Confusing CP Jump Point Question

TheNeckerCube · August 2017

From various sources, it is suggested that the CP perks like Master-at-Arms will need 52 points to yield 19% increase to direct damage attacks. However, the actual tooltip at 51 points reads 19%.

I know there is a chart that shows 52 points = 19%, but is this true or just a typo? Why would the tooltip read 51 points = 19% flat increase?

Any insight would be appreciated. Thanks!

Greydir · August 2017

The Jumppoint only work when you cross a certain threshold. The Threshold is the Full percentage. So with 19% you are at but not over the threshold and will only get an increase of 18% - as silly as that may sound. The fact that there even are such jump points is very stupid and for most people misleading, but such is this game.

zaria · August 2017

Greydir wrote: »

The Jumppoint only work when you cross a certain threshold. The Threshold is the Full percentage. So with 19% you are at but not over the threshold and will only get an increase of 18% - as silly as that may sound. The fact that there even are such jump points is very stupid and for most people misleading, but such is this game.

That way more stupid than I thought, I assumed it only counted percentage so 18.89 would give 18% but 19.01 give 19%.

If you has to take it to 19.07 for some reason it would be just as insane as some other counter intuitive stuff in the game.
If it has an good reason show this limits clearly in the tooltip.

GnarlyMcGnasty · August 2017

zaria wrote: »

Greydir wrote: »

The Jumppoint only work when you cross a certain threshold. The Threshold is the Full percentage. So with 19% you are at but not over the threshold and will only get an increase of 18% - as silly as that may sound. The fact that there even are such jump points is very stupid and for most people misleading, but such is this game.

That way more stupid than I thought, I assumed it only counted percentage so 18.89 would give 18% but 19.01 give 19%.

If you has to take it to 19.07 for some reason it would be just as insane as some other counter intuitive stuff in the game.
If it has an good reason show this limits clearly in the tooltip.

That's right, from what I understand as well. Perhaps the OP just has a tooltip error.

Basically you want to be at, or just over the whole number to get that amount of "boost" from it. Any percentages between whole numbers are worthless. (Those .07's, .59's, .99's.)

Asayre · August 2017

It is related to different rounding for damage calculation and tooltip display.

I believe that the formula for Master-at-Arms (and other 25% stars) is

4/5000000*Point^3-131/50000*Point^2+252/500*Point

With 51 points, this gives us a value of 18.9955. Damage calculation takes the floor of the value which is 18. The tooltip shown takes the rounded value to 2 decimal places which is 19.00.

TheNeckerCube · August 2017

Thank you all for the feedback and insights!

scipionumatia · August 2017

Wow... time to revisit my camp points, had exact percentages where I could fit em, this is kinda *** no?

Taleof2Cities · August 2017

scipionumatia wrote: »

Wow... time to revisit my camp points, had exact percentages where I could fit em, this is kinda *** no?

Same here ... I had 19% on a couple of stars ... will have to change per the jump point chart. Great question, @TheNeckerCube!

bebynnag · August 2017

Ive been trying to explian this to a few people in game,

i dont know if its how im explaining it,
or because its so absurd they think i must be wrong

but no one listens! LOL

Koolio · August 2017

Has Zos made an official announcement to this. I read all the post when this changed and explained it to my guild. Just want to see if this is how it's "meant to work".

Nestor · August 2017

Koolio wrote: »

Has Zos made an official announcement to this. I read all the post when this changed and explained it to my guild. Just want to see if this is how it's "meant to work".

The official announcement is, less lag is introduced working with Integers rather than Floating Point Numbers (those that have decimals), so they take the two most significant digits and ignore the fraction.

In this case, 19% displayed is really 18.99something as explained above.

As far as I can tell, this only effects a few stars in the constellations. Most of them it is clear your either below or above the Integer, for example, your 18.9% or 19.05% or something to that effect.

TheNeckerCube · August 2017

puffytheslayer wrote: »

Ive been trying to explian this to a few people in game,

i dont know if its how im explaining it,
or because its so absurd they think i must be wrong

but no one listens! LOL

Yup this happened to me; it's even more frustrating since. for me, the non-believers are typically higher level, and CP1000+ at times.

fgoron2000 · August 2017

Asayre wrote: »
It is related to different rounding for damage calculation and tooltip display.

I believe that the formula for Master-at-Arms (and other 25% stars) is
4/5000000*Point^3-131/50000*Point^2+252/500*Point
With 51 points, this gives us a value of 18.9955. Damage calculation takes the floor of the value which is 18. The tooltip shown takes the rounded value to 2 decimal places which is 19.00.

So the bottom line on this is, it's a simple matter of rounding? sheesh...BTW, the above from Asayre is the clearest explanation I've seen on this yet.

Now to muddy it up once again. The only percentage I'd ever seen this referenced, is for 19% in the 25% stars. So what about other percentages that are indicated in the tooltips as whole numbers?

For example, with Bastion or Warlord, 2 points gives you 1%. Do you need to get past that 1% or if you could see the math behind the calculation, would you see that 1% = 1%?

I guess if ZOS used the more precise tooltips, then we could see the actual breaks on these jump points? What I don't understand is their reasoning of why they're doing what they're doing, concerning lag due to FP instead of integers. Why couldn't they just use a simple lookup table with the correct values for the tooltips instead of doing the calulation every time? I'd think that may take away the cause of the lag?...at least for the affected stars?

psxfloh · August 2017

If they had a halfway decent user interface developer they wouldn't have introduced that crappy decimal numbers, but something like this instead:
"For the next 1% increase you have to spend X champion points"
.. and you'd spend X cp in one go to get to the next number that won't get rounded down.

But my guess is they only have 2 week interns working on several aspects of the game.. like cp system, activity finder, guild trader interface, balancing, loot RNG, etc.etc., it sure as hell feels like that.

starkerealm · August 2017

I'll be honest, the existence of jump points just convinces me that the CR system should really be point purchases for specific values, rather than a point by point granular system.

So, you spend a point to get your 1%, then you spend two or three to get your 2% in a single go, rather than individually.

Kurkikohtaus · August 2017

starkerealm wrote: »

the existence of jump points just convinces me that the CR system should really be point purchases for specific values, rather than a point by point granular system.

Agree 100%, this has to become transparent and intuitive. As beautiful as the interface screen is, the nodes need to be redesigned so that spending points reflect the actual stat gains.

randomkeyhits · August 2017

Nestor wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Has Zos made an official announcement to this. I read all the post when this changed and explained it to my guild. Just want to see if this is how it's "meant to work".

The official announcement is, less lag is introduced working with Integers rather than Floating Point Numbers (those that have decimals), so they take the two most significant digits and ignore the fraction.

In this case, 19% displayed is really 18.99something as explained above.

As far as I can tell, this only effects a few stars in the constellations. Most of them it is clear your either below or above the Integer, for example, your 18.9% or 19.05% or something to that effect.

Less work, really? What do they teach for programming these days?

If they want the tool tips to be accurate factor the stored numbers up by 100, divide by 100 when displaying and change the calculation accordingly.

Its not rocket science.

Sotomaior · August 2017

So if you put 100 points in a constellation with 25% you only reach 24.that's right?
Even in those with 15% ,putting 100 points it's worthless if you reach 14...
Something's wrong with zos

Samwell Slayer · August 2017

Sotomaior wrote: »

So if you put 100 points in a constellation with 25% you only reach 24.that's right?
Even in those with 15% ,putting 100 points it's worthless if you reach 14...
Something's wrong with zos

Nope. That's part of the issue, they don't show all the decimal places. 15% doesn't mean 15, it means 14.998, and there's no way to know that before hand.