Why not post patch notes earlier?

kamimark · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Vote how you want it to be, not how you think it has to be.

No. Wishing doesn't change the laws of physics and the real work of software engineering, or how annoying people are when they see notes for something they aren't going to get.

thamightyboro · September 2017

The build would have been ready on friday to go live monday. Patch notes are probably written up.at the same time.

A whole build gets patched someone doesnt sit there and do each change manually. If something went *** up when pushing it to live the whole patch would be rolled back.

Tbh its the first time ive seen it done and I was cm on. Some pretty big mmos.

Swg we pushed the patch notes the evening before the patch.

Aion pushed at the time of maintenance notification so 2_3 days earlier.

Swtor pushed when maintenance began.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

Demolitionary wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Demolitionary wrote: »

I don't think many understand at all how it is when patching.
Being working along side dev teams for software many times, not everything they think will go into the patch will actually make it.

Yes they have a road map of what they want to put in, but, some things may have a undesirable side effect or just have no more time to put the minor stuff in.

I don't think you understand your own point.
All that I have quoted above that you said all occur before any programs get taken down for the patch to be applied at that time.

Those decisions about what makes the cut and what doesn't have already taken place. We have a set in stone list now. We just can't see it yet because nobody has hit "new discussion" and "save comment" yet, or hit "make visible" if they have it posted but hidden.

I just want to read it while I wait for the patch and plan my gameplay accordingly. I don't want to have to wait until I should be playing to read notes to find out what I should look for that changed so I can plan around it. I want to play ASAP.

I understand my own point completely, because I have worked with dev teams and still do.

You really don't understand at all with that response and clearly you didn't read all of the post. Yes some decisions are made already but sometimes/ a lot of the time with ZoS, some things don't make it because things took longer than expected or a change while patching caused some other bug which they don't want in the game ect so they have to change the patch notes accordingly, so it is more effective to send out patch notes after the patch so the information is 100%.

You are making out like the game is a full time job, it isn't. Most people will read the patch notes during downloading or during a break at work. So it isn't really impeding with "game time".

Can't really explain a thing to the completely naive and self entitled I guess...

1) They can take all the time in the world to test a patch and also take the servers down for as long as they want to apply it. It says so in the TOS. So why would they not have a set in stone patch that gets applied?
This is not like a service provider trying to bring service for internet or telephone or tv or electricity back up while people slam their reps with calls due to the downtime. This is a luxury software service patch that is not so essential as to roll out piecemeal patches to it.

2) What is the point of a regularly scheduled patch downtime with indeterminate end time for unless they have a regular schedule which they can adhere to and finalize patch notes and thus patch contents after testing the week or weeks previously?

3) The patch notes for all previous patches that I remember have a post time from very early on patch day or before usually, and then they get "Revealed" later on in the day as if they were always there.
They should just reveal them now since they're already posted and will not change. They will add another post about any changes, which likely won't happen except to say "we were provided incorrect patch notes to post from the content push team and will have to make a correction to the post now that they all can see it" which means it would be better to post it now and have somebody correct them earlier than they would have noticed before.

You don't work on an MMO development and launch team, but worse is that you don't understand the past history of this game and these forums.
I'm just arguing for earlier reveal of the already FINALIZED A WEEK AGO patch notes.
Why would that be a problem? It would be just like seeing update notes on PTS, but there would be no disclaimer needed since all changes have been final for days.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

kamimark wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Vote how you want it to be, not how you think it has to be.

No. Wishing doesn't change the laws of physics and the real work of software engineering, or how annoying people are when they see notes for something they aren't going to get.

And yet you all seem to think this patch is a bunch of small little pieces that are being sifted through like some undecided child looking for their favorite toy in the toy box.
1) The patch contents were listed in an internal document by end of day Friday, if they know what they are doing remotely by now.
2) The patch notes were also listed in an internal document by end of day Friday as well, if they know what they are doing.

