Trading Guilds charging 15k/week now WTF

Artis · July 2017

LOL at things like "good guilds have sales to pay" and "no good guild will ask to pay". Sure, you might be right and that 1.5% of sales would be enough to get Rawlkha or Belkarth traders. But I recommend you try and bid there and see how it goes. I assure you that sales tax is not enough.

And if you think that GMs just make money out of players - you are wrong. Maybe some do, but most that I know invest tons of their own gold and time into their guilds just for prestige and name. Or do you think it's easy to collect gold?

Sure, you can ask or hope for donations and not have any dues/requirements. You can try and run raffles and auctions (where would you get funds for that?) without requiring that people participate/donate prizes for them. Try it and let me know how it goes. I can't blame GMs that have requirements. That makes perfect sense. Players in trading guilds should want a trader and should pay their share. When guilds organize raffles/auctions and other fundraisers - that's fun and a way to give guildies some gold back. They shouldn't have to do those things or rely mostly on those things to fund the traders. Quit this scrub mentality. There's nothing wrong with dues.

humpalicous · July 2017

andreasranasen wrote: »

These GM's have turned into Zenimax. [PS4/NA]

Leave the guild asap.

oMrRust · July 2017

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Must be a console thing. I do not know of any guilds in PC-NA that charge the members

Ethereal on NA in Rawl'kha PC.
They were starting to charge 15k a week in tickets. which is a reason why I left..

MLGProPlayer · July 2017

Huyen wrote: »

LadyDestiny wrote: »

Console's economy is horrible compared to pc. People charge double, triple and quadruple the amounts on xbox. Lots of shady business practices as well. Zos must approve......
I do agree that 15k is kind of ridiculous. Most charge around 7 to 10k. The fact that players cannot even even see what is in the guild bank is another frustrating thing. How can you tell if there is something you could use and ask for it? I pay my weekly dues, but quit donating items after looking at the history of who deposits items and who is constantly taking the most valuable items from the bank. Oh and the leaders taking money constantly for self use, not just for GT bidding. This goes on all the time.

And the stuff on PC is horrible compared to console: prices dropping like crazy, and sales going down every damn week, because everyone is farming.

Bots are helping drive prices down on PC.

Buyers are also becoming smarter and are using TTC.

MLGProPlayer · July 2017

andreasranasen wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm sure it's 15k donation or X amount in sales.

Competitive trading guilds require you sell a lot (I know one Rawl'kha guild has a 400k/week sales requirement).

It's 15k weekly dues

I've never been in a trading guild that requires dues. Sounds like it's a new guild trying to break through, but that's not a great way to do it. I would join a proper guild.

Just advertise yourself in zone chat (explaining how much you can sell weekly) or message people who are listing in a guild asking them for an invite or username of who you should contact.

ScytheNL · July 2017

datgladiatah wrote: »

Yeah I'm in a 4 trade guild collective with stores in the most popular spots (except Rawl'kha) and the worst they do is ask for raffle donations.

Agreed. I'm also in 4 guilds with traders in nice spots and there is NO obligatory fee.

ScytheNL · July 2017

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm sure it's 15k donation or X amount in sales.

Competitive trading guilds require you sell a lot (I know one Rawl'kha guild has a 400k/week sales requirement).

WOW how do you get 400k sales a week thats insane??

I've done 1 million+ a week more than a few times. It requires that you farm pretty much everyday though (like 1-2 hours per day). But it's definitely not easy to do all those sales in one guild due to having only 30 slots to sell items in (I have 3 trading guilds that I spread my wares between).

You can also do big flips. Like buy an item that's underpriced at 300k and sell for 400k. You don't necessarily need to make a profit of 400k, just that much in sales.

I definitely wouldn't do that to myself on a regular basis though (unless you REALLY love trading/farming). I like to actually play the game.

yeah but like farming what, i think the highest i ever sold an item was like 30-40k or so

You have to get lucky too. Someone sold me a Dwemer pet through Zone chat for 25K, I resold it for 80 or 90K. That's quick cash.

