My vision on DKs, and how to fix their useless/broken skills.

ak_pvp · August 2017

Hello all, I am here to talk about an issue very close to my heart. The lack of creativity or utility of skills on a DK. I'd like to say I am well experienced on DKs having mained one since beta. (Except one time I deleted it.) NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

DK used to be a really fun class, it had utility and strength. Then they nerfed everything to the point of killing many skills, and making the class near useless in group PvP, since every other class can do its job better. I will go though a list of changes to skills that will better help DKs become useful. My view on this game, everything deserves a counter. DKs should be slow, and not very burst, but instead good at locking down enemies and reflecting projectiles. Think of darth vader in rogue one. (Just less OP)

Chains: Ladies ands gentlemen one of the worst designed skills in the game: Height issues, auto CC immunity, generally useless outside of a few PvE circumstances. Why the hell should people be able to spam skills from a place a DK can't reach and get away with it, and the automatic CC immunity is pathetic, it just screws over the skill. The shoved in unworking gapcloser morph is a testament to the fact that the slowness of a DK doesn't work, so ZOS bandaided it and claimed to help. FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,
Leap: In the same vein, fix height issues and not works on leap
Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. If it is broken, then it gives CC immunity and doesn't pull. This way it won't affect PvE, and allow DKs to have some utility in stopping height abusers. (People going up rocks with streak/horse and ganking people from safety.) However can be broken out of so it isn't OP.
Fossilize: I understand some people like this skill, but personally, I hate it. It has 2 uses, pausing someones damage combo, and meteor. Otherwise it is a glorified 1man root, it breaks too easily and something like fear *** all over it. (Don't nerf fear btw) If it is to be comparable to fear, since it is only a st CC; make the stun not break from damage, the stunned player should do it themselves. As a trade off, it could have a shorter duration.
Scales: WHYYYYYYY. 4K mag for projectiles. (Terms and conditions apply) And has 2 ways of falling off, either time or projectile limit. FIX: Make it all projectiles bar meteor. Make it have infinite duration. This way, it doesn't need spamming and is actually worth using, but you can still break it by rushing it with projectiles.
Standard: Give it a stun+burst on its initial impact, adjust dot so damage isn't changed, Its awful in PvP, Destro ult pisses all over it.
Make dragon blood scale of max stats, i.e. sp/wp and health/mag/stam all affect its heal, so 10k stam+health and 40k mag would affect it the same way as 20k of each stat, that way tanks, stam and mag DKs can use it as a worth while heal, and it'd be quite unique.

Things I wish would happen which would match DKs against other classes for damage, since DK damage is still rather low and requires a lot of wearing down, even at lower health due to having no execute and purgable dots. However these may affect PvE, but wont make DK OP still.

Inferno: WILD CARD: Just make it AoE pls, the mag morph can be consuming inferno with magsteal, the other poison miasma with defile or something. Shouldn't affect DPS much.
Execute: WILD CARD. Its the only type of ability that can't be gained at all for mag, i.e. spammable though destro. Give DKs the implosion passive, Rename to toxify/cremate and fire/poison damage. This way it would make stacking fire/poison dots allow DKs to execute, since they don't have super high burst. (Though damage would be toned down as to not be OP.) OR make DK dots deal more damage at low health. But that would be too close to poison injection.

scipionumatia · August 2017

id like to see stone giant morph be stam based. your tossing a rock, that's pretty dang physical damage if ive ever seen it. other morph should be a fire bolt and heal the caster rather than nearest target.

should never be "target too hight/low" if your within range it should pull. got a problem with pple ripping players off keeps? make the walls slightly higher or reduce chains range. I also agree, the gap closer morph is lazy. you wanna give dk a mag class gap closer? change the morph to something like (and this is just off the top of my head)

"dragon rush"-transform into pure fury, charging your target for X fire damage. Gain empower on your next attack.

