Should SKYSHARDS be made available account-wide? [Improved poll, with more options!]

Yadvo · June 2017

Since the last thread got locked, it no longer serves any purpose, as comments are disabled. Nevertheless seeing the positive feedback I wish to investigate further on the subject. Learning from the previous experience, I decided to change the form in which the poll is presented for a more constructive feedback

Rules of the thread:
- We do not discuss lorebooks, championpoints etc. This thread is all about SKYSHARDS, their impact on the game and possible solutions,
- Should you decide to vote, please express precisely what was the reasoning behind your opinion. "No because well, no" is not a particularely constructive feedback to the developers,

My opinion:
1. Making the skyshards available account-wide does not mean that anything is handed out free. In order to be available to other characters, they have to be collected first. This takes time, patience and all the effort required to acomplish the task.
2. This does not prevent you from exploring the map. There are still other incentives, like world bosses, delves, quests etc. to keep you immersed at all times. Players who like the experience of exploring the map searching for collectibles still have a lot to discover;
3. My suggestion is aimed at players who have basicly maxed out a single character or more. Personally I made 11 characters, all of which have enough skyshards collected to use full builds, with all the skills and passives unlocked. Unfortunatelly this has taken disproportionally large amount of time, which could have been redirected towards a better objective. Instead of being forced to run around the map just to be able to use my ultimate, I could actually learn my rotation, pros and cons of the new class I wish to understand and more.

Solutions presented in the previous thread:

Cpt_Teemo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Should be account wide imo, the time you put into getting them does not equal fun tbh. This is why I stopped at 220 Skyshards see no point into getting more skills for my main and not doing it on alts since they have enough skill points where I want them without the skyshards.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Should be account wide imo, the time you put into getting them does not equal fun tbh. This is why I stopped at 220 Skyshards see no point into getting more skills for my main and not doing it on alts since they have enough skill points where I want them without the skyshards.

That actually is a great point! I aswell experience the same thing. With over 53 unused skillpoints on my main and just enough on other characters, this does not make much sense. I mean, we could actually make use of the aditionall skillpoints on other characters, whereas they are simply wasted on maxed out characters.

Tavore1138 · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

My personal feelings in response to your points...

1. It is handing out skill points to characters that have not earned them. Having got them across several characters it is an integral part of the playing experience and taking it away would lower the incentive to fully play each character. It would also remove the challenge even after hitting level 50 of having to decide where the next point goes and which content you will do next to find the shards to get the points to level up that new skill line you just opened up or wanted to try on your character.
2. Many of the other incentives you mention will take you to or right past the skyshards anyway - they are mostly placed in such a way as to be found while doing other content i.e. in delves & public dungeons or in and around quest locations. Since you will be going there anyway the 5 second stop for a shard should not be a problem.
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Volsunga · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

Voted per sympathy for console players. But I fully agree with @Tavore1138.

Speeking for myself, I play a Role-Playing Game essentially for the character developement and progression.
There is no pleasure for me to get all those skyshards I'v already "painfully" (in such a pleasant way) collected, on a fresh reroll and getting rid of all personal achievement and completion I would get otherwise.

Also, there is so many skyshards and skill points to collect everywhere, question is; is it really necessary to collect all skyshards on all your character ? SInce I'm reading some stop collecting them because they have already enough skill points.

idk · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

The skill points the character has (which of course skyshards are part of it) should be based on the time put in on the character to get it.

Many of us already have most of the skyshards on many characters. It would essentially be a punishment to long term players to make such a change. The reality is, especially after leveling one character, is we know what we were getting into.

Further, and while small, a very good point, there are 6 shards where 4 of them are more of a challenge to get, not impossible by any means, but they are behind alliance gates. This idea would mean it would be to easy to get since it would merely take having a character in each alliance.

Overall, not a good idea.

Tavore1138 · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Yadvo wrote: »

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Because already having all the skill points is a disincentive to play through the content because part of the pleasure of doing the content is the buzz (however mild) of getting that 3rd shard and allocating the skill point to give you that skill or morph you didn't have before. I lose the pleasure of *earning* my character progression as I just start with all the points already and earn much less by actually playing the game. I would never again have to make a tough choice about which morph to place a skill point into or which weapon line to open up as I would simply be able to max them all out as I levelled... I wouldn't have the pleasure of the character gradually gaining more skills and more versatility as I played through the content as I'd already have the points to do it all as son as I landed in Coldharbour/Firemoth... Even the 'shortcut lite' option of adding them at level 50 is going to impact on the pleasure that I take from just taking my time and enjoying the process of building a character, sometimes over months.

