Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time.

I love the limited time items. It is nice to have something in this game that not everyone else has. It is enough that there is hardly any uniqueness (other than dyes) with the items we can wear on or characters. That is the one thing that I really wish was in this game. That super hard to get item with unique looks and attributes that not everyone can get. I loved it when other games did that. The whole "Ooh look at that staff/sword/armor" is totally missing from this game. Something that will never change, unfortunately.

If you seriously think that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford *all the things* at sometimes $100 a pop, and if people can't afford that then they shouldn't be gaming, you're delusional. Since when does having to decide between a mount or a house make someone ineligible for playing games? Self-righteous nonsense.

Nothing self-righteous about my comment. I never said in my comment that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford all the things. If you read my comment more carefully, it says that "If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time."

If I have a full time job where I earn enough money at to pay my bills but I see a limited time item in a retail store that I really want, but cannot afford it at the moment, then maybe I should get a part time job so I can put some extra money in the bank and be able to afford these things when they happen. Yes, less time doing the things I enjoy, but I will have the money next time I need it.

Kinda just like complaining on a forum about not having enough money to buy something from the crown store. Play all the video games your heart can enjoy. If you want to do something but can't because the income isn't there, maybe you should play the video games less and do something else so you will have that money you need next time something pops up.

Welcome to responsible adulting 101.

ZOS, please keep the limited time sales.

Ok, time to get back to playing video games now. Tootles!

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time.

I love the limited time items. It is nice to have something in this game that not everyone else has. It is enough that there is hardly any uniqueness (other than dyes) with the items we can wear on or characters. That is the one thing that I really wish was in this game. That super hard to get item with unique looks and attributes that not everyone can get. I loved it when other games did that. The whole "Ooh look at that staff/sword/armor" is totally missing from this game. Something that will never change, unfortunately.

If you seriously think that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford *all the things* at sometimes $100 a pop, and if people can't afford that then they shouldn't be gaming, you're delusional. Since when does having to decide between a mount or a house make someone ineligible for playing games? Self-righteous nonsense.

Nothing self-righteous about my comment. I never said in my comment that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford all the things. If you read my comment more carefully, it says that "If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time."

If I have a full time job where I earn enough money at to pay my bills but I see a limited time item in a retail store that I really want, but cannot afford it at the moment, then maybe I should get a part time job so I can put some extra money in the bank and be able to afford these things when they happen. Yes, less time doing the things I enjoy, but I will have the money next time I need it.

Kinda just like complaining on a forum about not having enough money to buy something from the crown store. Play all the video games your heart can enjoy. If you want to do something but can't because the income isn't there, maybe you should play the video games less and do something else to have that money you need.

ZOS, please keep the limited time sales.

Ok, time to get back to playing video games now. Tootles!

What do you think an elderly retired person should do? Sit and stare at the walls until they die?

LOL I guess you just don't get it. I'm not trying to be mean to anyone here. I am not attacking anyone. I am just trying to turn the light on for some of you. Life isn't about free handouts. If you want to buy something but cannot afford it, do something that will be able to help you afford it in the future. It is not ZOS' fault that someone is elderly and retired, or someone doesn't have enough money to buy something in the store. We only get better if we do what it takes to be better. Don't blame a company for that. No free cell-phones here.

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time.

I love the limited time items. It is nice to have something in this game that not everyone else has. It is enough that there is hardly any uniqueness (other than dyes) with the items we can wear on or characters. That is the one thing that I really wish was in this game. That super hard to get item with unique looks and attributes that not everyone can get. I loved it when other games did that. The whole "Ooh look at that staff/sword/armor" is totally missing from this game. Something that will never change, unfortunately.

If you seriously think that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford *all the things* at sometimes $100 a pop, and if people can't afford that then they shouldn't be gaming, you're delusional. Since when does having to decide between a mount or a house make someone ineligible for playing games? Self-righteous nonsense.

Nothing self-righteous about my comment. I never said in my comment that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford all the things. If you read my comment more carefully, it says that "If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time."

If I have a full time job where I earn enough money at to pay my bills but I see a limited time item in a retail store that I really want, but cannot afford it at the moment, then maybe I should get a part time job so I can put some extra money in the bank and be able to afford these things when they happen. Yes, less time doing the things I enjoy, but I will have the money next time I need it.

Kinda just like complaining on a forum about not having enough money to buy something from the crown store. Play all the video games your heart can enjoy. If you want to do something but can't because the income isn't there, maybe you should play the video games less and do something else to have that money you need.

