Why is everyone so upset? ESO takes place duing a a Dragon Break it won't effect TES6. Relax

jockjammerb16_ESO · June 2017

It's just like the DC multiverse. at first you think "wow that explains alot,good going!" 20 years later you realise it's just a cop out to write any old crap and get away with it. There is something to be said for standing your ground.

Tyrobag · June 2017

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

"Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane." _ MK Commentaries on Talos

Stopped reading here. You just falsified everything you've said.

jockjammerb16_ESO · June 2017

Oh hey i forgot! who is your favorite Batman? Min is Batman from universe 349.32 He fights flavor! He's married to a magic bunny called ms.curdalot and drives a tricycle to fight good flavors at any opportunity by farting on cakes. Best thing ever.

Abeille · June 2017

jockjammerb16_ESO wrote: »

It's just like the DC multiverse. at first you think "wow that explains alot,good going!" 20 years later you realise it's just a cop out to write any old crap and get away with it. There is something to be said for standing your ground.

Well dammit, now that you put it this way I realize my hatred for using Dragon Breaks as an explanation for inconsistencies must simply mean I'm growing old and grumpy.

Aliyavana · June 2017

Tyrobag wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

"Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane." _ MK Commentaries on Talos

Stopped reading here. You just falsified everything you've said.

Mk writings have a tendency of becoming canon

Tyrobag · June 2017

aliyavana wrote: »

Tyrobag wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

"Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane." _ MK Commentaries on Talos

Stopped reading here. You just falsified everything you've said.

Mk writings have a tendency of becoming canon

Except that they aren't.

ofSunhold · June 2017

applause

I love a good dragon break theory. My day is complete.

The_Lex · June 2017

@RinaldoGandolphi

Awesome! Just the other day, my guildmates and I were talking about this very thing in the lore section of our BAND guild channel.

RinaldoGandolphi · June 2017

Tyrobag wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

"Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane." _ MK Commentaries on Talos

Stopped reading here. You just falsified everything you've said.

It's a shame you did. What did you think the Thalmor were trying to do during the Void Nightd of the 4th era making the moons disappear? (They were trying to unmake creation)

Why do you think they want to prevent people from worshipping Talos? (Deities get their power from being worshipped Talos gets in the way of unmaking creation if he ceases to be worshipped he loses his power much like how Ebonarm kinda went from the God of war to fading from existence and later replaced by Talos)

The moons are part of Lorhkan its most certainly easy to figure out what the Thalmor were trying to do during the Void nights.

There are numerous books stating the elves see Nirn as a prison to escape from and feel unmaking creation will free them to their previous. They see Lorhkan as a trickster that tricked them into this prison. Even Mankato Cameron eludes to it in Oblivion, allowing Dagon to destroy Tamriel would fit that unmaking creation goal they so desperately seem to want.

Aliyavana · June 2017

Tyrobag wrote: »

aliyavana wrote: »

Tyrobag wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

"Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane." _ MK Commentaries on Talos

Stopped reading here. You just falsified everything you've said.

Mk writings have a tendency of becoming canon

Except that they aren't.

You can't say all of mks lore is noncanon when plenty has been used for canon. Mks lore is noncanon untill it becomes canon and several is canon already

Faulgor · June 2017

While there is some reasoning behind this, I often see a Dragon Break used to reject something someone doesn't agree with, along the lines of "It's a Dragon Break, I don't have to bother with it and it's not real TES anyway". I think these people forget that they would also have to reject Akatosh then ...

Anyway.

Wouldn't then the Dragon Break conclude after the main quest when the planemeld ends?
Or are there "timelines" that forever exist in a Dragon Break because the conditions to end it are never met, i.e. when the player never finishes the main quest?

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

Lore boys/girls, just got to make you go lol. Who cares if giant space Alien star ships evades Tamrial and we have Gundams with Laser guns.
If it makes the game fun to play, and more quest. Let's do it!!

Sounds like Trans Cyrod Insurgency. Bring on the luminous red-scaled pariah of all dead cities to come!

Crowdosi · June 2017

After reading this, why do I suddenly feel like the vestige is actually Donnie Darko?

asuitandtyb14_ESO · June 2017

Abeille wrote: »

I HATE the "Dragon Break" excuse (the CHIM excuse too when used to explain inconsistencies).

It's a lazy cop-out, a poor narrative device, a gimmick equivalent to "coma theories" and "it was all just a dream" when it comes to bad storytelling.

I'll look for any other explanation, as absurd as it is, before accepting a Dragon Break as an explanation. This sort of cop-out irks me to no end.

^this

Osteos · June 2017

I disagree entirely. Its not a dragon break. Also TES6 has never been in danger. Bethesda said then know what they want to do and the technology is not there yet. So we wait, happily in my case. I want them to continue to make the games that they envision and want to make.

In the mean time we have ESO to entertain us. Set in a murky time period that not much is known or written about. As an archaeologist I can tell you we have a very biased view of the past simply because not everything survives, what does is recorded what doesn't is forgotten and lost.