Surprises are bad. If they can avoid surprises and set a cutoff date for changes where they will not be launched unless tested then they will.
Or do you think that every April 16th you can just send part of your taxes in within the USA and then do the rest later or send them a day later? You have ample warning and time to do your taxes so they need to be done and post-marked by that date or you have trouble(normally).
The developers set a cutoff. The patch has to be done and tested as a complete package by a certain day ahead of patch day, at which point the patch notes get set in stone ahead of patch day, and then they wait for patch day to apply the patch and let us know what it contains.

Turelus · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Things can change, better they post what happens than what should happen then have to amend it causing rage because they didn't deliver on something.

Also then you would remove the Natch Potes? meme and threads, you want to kill all our fun?

1) It's already happening.
The steak is cooked and on its way to your table. Time for the waiter to at least tell you what you are getting after you said "surprise me".

2) The patch notes and full patch data was already decided, likely on Friday, and just has not been shown to us yet. There is no changing it now.
The only thing that could change is that they have to redo the patch and keep the servers down longer to do so if somebody hits the wrong button and instead of applying patch formats the server drives. FYI, that happened to Everquest and was a story in the now defunct magazine Massively or whatever: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMO_Games_Magazine

From my personal experience with MMO gaming my reason is as to why it's always been. I could be wrong but as others have said I believe that's what ZOS has stated in the past.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

Turelus wrote: »

From my personal experience with MMO gaming my reason is as to why it's always been. I could be wrong but as others have said I believe that's what ZOS has stated in the past.

Oh yes, the big one. You all know what "public representative speak" is right?
I do because I am a phone rep for my company. I know things I can't tell the customer outright. I can't even put the blame squarely on a person both I and the customer know did wrong and how they did wrong. Instead of saying "I'm sorry he didn't do what he was supposed to" I have to say "I'm sorry we didn't do what we were supposed to" and other such misdirections.

They say "things can change" to avoid posting things ahead of time for other reasons that they can't tell because it would be either insulting or demeaning or just upset the customer.

In this case they probably should have said "we do not release patch notes early because people may see an exploit fix note and figure out how to exploit it and do so before we can fix it and a rollback of server data to fix that would take far more effort to fix than just keeping it a secret" or something similar.
BUT, you can't exploit an exploit they are fixing when the patch to fix it is currently being written to the server while the servers are offline from us, so there is no point to holding it back as soon as the data is being written to the memory on the server in preparation to send it down to us.

So again, the patch is already applying with no hiccups in sight, and any such hiccups will just delay the speed of it and not derail a piece of it. If it were to be derailed it would be the whole thing anyway.
Releasing the patch notes now, or 3 hours ago even, or waiting however much longer until the servers are back online fully is just a choice, not for any real reason that could be explained away.

So would you rather know Hurricane Irma is on your doorstep and you should be evacuating when you already see the rain and wind or have them tell you after your door is washed away and it's too late?

DRXHarbinger · September 2017

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

MissBizz · September 2017

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/370893/pc-mac-patch-notes-v3-1-8

Shunq · September 2017

You have to consider that the apply possible fixes ,they test them, leave out the failed ones, post the "successful" ones and that you don't know until almost the end.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

Hear comes the troll posting.

My point was....obviously....that these people saying "they can't post it when it might change" are claiming things that are in progress can change. Somehow, I am already driving down the road but can stop myself from ever driving and prevent myself from being where I already am.

The patch is already applied so where are the notes? As of 30 minutes ago?
I would think they could post the patch notes when they're 90% applied if not earlier.

Edit:
Oh hey look. The post says it was posted September 10th. We just see it now. I was right.
They even edited them as they always do if there are typos or anything else. Maybe next time they can reveal them earlier rather than causing one of these threads.

DRXHarbinger · September 2017

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

Hear comes the troll posting.

My point was....obviously....that these people saying "they can't post it when it might change" are claiming things that are in progress can change. Somehow, I am already driving down the road but can stop myself from ever driving and prevent myself from being where I already am.

