM, but that was my fault for consistently getting drawn into fights I shouldn't have.

Hunding? Clever alch since you are using speed pots?
Night mother? .

Minno wrote: »

[

Xvorg wrote: »

I'm theorycrafting a stamplar focused on penetration + armor reduction without using major fracture but I'm quite dissapointed with the game status to finish it...

Basically a 2H/Bow set up

5 NMG + 5 spriggan + 1 Krag/Slimecraw

Bow bar: lethal arrow + PotL, Javalin, shuffle, variable, U ballista
2H bar: crit rush, jabs, vigor, executioner, variable U DBoS

Infused weapons with crushing enchant.

The idea is to open with Lethal arrow + PotL, then swap to 2H (maul), crit rush, jabs and executioner within 6 secs. No idea if this works.

TBH, you need major fracture to make bow work similar to how ele drain helps offset lower staff item DMG. Only person that can synergize with the ranged combat is nightblade for two reasons:
- your burst spell from relentless is not an ultimate letting you use flawless Dawnbreaker for extra WD (which bow needs). Or you can use soul Assault for a cheap ranged ability that ignores dodge (bow ulti is dodgable)
- Mark target for a ranged major fracture debuff.

Nb let's you run a set for burst dmg (senche) whereas Templar has to run death mother and the nb will still have more penetration+DMG.

http://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=24975

I'm not sure if bowplar works without that major debuff. Are there other sources you can get?

Well, the trick is supposed to be on PotL copied dmg. And in case of a Templar, the only chance to get that debuff is through puncture. The thing is that NMG + PotL + Crushing glyph reaches similar numbers to major fracture. Then everything is on the melee section.

As I mentioned, I'm not on that build ATM, but I think it can be an interesting route to develop

Also, @Xvorg I took a stab in the editor:
http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=27752

A few notes:
- I was able to get mix matched monster helms for additional stats. 1pc kena+1pc kra'g
- mixed 1pc sets only possible by backbaring a set that activates. Since barksin can do this, I selected that one.
- my spare Templar is breton. I'm not leveling a new Templar lol. But their spell resistance synergizes with the 1pc physical resistance off barksin letting you deslot a pirate helm in favor for offensive stats (kra'g, slimecraw, max Stam or recovery if you need it)
- 5pc death mother on bow bar. Figured it would proc more since bow has higher crit chance + ability to proc it from range.
I- removed penetration off the mundas. Without it you'll be at around 7k and with Crushing+minor fracture you'll be at 10k. I think this is fine; might not need the debuff after all as you already stated.
- I gave consuming trap. Repentance would starve you if there are other players using it in pvp, and figured for a 28 meter ranged ability you can tag a player you know will die to get resorces back including mag! 10% on each enemy that dies and it tags two of them. Could be cool to tag+debuff+snipe+ spear stun+soul assault = gg. Also same combo but bar swap+crit rush+DB+jabs for more of a consistent combo.
- barksin could proc often in melee range given everything snares + DKs that catch up to you will definitely immobilize you. 2k health+1k Stam. Helps offset missing Regen stats.

Xvorg wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

[

Xvorg wrote: »

I'm theorycrafting a stamplar focused on penetration + armor reduction without using major fracture but I'm quite dissapointed with the game status to finish it...

Basically a 2H/Bow set up

5 NMG + 5 spriggan + 1 Krag/Slimecraw

Bow bar: lethal arrow + PotL, Javalin, shuffle, variable, U ballista
2H bar: crit rush, jabs, vigor, executioner, variable U DBoS

Infused weapons with crushing enchant.

The idea is to open with Lethal arrow + PotL, then swap to 2H (maul), crit rush, jabs and executioner within 6 secs. No idea if this works.

TBH, you need major fracture to make bow work similar to how ele drain helps offset lower staff item DMG. Only person that can synergize with the ranged combat is nightblade for two reasons:
- your burst spell from relentless is not an ultimate letting you use flawless Dawnbreaker for extra WD (which bow needs). Or you can use soul Assault for a cheap ranged ability that ignores dodge (bow ulti is dodgable)
- Mark target for a ranged major fracture debuff.

Nb let's you run a set for burst dmg (senche) whereas Templar has to run death mother and the nb will still have more penetration+DMG.

http://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=24975

I'm not sure if bowplar works without that major debuff. Are there other sources you can get?

Well, the trick is supposed to be on PotL copied dmg. And in case of a Templar, the only chance to get that debuff is through puncture. The thing is that NMG + PotL + Crushing glyph reaches similar numbers to major fracture. Then everything is on the melee section.

As I mentioned, I'm not on that build ATM, but I think it can be an interesting route to develop

Ok makes sense. What happens if crushing doesn't reliably proc? Would poison debuffs work better?

Poison debuff should make the work, yes (this one is starting to talk like Khajiit). In that case you could be abe to run sharpen/precise weapons.

Then it comes the decision, Heavy or medium? I believe Heavy is a decent option but I want medium to be viable.

BTW, how is pot reduction glyph working? The char I'm working on now is an Argonian and the debuff poison makes total sense with a thirsty build

Yea, I would use a poison. Would be better since it would be cheaper to make. I would still use sharpened weapons; the amount of DMG they can give you is very good despite the nerf.

I would do Medium. But you have to use Restoring focus. You get 8% minor protection+ 8% minor vitality+ 8% minor mending from the passive. This way you can either go mace for to huge 20% penetration debuff on the melee range encounters or go sword for 5% extra DMG. You might swing for axes and make that bar a bleed bar for block builds. I picked defensive traits; more passive mitigation so you can sustain jabs+gap closing in crit rush.

Potion duration enchants are bugged and zos has never started they will be fixing them. Consider them dead enchants; better to roll DMG enchants anyway 170 WD per item is hard to beat.