ZOS, please keep the limited time sales.

Ok, time to get back to playing video games now. Tootles!

What do you think an elderly retired person should do? Sit and stare at the walls until they die?

LOL I guess you just don't get it. I'm not trying to be mean to anyone. Life isn't about free handouts. If you want to buy something but cannot afford it, do something that will be able to help you afford it in the future. It is not ZOS' fault that someone is elderly and retired, or someone doesn't have enough money to buy something in the store. We only get better if we do what it takes to be better. Don't blame a company for that. No free cell-phones here.

All I'm trying to do is demonstrate that gamers are not all young people, and I've never had a handout in my life - that is *your* assumption of people who don't have quite as much as you do. The thing is, every penny I have is from my hard work throughout my life, and just because I do not have as many pennies to spare as you, does not give you the right to look down on me, or tell me how to spend my pennies now.

Please just for a moment try to imagine if someone told some old retired relative that you love that they shouldn't be doing their hobby and instead should look at earning more before having hobbies - having worked hard their entire life and being comfortable but not wealthy in their old age. How would you feel about someone who said that to an older relative of yours? How would he/she feel? And think before saying it to people online that you know absolutely nothing about. I owe you nothing, I've never taken a handout, whatever I have is mine to do with as I please. It's not as much as what you might have, but that doesn't make me worthless, and it doesn't give anyone the right to tell me I shouldn't be gaming.

There you go again taking my comment as a personal attack. I am not attacking you. I am not judging you. I am not assuming that all people have handouts. I never said you owe me anything. I never said you are worthless. I think you are reading into things a little too much and taking them personal. Chill. Step back and breathe.

Guess what, every penny I have is from my hard work too. I am not rich and cannot afford everything that I want. I don't look down on you for having a different income than mine. I don't look down on anyone for that. What kind of person would I be if I did so? Not the kind that I would like. Why would you think I am looking down on you? Did I say you are less than me? Did I say you are a bad person? Nope. Please just for a moment try to imagine that my posts are not putting you down.

Your example of an old retired relative is being stretched out to an extreme. Old people who work all their lives deserve everything any other person deserves. If they cannot afford something that is part of their hobby ,which they are getting to do for free if it is ESO, then it sucks to be them but hopefully they have someone special in their life who can help them afford the luxury items they want. Life is hard sometimes, and not everyone can have the "luxury" things like an item from a crown store. Hopefully a caring person like you will be there for them so you can show them your appreciation of them and buy them that item because you can afford it. Or whoever.

It is a video game. A video game that is free to play. All you have to do is buy the game and you can play it for free all you want. If you are elderly, that is awesome! Free! If you can't afford an item that is not needed in the game, there is no reason the company should give it to you for free. The item isn't necessary to play the game. It is a luxury item. It is a business. Businesses are in the business of making money.

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

Epona222 wrote: »

Kildayen wrote: »

If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time.

I love the limited time items. It is nice to have something in this game that not everyone else has. It is enough that there is hardly any uniqueness (other than dyes) with the items we can wear on or characters. That is the one thing that I really wish was in this game. That super hard to get item with unique looks and attributes that not everyone can get. I loved it when other games did that. The whole "Ooh look at that staff/sword/armor" is totally missing from this game. Something that will never change, unfortunately.

If you seriously think that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford *all the things* at sometimes $100 a pop, and if people can't afford that then they shouldn't be gaming, you're delusional. Since when does having to decide between a mount or a house make someone ineligible for playing games? Self-righteous nonsense.

Nothing self-righteous about my comment. I never said in my comment that the only people who ought to play games or spend any money on them are those who can afford all the things. If you read my comment more carefully, it says that "If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time."

If I have a full time job where I earn enough money at to pay my bills but I see a limited time item in a retail store that I really want, but cannot afford it at the moment, then maybe I should get a part time job so I can put some extra money in the bank and be able to afford these things when they happen. Yes, less time doing the things I enjoy, but I will have the money next time I need it.

Kinda just like complaining on a forum about not having enough money to buy something from the crown store. Play all the video games your heart can enjoy. If you want to do something but can't because the income isn't there, maybe you should play the video games less and do something else to have that money you need.

ZOS, please keep the limited time sales.

Ok, time to get back to playing video games now. Tootles!

What do you think an elderly retired person should do? Sit and stare at the walls until they die?