Easily_Lost · July 2017

I am in 1 trading guild. There rules are 1k gold weekly sales or 1k gold raffle tickets weekly. I do both, average weekly sales for me is between 5k - 10k gold each week. I am happy with that.

Prof_Bawbag · July 2017

Should be no more than 5k. 15k is being too greedy. That said, if people think trading guilds should be free, then they shouldn't go expecting Mournhold, front crag etc. Still amazed at the amount of people who think taxes etc cover the required 3-6m required to get these places on console. I have no idea what the prices are like on PC, so that may be a different story. If guilds charge nothing and they're getting these traders, then it's safe to say it's the GM pumping all that gold in and making a loss.

Runs · July 2017

I think on console this happens because it is way easier to track guild donations than it is to manually write down every sale then tally them.

On PC we have addons that track users sales, so GMs know who is performing and who isn't by just a quick glance, thus no reason to charge a weekly fee.

Fodore · July 2017

Most I know of is 15k minimum sales and 2k donation. Rawl'kha guild too

Cpt_Teemo · July 2017

Some of the top end areas require 150k+ I thought per week

HEXENWOLF · July 2017

I'm a PS4 player as well and have also run into this issue recently. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, most of the prolific trading guilds on PS4 are owned and operated by the same four people. I know of one gentleman who leads four of them. Recently, when the price in one of his guilds was bumped to 15k members questioned the move. The change occurred shortly after Morrowind launched and the excuse was, "Buying guild traders in capital cities has become a lot more expensive because there is more competition. To insure that we retain a trader in a busy city we're raising guild fees."

That's all well and good, but as many have mentioned here, guild traders can almost always be acquired with gold accrued from transaction fees. What I don't doubt is that some guild leaders are padding their own bank accounts. I mean, these aren't guilds which are getting spots in out-of-the-way places. These are huge guilds, staying at or near max membership, with purges of those not paying their dues, operating in capital cities. I don't mind paying dues. I think it's reasonable to pay for a guilds upkeep - especially when members are rotating in and out as often as those in trading guilds. But 15k is an absolute scam which I'll not be taking part in.

I left the guild which started charging 15k and would strongly advise you to do the same. There are still plenty of guilds on PS4, albeit more quiet about recruitment, that are still charging 10k. And you know, it's funny cause my price is 10k and we're still securing traders in Mournhold and Wayrest. Funny how that works......

Epona222 · July 2017

HEXENWOLF wrote: »

I'm a PS4 player as well and have also run into this issue recently. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, most of the prolific trading guilds on PS4 are owned and operated by the same four people. I know of one gentleman who leads four of them. Recently, when the price in one of his guilds was bumped to 15k members questioned the move. The change occurred shortly after Morrowind launched and the excuse was, "Buying guild traders in capital cities has become a lot more expensive because there is more competition. To insure that we retain a trader in a busy city we're raising guild fees."

That's all well and good, but as many have mentioned here, guild traders can almost always be acquired with gold accrued from transaction fees. What I don't doubt is that some guild leaders are padding their own bank accounts. I mean, these aren't guilds which are getting spots in out-of-the-way places. These are huge guilds, staying at or near max membership, with purges of those not paying their dues, operating in capital cities. I don't mind paying dues. I think it's reasonable to pay for a guilds upkeep - especially when members are rotating in and out as often as those in trading guilds. But 15k is an absolute scam which I'll not be taking part in.

I left the guild which started charging 15k and would strongly advise you to do the same. There are still plenty of guilds on PS4, albeit more quiet about recruitment, that are still charging 10k. And you know, it's funny cause my price is 10k and we're still securing traders in Mournhold and Wayrest. Funny how that works......

Who has said that? In what world is that possible? Which server? I can't comment on what goes on anywhere other than NA/PC, but if anyone thinks that taxes can pay for a city trader, they are living in a dreamland.