The patch is already applied so where are the notes? As of 30 minutes ago?
I would think they could post the patch notes when they're 90% applied if not earlier.

Edit:
Oh hey look. The post says it was posted September 10th. We just see it now. I was right.
They even edited them as they always do if there are typos or anything else. Maybe next time they can reveal them earlier rather than causing one of these threads.

You need to l2read (you evidently don't as someone already linked them in your thread but again you felt the need for need and bashed the keyboard anyway). Here it comes in the simplest possible terms for you.

ZOS does know what is in the patch.
ZOS deploys patch.
ZOS must wait for patch, test it and then if all good can release patch notes.
Patch notes go out.

This is the process, YES they KNOW what they are, but they MUST be tested however brief prior to being made live on client side, if they release the notes and someone is wrong guess what? Basement dwellers be all upset and end up reading another lot later on.. Which it would seem is not wanted or difficult.

Cannot be any simpler.

Looking at the patch notes...they took all of 30s to read, I do not see any harm in waiting, as said all read before anyone could load a toon in.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

Hear comes the troll posting.

My point was....obviously....that these people saying "they can't post it when it might change" are claiming things that are in progress can change. Somehow, I am already driving down the road but can stop myself from ever driving and prevent myself from being where I already am.

The patch is already applied so where are the notes? As of 30 minutes ago?
I would think they could post the patch notes when they're 90% applied if not earlier.

Edit:
Oh hey look. The post says it was posted September 10th. We just see it now. I was right.
They even edited them as they always do if there are typos or anything else. Maybe next time they can reveal them earlier rather than causing one of these threads.

You need to l2read (you evidently don't as someone already linked them in your thread but again you felt the need for need and bashed the keyboard anyway). Here it comes in the simplest possible terms for you.

ZOS does know what is in the patch.
ZOS deploys patch.
ZOS must wait for patch, test it and then if all good can release patch notes.
Patch notes go out.

This is the process, YES they KNOW what they are, but they MUST be tested however brief prior to being made live on client side, if they release the notes and someone is wrong guess what? Basement dwellers be all upset and end up reading another lot later on.. Which it would seem is not wanted or difficult.

Cannot be any simpler.

Looking at the patch notes...they took all of 30s to read, I do not see any harm in waiting, as said all read before anyone could load a toon in.

Duhhhhhh they were tested last week.
Duhhhhhh check the date int he top right of the patch notes posted.
Duhhhhhh the patch contents were being applied so they could release the patch notes.

You think they were testing TODAY?! Now who needs to learn to read? Maybe you should type out the whole words instead of "l2read".

I'm done with this thread and you are getting ignored.

Turelus · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

I lost interest when I realised the OP was an expert and didn't actually need a question answered. I wasn't aware we had Matt Firor himself in this thread telling us how ZOS worked.

DeadlyRecluse · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

I don't think they intentionally hold them back, I think they don't release them until they are 100% sure what is in the given patch.

DRXHarbinger · September 2017

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

Hear comes the troll posting.

My point was....obviously....that these people saying "they can't post it when it might change" are claiming things that are in progress can change. Somehow, I am already driving down the road but can stop myself from ever driving and prevent myself from being where I already am.

The patch is already applied so where are the notes? As of 30 minutes ago?
I would think they could post the patch notes when they're 90% applied if not earlier.

Edit:
Oh hey look. The post says it was posted September 10th. We just see it now. I was right.
They even edited them as they always do if there are typos or anything else. Maybe next time they can reveal them earlier rather than causing one of these threads.

You need to l2read (you evidently don't as someone already linked them in your thread but again you felt the need for need and bashed the keyboard anyway). Here it comes in the simplest possible terms for you.

ZOS does know what is in the patch.
ZOS deploys patch.
ZOS must wait for patch, test it and then if all good can release patch notes.
Patch notes go out.

