Don't you wish you could pick your (race) passives?

zergbase_ESO · June 2017

I wish. I rerolled My Khajiit mag sorc to an Altmer. Just to have the bloody passives. If I could say let me pick passives I want. Well I'd still have my Khajiit.

Aliyavana · June 2017

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

I suggested this a loooong time ago and got flamed hard core. I don't think your race should affect your damn stats. Not every argonian is a healer not every elf is a sorc. Look at the damn game trailer, every alliance has damn armies mixed with all races doing all tasks. Go in town, you see heavy armor elf guards with a 2 handed sword.
Everyone who keeps saying this is a dumb idea just doesn't want the game to change at all. It is ridiculous that min maxing is dependent on your race. Further more, people who don't own "any race any alliance" get heavily penalized.

Was skyrim your first elder scrolls game? Race has always mattered except for casual skyrim

MLGProPlayer · June 2017

It would be nice if I could play a dark skinned magicka wielder. Mage's aren't only white (and grey).

bottleofsyrup · June 2017

Would be cool if each race had an option between Magicka or Stamina subsets for passives.

lauykanson · June 2017

Just because you want to roleplay dosen't mean min-maxers should get punished, stop asking for nerfs to racial passives.

Malic · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

No, I don't wish that. If I want to wield magic more effectively, it is logical that I pick a race that is naturally gifted at it. If I pick a lesser race, I should be deprived of such bonuses. Being able to "cherrypick" your racial bonuses invalidates race choice as a whole.

A cat should not be able to wield magic as effectively as an Altmer master sorcerer. Likewise, an Altmer should not be able to sneak and ambush as effectively as a Bosmer or be as robust in melee combat as a child of the Alik'r. Races define specific cultures and combat styles. Your suggestion takes a giant s*** on that principle - a principle I may add, that has been a defining trait of the Elder Scrolls franchise.

Wow, what a glimmer of hope you've just given me. Ive been playing ESO since beta and many other ES game. Its extremely rare to see a logical succinct post that clarifies an issue quickly on these forums.

Its usually filled with remarkable stupidity bravo sir, you win. Your prize? I'd like to share with you the official ESO forums back round music. From this day forth you are exempt from hearing this song as you post. The rest of the filth that posts here? This is whats playing in the backround on a constant loop.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7ATWA6PhN4

subtlezeroub17_ESO · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

No, I don't wish that. If I want to wield magic more effectively, it is logical that I pick a race that is naturally gifted at it. If I pick a lesser race, I should be deprived of such bonuses. Being able to "cherrypick" your racial bonuses invalidates race choice as a whole.

A cat should not be able to wield magic as effectively as an Altmer master sorcerer. Likewise, an Altmer should not be able to sneak and ambush as effectively as a Bosmer or be as robust in melee combat as a child of the Alik'r. Races define specific cultures and combat styles. Your suggestion takes a giant s*** on that principle - a principle I may add, that has been a defining trait of the Elder Scrolls franchise.

Racial bonuses shouldn't be a meta factor in the first place. Furthermore, that principal only applied to single player games where there was no meta. As an MMO veteran, it reviles me to know that racial bonuses are so strong in this game.

Absolutely NO race should have a 8-10% effectiveness bonus. That's insane and the fact that these bonuses still exist after, what? 3 years is even worse.

There's a reason why mmo's don't make racial bonuses so strong or include combat bonuses in the first place. It completely ruins any sense of racial diversity and randomness when certain races are better at certain play styles than others. Hence, what we have today.

Iluvrien · June 2017

lauykanson wrote: »

Just because you want to roleplay dosen't mean min-maxers should get punished, stop asking for nerfs to racial passives.

Thank you for highlighting yet another case where competitive play is the problem.

You put that succinctly and concisely. I can only applaud you.

KochDerDamonen · June 2017

aliyavana wrote: »

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

I suggested this a loooong time ago and got flamed hard core. I don't think your race should affect your damn stats. Not every argonian is a healer not every elf is a sorc. Look at the damn game trailer, every alliance has damn armies mixed with all races doing all tasks. Go in town, you see heavy armor elf guards with a 2 handed sword.
Everyone who keeps saying this is a dumb idea just doesn't want the game to change at all. It is ridiculous that min maxing is dependent on your race. Further more, people who don't own "any race any alliance" get heavily penalized.

Was skyrim your first elder scrolls game? Race has always mattered except for casual skyrim

@Aliyavana Actually, outside of the stupid magicka scaling for mages in some games (Morrowind, for example. Bigger INT multiplier for base magicka for some races), your racials really only had a strong impact on the early game and could be effectively replaced with enchanted items or levelling. In fact, I think in Daggerfall your racial stat bonuses just got overridden when you picked your class anyways?

SydneyGrey · June 2017

If there were more races that were strong in magic, this wouldn't even be an issue. Basically, if you want to play magicka, you have to be either an elf, a Breton or an Argonian, so there are three races to choose from that are strong in magic, and four including Argonians.
Stamina races have six to choose from; seven if you count Argonians, as Argonians can technically be either stam or magic.

Even if you counted Argonians as being in the "magic" category, it's still:
4 magicka races
6 stamina races

That's a little lop-sided.