scales id just be happy if it reflected things like javelin, cliff racer, and crushing shock. and I don't wanna hear the "but its a beam/bird!" excuse, ive got no problem reflecting swallow soul and that's what I can only assume is some type of blood magic?

fossilize I don't like cause if your target is cc immune it doesn't do a damn thing. reason I changed it out for stone giant, its weak and can be reflected (on stam dk) but at least it hits for 2k-ish and the range isn't trash.

agree with ya on standard, would be cooler if a target was in the casting radius it was automatically chained rather than relying on synergy.

dragonblood scaling off max resource? yessss please!

other things on my wish list-
reduced cost on corrosive armor 130 seems fair.
poison whip that grants minor heroism
FoO create 3 balls that fire every 5 seconds or one fire ball that fires every 2 seconds. the one ball that shoots every 5 seconds is bad, your better off running camo hunter for the passive damage.

Vapirko · August 2017

Stam DKs definitely need some spice added. They got nerfed way way too hard. I honestly wouldn't say they need to be made more powerful, but their skills do need fixing and they need some kick that makes them unique. Stamina NB for example still makes really good use of a number of its class skills for damage, sustain and mobility. Stam DK and to some extent stam sorc as well, rely mostly on other skills lines. Not only is it sad, it's also boring.

Royaji · August 2017

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

ak_pvp · August 2017

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

Nice job you utter idiot. You didn't even read further on did you. Let me show you a scenario:

vMoL: Normal: Pull a white add, it pulls instantly, and then wait 6s for the add to lose CC immunity to pull again whilst it is bashing on your group. 6s of wait before add reaches you. NEW: Pull a white add, it is it stuns for 1.5s so it can't deal damage and then pulls. No CC immunity wait because those adds can't break CC. Pull again, stuns for 1.5s and pulls. 3s of wait time before add reaches you

It PvP that would make the skill worthwhile since you aren't cucking yourself by gifting the other player CC immunity straight away.

IxskullzxI · August 2017

Inferno should just pulse aoe fire damage every 5 seconds instead of a fireball that you have no idea who it's going to target.

scipionumatia · August 2017

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Inferno should just pulse aoe fire damage every 5 seconds instead of a fireball that you have no idea who it's going to target.

@IxskullzxI agree for mag morph, clearly FoO is the stam morph as it gives stam crit chance. Would be cool if the stam morph worked similarly to the mag morph but did physical/poison/disease damage. Maybe "molten ring of earth" like that new monster set?

IxskullzxI · August 2017

scipionumatia wrote: »

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Inferno should just pulse aoe fire damage every 5 seconds instead of a fireball that you have no idea who it's going to target.

@IxskullzxI agree for mag morph, clearly FoO is the stam morph as it gives stam crit chance. Would be cool if the stam morph worked similarly to the mag morph but did physical/poison/disease damage. Maybe "molten ring of earth" like that new monster set?

Could just make it like the monster set and be whatever stat is higher. Then do whatever with the other morph.

leepalmer95 · August 2017

Stone giant isn't actually bad, it does a lot of dmg (like 10% more than your base whip) on knockdown and gives stam return via passives, however it can be dodged and blocked.

Fossilise is a great skill, ranged cc that goes through block and roll with a root, also gives stam via passives.

Wings need to be better yes, lower the cost atleast.

Chains and leap need to be fixed, chains needs to pull you instantly or make the animation a lot faster because currently you throw the chains, it connect and then you pull where other gap closer close the gap instantly.

Standard needs a bigger aoe, at least the size of destro ult or maybe bigger. Be cool if the shifting because a cc instead.

Execute won't happens, it's already been stated by wrobel, also class doesn't need to much anymore.

Inferno is a great skill, used by both stam and mag in pve. Decent dmg for its cost and is amazing in 1v1. Used it on a few builds when i'm in IC or something.

Master_Kas · August 2017

Imo the lack of a proper gapcloser and some kind of execute is what I feel DK is lacking.

Some passive like impolsion, or making dots do more damage to people on low health.
Chains is buggy, works fine sometimes and sometimes not (the one that pulls you to the target).