This is the process, YES they KNOW what they are, but they MUST be tested however brief prior to being made live on client side, if they release the notes and someone is wrong guess what? Basement dwellers be all upset and end up reading another lot later on.. Which it would seem is not wanted or difficult.

Cannot be any simpler.

Looking at the patch notes...they took all of 30s to read, I do not see any harm in waiting, as said all read before anyone could load a toon in.

Duhhhhhh they were tested last week.
Duhhhhhh check the date int he top right of the patch notes posted.
Duhhhhhh the patch contents were being applied so they could release the patch notes.

You think they were testing TODAY?! Now who needs to learn to read? Maybe you should type out the whole words instead of "l2read".

I'm done with this thread and you are getting ignored.

So if they didn't test it today how would they know if the patch was successful? Until it makes to live / client end it cannot be tested and verified.. you know what im out. This kid has no clue. To save the mods from taking action I'm not saying anymore. OP is clearly on a 7 figure salary and knows how these things work more than any of us.

@ZOS_MattFiror a good candidate for the company here.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

Turelus wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

^everyone looses interest in a thread when someone compares not having patch notes to not being notified a cat 5 hurricane is on its way...

Some people eh?

I lost interest when I realised the OP was an expert and didn't actually need a question answered. I wasn't aware we had Matt Firor himself in this thread telling us how ZOS worked.

Troll uses troll face? Big Surprise

1) Never claimed to be an expert.
2) Simple logic not simple enough for you?

Look at the date of the patch notes post. It was posted yesterday but hidden.

So, do you ever get your car fixed without knowing exactly what they are going to do to it and what it will cost? You just hand them the keys and hope they don't charge you thousands of dollars for replacing blinker fluid(old joke)?

Did you patch your game yet today or are you waiting until tomorrow or next week? If you wait you are doing exactly what they did with the patch to the servers. It was already done and set in stone and they just applied it and didn't tell us abou the info until after fully applied, not even while in progress.

Think of it this way so maybe you will understand the simplest logic ever....
You're alive right? How do you know? Because you are and you think right? It's a simple truth. Well what if someone told you that you can't be alive because nobody told you that you were alive yet and then they told you and said "Happy Birthday"?
The patch was already being applied and the data was already known and wasn't changing and they could have revealed the notes that were posted yesterday but they decided to not reveal them until today when the patch was already applied and not even while it was in progress.

1+1=2
patch applying+downtime=patch already tested and done and notes should be posted

ZOS_GinaBruno · September 2017

Hey folks, wanted to give you a little insight here. The main reason is we prefer to wait until our QA team has verified that the build is good to publish. This doesn't mean they're checking all the fixes - this happens prior to the weekend - but they're checking things like if they can log in with characters, create a new character, the world is visible, monsters can be killed, menus can be opened, etc. This typically happens toward the end of maintenance, for obvious reasons, which is why the patch notes get posted toward the end.

If there's a situation where the build doesn't pass this last step of QA, or one of the fixes is causing a particular issue, we need to evaluate what to do and sometimes this means not publishing the build. If we've already published patch notes, then this could get confusing pretty quickly, especially for players who don't follow what's happening closely. We don't want to say "hey, here's the change log!" but then it doesn't actually happen for whatever reason.

We know some other games publish their patch notes sooner, but they likely have a different way of running maintenance and publishing builds - no one company is the same - so it's just the way it is. At the end of the day, it seems like we're arguing over just a few hours. If there's a particularly compelling reason why you'd like to see patch notes published earlier, please let us know. We're all ears! But if it's essentially just a patience issue, then...

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

I don't think they intentionally hold them back, I think they don't release them until they are 100% sure what is in the given patch.

But they were 100% sure yesterday when they posted them. They do intentionally hold them back, just like when parents don't tell their family they are having a baby until a specific time for a bigger reaction, or don't tell the baby's gender when they have known for a while. The baby is coming, whether they want to admit it or not.

Patch notes were set in stone yesterday as of the post date Sept 10th.
If the developers want to contradict me with a specific reason why I'm wrong then they can. But, I don't expect to see that as it would contradict the "rep speak".

