ESO Forums seem to be filled with fake news

Phinix1 · May 2017

RE: the sustain changes...

They absolutely did try to do way to much at once, and they timed it horribly to coincide with the release of new content and a new class they had been hyping for months, leading to a massive anti-climax.

Further there is no disincentive to pile CP into 3 stars as you put it. They simple removed one sustain star completely and added a new direct damage star instead. They also made the diminishing return curve a little steeper so you get most of the benefit from a star by only going to 54-75 points. HOWEVER, that doesn't mean any of the "fluff" stars like sprint cost or medium armor focus are any better, so really you end up spreading them out among the same 3-4 stars, maybe 5 in blue for a magicka class that also wants some in Thaumaturge, which is pretty much the same as it was before.

The entire re-balance came off as a massive nerf as well, with little to no actual benefit, since they timed all these class changes to ALSO coincide. It was too much all at once. The Templar nerfs, the sustain nerfs, the other class skills being tweaked or removed. It was just bad timing on ZOS's part trying to pile everything into one massive heap and hope it all worked out.

Then when people on PTS closed beta tried to explain this for months they were essentially ignored and ZOS pushed the changes live anyway. That also leaves a pretty bitter taste.

The end result to combat IS absolutely noticeable. The entire play style HAS changed and heavy attacks ARE mandatory now. Forcing people to play a certain way is always a bad idea, especially the heavy attack idea which is incredibly boring, just standing there holding one button down every 3-4 abilities to heavy attack regen. Plus it doesn't really make any sense as swinging a massive weapon should TAKE stamina like every other TES game, not give it.

Even replacing expensive gear with Seducer or equivalent and slotting sustain glyphs on jewelry, the impact of these sustain changes not only due to the complete removal of 15% cost reduction from the removal of the CP star for that, but also nerfs to armor cost reduction and regen across the board simultaneous to that change (too much at once), results in a massive shift in play-style (for the worse in my opinion) which makes little to no sense and offers nothing to the player experience but tedium. It takes away, but gives nothing in return. It forces a play style that no one asked for and no one really wanted in order to solve a PVP imbalance that ZOS straight up said in their live chat "was just too much work to solve the right way by balancing PVE and PVP separately."

When you have massive shortcuts being taken by a company that already asks for more than the average sub game if you want any of the costumes or mounts or other fluff that other games offer in-game ways to farm for, you have to at least admit that it is pretty understandable why long-term supporters would be a little pissed.

ANYTHING works if all you intend to do is kill mobs in open PVE while questing. But the playstyle for vet dungeons on up has been severely diminished by the forcing of heavy attack weaving and the cost and hassle of bar-gazing resource management, re-gearing, and massive class changes (almost universally nerfs) all dumped on us all at once.

The heaping of all this at once really gave the entire expansion launch a bit of a negative impact.

Publius_Scipio · May 2017

Correction. VERY fake news.

thegamekittenub17_ESO · May 2017

I read Test server forum and thought the sky was falling and I would lose a game I enjoy playing. I feared early access of Morrowind. I even talked to my hubby he may want to cancel our pre-order, because there some things that frustrated me with the game already. My hubby talked me into giving it whirl anyways.

I rarely play in big groups. I do not PVP. I do not do trails. I do not do dungeons outside of public ones. I do not know about the issues with these.

Been an MMOer for a long time and changes always happen no matter what MMO it is. I am fine as long as I can adapt. I am old so I am not quick as I use to be, so I do not bother with messing with groups. I do not count the damage I do things still die quickly for me. I test builds until I find one I like. I do have hybrids that survive well and resources are not draining quickly on most PVE mobs. I adapt and have fun.

But the forums at one point had me wanting to cancel a pre-order this time. I do not consider it fake news, it was a concern for those that played the game differently that gave their concerns the loudest. Not saying it was wrong. Their concerns seem legit with how they play.