NewBlacksmurf · June 2017

So you're saying something bout to change

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

Ugh, Dragon Breaks.

mesmerizedish · June 2017

ESO was never going to affect TESVI anyway, because there's almost a millennium between them.

But I love how this has descended into yet another Kirkbride argument.

JWKe · June 2017

Might as well combine eso with the fallout universe and cal it a dragon break. Dragon break is a joke it's just an excuse for poor planning.

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

JWKe wrote: »

Might as well combine eso with the fallout universe and cal it a dragon break. Dragon break is a joke it's just an excuse for poor planning.

I don't think it's poor planning so much as it is a once-functional means of explaining game mechanics.

IIRC, the Dragonbreak became codified after ES:II where there were multiple endings available, and in order not to invalidate anyone's efforts, they decided that because of a "Dragon Break" all the endings were equally valid.

And since then it's become a silly-ass way to reconcile game mechanics or missteps by the lore department into the world because, for some reason, people can't make a cognitive separation between mechanics and lore.

RinaldoGandolphi · June 2017

Osteos wrote: »

I disagree entirely. Its not a dragon break. Also TES6 has never been in danger. Bethesda said then know what they want to do and the technology is not there yet. So we wait, happily in my case. I want them to continue to make the games that they envision and want to make.

In the mean time we have ESO to entertain us. Set in a murky time period that not much is known or written about. As an archaeologist I can tell you we have a very biased view of the past simply because not everything survives, what does is recorded what doesn't is forgotten and lost.

Which is fine, but:

How do you explain 5000 Vestiges all competing the same quest in Bangkorai with 3500 of them ending the quest resulting in killing Duke Rechant, yet Dule Rechant is still alive?

ESO is full of of these contradictions all over the game that simply can not be explained in any other way. The simple "loss of history" does not explain these contradictions. How do you explain Duke Rechant still being alive to other Vestiges despite me killing him? What about the other players who killed him before I arrived in town, how is he still alive to talk to me? it doesn't make sense.

How do you explains 6 different Emperors all sitting on the same Ruby Throne at the same exact time? How do you explain each faction all owning all the ring keeps at the same exact time?

I know you don't like the Dragon Break theories, but a lot of what happens in ESO makes absolutely no sense whatsoever without one.

Trust me, Im all ears on an alternative....I was all ears on an alternative to Daggerfalls ending to, but the game wouldn't have made sense without one....unless you have a better explanation, ESO is looking like it won't make sense without one either due to the way things are written (I think the writing is good mind you.) I am just a logical think and i like things to make sense to build on

RinaldoGandolphi · June 2017

PS: i'd rather they wait to release TES6 on the next gen of consoles a few years down the road. I am more curious to see what these new projects are they have been spending so much time on. ESO and Skyrim Se is more then enough to hold me over till then.

inespeloazul · June 2017

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

How do you explain 5000 Vestiges all competing the same quest in Bangkorai with 3500 of them ending the quest resulting in killing Duke Rechant, yet Dule Rechant is still alive?

ESO is full of of these contradictions all over the game that simply can not be explained in any other way. The simple "loss of history" does not explain these contradictions. How do you explain Duke Rechant still being alive to other Vestiges despite me killing him? What about the other players who killed him before I arrived in town, how is he still alive to talk to me? it doesn't make sense.

How do you explains 6 different Emperors all sitting on the same Ruby Throne at the same exact time? How do you explain each faction all owning all the ring keeps at the same exact time?

I know you don't like the Dragon Break theories, but a lot of what happens in ESO makes absolutely no sense whatsoever without one.

Trust me, Im all ears on an alternative....I was all ears on an alternative to Daggerfalls ending to, but the game wouldn't have made sense without one....unless you have a better explanation, ESO is looking like it won't make sense without one either due to the way things are written (I think the writing is good mind you.) I am just a logical think and i like things to make sense to build on

Parallel Universes. There's already lore set up for them with both the Elder Scrolls themselves and Shadow Magic. In fact, Shadow Magic was pretty much invented for the sake of multiplayer like TESO's which is why I don't understand not making use of it again.

I will say, though, time being broken does explain things like "phasing" and resetting quests. It doesn't, however, explain lore inconsistencies. Then again, even the single player games recton things whenever it's convenient. My bet would be that had the Bethesda team worked on ESO, it wouldn't get as much hate over "getting things wrong." Don't get me wrong, there were some dumb mistakes made in the past by this game's lore team in spite of getting help from Beth.

edited for formatting blunder

inespeloazul · June 2017

double post

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Osteos wrote: »

I disagree entirely. Its not a dragon break. Also TES6 has never been in danger. Bethesda said then know what they want to do and the technology is not there yet. So we wait, happily in my case. I want them to continue to make the games that they envision and want to make.