It seems to me we are simply looking for different things from the game and I honestly don't see how they are compatible in this situation.

ADarklore · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

I think console players should have some of the same 'features' that PC players have with addons.

Additionally, perhaps I am one of the few players who actually enjoys searching for Skyshards and Lorebooks. Every character I create that is one of the first things I do, I go through the various zones seeking Skyshards while leveling my character along the way by battling enemies I come across. Once I get enough Skyshards for what what I need skill points for, I return to where I started, doing quests in my Alliance zone.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

The skill points the character has (which of course skyshards are part of it, should be based on the time put in on the character to get it.

Many of us already have most of the skyshards on many characters. It would essentially be a punishment to long term players to make such a change. The reality is, especially after leveling one character, is we know what we were getting into.

Further, and while small, a very good point, there are 6 shards where 4 of them are more of a challenge to get, not impossible by any means, but they are behind alliance gates. This idea would mean it would be to easy to get since it would merely take having a character in each alliance.

Overall, not a good idea.

Would you kindly expand on the part where you consider it a punishment? In my opinion it would actually be a reward, considering that I'm 99 percent sure that it would be beneficial for you!

TheRealPotoroo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Making skyshards account-wide like CP would mean only one of your characters ever has to go into Cyrodiil.

Tasear · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

Okay champion points makes sense... I was going to never level another character again... I mean never ever. On the other hand, I just don't agree with skyshards. You make a competitive character just find by getting to level 50 maybe doing a quest or 3. While I do agree it would be nice for it to be account wide... this isn't just takes instead of gives from the experience. Would feel like sims with cheat codes on. Mind I won't complain if it happens... but how do you reward those who collected them all on multiple characters.

Also after this well we give quests skill points too? Yeah no idea is rejected.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Tasear wrote: »

Okay champion points makes sense... I was going to never level another character again... I mean never ever. On the other hand, I just don't agree with skyshards. You make a competitive character just find by getting to level 50 maybe doing a quest or 3. While I do agree it would be nice for it to be account wide... this isn't just takes instead of gives from the experience. Would feel like sims with cheat codes on. Mind I won't complain if it happens... but how do you reward those who collected them all on multiple characters.

Also after this well we give quests skill points too? Yeah no idea is rejected.

Please read the rules of the discussion. I intend this thread only to focus on the skyshards, not the quest skill points. This has brought a lot of salty comments in the previous thread as it was impossible to focus on this particular aspect of the gameplay. Lorebooks, quests etc. would be untouched considering my proposal.

Uncle_Sweetshare · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

As someone who has gathered all but 4 Skyshards on 3 characters, it's just a complete waste of time. There's nothing fun or entertaining about running all around the map for 40+ hours per character just for Skyshards (and that's with knowing their locations).

Tommy_The_Gun · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Well... somehow when I complete "tutorial" I can skip it on fresh, newly created character. It should be the same for Sky-shards.... Or just how about an option to create a "new" character... and a "New game+" charter - that will copy some sky-shards, skill points and even some (not all) achievement form the character that has unlocked the most (you will still be able to play your old and new characters).

Gathering all this stuff again is just so annoying....

mocap · June 2017

5. Class change token? )

kargen27 · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Gathering skyshards is simple. Beyond that just leveling your character without the lazy grinds you will not be lacking for skill points. If you want to play a new character then play the new character. You are trying to drag participation medals into ESO.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Because already having all the skill points is a disincentive to play through the content because part of the pleasure of doing the content is the buzz (however mild) of getting that 3rd shard and allocating the skill point to give you that skill or morph you didn't have before. I lose the pleasure of *earning* my character progression as I just start with all the points already and earn much less by actually playing the game. I would never again have to make a tough choice about which morph to place a skill point into or which weapon line to open up as I would simply be able to max them all out as I levelled... I wouldn't have the pleasure of the character gradually gaining more skills and more versatility as I played through the content as I'd already have the points to do it all as son as I landed in Coldharbour/Firemoth... Even the 'shortcut lite' option of adding them at level 50 is going to impact on the pleasure that I take from just taking my time and enjoying the process of building a character, sometimes over months.