There are things I do have issues with (The rng in this game is terrible and add my not lucky status to it). But I adapted.

Jayne_Doe · May 2017

I think the OP's point was not that people shouldn't have complained about the changes, what I think they were getting at was that there were a LOT of doom & gloom posts - RIP, the game is ending, I'm quitting, etc. There was a lot of irrational negativity AND irrational positivity to wade through.

Unless one took the time to wade through all the reactionary and baseless comments (both positive and negative) to get to the good posts that provided constructive feedback based on actual playtesting and supported with numbers, one would think that the game was going to be unplayable by everyone when Morrowind launched and everyone was going to leave en masse, and the game was just going to die.

Negative feedback is necessary and lead to some positive changes from the original PTS patch. But there were a LOT of other posts that were just noise. I read through a lot of arguments from both sides and many good points were raised. In the end, after much reading, I came to the conclusion that the changes would not affect my non-theorycrafted, hybrid builds and the casual way I play. I don't do end-game content - I'm a hardcore quester (and NO, I don't expect ZOS to change anything to suit my playstyle, and I have adapted to all changes since early access on PC).

So, the OP is a lot like me and I'm hopeful that my experience will be like theirs, and not doom & gloom, the game is ruined, etc. No, it's also not a bed of roses, and from what I've read there are issues for end-game players doing vet trials - those need to be addressed. And players who do that content need to continue to be vocal and raise concerns/provide feedback. But, they also shouldn't feel it necessary to label those that actually are finding the changes to be ok for them as white knights - they just discovered that FOR THEM, the changes aren't as bad as most of what they read on the forums lead them to believe.

TL:DR - PTS feedback was constructive/necessary and lead to positive changes, but there was also a lot of NOISE that gave an inaccurate impression of what the update has turned out to be for some players. For end-game content players - keep raising your concerns/issues!

Sweetpea704 · May 2017

Folks basically want to keep using their old meta build from some video they saw on YouTube like a year ago.

Phinix1 · May 2017

Sweetpea704 wrote: »

Folks basically want to keep using their old meta build from some video they saw on YouTube like a year ago.

That is pretty short-sighted and doesn't show any awareness of the (legit) concerns players that actually do veteran dungeons and higher content have and continue to raise.

The complete removal of an entire CP star (15% cost reduction) ON TOP of nerfing armor passive cost reduction ON TOP of nerfing class passive and ability resource management ON TOP of gear nerfs and other class changes, has led to players doing serious content (you can literally play naked with your fists and have fun doing solo PVE) being FORCED into just standing there holding down heavy attack nearly half the time, and not even getting anything back for it if they have to interrupt that long windup to dodge/block/bash, etc. Never mind other oversights like what about melee player sustain during ranged fights, etc.

It was too much at once. If you need to balance things always do it with a scalpel not a chainsaw.

It is an illogical play style change forced on the people doing the content where it actually matters, one that goes against the whole TES paradigm of heavy attacks COSTING resources, not giving them. I mean how does it make sense that swinging a massive 30 lb sword gives you MORE energy? But most of all it is forcing a play style which is slower, more tedious (constant bar gazing) and diminishes the fast-paced combat the game was built on.

But most damning is that it was all because ZOS straight up admits "it is just too hard to balance PVE and PVP separately." That is bad and they should feel bad.

starkerealm · May 2017

danno8 wrote: »

OldGamerESO wrote: »

My DPS chars in most cases have higher DPS than before.

because every objective test on PTS showed that while sustain can be had, it will drop your DPS by several thousand. For myself at first I dropped around 5k DPS on a test dummy, then after some tweaking and finding the right balance I was able to get my DPS to within 3k of what it was pre-Morrowind.

Also, just to note, if all you do are mainly overland and Veteran Dungeons (particularly release dungeons) then you will find very little difference as stuff dies too fast to have a noticeable effect. IT is the Veteran Trials groups that were hit hard with the sustain nerfs.