Hmmm, I guess all the people who voted blue on this pole for option 2 are gullible enough to believe things like when Al Gore claimed to have invented the internet 47 seconds into this video:
[url

bebynnag · September 2017

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey folks, wanted to give you a little insight here. The main reason is we prefer to wait until our QA team has verified that the build is good to publish. This doesn't mean they're checking all the fixes - this happens prior to the weekend - but they're checking things like if they can log in with characters, create a new character, the world is visible, monsters can be killed, menus can be opened, etc. This typically happens toward the end of maintenance, for obvious reasons, which is why the patch notes get posted toward the end.

If there's a situation where the build doesn't pass this last step of QA, or one of the fixes is causing a particular issue, we need to evaluate what to do and sometimes this means not publishing the build. If we've already published patch notes, then this could get confusing pretty quickly, especially for players who don't follow what's happening closely. We don't want to say "hey, here's the change log!" but then it doesn't actually happen for whatever reason.

We know some other games publish their patch notes sooner, but they likely have a different way of running maintenance and publishing builds - no one company is the same - so it's just the way it is. At the end of the day, it seems like we're arguing over just a few hours. If there's a particularly compelling reason why you'd like to see patch notes published earlier, please let us know. We're all ears! But if it's essentially just a patience issue, then...

in otherwords Gina is telling ya'll to quit your bellyaching

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey folks, wanted to give you a little insight here. The main reason is we prefer to wait until our QA team has verified that the build is good to publish. This doesn't mean they're checking all the fixes - this happens prior to the weekend - but they're checking things like if they can log in with characters, create a new character, the world is visible, monsters can be killed, menus can be opened, etc. This typically happens toward the end of maintenance, for obvious reasons, which is why the patch notes get posted toward the end.

Why does that happen on live servers after the build is pushed to live?
You said it happens at the end so does that mean you can roll back the build that easy?

And if this is all true, why does this game need to do that when every other MMO I have played has shorter downtimes usually, has the patch ready to download for players as soon as downtime starts or shortly after so they can patch during downtime, lets players get in immediately when downtime ends and also post patch notes as soon as that downtime starts or even the day before?

Something tells me this game doesn't have a patch server that is separate from the live servers but in the same environment for this testing, and this game really needs to learn more from other games.

Sorry to be critical, but that's the only way we improve is facing hard truths and dealing with them.

Demolitionary · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Ah, the joys of a keyboard Einstein, it is why I gave up wasting time on someone that thinks they somehow knows ALL with an all seeing eye of Dagon himself.

anitajoneb17_ESO · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

1+1=2
patch applying+downtime=patch already tested and done and notes should be posted

Can't you understand that something can go wrong DURING maintenance / patch application, forcing them to remove some parts of the patch in the last minute ?

Base situation :
- Patch is meant the change horse color to pink
- Patch goes through Q/A, all is fine. Patch notes are ready.
- On patch day something is wrong and the "horse-pink-color-module" has to be removed from patch

Scenario 1 :
- Patch notes have been released at the beginning of maintenance
- Players are all hyped about pink horses
- Patch notes must be amended with explanations and apologies
- Players rage because they've been all hyped about pink horses they won't get.
- (Not-so-optional : players all over the forum start teaching ZOS how to implement pink horses, how easy that is, and how incompetent they are).

Scenario 2 :
- Patch notes have not yet been published, they're simply amended (pink horses removed from patch notes)
- Players don't get upset about no-pink-horses, because they haven't been expecting them in the first place.

I can understand why ZOS chooses scenario 2.

Besides, there's the seagulls' thing and all.

bebynnag · September 2017

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

I don't think they intentionally hold them back, I think they don't release them until they are 100% sure what is in the given patch.

But they were 100% sure yesterday when they posted them. They do intentionally hold them back, just like when parents don't tell their family they are having a baby until a specific time for a bigger reaction, or don't tell the baby's gender when they have known for a while. The baby is coming, whether they want to admit it or not.

