Stop asking for nerf! Ask for buff!

PlautisCarvain · July 2017

Stop crying that your class is not good, every class is good. You may just be, and I'm sorry to say it, bad at the game. You don't have to make everyone pay because you always die and ask for nerf

altemriel · July 2017

yes, I do not get this, why ZOS nerfs everything, instead of buffing the opposite

noone would complain then and everyone will be happy

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_BrianWheeler

7788b14_ESO · July 2017

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

thedude33 · July 2017

altemriel wrote: »

yes, I do not get this, why ZOS nerfs everything, instead of buffing the opposite

noone would complain then and everyone will be happy

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sadly that might be true, even though the end result is the same.

Jollygoodusername · July 2017

Buff NA megaserver.

seedubsrun · July 2017

Yes. I've been saying that for awhile now. All these people crying for nerfs and it just makes things worse in the end. Usually it comes from PvPers and messes with PvEers in the end. Separate the two by expanding battle spirit to tighten up PvP. Then ask for buffs to classes that are underperforming. There's so many cries to nerf sorcs, even now that they're not the very best anymore DPS wise at least. I think all the outrage at that class suggests that sorcs may be the better balanced class. If so then other classes should be buffed to that level instead of sorcs getting nerfed down.

josiahva · July 2017

thedude33 wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

yes, I do not get this, why ZOS nerfs everything, instead of buffing the opposite

noone would complain then and everyone will be happy

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sadly that might be true, even though the end result is the same.

Then end result is NOT the same. With buffs, PvE doesn't suffer, with nerfs it does, unless of course they buff enemies at the same time.

Medakon · July 2017

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

NO.

Elder_Martin · July 2017

They spent 3 years trying to balance everything by tinkering and realized they were making things worse so they just nerfed everything. I don't think they've realized yet that it didn't fix anything...

josiahva · July 2017

Medakon wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

NO.

Yes.

They should go further than this and have skill lines dedicated to ONLY PvP and ONLY PvE. Then and only then would they be able to accomplish balance, until then the cries for nerfs will continue to mess up both sides of the game.

Strider_Roshin · July 2017

Great idea, how about we increase all damage to damage shields by 25% across the board since we can't crit against. I'm all for this buff

Vercingetorix · July 2017

Unfortunately, player skill is not an element of the game that developers can buff.

Medakon · July 2017

josiahva wrote: »

Medakon wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

NO.

Yes.

They should go further than this and have skill lines dedicated to ONLY PvP and ONLY PvE. Then and only then would they be able to accomplish balance, until then the cries for nerfs will continue to mess up both sides of the game.

No.

The game sold it self as "Play how you want", not "Play how you want, except you are not allowed to stealth, use proc sets, and absorb shield stacking while in pvp because people dont like it, also you cant be a healer in pvp"

No restrictions, if I wanna focus on counter play classes, dont block me from creating builds that does this. If I wanna use the same abilitys I use for dungeons in PvP, let me. I dont wanna bother respec abilitys, or waste time on swaping spells.

thedude33 · July 2017

josiahva wrote: »

thedude33 wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

yes, I do not get this, why ZOS nerfs everything, instead of buffing the opposite

noone would complain then and everyone will be happy

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Sadly that might be true, even though the end result is the same.

Then end result is NOT the same. With buffs, PvE doesn't suffer, with nerfs it does, unless of course they buff enemies at the same time.

When a class gets nerfed. and other classes don't, that class now becomes less desirable. Less wanted in meta groups. Less wanted when people try and form the perfect 4 man or 12 man group.

When a class gets buffed, and other classes don't, that class now becomes more desirable. More wanted in meta groups. More wanted when people try and form the perfect 4 man or 12 man group. = another class is now less desirable

= buff or nerf is the same result overall.

Unless of course you want EVERY class to get a buff and make pve even easier ? ..and even if you did buff every class. Whichever class was weakest before the buffs, would still be the weakest after everyone was buffed = nothing changed or was accomplished.

zcripturez · July 2017

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

Ch4mpTW · July 2017

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

zcripturez wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

Quoted for truth.

Demycilian · July 2017

zcripturez wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

Very much agreed.

Danksta · July 2017

zcripturez wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

If it's "PvP ruins MMOs" because the devs decide to not balance them separately, then isn't devs that ruin MMOs?

Marto · July 2017

I don't understand this mentality.

Buffs and nerfs impact the game in the exact same way. Hell, nerfing is often HEALTHIER for the game because it prevents power creep.