It's really this basic - if you don't donate to help pay for it, then someone else is paying for it on your behalf. Some guilds are relaxed about this, and the GM and a small number of dedicated members pay for the trader every week. In other guilds, there are no fees and the guild does fundraising which usually means the weekly trader bill is paid for by say around 20-30% of the members. And some guilds choose to charge everyone to pay for it so the cost is spread around a bit more.

If you are in a guild with a trader in a good spot and make money from the trader and expect to put nothing back in besides the automatically deducted taxes, then unless you are selling a large amount a week (hundreds of thousands) that is leeching and someone else in the guild is paying for you to have that privilege. I can absolutely 100% guarantee that.

Rowjoh · July 2017

Just leave.

You are being cheated - the guild owner(s) are pocketing the gold for themselves.

There are plenty of decent guilds that don't charge anything.

It’s common practice that the only requirement is to sell a certain amount per week. This can vary from as little as 5k per week to as much as 100k per week depending on where the trader is located. This comfortably covers the trader and the owners still make some nice gold too.

Rex-Umbra · July 2017

Some xbox na ones 20k a week....

JUGSoMILK · July 2017

THE MOUNHOLD MAFIA. Aldmeri Nation, Back Alley Trading and Harbringers of Dismay.. these are your 15k weekly scammers on PS4 NA. They are accompanied by around 15 peon guilds who they make bid in certain locations weekly as well. Plain and simple. Everyone has seen these guilds. Bad news and bad business. We run a 10k weekly guild and hit capital cities weekly pretty easy because we bid our whole guild bank. These 15k weekly guilds pocket money and bid small amounts to steal from players. I actually know the week after one of the guilds went to 15k weekly they made a 4million gold bid in the back row of craglorn and pocketed 10 million.. people are oblivious and that is why they get away with this stuff. LEAVE THEIR GUILDS. Make them weak and let them crumble. They are cancer. We have these idiots who are willing to pay 15k weekly because the are oblivious to reality tho.. I will not support 15k weekly because I know 5 to 10k weekly can win bids in capital cities.

Prof_Bawbag · July 2017

HEXENWOLF wrote: »

I'm a PS4 player as well and have also run into this issue recently. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, most of the prolific trading guilds on PS4 are owned and operated by the same four people. I know of one gentleman who leads four of them. Recently, when the price in one of his guilds was bumped to 15k members questioned the move. The change occurred shortly after Morrowind launched and the excuse was, "Buying guild traders in capital cities has become a lot more expensive because there is more competition. To insure that we retain a trader in a busy city we're raising guild fees."

That's all well and good, but as many have mentioned here, guild traders can almost always be acquired with gold accrued from transaction fees. What I don't doubt is that some guild leaders are padding their own bank accounts. I mean, these aren't guilds which are getting spots in out-of-the-way places. These are huge guilds, staying at or near max membership, with purges of those not paying their dues, operating in capital cities. I don't mind paying dues. I think it's reasonable to pay for a guilds upkeep - especially when members are rotating in and out as often as those in trading guilds. But 15k is an absolute scam which I'll not be taking part in.

I left the guild which started charging 15k and would strongly advise you to do the same. There are still plenty of guilds on PS4, albeit more quiet about recruitment, that are still charging 10k. And you know, it's funny cause my price is 10k and we're still securing traders in Mournhold and Wayrest. Funny how that works......

I can see you've never ever ran a top guild on PS4. That is simply not true. Do i think 15k is a step too far? Yes, 10k too far imo. But selling fees do not cover the 4 or 5m to get the likes of Mournhold etc. Nowhere near enough. Granted, some GM's are lining their own pockets, but that's because they're employing underhanded tactics elsewhere in the trading system. No legit GM large or small line their own pockets. Most plough their own gold in to cover the shortfall. The only guilds that make a any sort of profit relative to their bid are larger guilds that only managed to snipe refuges and small out the way traders due to losing their main bid. However, that guild will lose members due to their poor location and both sales and profits will drop dramatically and will end up incurring losses if the same befalls them the next week.

On PS4 EU, Atin (trader closest to the wayshrine in wayrest) goes for around 6-7m. No way is a guild gonna make that back through sales.

