Get rid of CP and bring Level 100

Avrael · July 2017

So, this is only an Idea that i had for quite some time now.
It really grinds my gears that we have so many diffrent "Max. Levels". Heres the List:

Max. Level: Lv. 50
Max Potion/Food Level: CP 150
Max. Gear Level: CP 160
Max. Championpoints avalible (atm.): 630
Max. Championpoints you can get: Infinite (as far as i know)

Why is it so complicated? Why so many diffrent Levels?
And i already hear everyone say, thats no reason to change the Level-System blah blah... ye, that alone maybe not. But for a few other reasons too.

One other reason would be, that you (the devs) cant keep on going to raise the Max. CP Cap, even if they changed the CP Scaling now a bit, People with a lot of CP get more OP every time. Wich ALSO leads to People that are over 160, but under 630 CP get left out to get into groups for dungeons and raids, because they're "not high enough", which is (mostly) not true! There could be a full gold Equipped CP 200 that does a lot of dmg, but the DD that's CP 500 gets taken instead, even if he has only purple gear, because People think "Oh, more Level means more dmg."

My Idea would be, to make the Max. Level 100, and make all gear, food, potions and enemies Lv. 100 too.
Instead of the Championpoints, you would get still 2 Points every normal Level, 1 Point to put into the normal Attributes Mag/Stam/Life, and 1 Point to put into a slightly changed "Champion"-Tree.
This tree would have some Passives from the normal CP-Tree atm, like more Dmg from direct Dmg or less dmg taken from Area Effects, but with higher Scaling, because you could spend "only" 100 Points, and to have maybe entire or at least only half %, because 0,00526% is 1. stupid to look at, and 2. too hard for this game to calculate... AND it would not have the Passives that (almost) noone takes, because they are not even worth looking at, like Reduces cost of sneak or raises Health Recovery, so the entrie Tree would be much more compact.

To come up with a specific new Tree would take some time, so im not going to make one up and write it all in here (maybe we can make on as a community if enough people see this thread xD).

As i said, only an Idea, wont be read by Devs anyway sadly, but i wanted to hear what some of you think about it, and if you like CP, or would like normal Levels more etc.

Vildebill · July 2017

Raise cap would not change anything, except new gear grind, since the game scales anyway since 1T. The CP power creep on the other hand is just bad design :P

Bonzodog01 · July 2017

Just as an addendum, there is a cap on CP earnable - its 3600 CP!

However, I know of almost no-one that has reached it yet.

I would like to know if there is a planned cap on allocatable CP, surely its going to stop at some point?

Ackwalan · July 2017

I'd rather not have a new gear grind every time a new DLC comes out.

Voxicity · July 2017

Bonzodog01 wrote: »

However, I know of almost no-one that has reached it yet.

Almost no one?

I mean I've seen people 1600-1700cp but I've never seen anyone even close to double that in my 2 and a half years of playing daily

Sheey · July 2017

Highest player on PC both has earned 2232. This data is 3 month old.

Asardes · July 2017

There was a guy a year ago with 2700. Probably has 3000+ by now.

jcaceresw · July 2017

I like it. However there are certain considerations:

- Instead of CP raisings it should be level raising. Example: Level 100 to 120.
- ZOS should implement a way to upgrade our current gear to the new maximum without need to recraft or grind for the same item again.
- ZOS should also create a wardrobe where we can put several gear builds. Practical example: you create 2 new toons. Before questing and leveling those toons you create just one lvl1 gear build. When any of your toons reach lvl14, create another set with lvl14 gear. You store the level 1 gear in the wardrobe for future use. I know you could use the bank but I prefer to have another source of space to organize my things. The wardrobe should feature around 10 tab slots where you can store 7 armor pieces, 1 necklace, 2 rings and 4 weapons (since staffs and dual hand count as 2 instead of one).
- Since you asking for CP elimination, the bonuses on those trees either get forever lost or put as "World" skillines. You unlock the passives the more you level your toon up to 100. Level increment wont affect unlocking them unless new passives are added.
- I would like ZOS refactor everything as multiple of 5. Let's say each level gained gives you 87 magicka, 87 stamina and 66 health. The idea is to standarize those values as multiple of 5. So it can become like 90/90/70. Same with percentages like the ones used for divines gear.