Smmokkee · July 2017

Marto wrote: »

I don't understand this mentality.

Buffs and nerfs impact the game in the exact same way. Hell, nerfing is often HEALTHIER for the game because it prevents power creep.

I agree

Fherrit · July 2017

I wouldn't say PvP ruins MMOs, but the dynamics of pvp and pve are two very different beasts to tame. While I understand the desire to take your PvE build into PvP because that's what one is familiar with and it works to one's satisfaction, the PvE variables a player is responding to are scripted and its mostly rote learning that's taken place. Stepping away from that is merely moving out of one set of learned responses to another.

PvP is far more dynamic and fluid and by necessity, should have as the only variables class and abilities slotted along with standard enchants/consumables provided for you by the game itself at the start of a match. (i.e. once you drink those pots the game gave you, tough nuts kiddo,you're out best go to a supply depot..oh wait, you let the enemy capture it...darn). And absolutely never ever should "end game" progression harvested doing PvE be applied to PvP (i.e. CPs).

While it may seem to discourage participation, when you boil down pvp math to knowing your class/ability and that of your foes, along with tactics/strategy, the devs can address exploits or performance issues both swiftly and effectively, allowing them to concentrate on maps and objectives and that's where pvp should have its greatest variables is how do players meet the objectives with the tools they start the match with?

Instead, they have CPs, gear, stacks and stacks of consumables all cascading off class abilities with both being used in PvE, adjust one thing for PvP and all kinds of ripples issue forth when that change carries over from one to the other. So while I understand those who feel this "dumbs down" PvP because they can't use all that time invested in the PvE side of the game to use against other players, one has to consider what one is doing. You're not clearing a instance, or a world boss, etc, you're (ideally) fighting a war with strategic objectives so it would follow that one doesn't use the same tools and strategies to succeed, no?

But, they designed it this way, and because I think its a poor way to do pvp, I only lightly dabble in it from time to time and don't care when I lose. If I wanted good PvP I'd go back to GW2, instead for the time being I want the lore/world/pve of the ES. PvP in ESO simply isn't worth the time due to how its designed.

Biro123 · July 2017

Smmokkee wrote: »

Marto wrote: »

I don't understand this mentality.

Buffs and nerfs impact the game in the exact same way. Hell, nerfing is often HEALTHIER for the game because it prevents power creep.

I agree

Me too.

If 1 ability out of 500 is too strong, and let's say that altering a single ability takes 5 days of effort(including stat gathering, deciding how to alter it, and testing the result). And let's say that every time you change an ability, you have a 5% chance to totally break it one way or another.

Do you:

A) Nerf 1 ability, taking 5 days of effort an introducing a 5% chance of breaking something?

Or

Buff 499 abilities, taking 2500 days of effort and being guaranteed to break a number of them.

?

Well?

CrimsonSpiral · July 2017

Biro123 · July 2017

zcripturez wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

IMO its PVE players who don't want balance and instead want everything to be easier that ruins MMOs..

ssewallb14_ESO · July 2017

Marto wrote: »

I don't understand this mentality.

Buffs and nerfs impact the game in the exact same way. Hell, nerfing is often HEALTHIER for the game because it prevents power creep.

I think people have developed the illogical belief that nerfs are somehow inherently bad from other games that rely on nerfing exclusively as a balancing strategy. Balance is a combination of nerfs and buffs, hence "balance." When you only nerf or only buff, game mechanics start becoming irrelevant, as they are either too weak to matter or so strong that the mechanic can be effectively ignored.

If you take an unbiased look at ESO you'll find ZoS has heavily favored buffs prior to Morrowind, and the result was having to rebalance all of the PvE endgame content (people were burning the Foundation Atro in like 6 seconds), and the endless sustain/1-shot meta in PvP, which they attempted to alleviate all in 1 patch.

Sylosi · July 2017

zcripturez wrote: »

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

What they should really do is separate PvP from PvE skill adjustments.

100%

IMO PvP ruins MMOs

The cancer on MMOs are the type of PvE players who don't really give a toss about gameplay, but mainly play for shiny things (much like a dog doing something for a reward), who wouldn't agree with any nerf regardless of how broken, skilless, brainless something may be, because it slows down their acquisition of shiny things, these people are why the MMORPG genre is in the dying state it is and why even the biggest MMO has far fewer players than games with meaningful gameplay (most of which are PvP focused).

Vipstaakki · July 2017

Nerf this thread