It seems to me we are simply looking for different things from the game and I honestly don't see how they are compatible in this situation.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well... somehow when I complete "tutorial" I can skip it on fresh, newly created character. It should be the same for Sky-shards.... Or just how about an option to create a "new" character... and a "New game+" charter - that will copy some sky-shards, skill points and even some (not all) achievement form the character that has unlocked the most (you will still be able to play your old and new characters).

Gathering all this stuff again is just so annoying....

@Tavore1138 Could you please adress the solution suggested by @Tommy_The_Gun ? This is a great way to satisfy opposite sides of the discussion in a very elegant way.

Tasear · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

Yadvo wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Okay champion points makes sense... I was going to never level another character again... I mean never ever. On the other hand, I just don't agree with skyshards. You make a competitive character just find by getting to level 50 maybe doing a quest or 3. While I do agree it would be nice for it to be account wide... this isn't just takes instead of gives from the experience. Would feel like sims with cheat codes on. Mind I won't complain if it happens... but how do you reward those who collected them all on multiple characters.

Also after this well we give quests skill points too? Yeah no idea is rejected.

Please read the rules of the discussion. I intend this thread only to focus on the skyshards, not the quest skill points. This has brought a lot of salty comments in the previous thread as it was impossible to focus on this particular aspect of the gameplay. Lorebooks, quests etc. would be untouched considering my proposal.

I did but you have to consider cause and effect.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Tasear wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Okay champion points makes sense... I was going to never level another character again... I mean never ever. On the other hand, I just don't agree with skyshards. You make a competitive character just find by getting to level 50 maybe doing a quest or 3. While I do agree it would be nice for it to be account wide... this isn't just takes instead of gives from the experience. Would feel like sims with cheat codes on. Mind I won't complain if it happens... but how do you reward those who collected them all on multiple characters.

Also after this well we give quests skill points too? Yeah no idea is rejected.

Please read the rules of the discussion. I intend this thread only to focus on the skyshards, not the quest skill points. This has brought a lot of salty comments in the previous thread as it was impossible to focus on this particular aspect of the gameplay. Lorebooks, quests etc. would be untouched considering my proposal.

I did but you have to consider cause and effect.

I also wish to moderate the discussion in order for it not to go off the topic. I do realise that some people might later say sth along the way of "Well X has been changed, why not change Y aswell". However this has no direct association with the poll as it covers skyshards strictly.

AzraelKrieg · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

kargen27 wrote: »

Gathering skyshards is simple. Beyond that just leveling your character without the lazy grinds you will not be lacking for skill points. If you want to play a new character then play the new character. You are trying to drag participation medals into ESO.

Tavore1138 · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Yadvo wrote: »

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Because already having all the skill points is a disincentive to play through the content because part of the pleasure of doing the content is the buzz (however mild) of getting that 3rd shard and allocating the skill point to give you that skill or morph you didn't have before. I lose the pleasure of *earning* my character progression as I just start with all the points already and earn much less by actually playing the game. I would never again have to make a tough choice about which morph to place a skill point into or which weapon line to open up as I would simply be able to max them all out as I levelled... I wouldn't have the pleasure of the character gradually gaining more skills and more versatility as I played through the content as I'd already have the points to do it all as son as I landed in Coldharbour/Firemoth... Even the 'shortcut lite' option of adding them at level 50 is going to impact on the pleasure that I take from just taking my time and enjoying the process of building a character, sometimes over months.

It seems to me we are simply looking for different things from the game and I honestly don't see how they are compatible in this situation.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well... somehow when I complete "tutorial" I can skip it on fresh, newly created character. It should be the same for Sky-shards.... Or just how about an option to create a "new" character... and a "New game+" charter - that will copy some sky-shards, skill points and even some (not all) achievement form the character that has unlocked the most (you will still be able to play your old and new characters).

Gathering all this stuff again is just so annoying....

@Tavore1138 Could you please adress the solution suggested by @Tommy_The_Gun ? This is a great way to satisfy opposite sides of the discussion in a very elegant way.

Simple issue here is what happens in PvP content? A lot of PvP players already have enough concerns around the potential imbalances caused by CP numbers, how much more would that imbalance be increased by having some players running a level 30 with 300+ skill points where others are taking the other approach. So if I want to compete even in BabyPvP I am going to have to take the shortcut option or just accept losing to a bunch of players who have opened up way more skills than their kevel allows.