I'd actually turn this around and say, if you weren't pushing against the ceiling before, the changes will probably result in a DPS increase.

For all the whining, the floor did get raised. At the same time, if you were using animation canceling rotations, and relying on infinite sustain through shards, then, yeah, this patch will burn you a bit.

Kodrac · May 2017

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

People who are happy with the game don't usually post threads about how happy they are. People who are unhappy (or who think they might be in the future after a patch) rush on here to scream and whine and declare the game is "ruined." Meanwhile, the happy people are busy playing the game.

Yet here you are!
So which type of people that makes you?

You have a wide aggro radius, bruh. Chill on the energy drinks.

WalksonGraves · May 2017

Just like in real life the person shouting fake news is a troll trying to distort reality.

thegamekittenub17_ESO · May 2017

Phinix1 wrote: »

Sweetpea704 wrote: »

Folks basically want to keep using their old meta build from some video they saw on YouTube like a year ago.

That is pretty short-sighted and doesn't show any awareness of the (legit) concerns players that actually do veteran dungeons and higher content have and continue to raise.

The complete removal of an entire CP star (15% cost reduction) ON TOP of nerfing armor passive cost reduction ON TOP of nerfing class passive and ability resource management ON TOP of gear nerfs and other class changes, has led to players doing serious content (you can literally play naked with your fists and have fun doing solo PVE) being FORCED into just standing there holding down heavy attack nearly half the time, and not even getting anything back for it if they have to interrupt that long windup to dodge/block/bash, etc. Never mind other oversights like what about melee player sustain during ranged fights, etc.

It was too much at once. If you need to balance things always do it with a scalpel not a chainsaw.

It is an illogical play style change forced on the people doing the content where it actually matters, one that goes against the whole TES paradigm of heavy attacks COSTING resources, not giving them. I mean how does it make sense that swinging a massive 30 lb sword gives you MORE energy? But most of all it is forcing a play style which is slower, more tedious (constant bar gazing) and diminishes the fast-paced combat the game was built on.

But most damning is that it was all because ZOS straight up admits "it is just too hard to balance PVE and PVP separately." That is bad and they should feel bad.

This is the first MMO I have played that PvP and PvE were treated as the same. And I have been playing MMOs for ages. I did PvP in WoW and usually to protect beginning areas where people enjoyed killing quest givers or the barrens XD. I lost a few and won a few (Huntard always) but when I lost it was because of the difference of a true PvPer with true PvP gear and such. I did beat some good geared PvPer but that was because I was higher than them by 20 levels and knew how to use my pet. Now I miss WoW lol, my pets.

PvP and PvE are two different games to me. They should be treated as such. Other MMOs do treat them differently and for as long as I have played MMOs I can say balance in an MMO is hard to come by, but treating two different game as one is the biggest flawed system I've ever seen.

geonsocal · May 2017

I must be the rare exception - i enjoy just about all the regular posters on the forums, even the grumpy ones...

it's interesting to read different views from folks...

checking through the forums is like scanning the national enquirer and reading about alien encounters...

probably ain't real - but, interesting all the same...

best advice any teacher ever gave me in school - the importance of critical reading/thinking...

just cuz someone writes/speaks about a thing - don't make it true...

Judgedread101071 · May 2017

Kodrac wrote: »

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

People who are happy with the game don't usually post threads about how happy they are. People who are unhappy (or who think they might be in the future after a patch) rush on here to scream and whine and declare the game is "ruined." Meanwhile, the happy people are busy playing the game.

Yet here you are!
So which type of people that makes you?

You have a wide aggro radius, bruh. Chill on the energy drinks.

Asking a question makes a person with "wide aggro radius"?
Yeahh ok.Thx for your input.

Rouven · May 2017

geonsocal wrote: »

(...)

probably ain't real - but, interesting all the same...

(...)

What do you mean? Bzzzz ttrrriii pllllllrrr aiiiiiii!