Spacemonkey · July 2017

there wouldnt be a new <start-over> gear grind if they did like most mmos and allowed gear upgrade.

Dasovaruilos · July 2017

Voxicity wrote: »

Bonzodog01 wrote: »

However, I know of almost no-one that has reached it yet.

Almost no one?

I mean I've seen people 1600-1700cp but I've never seen anyone even close to double that in my 2 and a half years of playing daily

They tweeted a while back that the person with the most CP had 2.3k or 2.5k points. So I don't think ANYONE has reached 3.6k CP yet.

As for the OP: the different levels really bug me as well, but be sure that a level cap increase for gear now would make most of the already small end game community want to quit.

I honestly think they should only do a new level cap if and when they: (i) reweord all the traits for both weapons and gear to make other traits as competitive as Divines/Shard and (ii) get a token system or anything that puts an upper limit in the amount of tries required to get a specific piece.

When they reword traits, people will probably need to regrind a lot of stuff anyways, so that is a good time to increase level cap.

My OCD would also be grateful if the new max level was a random number like 200 or 300 hehe.

Destyran · July 2017

Bonzodog01 wrote: »

Just as an addendum, there is a cap on CP earnable - its 3600 CP!

However, I know of almost no-one that has reached it yet.

I would like to know if there is a planned cap on allocatable CP, surely its going to stop at some point?

There is a picture out there on these forums of a guy with around 2800 cp

Tasear · July 2017

I don't even try and I am 745 cp. It's not
that hard with experience events and enlightenment. As to say would of been fair too stop leveling before cap is raised, but can't now.

As to say your suggestion is selfish. You can't just take hundreds of levels from others so you can compete

disintegr8 · July 2017

I think going down the CP path was probably not the best option for the game and making them account wide made it worse as far as I am concerned. Displaying your CP once you reach level 50 created the group finder kicking issue, even though we blame the players.

I was near the CP cap of 501 when vet levels were removed but had only reached VR16 on a tank. This immediately converted to CP160 and any character I had or created after that becomes gear capped on reaching level 50 and very quickly CP capped.

My first 4 characters were all stamina based, 2 of them tanks. All of a sudden I roll a magic based healer, power level to 50 and look good when I rock up in a group as a CP capped healer - but do I really know how to heal a group for a vet trial or vet WGT?

Most experienced players realize that CP does not equate to ability, it is relatively easy to get and people focus too much on getting as much as they can as quick as they can. This is different to learning how to play the game and learning how to play your characters role well.

ZOS has already said that if the gear cap is increased, they will not penalize people who have farmed or obtained max level gear. I can only interpret this as saying that they will either provide an easy way for you to 'improve' or upgrade the CP160 gear you have, or or it will automatically level up.

For the record I am at CP808 now but have started a second account and spend more time on that these days. I am very surprised how easy the game feels now that I know what I am doing and how to play the characters - even without any CP.

PS. I will add that my new account characters do get appropriate armour/weapon sets, glyphs, food and potions made by my main accounts master crafter, so that probably does help with making the content feel easier. I don't want to imply that anyone finding the game difficult when they start out is no good at it.

Sigtric · July 2017

As much as I don't really like the CP system, we've had re-dos on end game leveling already. Not again.

zaria · July 2017

Spacemonkey wrote: »

there wouldnt be a new <start-over> gear grind if they did like most mmos and allowed gear upgrade.

WOW has start over but no gear upgrade as far as I know.
Yes if you saved up enough dungeon tokens i think you could buy a full set of elite dungeon gear, even raiding stuff the day after expansion.
Has not played pandora and later so this might have changed.

Note that wow did not remove the gear grind it just moved the goal posts. getting dungeon gear was pretty easy and you could buy the missing parts, however you could also buy raiding gear with them and this was expensive.

As for ESO, the leveling benefit tapper of, in the start you need skill points hard, then you get to 50 and no more attribute points. At cp160 you can wear all gear and the benefits from one extra cp goes down as you get higher because of diminishing return.

