True, true.

But I think we should take into consideration that most of the content in the game is PvE, and someone who doesn't have time to invest in different characters probably shouldn't focus on a magicka Warden. I like mine, but that's because I have many other characters that can get stuff done when she can't.

I don't think anyone is complaining about Warden outside of PvE dps.

mag warden is not top dog pvp yeah they have a undodgable spamable it counter stamblades and other dodge spammy classes but there burst is easy to dodge.
only way spamming birds gets kills is if your in a zerg. if you get killed my a guys spaming birds is 1v1 or small scale you need to l2p.

if you look at how there burst works in pvp its like a gimped sorc with half burst easy to dodge and no reliable execute.

I would gladly give up undodglable birds for faster animations and a reliable execute that's not the bear.

lucky_Sage wrote: »

mag warden is not top dog pvp yeah they have a undodgable spamable it counter stamblades and other dodge spammy classes but there burst is easy to dodge.
only way spamming birds gets kills is if your in a zerg. if you get killed my a guys spaming birds is 1v1 or small scale you need to l2p.

if you look at how there burst works in pvp its like a gimped sorc with half burst easy to dodge and no reliable execute.

I would gladly give up undodglable birds for faster animations and a reliable execute that's not the bear.

They are less bursty more Healy magSorcs. Who don't have a area denial skill like mines or any of the CC's in the sorc kit. All they have are slow undodgeable birds. That's their claim to fame. They are good sure. But so many of the other classes are so much more robust in their offensive options and crowd control. The MagWarden is legit 3 skills you put the fissure you throw a bird then crushing and rearm it. It will work against the usual low CP, casual pvpers, and thats it.

I've heard from people that the deep fissure stun is the most OP stun in the game and that's just hilarious. It's obvious, you can legit side step it, block it, root them and they done, they have to constantly aim it.

A magWarden is good in PvP you'll kill lowbies and anyone that is near dead. But mehhhhhhhhh go sorc and get a far more robust class that does most of the same things, and a WHOLE LOT MORE.

ZOS took everything people hated and made a class out of it. People hate not having a class execute, they hated the old 3.5 second curse cause it complicated rotations, hate having to use mistform, hate 12 second dots that don't line up with skills, and hate pets. Well here you go enjoy your new class.

We finally get an ice class, so many people wanted to do ice dps... And ZOS misses the mark so DAMN hard.

You haven't seen my newest build.

It is OP.

And I never call anything OP

Waffennacht wrote: »

You haven't seen my newest build.

It is OP.

And I never call anything OP

Wtb

SoLooney wrote: »

lol who complained about wardens being weak in pvp? 0, dont know why this thread was even created

I have seen wardens being weak posts
they only have one thing that can cause problems and if you die by a bird spammer then you need to l2p spamming birds will not kill a competent player unless its by a zerg

Blanco wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

lol who complained about wardens being weak in pvp? 0, dont know why this thread was even created

Actually, it did make sense for this thread to be created because PvEers don't know this, and don't account for it in their arguments.

Not sure how you overlooked that apparent fact.

Just because you and a handful other mediocre players keep spamming the same wrong message doesn't make it "fact". Your way of debating makes me not only doubt your skills as a player but your level of education as well.

All I see is wrong info & vague strawmwns. None of you complainers has been able to objectively point out magWardens actual status quo somewhat legitimately by:

a) montioring all PvP scenarios individually (Duels, BGs, Cyro, IC; Zerg, Smallscale, Solo Roaming) and providing feedback on those compared to other classes
b) mathematically evaluating skill performance to equivalents of other classes while keeping the big picture in mind (stronger skills are offset by weaker skills, manual targeting more difficult than smart targeting)

I haven't met a good magWarden on PC EU ("good" means better than me in that case) and in my books PvP magWarden has:

1) less heals than a mTemplar
2) less and more predictable burst than a mSorc or mNB
3) less mobility than mSorc or mNB
3) less tankyness than a DK

It's a middle of the road class, it can a bit of everything, but doesn't excel in anything (except spamming birds which is completely not viable for any solo pvp scenario or BGs). It is not mobile at all, means every fight that is not won is lost (unlike playing sorc or NB). No escape.

I consider 90% of people in this game completely terrible at PvP, so I understand that if you (the typical forum bob) meet a really good player who mastered mWarden, it can look really strong. But so would any other class.

From what I've seen, mWarden is strongest inmidst of an allied zerg or against terrible players. Are you a terrible player?

Enslaved wrote: »

vpy wrote: »

...Step into Cyrodill

Ah, I was fool to expect an elaborate, fact backed post.

i was expecting a simple line saying "you guys are correct"

I will now not take any post seriously that does not acknowledge that wardens (stam and mag), are overperforming in certain areas. Just in the same way that I do not take any post seriously that is calling for nerfs to sorcs in their current state.

If you do either of the above, it is almost guaranteed that you are bad

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

SoLooney wrote: »

lol who complained about wardens being weak in pvp? 0, dont know why this thread was even created

Actually, it did make sense for this thread to be created because PvEers don't know this, and don't account for it in their arguments.

Not sure how you overlooked that apparent fact.

Just because you and a handful other mediocre players keep spamming the same wrong message doesn't make it "fact". Your way of debating makes me not only doubt your skills as a player but your level of education as well.

All I see is wrong info & vague strawmwns. None of you complainers has been able to objectively point out magWardens actual status quo somewhat legitimately by:

a) montioring all PvP scenarios individually (Duels, BGs, Cyro, IC; Zerg, Smallscale, Solo Roaming) and providing feedback on those compared to other classes
b) mathematically evaluating skill performance to equivalents of other classes while keeping the big picture in mind (stronger skills are offset by weaker skills, manual targeting more difficult than smart targeting)

I haven't met a good magWarden on PC EU ("good" means better than me in that case) and in my books PvP magWarden has:

1) less heals than a mTemplar
2) less and more predictable burst than a mSorc or mNB
3) less mobility than mSorc or mNB
3) less tankyness than a DK

It's a middle of the road class, it can a bit of everything, but doesn't excel in anything (except spamming birds which is completely not viable for any solo pvp scenario or BGs). It is not mobile at all, means every fight that is not won is lost (unlike playing sorc or NB). No escape.

I consider 90% of people in this game completely terrible at PvP, so I understand that if you (the typical forum bob) meet a really good player who mastered mWarden, it can look really strong. But so would any other class.

From what I've seen, mWarden is strongest inmidst of an allied zerg or against terrible players. Are you a terrible player?

I agree in almost evrething but warden are really strong also for small scale pvp for their utility/aoe burst. Got major defile aoe, you can wipe a small Group if you time your deep fissure with dawnbreaker and maybe an ally ulti. Permafrost in combo with an ally eye of flame is op. Not talking because i've encountered some of them i talk because i play one of them and i see the difference when i use other classes. Still
hard to play for duels or solo play if u encounter people Who actually can play their class and has a lot of experience. Stronger in no cp pvp, i use to melt a lot of people in bg. Ah was forgetting about the bear, is super bad exept for duels! Damn if Zeni fix it it would be super op in duels.

I don't remember anything memorable about wardens except their rarity. When I encountered them I had no trouble killing them, except a few heal-bots that just healed and did no damage, but there are plenty of Templars with similar builds.