Some more experienced DK's prob know better what the class needs but thats what I've noticed lately. Miss the times where you actually could use invasion as a gapcloser :<

generalmyrick · August 2017

SHOUTOUT TO THE DK THAT JUST TALONED ME EVERY HALF STEP!!!

leepalmer95 · August 2017

generalmyrick wrote: »

SHOUTOUT TO THE DK THAT JUST TALONED ME EVERY HALF STEP!!!

Yeah what a guy sacrificed all his sustain to root you every 2s.

Qbiken · August 2017

I just want the old Battleroar and Helping hands back.

montjie · August 2017

Qbiken wrote: »

I just want the old Battleroar and Helping hands back.

Im with you on that one. DK's really got neutered with that change

Valencer · August 2017

Magicka DKs are really strong at the moment. Mostly because the morrowind changes were a giant nerf to stam DK and a huge buff to mag DK.

If you're just talking about group utility... well, the only thing that matters in group play at the moment is mobility and damage output and neither of those 2 things have ever been DK strengths.

Royaji · August 2017

ak_pvp wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

Nice job you utter idiot. You didn't even read further on did you. Let me show you a scenario:

vMoL: Normal: Pull a white add, it pulls instantly, and then wait 6s for the add to lose CC immunity to pull again whilst it is bashing on your group. 6s of wait before add reaches you. NEW: Pull a white add, it is it stuns for 1.5s so it can't deal damage and then pulls. No CC immunity wait because those adds can't break CC. Pull again, stuns for 1.5s and pulls. 3s of wait time before add reaches you

It PvP that would make the skill worthwhile since you aren't cucking yourself by gifting the other player CC immunity straight away.

And this just shows how Stupid PvPers™ who have no idea about PvE ruin the game for PvE crowd. Most of the enemies in trials and DLC dungeons can't be stunned but can be chained. For example stoneshapers in RoM. And NPCs get CC immunity even if the stun was not broken.

And with your *** changes chaining 3 adds in will take 7,5 seconds at least. Now I can do it in 3. 3,5 seconds of DPS on the add is a big loss.

But who cares, little PVPer is upset that he can't 1v20 with this ring around the tree gameplay. Let's kick PvE tanks a bit more like they didn't suffer enough because of you.

And who is an utter idiot here?

WaltherCarraway · August 2017

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

Nice job you utter idiot. You didn't even read further on did you. Let me show you a scenario:

vMoL: Normal: Pull a white add, it pulls instantly, and then wait 6s for the add to lose CC immunity to pull again whilst it is bashing on your group. 6s of wait before add reaches you. NEW: Pull a white add, it is it stuns for 1.5s so it can't deal damage and then pulls. No CC immunity wait because those adds can't break CC. Pull again, stuns for 1.5s and pulls. 3s of wait time before add reaches you

It PvP that would make the skill worthwhile since you aren't cucking yourself by gifting the other player CC immunity straight away.

And this just shows how Stupid PvPers™ who have no idea about PvE ruin the game for PvE crowd. Most of the enemies in trials and DLC dungeons can't be stunned but can be chained. For example stoneshapers in RoM. And NPCs get CC immunity even if the stun was not broken.

And with your *** changes chaining 3 adds in will take 7,5 seconds at least. Now I can do it in 3. 3,5 seconds of DPS on the add is a big loss.

But who cares, little PVPer is upset that he can't 1v20 with this ring around the tree gameplay. Let's kick PvE tanks a bit more like they didn't suffer enough because of you.

And who is an utter idiot here?

MagDK 1v20... You fapped too much at permablock build video right?

PvPer are stupid.. okay. Despite the fact that lots of nerfs are tuned around PvP aspect.

Well I think beside dealing with programmed npcs and instances, PvEer can jump off a rock and climb for all day.