Avrael · July 2017

Tasear wrote: »

As to say your suggestion is selfish. You can't just take hundreds of levels from others so you can compete

I am CP 630+, im not talking about myself in that regard.
And i would think they would make leveling Lv. 50-100 as long as CP1-160, so i dont want to "get some quick max level yo".

I just dont like all those diffrent Caps... if im alone with this ok, but i heard at least a few others that dont like it that much either.
I mean, does anyone know of another game that has 6 diffrent Level-Caps for different things? It just doesent feel right. X-x
And as i said, I dont like that "low" Level Players that just hit 160 CP get overlooked, because others think everything under 630 is not worth getting into a Group with, even tho they may have the same gear. Sure, if you do High-End Raids or something like that, i can understand that you want a full grp of almost perfect skilled and geared players, but for everything else, 160 is enough... and if everyone would be Lv. 100 and the Gear was Lv. 100, and you would have your points at Lv. 100, then theres no big gap anymore.

Oh and for the gear, they already morphed all gear back in the day, from Veteran 16 to CP160, i dont see why they wouldnt morph CP160 into Lv. 100 again. Even tho were talking about Zenimax here, they at least already got THAT right one time.

leepalmer95 · July 2017

Is it that complicated?

Ahmbor · July 2017

I like my CP points.

Avrael · July 2017

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Is it that complicated?

Depends on what you mean... owo

Phica_Lovic · July 2017

It's silly to go to lvl 100 because we have no need for more attribute points and definitely not skill points.

A better suggestion would be to make CP more uniform - cuz honestly no CP lvl anything says "I'm lvl 50!"

I like the system. I think it's unachievable end gives a small feel of progression when you're not gear grinding or doing something worth your time.

Tasear · July 2017

Avrael wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

As to say your suggestion is selfish. You can't just take hundreds of levels from others so you can compete

I am CP 630+, im not talking about myself in that regard.
And i would think they would make leveling Lv. 50-100 as long as CP1-160, so i dont want to "get some quick max level yo".

I just dont like all those diffrent Caps... if im alone with this ok, but i heard at least a few others that dont like it that much either.
I mean, does anyone know of another game that has 6 diffrent Level-Caps for different things? It just doesent feel right. X-x
And as i said, I dont like that "low" Level Players that just hit 160 CP get overlooked, because others think everything under 630 is not worth getting into a Group with, even tho they may have the same gear. Sure, if you do High-End Raids or something like that, i can understand that you want a full grp of almost perfect skilled and geared players, but for everything else, 160 is enough... and if everyone would be Lv. 100 and the Gear was Lv. 100, and you would have your points at Lv. 100, then theres no big gap anymore.

Oh and for the gear, they already morphed all gear back in the day, from Veteran 16 to CP160, i dont see why they wouldnt morph CP160 into Lv. 100 again. Even tho were talking about Zenimax here, they at least already got THAT right one time.

Champion Points aren't really lvls... technically. It sorta see your point, but we already switched systems. I kinda would feel bitter and lose confidence in company. It would have to clearly explain how this had to be done. Also we would need to be compensated for our time under old system. Still I don't think it's necessary.

You clearly know when you are champion. Only odd thing is gear upgrades. Here's hoping we have to collect upgrade materials and use master crafter. For end game content you are safe with 20k dps min and 300 cp. For dungeons 10k as dps plus.

Yes it's mostly a dps game, we need reasons to use scouts, remove traps, pitfalls, more lava, water and such.

The problem isn't champiob points ... it's game design. Maybe touch ups on dungeons.

missjackieb14_ESO · July 2017

Ackwalan wrote: »

I'd rather not have a new gear grind every time a new DLC comes out.

Why? From a financial standpoint, it's a great way to earn money (that is, if they don't quit because of it). Spend $14.99 for the next few months just grinding away to get gear.

leepalmer95 · July 2017

Avrael wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Is it that complicated?

Depends on what you mean... owo

Consumables = 150
Max gear = 160

Max rank = 630

Doesn't seem too complicated.