In fact, it's WAY lop-sided. It gives magicka character fewer choices, which you have to admit kind of sucks.

notimetocare · June 2017

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

I suggested this a loooong time ago and got flamed hard core. I don't think your race should affect your damn stats. Not every argonian is a healer not every elf is a sorc. Look at the damn game trailer, every alliance has damn armies mixed with all races doing all tasks. Go in town, you see heavy armor elf guards with a 2 handed sword.
Everyone who keeps saying this is a dumb idea just doesn't want the game to change at all. It is ridiculous that min maxing is dependent on your race. Further more, people who don't own "any race any alliance" get heavily penalized.

Heavily penalized? My satm sorc Argonian and khajiit magblade do stellar lol. L2P?

zaria · June 2017

Axoinus wrote: »

I've thought about this. If everyone gets to pick their own racial passives, then we just add another layer of FOTM.

The problem with racial passives is that they matter too much. My opinion, is that their influence should only matter at beginning of game and then gradually have less influence as you level. Doing so would not increase build diversity necessarily, but would increase cosmetic diversity.

This, racial bonuses in the TES games has been something you worked around, they are pretty strong in the start but very marginal at high level.
In ESO its the other way around. It was ignored in the start because of the soft cap.

Changing buffs from an percent buff to an fixed value would be one way but might look weird with the scaling.

zaria · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

No, I don't wish that. If I want to wield magic more effectively, it is logical that I pick a race that is naturally gifted at it. If I pick a lesser race, I should be deprived of such bonuses. Being able to "cherrypick" your racial bonuses invalidates race choice as a whole.

A cat should not be able to wield magic as effectively as an Altmer master sorcerer. Likewise, an Altmer should not be able to sneak and ambush as effectively as a Bosmer or be as robust in melee combat as a child of the Alik'r. Races define specific cultures and combat styles. Your suggestion takes a giant s*** on that principle - a principle I may add, that has been a defining trait of the Elder Scrolls franchise.

Look up the racial bonuses in Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion, Skyrim is a bit special here.
Racial bonuses is an buff to the starting skill and attributes. Add some resistance and special features most noticeable is an fixed magic bonus to Altmer and an smaller for Breton.

This bonuses are strong in the start but as you level lower level skill faster majority of the effect is gone at level 10 and not noticeable at level 25 if you work a bit with it, if you don't work with it say you play Orc and rarely use magic your magic skills would be weaker than an Altmer who rarely use magic.

ironically you maximum level in Morrowind and Oblivion would be higher if you selected an race with low starting skills as primarily as you would be able to level them up more.
ESO turn it on the head, racial bonuses are most important at end game.

TheNuminous1 · June 2017

I have been desiring a magicka bosmer warden healer since forever. Long before they even announced warden.

But I knew people would be racist against me in trials and even dungeons if I wasn't a min/max race.

Soni made a breton warden maxed it out did all the fun stuff new trial and a ton of dungeons.

But I hate it.. I hate it so much. Because its not the race I envisioned. What I was so excited for was a wood elf that could summon trees and flowers and heal. Like a spinner kinda.

So today I made her. My bosmer warden healer.

And I don't care if its not accepted by the masses if you wanna que for another healer be my guest and kick me. But ima play what's fun for me.

KochDerDamonen · June 2017

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

I have been desiring a magicka bosmer warden healer since forever. Long before they even announced warden.

But I knew people would be racist against me in trials and even dungeons if I wasn't a min/max race.

Soni made a breton warden maxed it out did all the fun stuff new trial and a ton of dungeons.

But I hate it.. I hate it so much. Because its not the race I envisioned. What I was so excited for was a wood elf that could summon trees and flowers and heal. Like a spinner kinda.

So today I made her. My bosmer warden healer.

And I don't care if its not accepted by the masses if you wanna que for another healer be my guest and kick me. But ima play what's fun for me.

@TheNuminous1 Go for a hybrid build and use the stamina morph heal and vigor for your big hitters. Magicka mostly only recovery to use utility spells, just to see what happens.

Dracindo · June 2017

I get why you would want this, but this sounds less reasonable than freely choosing your class skills.

I don't see an Orc swim as fast as an Argonian.

rootimus · June 2017

aliyavana wrote: »

No, lore>cosmetics. An altmer is more gifted than a khajiit in magic naturally

Quite so. And Khajiit, we are naturally more gifted in the looks department, yes? The Eight had to throw the silly Altmer something for taking part.

red_emu · June 2017

I actually kinda like the idea of having a "cosmetic race change token" and a "full race change token" to be sold separately in the crown store. I would love to have a Stam Breton character (not viable with light armor and mag Regen passives) as you can make them look like classic Tolkien elves but I am stuck with an Asian looking bosmer (I have nothing against Asians, but my personal idea of how an elf should look like is somewhat non Elder Scrolls).

TheRealPotoroo · June 2017

bottleofsyrup wrote: »

Would be cool if each race had an option between Magicka or Stamina subsets for passives.