Sorry, mea culpa. Definitely fake news this one. Nothing to see here, move along.

Edit: Sorry @OldGamerESO for the fake news tease, I did see your other post earlier.

Galwylin · May 2017

Jammer480 wrote: »

Actually, I did want to read it again... cuz it's spot on.

Seriously? Well, its the first post in this topic so knock yourself out.

SydneyGrey wrote: »

People who are happy with the game don't usually post threads about how happy they are. People who are unhappy (or who think they might be in the future after a patch) rush on here to scream and whine and declare the game is "ruined." Meanwhile, the happy people are busy playing the game.

Any company that creates a forum for their game and thinks its going to be filled with roses is in for a rude awakening. Forums are the masses. They're crude, insulting, demanding, etc. But there is something to learn. A number of items keep being brought up. That should be looked into. You look at what your play testers are saying. You look at how people are playing. You take all that and try to discern what players want and need. And deliver it.

Not once have I watched a live stream where player wants and needs are addressed other than they hear you. Its filled with "We want". Does we want pay the bills? Why after three years are you still not sure if you have a tank class. Its foolishness for them to keep on. The only problem with this game is the devs think they can fix problems. Directions they want to go.. That needs to stop looking at players as banks. That recognizes the same content reskinned is not new content. Use your wishes for the new class. That's the one you can be unsure about. Not three year old ones. I've said before and will say again. This is a good game that needs some improvements here and there but this constant change in play has got to end. Its too much desire on their part coming through and too little being heard from players.

And the only place I've noticed the sustain issues is in groups. Just questing, its as its always been. But I was just getting to enjoy groups then this dropped. I wish people would quit apologizing for the devs screw up because they hear you and believe it. What they need is to be thrown to the masses and explain their way out. Maybe then they would get you don't do all this crap attached to a subpar offering that was more expensive than anything else you've done. Not and expect praise.

I will leave with this, what would have changed if they hadn't did all this? No sustain reduction, no racial impacted, no gear change, none of this patch. How would the game have been different today. Would Morrowind had been just a tiny bit better? Would battlegrounds still end before the timer? What would have changed? And of course, would it have been better than this?

Kay1 · May 2017

This forum feeds any type of troll, lmao I may create a new forum account and start trolling people because the majority of people here are very innocent

Kodrac · May 2017

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

Kodrac wrote: »

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

People who are happy with the game don't usually post threads about how happy they are. People who are unhappy (or who think they might be in the future after a patch) rush on here to scream and whine and declare the game is "ruined." Meanwhile, the happy people are busy playing the game.

Yet here you are!
So which type of people that makes you?

You have a wide aggro radius, bruh. Chill on the energy drinks.

Asking a question makes a person with "wide aggro radius"?
Yeahh ok.Thx for your input.

starkerealm · May 2017

OldGamerESO wrote: »

So how come we were led to believe that ESO had become at best unenjoyable and at worst unplayable? Was this hysteria manufactured in order to create some sort of bargaining power with ZeniMax?

Sort of. Though it'd be a little disingenuous to say they were intentionally doing it as a bargaining chip. More, they were throwing a tantrum in the vain hope that ZOS would take pity on them, and revert the changes. Thing is, we're talking about at most a handful of players. Problem is, a couple of these individuals had fans. Fans who neither understood the mechanics involved, nor any reason to question what they were being told. Fans who, once the hew and cry was raised, went to work on the forums pronouncing the death of ESO.