You keep going

Valencer · August 2017

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

Nice job you utter idiot. You didn't even read further on did you. Let me show you a scenario:

vMoL: Normal: Pull a white add, it pulls instantly, and then wait 6s for the add to lose CC immunity to pull again whilst it is bashing on your group. 6s of wait before add reaches you. NEW: Pull a white add, it is it stuns for 1.5s so it can't deal damage and then pulls. No CC immunity wait because those adds can't break CC. Pull again, stuns for 1.5s and pulls. 3s of wait time before add reaches you

It PvP that would make the skill worthwhile since you aren't cucking yourself by gifting the other player CC immunity straight away.

And this just shows how Stupid PvPers™ who have no idea about PvE ruin the game for PvE crowd. Most of the enemies in trials and DLC dungeons can't be stunned but can be chained. For example stoneshapers in RoM. And NPCs get CC immunity even if the stun was not broken.

And with your *** changes chaining 3 adds in will take 7,5 seconds at least. Now I can do it in 3. 3,5 seconds of DPS on the add is a big loss.

But who cares, little PVPer is upset that he can't 1v20 with this ring around the tree gameplay. Let's kick PvE tanks a bit more like they didn't suffer enough because of you.

And who is an utter idiot here?

The Stoneshapers in RoM are stunnable. Chains is a CC so if they weren't stunnable they wouldn't be chainable either.

It's always a good idea to get the basic facts straight before throwing insults around.

IxskullzxI · August 2017

Master_Kas wrote: »

Imo the lack of a proper gapcloser and some kind of execute is what I feel DK is lacking.

Some passive like impolsion, or making dots do more damage to people on low health.
Chains is buggy, works fine sometimes and sometimes not (the one that pulls you to the target).

Some more experienced DK's prob know better what the class needs but thats what I've noticed lately. Miss the times where you actually could use invasion as a gapcloser :<

I can deal without a gapcloser and execute. Imo what feels lacking is the lack of built in defense. Dk has no mobility/ways to reset a fight (other than mist) and no way to defend, other than block. (Both of which stop your regen) what I'd like to see is instant cast at your feet ash cloud morph that grants evasion while inside, and wings projectile limit increased to something like 6 or 7. Also, if the projectile has a debuff or dot attached to it, it shouldn't apply if reflected.
Edit: I'd also like to see an igneous morph be an actual useful shield. One That scales off max magicka.

scipionumatia · August 2017

Hey guys concerning PVP, I think HotR will help us out TBH. Sharpened meta and proc sets are going away so we will likely have more survivability. people will probably run oblivion glyphs on infused weapons but that's going to hurt other classes more than us I feel.
I'm optimistic

changed my build around and come HotR on console everything on my build is getting buffed

Side note- Have any PVP DK used mighty chiudon? I only ask because ive been using it for probably half a year now and its fantastic! 100% up time, no longer need to use Hardened armor so that frees up bar space and saves your mag pool for CCs and Scales! Also its 1pc is getting buffed in HotR.
Running chiudon would of been a more difficult decision if spiked armor had a good morph but you get to choose between a weak damage shield or a tiny weak AoE. Ill take the 100% uptime on major ward and resolve + the increased health any day.

Ocelot9x · August 2017

Mag dk is fine. Really,solo/group he's quite nice,and he doesn't need more damage etc,maybe more utility for group play.
Meanwhile stamina dk completely sucks,no way of helping your small scaling ,no utility at all.

Some changes I would find nice:

Shifting standards: on every cast people are feared for 1,5 sec,minor vulnerability

Inferno: poison damage

World in ruins : aoe poison DMG is beyond pathetic,make it physical

Green dragon blood: scaling with stamina/cost stamina

Battle roar: scales of max stat,being better then now at 35k max resource

Stonefist : one of the morph scaling with stam,gives minor heroism,tooltip is surprise attack

And maybe Stam dk will be on par with other classes

ak_pvp · August 2017

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

NONE OF THESE CHANGES LISTED WILL CHANGE DK FOR PVE.