That would probably satisfy most people and be the most practical to implement. I've found myself frustrated by the way races get pigeonholed. I'm not a min-maxer but I do take the passives into account when creating characters, which is why I've ended up with four out of my five characters being stamina. I'd like to play more magicka but there are certain racial characteristics or story lines or aesthetics or whatever that lead me to prefer some races over others. For example, Dumner passives favour certain magicka builds but I don't like Dunmer - if my Bosmer had the option of a magicka passives subset it would go a long way towards enabling the "play as you want" style ZoS have always bragged about.

PzTnT · June 2017

It would indeed be nice to have the option to select passives. I'd say a good balance would be to keep the first passive locked as it is but with the option of choosing the rest as a set. For example an Argonian would always have its swim speed boost, but could for instance pick all the Altmer, Kajiit etc passive skills apart from that. But only as a full set of all 3 remaining passives.

Vercingetorix · June 2017

Wintergreen wrote: »

I started a magicka Warden Nord. I don't like tanking. So yeah, I'd love to pick her passives

Then, don't pick a Nord. Problem Solved.

Vercingetorix · June 2017

ClawmyName wrote: »

I would like a fire breathing dragon knight Argonian with dark elf passives or a khajiit with may be high elf or orc passives

Argonians have no attunement to fire like the Dunmer and Khajiit have always been stealth-oriented. Your suggestion is illogical. Lore takes precedence: Races exist for a reason - pick the race you want. If you can't accept that, then maybe you should be playing a different game.

Vercingetorix · June 2017

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I wish I could play a Redguard as a magicka character. I mean, technically I *could*, but she'd be crippled in end-game content. Yeah, that kind of sucks.

Then don't pick a Redguard. Problem Solved.

Kali_Despoine · June 2017

pretty sure you pick you race passives at the beginning of the character creation screen.

Vercingetorix · June 2017

zergbase_ESO wrote: »

I wish. I rerolled My Khajiit mag sorc to an Altmer. Just to have the bloody passives. If I could say let me pick passives I want. Well I'd still have my Khajiit.

Khajiit have no business being as strong as Altmer in sorcery. The Altmer are descendants of the Ayleids and have the closest connection to Aetherius - they should be the strongest with magic. Bretons and Dunmer have similar backgrounds that lend themselves to magical proficiency, with some more focus on certain aspects like defensive magic or fire magic.

If you care more about the Khajiit, then be a stamina-based spec. A cat should have weaker lightning bolts than a descendant of the Ayleids.

SanTii.92 · June 2017

My ideal race system would be a couple different lines to choose from for each race. So three lines that would be somewhat aligned with tank/mage/warrior per race.

Kali_Despoine · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

A cat should have weaker lightning bolts than a descendant of the Ayleids.

Khajiits should get a static shock bonus if you rub their fur the wrong way.

AlnilamE · June 2017

ofSunhold wrote: »

It would be great if racial passives were toned down. They're way too important - and this is really my main issue - I don't want to be a goddamned Altmer and I don't think my character should be penalized so hard for that aesthetic choice.

Maybe instead we could get much more minor racial passives - yes, Altmer should be extramagical, just tone it down - and then choose from a couple of sets of passives based on our class choice. You want to be a mage? Here is a regen set of of passives, or you can choose this more aggressive set of passives, or you can go with this third set that has defense and a bonus to luck.

Eh, but I'm dreaming. I just find it frustrating, and boring, as it is now.

* Don't be that guy who tells me Altmer don't have significant bonuses, or the game is so eeeeeeeasy it doesn't matter. Bollocks.

Edited for extra and, and apparently I'm cranky today.

They could double the Altmer passives and I still wouldn't play one. :-P

subtlezeroub17_ESO · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I wish I could play a Redguard as a magicka character. I mean, technically I *could*, but she'd be crippled in end-game content. Yeah, that kind of sucks.

Then don't pick a Redguard. Problem Solved.

[snip] Like I understand you love your lore (I do too) but this is an mmo where you're competing with other people. Racial bonuses have no business in this game.

They need to be either toned down to at most 2% increases or simply removed.

[Edit for baiting]

ecru · June 2017

Vercingetorix wrote: »

No, I don't wish that. If I want to wield magic more effectively, it is logical that I pick a race that is naturally gifted at it. If I pick a lesser race, I should be deprived of such bonuses. Being able to "cherrypick" your racial bonuses invalidates race choice as a whole.

A cat should not be able to wield magic as effectively as an Altmer master sorcerer. Likewise, an Altmer should not be able to sneak and ambush as effectively as a Bosmer or be as robust in melee combat as a child of the Alik'r. Races define specific cultures and combat styles. Your suggestion takes a giant s*** on that principle - a principle I may add, that has been a defining trait of the Elder Scrolls franchise.

Race choice should be purely cosmetic. People should be able to look like whatever race they want and not have to be bad at whatever you feel they should be bad at because they want to be a cat person or whatever.

I think some people need to be reminded that other people's choices in the game about how they want to look have absolutely no effect on any part of your game experience.

I think it's a major oversight making racial passives as good as they are. The same goes for other forced appearance choices, like vampirism. I won't spend crowns on a lot of cosmetic items now because they look really terrible due to being a vampire. That's less money in zos's pocket.

Let people look however they want.