If this were a solo game that would be a great fix but in an MMO where you are potentially competing even outside PvP anything that gives artifical advantage is dangerous.

I know you wanted to avoid other cross character aspects in the thread but the post you have asked me to respond to mentions other things... so...

The other danger is scope creep... say you get this then the next thing that annoys you is that you have to play enough content to level skill trees to level 50 so your next ask becomes "Why can't skill tree levels gained in previous play throughs be unlocked for me?" After all you now have 300 skill points you can't spend until that is done so you still can't fully play your new character... after that it's something else and so on... in the end maybe what you really want is a cp630 pre-made with all skills and skill points fully opened... I understand there are games that will do that, I hope ESO never does because I think the journey to develop a character is a large part of enjoying the game and while you might think you want to just start at the end I think you would gain less pleasure from it and value your characters less.

Yadvo · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Because already having all the skill points is a disincentive to play through the content because part of the pleasure of doing the content is the buzz (however mild) of getting that 3rd shard and allocating the skill point to give you that skill or morph you didn't have before. I lose the pleasure of *earning* my character progression as I just start with all the points already and earn much less by actually playing the game. I would never again have to make a tough choice about which morph to place a skill point into or which weapon line to open up as I would simply be able to max them all out as I levelled... I wouldn't have the pleasure of the character gradually gaining more skills and more versatility as I played through the content as I'd already have the points to do it all as son as I landed in Coldharbour/Firemoth... Even the 'shortcut lite' option of adding them at level 50 is going to impact on the pleasure that I take from just taking my time and enjoying the process of building a character, sometimes over months.

It seems to me we are simply looking for different things from the game and I honestly don't see how they are compatible in this situation.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well... somehow when I complete "tutorial" I can skip it on fresh, newly created character. It should be the same for Sky-shards.... Or just how about an option to create a "new" character... and a "New game+" charter - that will copy some sky-shards, skill points and even some (not all) achievement form the character that has unlocked the most (you will still be able to play your old and new characters).

Gathering all this stuff again is just so annoying....

@Tavore1138 Could you please adress the solution suggested by @Tommy_The_Gun ? This is a great way to satisfy opposite sides of the discussion in a very elegant way.

Simple issue here is what happens in PvP content? A lot of PvP players already have enough concerns around the potential imbalances caused by CP numbers, how much more would that imbalance be increased by having some players running a level 30 with 300+ skill points where others are taking the other approach. So if I want to compete even in BabyPvP I am going to have to take the shortcut option or just accept losing to a bunch of players who have opened up way more skills than their kevel allows.

The mentioned post does indeed cover other aspect, which I wanted to avoid. My mistake. Allow me to get the discussion back on track by adressing only the part above.

It seems to me that the solution to this, considering the PvP imbalance implications, would be the second option in the pool. Would that make sense to you?

Morrawind · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

The road to is more important for me than the end result. Collecting each and every skyshard are goals for me to achieve for every character i have.
Getting things the easy way for me is less goals in the game. So less reasons to play.

Tasear · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

Yadvo wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Okay champion points makes sense... I was going to never level another character again... I mean never ever. On the other hand, I just don't agree with skyshards. You make a competitive character just find by getting to level 50 maybe doing a quest or 3. While I do agree it would be nice for it to be account wide... this isn't just takes instead of gives from the experience. Would feel like sims with cheat codes on. Mind I won't complain if it happens... but how do you reward those who collected them all on multiple characters.

Also after this well we give quests skill points too? Yeah no idea is rejected.

Please read the rules of the discussion. I intend this thread only to focus on the skyshards, not the quest skill points. This has brought a lot of salty comments in the previous thread as it was impossible to focus on this particular aspect of the gameplay. Lorebooks, quests etc. would be untouched considering my proposal.

I did but you have to consider cause and effect.

I also wish to moderate the discussion in order for it not to go off the topic. I do realise that some people might later say sth along the way of "Well X has been changed, why not change Y aswell". However this has no direct association with the poll as it covers skyshards strictly.

Skyshards = skill points = Quests

bebynnag · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

because i am a console player

I personally know where 90% of skyshards more or less are (having gathered them so many times).