In the mean time we have ESO to entertain us. Set in a murky time period that not much is known or written about. As an archaeologist I can tell you we have a very biased view of the past simply because not everything survives, what does is recorded what doesn't is forgotten and lost.

Which is fine, but:

How do you explain 5000 Vestiges all competing the same quest in Bangkorai with 3500 of them ending the quest resulting in killing Duke Rechant, yet Dule Rechant is still alive?

ESO is full of of these contradictions all over the game that simply can not be explained in any other way. The simple "loss of history" does not explain these contradictions. How do you explain Duke Rechant still being alive to other Vestiges despite me killing him? What about the other players who killed him before I arrived in town, how is he still alive to talk to me? it doesn't make sense.

How do you explains 6 different Emperors all sitting on the same Ruby Throne at the same exact time? How do you explain each faction all owning all the ring keeps at the same exact time?

I know you don't like the Dragon Break theories, but a lot of what happens in ESO makes absolutely no sense whatsoever without one.

Trust me, Im all ears on an alternative....I was all ears on an alternative to Daggerfalls ending to, but the game wouldn't have made sense without one....unless you have a better explanation, ESO is looking like it won't make sense without one either due to the way things are written (I think the writing is good mind you.) I am just a logical think and i like things to make sense to build on

Game mechanics.

DaveMoeDee · June 2017

Yes, dragon breaks are stupid. But there are 6 Elder Scrolls games so far plus a card game. It avoids the situation where you load the save game into ME3 and a ton of companions are dead for the sake of continuity.

ButtersEP · June 2017

How do you know this?

DaveMoeDee · June 2017

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Osteos wrote: »

I disagree entirely. Its not a dragon break. Also TES6 has never been in danger. Bethesda said then know what they want to do and the technology is not there yet. So we wait, happily in my case. I want them to continue to make the games that they envision and want to make.

In the mean time we have ESO to entertain us. Set in a murky time period that not much is known or written about. As an archaeologist I can tell you we have a very biased view of the past simply because not everything survives, what does is recorded what doesn't is forgotten and lost.

Which is fine, but:

How do you explain 5000 Vestiges all competing the same quest in Bangkorai with 3500 of them ending the quest resulting in killing Duke Rechant, yet Dule Rechant is still alive?

ESO is full of of these contradictions all over the game that simply can not be explained in any other way. The simple "loss of history" does not explain these contradictions. How do you explain Duke Rechant still being alive to other Vestiges despite me killing him? What about the other players who killed him before I arrived in town, how is he still alive to talk to me? it doesn't make sense.

How do you explains 6 different Emperors all sitting on the same Ruby Throne at the same exact time? How do you explain each faction all owning all the ring keeps at the same exact time?

I know you don't like the Dragon Break theories, but a lot of what happens in ESO makes absolutely no sense whatsoever without one.

Trust me, Im all ears on an alternative....I was all ears on an alternative to Daggerfalls ending to, but the game wouldn't have made sense without one....unless you have a better explanation, ESO is looking like it won't make sense without one either due to the way things are written (I think the writing is good mind you.) I am just a logical think and i like things to make sense to build on

There is no need to account for all the vestiges. That is just what happens in an MMO. Are we going to have to account for my character killing named bosses multiple times? Respawning is needed or there is no content left.

Dragon breaks may be the reason for many things, but they aren't the reason for multiple vestiges. I can group with other vestiges and we can do vestige only things. There is no more need to account for that in the lore than there is a need to account for mounts appearing out of thin air or being able to walk through other players.

Metal10957 · June 2017

I thought I read something about Elder Scrolls 6?

That was a well thought out post. Must have taken quite some time.

Osteos · June 2017

@RinaldoGandolphi

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Game mechanics.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

There is no need to account for all the vestiges. That is just what happens in an MMO. Are we going to have to account for my character killing named bosses multiple times? Respawning is needed or there is no content left.

Dragon breaks may be the reason for many things, but they aren't the reason for multiple vestiges. I can group with other vestiges and we can do vestige only things. There is no more need to account for that in the lore than there is a need to account for mounts appearing out of thin air or being able to walk through other players.

This is my answer. I simply don't have to.

Korah_Eaglecry · June 2017

Abeille wrote: »

I HATE the "Dragon Break" excuse (the CHIM excuse too when used to explain inconsistencies).

It's a lazy cop-out, a poor narrative device, a gimmick equivalent to "coma theories" and "it was all just a dream" when it comes to bad storytelling.

I'll look for any other explanation, as absurd as it is, before accepting a Dragon Break as an explanation. This sort of cop-out irks me to no end.

Well the only other way they can handle inconsistencies is to handwave it off as no longer canon. Which I feel is the even lazier way of dealing with it. At least with CHIM and Dragonbreaks they are in some manners adding to the lore and at the same time not taking things the players did or took part in and dismissing it.

I do think they need to get away from using Dragonbreaks as much because itll become a really tiresome trope farther into the franchise we get. But for now its still reasonable to think that Dragonbreaks have happened from time to time.