Another telltale sign GM's aren't lining their own pockets, look in most large trading guilds and you'll see it's the GM's that have items listed at their most expensive. Why? Because they need as much gold as they can get. Complete myth that most GM's are sitting pretty with +200m in their personal banks. The richest people tend to be those who sell expensive items regularly, not GM's.

Darkheart · July 2017

I don't ask anything on my members to donate or have X amount of sales each week. Its a game not a job.

Taleof2Cities · July 2017

A good trading guild doesn't have a mandatory 15k per week membership fee or a 400k weekly sales quota.

If you're in either one of those guilds I'd suggest getting out sooner than later ...

Chadak · July 2017

The entire trading system on here is a half-arsed, byzantine nightmare wrapped in the most shameful market UI I've seen in many a long time.

I get the appeal of trying to turn market play into its own aspect of the game. I played UO back in the day, and we were all putting our houses near the high traffic areas and throwing our vendors on the steps. This isn't new. This is old as MMO gaming.

And it shows when there aren't even search features in the UI.

At no point did I want to go back to 1998 and feel like I was playing Ultima Online again. Functionality is not here. Usefulness of the market space is only there if you're part of trade guilds that make winning trader bids in prime areas a priority, which is going to encourage behaviour precisely as this thread is calling out - guild fees, more fees, higher fees, all the fees.

So, back to 1998 with us and just selling anything worthwhile in zone chat.

Why? Because you have to be super competetive and very organized about it if you want a good trader anywhere people actually go and look to buy things.

If you actually wanted to play some other part of the game, well...son, there's a word for you.

That word is 'Fool'.

You can epic yourself by spending a lot of time doing it, and then you can be an Epic Fool.

Whoever came up with this system obviously had the idea in their head that doing it this way would just be the bee's knees.

Competition! Trade guilds bid-pvping for the good spots! Drama! Suspense!

The reality? I'd bet every goldpiece I have that 80% or more of the entire playerbase find it completely exhausting and avoid using it whenever possible.

I don't know for sure if that is so, but I'd be willing to bet that if I'm off, it isn't by much.

How do I know? Because I used to run half a player made town worth of vendors in UO. I've done this before. Humanity ain't changed its stripes since then. If anything, people are very likely to be even more impatient with convoluted systems and unintuitive methods of accessing markets in an MMO.

Zenimax clearly wanted to be more like UO, or maybe even like EVE. Its painfully, pitifully obvious that they thought this would be something akin to its own pillar of gaming; PvE, PvP, Trading!

Can't even put in a search line so we don't have to scrolls through 113 vendors scattered around Tamriel to find something that isn't extremely obvious and easy to single out with the dropdowns though, could ya.

I dunno folks. If I'd come up with this, I'd be ashamed of myself.

As it is, there's one (1) reason I'm in any trading guilds at all, and that's to scan the prices so I'm not wasting my time hawking things in zone chat that might be worth bothering to sell. As a result, I tend to hoard things until I have a good pile of fun stuff I know will probably sell to somebody sooner than later, then I go hawk it all at prices undercutting whatever I pull off trade build vendor scans.

I vendor trash a tremendous amount of stuff I might otherwise take the time to sell on an auction house that wasn't stolen from Ultima Online's trash can, and you know what? I'm going to keep doing so, forever. No, I might not get as much money singling out Intricates to sell for maybe 150-200 instead of vendor trash prices, but neither am I having to deal with the headache of limited trade slots or any guild's asinine membership fees.

I'm not concerned with getting rich quick. There's infinite gold in the game. I'll get everything I want sooner or later.

The opportunity cost of maybe getting it a little faster by participating in these increasingly demanding trade guilds is my sanity and enjoyment of the game, however.

If I wanted to play spreadsheet wars, I'd go play EVE some more. They do it far better, and actually designed a system for it.

You can keep Ultima Online all to yourself. Cheerio to you with it.