I am forever running into new or returning players who are are struggling with this,

they ask me for my help, and i try to help but its difficult. my right minded dyslexic brain doesnt know where specific skyshards are if asked, but specifically when im running skill point quests, i get a visual Que so i know that is i divert off course for a few meters, i can collect X no of skyshards/lorebooks and then get bk to my quest with ease.

so because i would like to be able to actually help the people i syumble across who are looking for a specific skyshard - please give console players (& non add on using pc players) the ability to unlock some kind of built in skyshard guide

Beardimus · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Main reason as a counter to your arguement is There are MORE than enough skill points in the game for Alts. My main has them all sure as he's my main and crafter. Alts on the other hand have surplus Skill Points just from levelling and quests, so there is no need for this change.

Primarily though, SS are a great reason to properly explore the map whilst doing other things, the quests, and other things to collect.

The people that complain appear to be grinders who speed level toons. Well, in my opinion that's not playing the game right so sure you then feel shard hunting is pointless - its not. Every time i explore with a toon and new perspective i find new things. Play the game as intended and A there is no need for extra points and B they are easy to get as you go.

Tavore1138 · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Yadvo wrote: »

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

Tavore1138 wrote: »

Yadvo wrote: »

@Tavore1138 I will focus just on this part

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

Okay, but how does it prevent you from completing different ammounts of content on different characters and thus lowers your individuallity? I do not see the connection between the two. It would not influence your decision making process in any way. In the end you would still be the one to decide which quests to complete, how to develop your character etc.

Because already having all the skill points is a disincentive to play through the content because part of the pleasure of doing the content is the buzz (however mild) of getting that 3rd shard and allocating the skill point to give you that skill or morph you didn't have before. I lose the pleasure of *earning* my character progression as I just start with all the points already and earn much less by actually playing the game. I would never again have to make a tough choice about which morph to place a skill point into or which weapon line to open up as I would simply be able to max them all out as I levelled... I wouldn't have the pleasure of the character gradually gaining more skills and more versatility as I played through the content as I'd already have the points to do it all as son as I landed in Coldharbour/Firemoth... Even the 'shortcut lite' option of adding them at level 50 is going to impact on the pleasure that I take from just taking my time and enjoying the process of building a character, sometimes over months.

It seems to me we are simply looking for different things from the game and I honestly don't see how they are compatible in this situation.

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well... somehow when I complete "tutorial" I can skip it on fresh, newly created character. It should be the same for Sky-shards.... Or just how about an option to create a "new" character... and a "New game+" charter - that will copy some sky-shards, skill points and even some (not all) achievement form the character that has unlocked the most (you will still be able to play your old and new characters).

Gathering all this stuff again is just so annoying....

@Tavore1138 Could you please adress the solution suggested by @Tommy_The_Gun ? This is a great way to satisfy opposite sides of the discussion in a very elegant way.

Simple issue here is what happens in PvP content? A lot of PvP players already have enough concerns around the potential imbalances caused by CP numbers, how much more would that imbalance be increased by having some players running a level 30 with 300+ skill points where others are taking the other approach. So if I want to compete even in BabyPvP I am going to have to take the shortcut option or just accept losing to a bunch of players who have opened up way more skills than their kevel allows.

The mentioned post does indeed cover other aspect, which I wanted to avoid. My mistake. Allow me to get the discussion back on track by adressing only the part above.

It seems to me that the solution to this, considering the PvP imbalance implications, would be the second option in the pool. Would that make sense to you?

If the imbalance in BabyPvP was my only issue with having skill points from shards then yes option 2 would be a work around but I think my other posts give you the reasons why I don't like the idea as a whole in more detail.

The basic problem with @Tommy_The_Gun 's proposal is that it creates a 2 tier system for players across the game, BabyPvP would be one of the the most obvious areas but anywhere where having an advantage over another player is relevant then those who took the shortcut would have an advantage. Then players who enjoy playing the content and developing their characters would be forced to choose between being at a disadvantage or deviling their playing pleasure to be equal - again not a good situation.

Any solution has to work for everyone and none of the currently proposed ones do thus my feeling is still leave things as they are.

This is not like achieves where there could be a compromise (i.e. a summary screen where the completionists can see all account achieves) this is a situation where I can't see a way for you to get what you want without in some way impacting on how I enjoy the game and the same is true for you.

Kendaric · June 2017

Once gathered, the skyshards are marked on the map for other characters (console players suggestion)

Voted that way since console players have no add-ons like we PC players do. Other than that, skyshards are entirely fine as is and we don't need to have accountwide.