Chains: blah blah blah... FIX: Remove it and replace with something else,

Stone giant: Rename this skill tectonics. Stuns for 1.5 sec, and then pulls. more blah blah...

Yeah, thanks. You've literally just f*** over all PvE tanks in this game. How about no?

Nice job you utter idiot. You didn't even read further on did you. Let me show you a scenario:

vMoL: Normal: Pull a white add, it pulls instantly, and then wait 6s for the add to lose CC immunity to pull again whilst it is bashing on your group. 6s of wait before add reaches you. NEW: Pull a white add, it is it stuns for 1.5s so it can't deal damage and then pulls. No CC immunity wait because those adds can't break CC. Pull again, stuns for 1.5s and pulls. 3s of wait time before add reaches you

It PvP that would make the skill worthwhile since you aren't cucking yourself by gifting the other player CC immunity straight away.

And this just shows how Stupid PvPers™ who have no idea about PvE ruin the game for PvE crowd. Most of the enemies in trials and DLC dungeons can't be stunned but can be chained. For example stoneshapers in RoM. And NPCs get CC immunity even if the stun was not broken.

And with your *** changes chaining 3 adds in will take 7,5 seconds at least. Now I can do it in 3. 3,5 seconds of DPS on the add is a big loss.

But who cares, little PVPer is upset that he can't 1v20 with this ring around the tree gameplay. Let's kick PvE tanks a bit more like they didn't suffer enough because of you.

And who is an utter idiot here?

Still you boo.

Hint: If they can be chained before, they would be able to be chained after. Because chaining works in the same way as a CC does, (Stoneshapers are indeed stunnable as the above comment said) on some adds ZOS just added a caveat for it, in a world with common sense, the caveat would work with the stun of chains ability too. On the CC immunity even if the stun isn't broken, I am asking for that to be removed for chains, only granting it if the stun IS broken.

And w0t... How exactly will it take 7.5s to pull in 3 adds. Using complex mathematical graphing (MSPaint) I have calculated that it will take 4.5s to pull all 3 adds, because you don't have to wait for each add to pull for the 1.5s timer on the other to begin. In a trial situation where multiple pulls may be needed, before adds are in a position to be damagable, my method would take 9s for 2 full pulls on 3 adds, the current method would take 10. My method would also account for *** pulls, being pullable again straight after.

CONCLUSION: 1.5s worse on single pulls, 1s better on multi pull, and also better if a pull is *** up (Add too far, wrong add pulled, pulled slightly off location) All this assuming PERFECT pulls, nothing a second early or late. So the general consensus is: Nothing changes, you are crying for cryings sake.

And ftr, contrary to my name, I play a lot of PvE, trials, vet dungeons etc and do indeed know what I am talking about.

montjie · August 2017

Ocelot9x wrote: »

Mag dk is fine. Really,solo/group he's quite nice,and he doesn't need more damage etc,maybe more utility for group play.
Meanwhile stamina dk completely sucks,no way of helping your small scaling ,no utility at all.

Some changes I would find nice:

Shifting standards: on every cast people are feared for 1,5 sec,minor vulnerability

Inferno: poison damage

World in ruins : aoe poison DMG is beyond pathetic,make it physical

Green dragon blood: scaling with stamina/cost stamina

Battle roar: scales of max stat,being better then now at 35k max resource

Stonefist : one of the morph scaling with stam,gives minor heroism,tooltip is surprise attack

And maybe Stam dk will be on par with other classes

Why would you want to fear enemies out of your ult. Seems counterproductive

Master_Kas · August 2017

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Imo the lack of a proper gapcloser and some kind of execute is what I feel DK is lacking.

Some passive like impolsion, or making dots do more damage to people on low health.
Chains is buggy, works fine sometimes and sometimes not (the one that pulls you to the target).