Beardimus · July 2017

Shame that's spread to Consoles, but must be a NA thing in general, Xbox EU have zero charges in any of the top traders I've been part of. Good thing to

Slick_007 · July 2017

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Must be a console thing. I do not know of any guilds in PC-NA that charge the members

i see lots of ads that say they do actually. not all but enough. though its usually around 2k

jaschacasadiob16_ESO · July 2017

I have seen several such guilds on the PS4. If you do not donate every week you are removed from the guild. Not really worth being part of it. Not to mention that the guild already gets a cut off each sale.

Ashdroid · July 2017

thorntk421 wrote: »

While watching some bot farmers the other day, I began to wonder. What if anything is stopping the bot/gold sellers from starting several trade guilds on their accounts, fill them with all the farm bots then some players to make it look legit? Who actually runs some of the elite trade guilds? The gold would be endless and guarantee the prime trade slots. Potentially giving them the ability to control the market. Are there really that many players constantly farming just to make outrageous guild quotas?

I'm certain that's what's happening. I was browsing a trader at a very good location, and the PSN name of someone in that guild suggested that either that person is really passionate about selling wax irl or it's an account created solely for farming... This guild trader also had an absurdly huge number of listings for dreugh waxes and elegant linings; easily 5x more than I've ever seen at other guilds in major hubs.

redshirt_49 · July 2017

Huyen wrote: »

LadyDestiny wrote: »

Console's economy is horrible compared to pc. People charge double, triple and quadruple the amounts on xbox. Lots of shady business practices as well. Zos must approve......
I do agree that 15k is kind of ridiculous. Most charge around 7 to 10k. The fact that players cannot even even see what is in the guild bank is another frustrating thing. How can you tell if there is something you could use and ask for it? I pay my weekly dues, but quit donating items after looking at the history of who deposits items and who is constantly taking the most valuable items from the bank. Oh and the leaders taking money constantly for self use, not just for GT bidding. This goes on all the time.

And the stuff on PC is horrible compared to console: prices dropping like crazy, and sales going down every damn week, because everyone is farming.

Not to mention the market suddenly exploding because somebody's been hoarding rare materials for years and then just drops it all into the market causing massive price drops x) (It shall forever be known as the great Aetherial Dust Meltdown of 2017 )

HeavyMetalAngel · July 2017

Mostly I play the game. I'm NA PC. I've never been in a trading guild that required dues. I don't stay in trade guilds with a sales minimum because, I have irl things to do sometimes. I can't be worrying about whether I made my sales or not. Basically when I want to save up gold, I both list items in both of my trading guilds, as well as steal & fence items. It's slow, but it's how I prefer to play the game. Farming for 2 hours...I can barely get through 20 minutes before I get bored. I pick up mats and such while I quest. I also usually make some gold selling the alchemy mats I pick up along the way.

You do you, though.

Jamascus · July 2017

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm sure it's 15k donation or X amount in sales.

Competitive trading guilds require you sell a lot (I know one Rawl'kha guild has a 400k/week sales requirement).

There should be no such thing as "competitive trading guilds". The current system is *** terrible.

IcyDeadPeople · July 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

CavalryPK wrote: »

That means they are not selling well.

a good trading guild already has the sales to get the spot.

I honestly believe it's these greedy GM's who are also stuffing a lot of the gold in their banks for themselves. Granted of course that the prices for guild traders a week in places like Mournhold and Elden Root are obnoxiously expensive, they make more than enough gold to pay for their spot. And plus, a lot of these guilds are at max capacity. So let's put that into proper perspective. 15k multiplied by 500 is 7.5M a week. That's just assuming that everyone pays their dues. That's not including: Sells that are made, donations, etc. It's ridiculous.

On PC NA bids for the top spots have often been around 10m/week or more. I doubt it has ever been possible to cover those costs from the transaction taxes. This is why they do so many raffles, auctions, etc.

Daganerabus · July 2017

Those of you on PS4 -
You should hit-up the Real "Spirit_WolF" of the real "ShadowForce-Guardians".

They are amazing! They have maintained "Traders" since forever, and "Top" traders on major patch releases. They are a "FREE" Guild and literally give a new meaning to the word "Free Guild"!