Alchemical · June 2017

Make the skyshards available account wide, with no restrictions

I enjoy skyshard hunting, but I think it account wide would be a better system.

Example, my max level crafter is starved for skill points, but is otherwise aptly geared and I don't have a reason to play them as much, especially if it's just going back to old, boring zones I already quested through but may have missed a delve or two. That's not gonna be fun, it's gonna be tedious.

I'd much rather be playing my new Warden, with whom I can do the delves or shards I missed while also practicing my new character and getting use to their playstyle. I'm helping my crafter get the points they need WHILE leveling my Warden too, getting twice as much work done and not getting burnt out from have to do something boring over and over and over again.

There's probably lots of other ways that it wouldn't work out so neatly, so I'm not going to pretend that it's objectively a great idea with no potential for exploiting. I just think it would be a nice QoL improvement if I could help my higher level toons (mostly just my crafter tbh) by getting skill points for them while questing, just like my 50's help my lowbies by wracking up CP.

Tandor · June 2017

Skyshards are fine the way they are and should not be touched

Tavore1138 wrote: »

My personal feelings in response to your points...

1. It is handing out skill points to characters that have not earned them. Having got them across several characters it is an integral part of the playing experience and taking it away would lower the incentive to fully play each character. It would also remove the challenge even after hitting level 50 of having to decide where the next point goes and which content you will do next to find the shards to get the points to level up that new skill line you just opened up or wanted to try on your character.
2. Many of the other incentives you mention will take you to or right past the skyshards anyway - they are mostly placed in such a way as to be found while doing other content i.e. in delves & public dungeons or in and around quest locations. Since you will be going there anyway the 5 second stop for a shard should not be a problem.
3. This one seems to be the real point you are making - why should you have to do it 12 times just to play your CP630 Warden? That is the only one I do have a certain sympathy for but the only suggestion that balances this with many people's pleasure in replaying content in multiple ways with multiple characters is the map marking one (which PC players could have anyway).

The problem with this and many other threads around things being account wide is that many people like to treat each character as an individual (and yes dyes, yes housing but that's not our choice either) - I have 9 and each one has completed different amounts of the content, has different achieves etc and that's how I like it. I empathise with your issues to a point but giving you what you want would make the game less pleasurable for me so I can't support it, I also sincerely believe that part of what makes RPG games enjoyable is earning the progress, even on repeat play throughs.

This sums up my own position very well.

It's been pretty clear whenever account-wide issues arise on the forum that there's a difference primarily between those PC veterans of MMORPGs and those console veterans of other games (there not being many MMORPGs on console). The latter are used to having everything earned as a player while the former are used to having everything earned as a character. It's an important distinction, because ESO is first and foremost a MMORPG no matter which platform it is played on.

I personally play MMORPGs with multiple characters (across two accounts in the case of ESO) and have no wish to lessen the enjoyment of developing each character fully and individually by dumbing down the means of advancement and being awarded things on one character that have only been earned on a different character.

While I can appreciate in the light of the predominantly negative responses the OP got on his previous poll thread why he would (a) want to increase the number of options and so dilute the players' opposition and (b) want to limit the scope of the discussion to just skyshards, it's not for an OP to "own" a thread and dictate how people should respond. The fact is that account-wide issues arise from time to time and are usually related to a range of things like skyshards, lorebooks, achievements, and titles etc, so limiting any discussion to just one aspect is likely to be seen as the thin end of the wedge with the next poll covering lorebooks, then one on achievements and so on. I prefer to make it quite clear that I dislike the whole concept of things being held account-wide - and yes, that includes dye unlocks and champion points etc. However, I happily accept that we are where we are, but would not want it to go any further in any respect including skyshards.

Finding and activating skyshards is part of playing the game, and if people don't want to play the game they are under no obligation to do so - or they can simply play one character if they don't want to go through the process of playing more than one character. No game should be structured around those who only wish to "grind an alt" to max level in the minimum time possible and without the "inconvenience" of playing the game up to that point purely on the grounds that they've done it once so don't want to do it again. A lot of us play multiple characters as equal individuals not as a "main plus alts" and it would destroy the way we play the game if such things as skyshards were earned across the account.

The Elder Scrolls Online

Should SKYSHARDS be made available account-wide? [Improved poll, with more options!]

Should SKYSHARDS be made available account-wide? [Improved poll, with more options!] 509 votes