Some more experienced DK's prob know better what the class needs but thats what I've noticed lately. Miss the times where you actually could use invasion as a gapcloser :<

I can deal without a gapcloser and execute. Imo what feels lacking is the lack of built in defense. Dk has no mobility/ways to reset a fight (other than mist) and no way to defend, other than block. (Both of which stop your regen) what I'd like to see is instant cast at your feet ash cloud morph that grants evasion while inside, and wings projectile limit increased to something like 6 or 7. Also, if the projectile has a debuff or dot attached to it, it shouldn't apply if reflected.
Edit: I'd also like to see an igneous morph be an actual useful shield. One That scales off max magicka.

Yes one can manage. Having a blast on dk atm, stopped playing my magblade even. And nice suggestions.

ZOS plx

ak_pvp · August 2017

Ocelot9x wrote: »

Mag dk is fine. Really,solo/group he's quite nice,and he doesn't need more damage etc,maybe more utility for group play.
Meanwhile stamina dk completely sucks,no way of helping your small scaling ,no utility at all.

Some changes I would find nice:

Shifting standards: on every cast people are feared for 1,5 sec,minor vulnerability

Inferno: poison damage

World in ruins : aoe poison DMG is beyond pathetic,make it physical

Green dragon blood: scaling with stamina/cost stamina

Battle roar: scales of max stat,being better then now at 35k max resource

Stonefist : one of the morph scaling with stam,gives minor heroism,tooltip is surprise attack

And maybe Stam dk will be on par with other classes

The fear idea wouldn't work unfortunately as it would push people from the standard. A burst and maybe a root would be nice.

World in ruin is literally useless on stam unless running some niche sets. (I have also heard that it only works for DK abilities.) an AoE poison inferno would help with that.

I was thinking that base and GDB should just scale of total stats so tanks, mag and stam and hybrid builds get a benefit. (ZOS wants one morph viable for health tanks.) And the other can be for mag only as an oshit heal. StamDK would get some nice benefits from a burst heal because igneous now only does 2 ticks of vigor.

Stonefist as a stam spammable would also be quite nice, I was thinking of it as the pull because of the guards, where their stonefist stuns you, and if they pull you straight after it almost looks like the ground itself is pulling.

Defilted · August 2017

Wings

Morph 1
1/2/3 projectile limit but unlimited duration

Morph 2
4 to 10 projectile limit but the duration is 6 seconds

NBrookus · August 2017

mDK really is not in a bad place right now. There are some sore spots for sure, but we have defense (one trick pony there), good healing now and one good ultimate.

Chains needs to be fixed. Like for real. Swarm Mother pulls no problem. Silver Leash works fine. WTH does chains still got height issues?!

Standard - We need a replacement for standard. Warden has the same effect as a spammable DKS get for a 250 cost Ultimate. A better group utility ultimate is badly needed. (OR... maybe the shackle is auto-activated? Picking up that synergy is often a death sentence in PvP; auto-shackle, even minus the damage, would be worth the ultimate cost.)

Wings - They are just terrible now. What should be a key defensive skill is functionally limited to protection from overload spam and frags and killing tuberous max range archers spamming poison injection.

The remaining pain points are structural. The class has no mobility but pvp is highly mobile. The class relies on ultimate for too many things -- for sustain, for burst, for execute -- oh hai, let's nerf Battle Roar. Our skills are largely low damage and easily purged so we lack both sustained pressure and burst damage. How do you wear down an opponent with dots when every other class has access to the same or better sustain and can outheal/outshield/purge your damage?

If the devs vision continues to be for DKs to be a stand-your-ground class that outsustains, we need better tools to accomplish that.

Ocelot9x · August 2017

montjie wrote: »

Ocelot9x wrote: »

Mag dk is fine. Really,solo/group he's quite nice,and he doesn't need more damage etc,maybe more utility for group play.
Meanwhile stamina dk completely sucks,no way of helping your small scaling ,no utility at all.