LOL I guess you just don't get it. I'm not trying to be mean to anyone. Life isn't about free handouts. If you want to buy something but cannot afford it, do something that will be able to help you afford it in the future. It is not ZOS' fault that someone is elderly and retired, or someone doesn't have enough money to buy something in the store. We only get better if we do what it takes to be better. Don't blame a company for that. No free cell-phones here.

All I'm trying to do is demonstrate that gamers are not all young people, and I've never had a handout in my life - that is *your* assumption of people who don't have quite as much as you do. The thing is, every penny I have is from my hard work throughout my life, and just because I do not have as many pennies to spare as you, does not give you the right to look down on me, or tell me how to spend my pennies now.

Please just for a moment try to imagine if someone told some old retired relative that you love that they shouldn't be doing their hobby and instead should look at earning more before having hobbies - having worked hard their entire life and being comfortable but not wealthy in their old age. How would you feel about someone who said that to an older relative of yours? How would he/she feel? And think before saying it to people online that you know absolutely nothing about. I owe you nothing, I've never taken a handout, whatever I have is mine to do with as I please. It's not as much as what you might have, but that doesn't make me worthless, and it doesn't give anyone the right to tell me I shouldn't be gaming.

There you go again taking my comment as a personal attack. I am not attacking you. I am not judging you. I am not assuming that all people have handouts. I never said you owe me anything. I never said you are worthless. I think you are reading into things a little too much and taking them personal. Chill. Step back and breathe.

Guess what, every penny I have is from my hard work too. I am not rich and cannot afford everything that I want. I don't look down on you for having a different income than mine. I don't look down on anyone for that. What kind of person would I be if I did so? Not the kind that I would like. Why would you think I am looking down on you? Did I say you are less than me? Did I say you are a bad person? Nope. Please just for a moment try to imagine that my posts are not putting you down.

Your example of an old retired relative is being stretched out to an extreme. Old people who work all their lives deserve everything any other person deserves. If they cannot afford something that is part of their hobby ,which they are getting to do for free if it is ESO, then it sucks to be them but hopefully they have someone special in their life who can help them afford the luxury items they want. Life is hard sometimes, and not everyone can have the "luxury" things like an item from a crown store. Hopefully a caring person like you will be there for them so you can show them your appreciation of them and buy them that item because you can afford it. Or whoever.

It is a video game. A video game that is free to play. All you have to do is buy the game and you can play it for free all you want. If you are elderly, that is awesome! Free! If you can't afford an item that is not needed in the game, there is no reason the company should give it to you for free. The item isn't necessary to play the game. It is a luxury item. It is a business. Businesses are in the business of making money.

That all sounds very reasonable, and I can't disagree with any of it, but you also said:

"If not having enough money to purchase something from the Crown Store is an issue for you, maybe you should consider doing something other than playing video games with your time."

That is all.

Kildayen wrote: »

LOL I guess you just don't get it. I'm not trying to be mean to anyone here. I am not attacking anyone. I am just trying to turn the light on for some of you. Life isn't about free handouts. If you want to buy something but cannot afford it, do something that will be able to help you afford it in the future. It is not ZOS' fault that someone is elderly and retired, or someone doesn't have enough money to buy something in the store. We only get better if we do what it takes to be better. Don't blame a company for that. No free cell-phones here.

"Life isn't about free handouts...No free cell-phones here."

The same, lazy "ruh ruh entitlement" argument again. That's a strawman which posits that people are asking to be given things for free. They aren't. If you re-read the arguments against LTOs again, people are actually saying:

"ZOS, we'd love to give you our money. Really, we would. Please make it easier for us to give you our money in return for your products, which we would like to purchase." (paraphrasing, obviously).

I don't think that ZOS actually care so much about the perceived exclusivity and bragging rights attached to LTO things since that exists only in the mind of the person who buys it, and are more interested in pressuring people into buying things they would otherwise have felt ambivalent about buying, because (as someone else in the thread already pointed out) of a Fear of Missing Out. If people want to buy a product, but ZOS time-limit it to four days, (for instance), then people may be either a) at the end of the month and waiting for pay-day, b) on holiday and without access to their computer or c) have some other reason why they can't log in to buy it during that exact window, especially since we can't buy crown store items via the website (which Blizzard actually allows). That is the argument - that ZOS are losing out on sales simply by restricting the sales window so as to target those with low willpower or an excess of disposable income. The argument is not "ermahgerd, I can't buy it right now so I think you should give me it for free."

That's an utterly ridiculous and facile position to take.