Patch notes were set in stone yesterday as of the post date Sept 10th.
If the developers want to contradict me with a specific reason why I'm wrong then they can. But, I don't expect to see that as it would contradict the "rep speak".

Hmmm, I guess all the people who voted blue on this pole for option 2 are gullible enough to believe things like when Al Gore claimed to have invented the internet 47 seconds into this video:
[url

calling people gullible & holding this up as an example. its cute that you have no idea why its funny!

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

puffytheslayer wrote: »

calling people gullible & holding this up as an example. its cute that you have no idea why its funny!

Enlighten me, seriously.

Is it because he misspoke, as anyone would, when put on the spot and then it has been used against everything he will ever say in the future to try to discredit anything he says when it could have been stopped by the interviewer calling it out right then as well and asking him if he wished to correct himself?

Or is it because you really think he, or his political party, had any real say in inventing the internet?

I would believe the first option and hopefully proved I understand it. The second option is like believing politicians have degrees in all these fields of study that they make decisions about and aren't actually just delegating to people who really do know these fields and aren't just telling the politicians what to say. If that were the case the country would be less divided and a lot better off if politicians knew more about how their decisions affected everyone, but more often than not they just listen to the most vocal with the most money.

I've said my piece and asked my questions of the devs. If they choose to answer, or just think about my questions to help the game, or not then I am ok with it today.

Turelus · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

hahaha so OP insults everyone, then ninja edits but not before Puffy can capture it in a quote?

Oh this thread just continues to deliver.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

Turelus wrote: »

hahaha so OP insults everyone, then ninja edits but not before Puffy can capture it in a quote?

Ninja edits what?
Only edits I did are to add things or correct typos/grammatical errors.

Mystrius_Archaion · September 2017

Post patch notes soon after maintenance starts.

Yes, I'm truly confused at what I supposedly "ninja edited". Is he just making stuff up?

Turelus · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

Yes, I'm truly confused at what I supposedly "ninja edited". Is he just making stuff up?

Ah yeah I thought it was the other post, my bad. You just insulted everyone and left it.

anitajoneb17_ESO · September 2017

Hold patch notes back like they do now.

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

But they were 100% sure yesterday when they posted them. They do intentionally hold them back, just like when parents don't tell their family they are having a baby until a specific time for a bigger reaction, or don't tell the baby's gender when they have known for a while. The baby is coming, whether they want to admit it or not.

Ever heard of miscarriage ?
That's the main reason why future parents usually hold the "info" until later in the pregnancy.

Relatively speaking, (let's not compare a baby with a piece of software) the same logic applies here : something can go wrong.

DRXHarbinger · September 2017

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey folks, wanted to give you a little insight here. The main reason is we prefer to wait until our QA team has verified that the build is good to publish. This doesn't mean they're checking all the fixes - this happens prior to the weekend - but they're checking things like if they can log in with characters, create a new character, the world is visible, monsters can be killed, menus can be opened, etc. This typically happens toward the end of maintenance, for obvious reasons, which is why the patch notes get posted toward the end.

Why does that happen on live servers after the build is pushed to live?
You said it happens at the end so does that mean you can roll back the build that easy?

And if this is all true, why does this game need to do that when every other MMO I have played has shorter downtimes usually, has the patch ready to download for players as soon as downtime starts or shortly after so they can patch during downtime, lets players get in immediately when downtime ends and also post patch notes as soon as that downtime starts or even the day before?

Something tells me this game doesn't have a patch server that is separate from the live servers but in the same environment for this testing, and this game really needs to learn more from other games.

Sorry to be critical, but that's the only way we improve is facing hard truths and dealing with them.

Please go and work in some kind of IT environment and stop listening to guild mates (if you have any) Testing in a test environment is way different to testing on live. Barely anyone tests on live anywhere..

Face it, Gina just schooled you, feel the burn and leave it.