Xvorg wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Also, @Xvorg I took a stab in the editor:
http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=27752

A few notes:
- I was able to get mix matched monster helms for additional stats. 1pc kena+1pc kra'g
- mixed 1pc sets only possible by backbaring a set that activates. Since barksin can do this, I selected that one.
- my spare Templar is breton. I'm not leveling a new Templar lol. But their spell resistance synergizes with the 1pc physical resistance off barksin letting you deslot a pirate helm in favor for offensive stats (kra'g, slimecraw, max Stam or recovery if you need it)
- 5pc death mother on bow bar. Figured it would proc more since bow has higher crit chance + ability to proc it from range.
I- removed penetration off the mundas. Without it you'll be at around 7k and with Crushing+minor fracture you'll be at 10k. I think this is fine; might not need the debuff after all as you already stated.
- I gave consuming trap. Repentance would starve you if there are other players using it in pvp, and figured for a 28 meter ranged ability you can tag a player you know will die to get resorces back including mag! 10% on each enemy that dies and it tags two of them. Could be cool to tag+debuff+snipe+ spear stun+soul assault = gg. Also same combo but bar swap+crit rush+DB+jabs for more of a consistent combo.
- barksin could proc often in melee range given everything snares + DKs that catch up to you will definitely immobilize you. 2k health+1k Stam. Helps offset missing Regen stats.

Interesting... maybe I'm not quiting after this xD

Try it! Then if you think it's fun, you found a class and build worth playing!

nCats wrote: »

I guess my question is, how much recovery you need as a bare minimum to function. Builds from a year ago were running with like 800, even with all the nerfs to constitution that is an extremely low number...

1400, if you have another source or two to help compensate. Otherwise 1700 minimum.

Instead of repentance, run consuming trap. It will give you 10% mag/Stam/health on kills and hit two players. 2300 health+3000 Stam+1200 mag for each affected enemy killed (doesn't have to be by you )
Repentance might give you more health but it's similar in stamina returned. And you'll only get the resorces if you are the one that hits it first; which is terribly inefficient for reliability.

Minno wrote: »

nCats wrote: »

I guess my question is, how much recovery you need as a bare minimum to function. Builds from a year ago were running with like 800, even with all the nerfs to constitution that is an extremely low number...

1400, if you have another source or two to help compensate. Otherwise 1700 minimum.

Instead of repentance, run consuming trap. It will give you 10% mag/Stam/health on kills and hit two players. 2300 health+3000 Stam+1200 mag for each affected enemy killed (doesn't have to be by you )
Repentance might give you more health but it's similar in stamina returned. And you'll only get the resorces if you are the one that hits it first; which is terribly inefficient for reliability.

Interesting reasoning, indeed.

I have to say that, however, repentance gives a good amount of stationary recovery, even when you are outside of combat.

I guess it has to be tested, after all.

nCats wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

nCats wrote: »

I guess my question is, how much recovery you need as a bare minimum to function. Builds from a year ago were running with like 800, even with all the nerfs to constitution that is an extremely low number...

1400, if you have another source or two to help compensate. Otherwise 1700 minimum.

Instead of repentance, run consuming trap. It will give you 10% mag/Stam/health on kills and hit two players. 2300 health+3000 Stam+1200 mag for each affected enemy killed (doesn't have to be by you )
Repentance might give you more health but it's similar in stamina returned. And you'll only get the resorces if you are the one that hits it first; which is terribly inefficient for reliability.

Interesting reasoning, indeed.

I have to say that, however, repentance gives a good amount of stationary recovery, even when you are outside of combat.

I guess it has to be tested, after all.

Very true. Repentance is hard to beat, especially for melee builds. But for players complaining about repentance nerfs, consuming trap is a nice little addition.

I am still interested in 2h for a simple reason: crit rush hits quite hard due to templar passives and gives some mobility.

Here's a following sketchy build, to be tested thoroughly when I get a newer machine.

2h/resto setup, 4+resto heavy alchemist, 4+2h viper (yes, but with channeled character of our damage it is not too bad). Monster set of your choice, trying domihaus+molag kena, can be 2 slimecraw, 2 selene, or 2 bloodspawn.

The killcombo is (potion if able/needed)->PoTL->CritRush->dizzy/jabs/DB->PoTL blows up. Resto ult for cheaper than remembrance defensive ult.

A more intricate variation is ravager/medium alchemist (with healthy jewelry, yes) with, it seems, slimecraw for crit and stuff.

s&b over dual wield. swap spear for reverb und run s&b ult. bashcancel everyting, e.g. vigor etc. if you want bursts, run veli over troll king. run a dawnbreaker on your 2h bar und also weapon swap cancel it to the damage bar. works much better for me for real solo, whereas dual wield is better in duo upwards because of the higher burst. when solo, s&b ult is in valuable, though and the only way I can dive a group to finish a target or that I can actually kite a few players until I find an area where I want to fight them.

that said, my stam warden feels slightly stronger than my stamplar

Brrrofski wrote: »

Yeh, this is the thing.

I played my stamplar. Medium was horrid. In heavy I lacked sustain. Went back on to my warden and it was just easy mode in comparison. I love playing stamplar, but it felt like work compared to my warden which is a LOT of fun to play.

Yes, sure, that is undeniable. I dislike the principles and aesthetic of warden play though.

Part of getting enjoyment from the game is about playing what you feel like. Hence me willing to discuss stamplar.

Can't really comment on Warden (mine is only level 9 - lol) - but I find stamplar much easier (and more fun) to play than my stamsorc was (even back in the viper/tremor/blackrose days).

DW/2H
Lava soup

Ravager
7th Legion
Chudan