Dracofyre wrote: »

nitche targeted market, the Whales, aka Wallet Warriors who are rich and spoiled.
many can resist and some are too broke.

"Rich" maybe (but debatable) - I'd say well off - but I didn't get here by being spoiled. 8 years of Uni and specialization in mental health. The money I make everyday is well deserved - and I have the right to spend it on anything I want. I love the mentality poor people take - they have to insult people who are better off than they are because they lack the means to elevate themselves to that status.

If you're of able mind and body, then go out, work, sacrifice - you will likely see returns, not guaranteed - but being spoiled doesn't explain everything way... sorry!

You just didn't put yourself where you want to be in life. I know I have these things and not because I was spoiled, but because I worked for them and when I was younger I invested into my future so I'd never have to want later down the line....

Epona222 wrote: »

rhapsodious wrote: »

Limited time sales are a good marketing tactic, but I feel like they should have a... limited... amount of limited-time sales. It annoys me a bit, but whatever, most of the LTO stuff doesn't interest me so I don't buy it just because it's there.

And if you're living paycheck to paycheck or are otherwise broke, you shouldn't be spending your money on digital cosmetics. C'mon. Never understood that line of reasoning. If you can't afford it now, you can't afford it.

Oh please, as long as I have an income I will spend it however I choose, it's my money, not yours.

I agree Epona.



Hey all you poors! ESO forum goers are here to tell you: if you have a fixed income due to disability or retirement (so you save for large purchases over time and refrain from impulse buying), you don't deserve to have nice things! Git gud responsible persons with fixed incomes!

Every time I see something offered "for a limited time", I almost always ignore it. It's the same with big box electronics stores that try to "sell" me something in the next 24 hours. I ignore them because the whole practice of having to jump through a hoop to buy something from a company is ridiculous to me. So I'll go without, and they'll not get money from me.

I've said this before, but I'm ranting about it again. They already spent the time and money to develop something that would cost them NOTHING to continue to sell indefinitely and profit off their investment forever, but they don't because some people who wouldn't normally buy it might if they make it artificially scarce. They do so and completely ignore all the future players who would buy it and the potential profits sustained throughout the game's entire lifetime. Honestly, it boggles my mind. It's like they literally hate money. It's the only logical answer I can figure for such a wildly anti-consumer cash shop.

It's not because I can't afford it, or mommy won't let me borrow her credit card, or some other ad hominem attack people toss out to defend Zenimax on this. On the contrary, I greatly dislike limited sales as someone who does have disposable income to fritter away on cosmetics. You know why? Because I buy things to collect them. That is my hobby, even more than gaming. I'm the type of person who will spend thousands of dollars on F2P Korean MMOs I don't even like just so I can 'catch'em all'. To me completing a collection is almost as gratifying as actually playing the game. Sometimes even more. (I've blown a couple grand on Hearthstone, but I don't even play the game, it's awful. I just get a high looking at my full card binder.)

Limited Time Offers remove things from the pool of collectable items in the name of making a few more dollars in the short term, but it makes crown store items worthless for a completionist collector like me because the arbitrary removal of items means my collection never CAN be completed. A collection that you can never complete is pointless, so investing in it brings no sense of gratification that would normally encourage me to spend more. I often view these 'non-collection collectables' as a money sink instead of an investment and usually end up talking myself out of it. It doesn't mean I don't buy some items, but I spend maybe $20 a month if there's something I REALLY fancy instead of the $200 or more I would otherwise trying to gradually fill up those pages of the mount and companion tab. I invest in my collections consistently and regularly, not just whenever there's a sale, or whenever I just happen to have a little extra change to piddle away. It's free money Zeni leaves on the table whenever they only run an item for a few days, because now I have nothing to spend it on.

I'm frustrated because I want to support them and give them a gross amount of money for products they already have in limitless quantities, but Zenimax is telling me they don't want me to give them the limitless amount of dosh I've been blowing on my serial collecting obsession for a decade and they find it more reliable to court the 'buyer's remorse' audience. But hey, I'm sure those people living paycheck to paycheck who are tricked into impulse buying things they can't afford by an awful marketing tactic will ALWAYS be happy customers that will provide a stable source of income for years...

arpadsweb16_ESO wrote: »

lagrue wrote: »

*Hops onto my Hearthfire Kagouti* - You'll be watching as me and my new mount are prancing into the sunset (as the mini-pet version follows us) - laughing all the way at the serfs who were not fortunate, for whatever reason, to get it.