Some changes I would find nice:

Shifting standards: on every cast people are feared for 1,5 sec,minor vulnerability

Inferno: poison damage

World in ruins : aoe poison DMG is beyond pathetic,make it physical

Green dragon blood: scaling with stamina/cost stamina

Battle roar: scales of max stat,being better then now at 35k max resource

Stonefist : one of the morph scaling with stam,gives minor heroism,tooltip is surprise attack

And maybe Stam dk will be on par with other classes

Why would you want to fear enemies out of your ult. Seems counterproductive

Because aoe fear is really powerful when group playing,lot more useful than a ridiculous dot. I'll happily trade the DMG with something better.

scipionumatia · August 2017

I don't know how stone fist hasn't always been a stam ability

also physical/poison/disease whip that grants heroism please! for being a class that has sustain rely largely on ulti- generation we have no class abilities that grant heroism.

IxskullzxI · August 2017

Master_Kas wrote: »

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Imo the lack of a proper gapcloser and some kind of execute is what I feel DK is lacking.

Some passive like impolsion, or making dots do more damage to people on low health.
Chains is buggy, works fine sometimes and sometimes not (the one that pulls you to the target).

Some more experienced DK's prob know better what the class needs but thats what I've noticed lately. Miss the times where you actually could use invasion as a gapcloser :<

I can deal without a gapcloser and execute. Imo what feels lacking is the lack of built in defense. Dk has no mobility/ways to reset a fight (other than mist) and no way to defend, other than block. (Both of which stop your regen) what I'd like to see is instant cast at your feet ash cloud morph that grants evasion while inside, and wings projectile limit increased to something like 6 or 7. Also, if the projectile has a debuff or dot attached to it, it shouldn't apply if reflected.
Edit: I'd also like to see an igneous morph be an actual useful shield. One That scales off max magicka.

Yes one can manage. Having a blast on dk atm, stopped playing my magblade even. And nice suggestions.

ZOS plx

Don't get me wrong, a proper gap closer and execute would be amazing to have. I just know zos has said before they don't want to give dk an execute. As for chains, I think they would have to add a stun to the morph that pulls you to the target to make it really worthwhile. I can't see having room to slot chains and a hard cc. My bar is crowded as is

I want to point out, too, that I don't think the mDK is in a bad place at all (cant speak for stam, I don't play it) I just don't think a class being "fine" is an excuse to have skills that are broken or flat out useless. Especially for how long some of these skills have had problems.

Master_Kas · August 2017

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

IxskullzxI wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Imo the lack of a proper gapcloser and some kind of execute is what I feel DK is lacking.

Some passive like impolsion, or making dots do more damage to people on low health.
Chains is buggy, works fine sometimes and sometimes not (the one that pulls you to the target).

Some more experienced DK's prob know better what the class needs but thats what I've noticed lately. Miss the times where you actually could use invasion as a gapcloser :<

I can deal without a gapcloser and execute. Imo what feels lacking is the lack of built in defense. Dk has no mobility/ways to reset a fight (other than mist) and no way to defend, other than block. (Both of which stop your regen) what I'd like to see is instant cast at your feet ash cloud morph that grants evasion while inside, and wings projectile limit increased to something like 6 or 7. Also, if the projectile has a debuff or dot attached to it, it shouldn't apply if reflected.
Edit: I'd also like to see an igneous morph be an actual useful shield. One That scales off max magicka.

Yes one can manage. Having a blast on dk atm, stopped playing my magblade even. And nice suggestions.

ZOS plx

Don't get me wrong, a proper gap closer and execute would be amazing to have. I just know zos has said before they don't want to give dk an execute. As for chains, I think they would have to add a stun to the morph that pulls you to the target to make it really worthwhile. I can't see having room to slot chains and a hard cc. My bar is crowded as is I want to point out, too, that I don't think the mDK is in a bad place at all (cant speak for stam, I don't play it) I just don't think a class being "fine" is an excuse to have skills that are broken or flat out useless. Especially for how long some of these skills have had problems.

Wasn't thinking of a execute skill really. But I recall ZOS saying they want dk to do more pressure with dots. Which is why I thought dots doing a bit more damage on low HP