For almost 2 years, they have given hundreds of millions "free" in crafting, motifs, ingame sought after items, and so much more! Individuals in their guild never seem to be concerned for "gold" because if someone needs something, they are like family and collectively go get it.
They "Give" gold away.

It is amazing how organized they are, and how they do so much for everyone in their guild, and even those not in their guild!

They have an amazing coordinated team.
They run all kinds of "EVENTS" - and this one in particular which they call "HUMAN DARTS" and offer 5k a win! Wow! So much fun! Creative!

Spirit_WolF built a Labrynth maze obstacle course. Its is amazing fun! He offers 50k to anyone who can beat current records which is around 2m 20sec. But also offer everyone 25k if they get through it within 15min 1st time in, and 10k if you get through it within 25min first run!

"PaintBall/MudBall fight on their Island! With barriers set-up to run amd dodge, and so much more fun! Winners take home gold!

Spirit has this "Freely received; freely given" philosophy which remains unmatched.

Spirit's guild is active 24hours a day! He has these things he calls "blocks" - a set of coordinators and officers all whom agreed on "Shifts" and each group on their shift; runs their own agreed and coordinated events and contests, all the while, they all encourage "POSITIVE SOCIAL INTERACTION". Their main chat being chat-2. The level of respect and compassion he has for his members is unmatched, unsurpassed.

Countless "Trolls" have attacked him and his guild, causing grief and heartache. And much to the amazement of countless individuals. Sadly though; "ZOS" never did a thing to help, nor even banned the worse of the worse. But, he never gave-up! He just keeps on giving and giving! He has made such a positive impact on thousands of "eso" members. He even "supports" other "guildmasters" and as long as they adhere to specific standards, morals, virtues; Spirit and his guild will assist those guildmasters in the development of their respective guilds, or the overall improvement of their guilds.

They have regular meetings. After each meeting, Spirit gives away 50k free in a instant win "pick the number" contest.

They run pvp, pve, dailies, crafting, gbank banking bonanza (free give-away) - and that event is really fun! He rotates theblock unlock feature of the gbank, its all timed. Keep what you can take! Spirit receives financial support from some of his top supporters. He turns around and "gives" the gold back to guildies freely! Freely for maybe ranking up, or for being socially active, or for helping others. He always tells his members to "just pay it forward".

Duplication is paramount. It is the key to creating a more improved, better quality, and overall experiences for the entire eso online community.

The lists go on.

He positively encourages everyone. He does so much behind the scenes with his companions. He asks for nothing, accept that; people enjoy their gaming, their explorations, and enjoy meeting and making lasting friendships; which in turn, could eventually be taken to other games in the future. He brings people from all walks-of-life and of various ethnicity, and brings them together in ways, no-other can match.

Spirit_WolF does not boast about the things he does. He does so much behind the scenes and on a lowkey. He encourages and positively reinforces his members. He is always telling them just "how great" they all are. How valuable they all are.

The real Spirit_WolF has the "L" in his name and not the capital "i" which the trolls had created. The trolls were using the fake spirit_wolf to be extremely mean towards others, and to bash them. And the real Spirit_WolF would get all the "hate mail" and public harassment by many; whilst the "trolls" would remain in public voice, and zone text chat, and would say very shocking, hateful, trolling things, and would harrass him everywhere he went. Even as far as taking it to other social media. But "zos" would do nothing; despite the recorded, witnessed, and proven serious breach of "tos" - "terms of service".

SHADOWFORCE-GUARDIANS TRULY IS A ONE-OF-A-KIND Stand-alone Guild!

If ever your lucky to be a part of it. Hang onto it! Because you will never really want for much. Because there; you would have it all.

Everyone who is a solid person. They become a part of the "SFG FAMILY".

In conclusion;
Gold is not everything; if you are a part of an active guild where everyone works together on behalf of one another.

Your here to enjoy your experiences, and possibly make new and lasting online friendships.

"Let the game be your escape from the realities some of you may face daily. But, do not let it become your reality in which you cannot escape."

Happy Gaming!