Joke is on you when they release the Fabricant Kagouti.

Why is the joke on me? I'll just buy that too - or if it's earned from endgame content, I'll do the content. More laughs for me lol

Alchemical wrote: »

I've said this before, but I'm ranting about it again. They already spent the time and money to develop something that would cost them NOTHING to continue to sell indefinitely and profit off their investment forever, but they don't because some people who wouldn't normally buy it might if they make it artificially scarce. They do so and completely ignore all the future players who would buy it and the potential profits sustained throughout the game's entire lifetime. Honestly, it boggles my mind. It's like they literally hate money. It's the only logical answer I can figure for such a wildly anti-consumer cash shop.

It's not because I can't afford it, or mommy won't let me borrow her credit card, or some other ad hominem attack people toss out to defend Zenimax on this. On the contrary, I greatly dislike limited sales as someone who does have disposable income to fritter away on cosmetics. You know why? Because I buy things to collect them. That is my hobby, even more than gaming. I'm the type of person who will spend thousands of dollars on F2P Korean MMOs I don't even like just so I can 'catch'em all'. To me completing a collection is almost as gratifying as actually playing the game. Sometimes even more. (I've blown a couple grand on Hearthstone, but I don't even play the game, it's awful. I just get a high looking at my full card binder.)

Limited Time Offers remove things from the pool of collectable items in the name of making a few more dollars in the short term, but it makes crown store items worthless for a completionist collector like me because the arbitrary removal of items means my collection never CAN be completed. A collection that you can never complete is pointless, so investing in it brings no sense of gratification that would normally encourage me to spend more. I often view these 'non-collection collectables' as a money sink instead of an investment and usually end up talking myself out of it. It doesn't mean I don't buy some items, but I spend maybe $20 a month if there's something I REALLY fancy instead of the $200 or more I would otherwise trying to gradually fill up those pages of the mount and companion tab. I invest in my collections consistently and regularly, not just whenever there's a sale, or whenever I just happen to have a little extra change to piddle away. It's free money Zeni leaves on the table whenever they only run an item for a few days, because now I have nothing to spend it on.

I'm frustrated because I want to support them and give them a gross amount of money for products they already have in limitless quantities, but Zenimax is telling me they don't want me to give them the limitless amount of dosh I've been blowing on my serial collecting obsession for a decade and they find it more reliable to court the 'buyer's remorse' audience. But hey, I'm sure those people living paycheck to paycheck who are tricked into impulse buying things they can't afford by an awful marketing tactic will ALWAYS be happy customers that will provide a stable source of income for years...

Yeah your dreams of being a completion collector went out the door long before time limited sales - loyalty rewards for old subbers, anyone?

Anyway - I'm a major completionist and my favourite game Warframe, as an example has a couple items which were for closed Beta players and Founders (people who paid for alpha+beta) only.

You don't see me getting my knickers in a twist about it and there's actually a very good reason for it that ESO shares - you don't have a list! There is no list to look at and see missing items. In Warframe the exclusives are not in the codex - meaning I'll always be able to truly max out my codex.

Not quite the same in ESO, there's nothing to max here - what is the same is that ESO shares is the no lists - you have no collectible category that tracks mounts and pets earned, therefore you not having them doesn't affect your ability to complete anything but the imaginary list in your head.

If we had a list of pets and mounts to view - and half were greyed out because I didn't own them, then I would be 100% more likely to agree with you - but you're talking about an imaginary/fictional list that nobody in their right mind would spend 10s of 1000s of dollars trying to complete... if anything your suggestion is to entice them to make this a problem when its really not.

From one completionist to another, I don't think this shouldn't bother you, because nothing tracks this completion. Owning everything and being a completionist in a game aren't the same thing.

Alchemical wrote: »

I've said this before, but I'm ranting about it again. They already spent the time and money to develop something that would cost them NOTHING to continue to sell indefinitely and profit off their investment forever, but they don't because some people who wouldn't normally buy it might if they make it artificially scarce. They do so and completely ignore all the future players who would buy it and the potential profits sustained throughout the game's entire lifetime. Honestly, it boggles my mind. It's like they literally hate money. It's the only logical answer I can figure for such a wildly anti-consumer cash shop.

...

I think you are confusing "limited time" and "exclusive" or "one time offer."

Off the top of my head, only the striped senche mount loyalty reward was specifically advertised as never going to appear in the crown store.

I have seen at least one limited time mount that the owner said they got out of a crown crate...