LioraValkyrie · May 2017

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

@souravami
Although i try not to bash ppl or to insault them at some point when someone is saying that things are even better now as far as dps goes the only thing that comes in my mind is the light attack spammers we've all seen and played at some point,in which case they saw a dps increase since light attacks got buffed.other than that it's confusing to me how someone has better dps now.
But i am still waiting for the OP's answer

Not the OP, but here is m@souravami smile:

I too have had a substantial increase in DPS since the patch (up from 25 to 30k) for the following reasons- 1) as a stam sorc dd, I used to run 5 heavy to compensate the lack of wards, used heavy attacks for increased resource return, got used to this playstyle in vMA (got flawless with it), and stuck with it. However, with the change in the Warrior CP tree allowing for a greater amount of mitigation than before (about 30% flat from any damage source, instead of 25% I believe) and the changes to heavy attack resource recovery, I was encouraged to play more offensively and put on medium armour. 2) I don't like the change to caltrops, which I used to use in almost every encounter for its huge long-term AoE. Consequently, I replaced it with poison injection, which deals much more single target dps. 3) Because this patch played into the wheelhouse of my existing heavy attack playstyle, I was not required to put any cost reduction or recovery glyphs on my jewellry.

In short, I probably could have had more dps in the last patch, but the changes encouraged me to experiment and explore new avenues which resulted in a pretty drastic increase in my damage output.

Pops_ND_Irish · May 2017

OldGamerESO wrote: »

It seems increasingly hard to rationalize the difference between the hysteria on the forums and the reality in the game. It feels very similar to arguments people have with politics, where their particular bias colors their interpretation of events. The bias on these forums seems to be so heavily anti-ESO/ZeniMax that any positive posts are overrun with an angry mob shouting them down.

A perfect example is the CP and sustain changes in the last patch. I really did think the sky was falling. All of the posts about ESO "being ruined" and it becoming "heavy attacks online" seemed very persuasive and I expected to be miserable after the patch. So how do I explain that the exact opposite happened... I love the changes. Every single one of my characters seem substantially better after I reworked all my CP, tweaked my rotations and changed some glyphs, poisons and potion usage. I love the fact that I have been given a disincentive to piling all my CP into 3 perks. My characters seem much more resilient now even though I don't have more than 50 in any one perk. My DPS chars in most cases have higher DPS than before and with no sustain issues at all. Vet Dungeon bosses die just as fast as they did before. I can solo the same world bosses in the same amount of time (or better) now. Normal trials seem even easier now. I can't speak to veteran trials because, like 99.9% of players, I don't do them. I was doubting my sanity so I have been chatting with my guild mates about their experience... and wow, it turns out they feel the same way I do! I heard a couple of gripes about a few things (Templars losing major mending for example) but that was always followed up with "it didn't seem to make a big difference". In general everyone seems very happy with the patch and the changes.

So how come we were led to believe that ESO had become at best unenjoyable and at worst unplayable? Was this hysteria manufactured in order to create some sort of bargaining power with ZeniMax? That people claim to be quitting over these changes seem ludicrous. My guess is that if someone is leaving over these changes then they were just looking for an excuse to quit a game they stopped enjoying a long time ago.

I am sure the reaction to my post will be to either ignore it or tell me how wrong I am. Perhaps what I have learned is that the forums aren't really a useful place to discuss the game. It is too bad, because I seem to remember a time when it was different on the forums.

P.S. After reading these responses I guess I should not have used the term "fake news". It seems incorrect to characterize posts on the negative aspects of the patch as "fake". I guess I need a word that describes "exaggerated the negative experience to the average player". I also concede that some of the PTS complaints had the desired effect of changes that made the release more palatable. And finally I acknowledge that the increase in my own dps had to do with the CP changes being good for my own loose and non-efficient rotations. DPS is provably lower for perfectly efficient rotations/gear/buffs than before. I still stand by my point that there were too many exaggerations about how bad things would be for the regular player and that there is a vast gulf between the doom-sayers and reality for most players.

Great Post !!!!!

Dont listen to the whiners, youtubers, and so called experts, They will always have something negative to say. I f you listen to whiners, youtubers, and so called experts,and let them guide your thinking, then its your own fault. Especially youtubers who draw in people and they believe every word. They have a problem.

Bombashaman · May 2017

To OP: don't mind the idiotic rants. They just feel they are special snowflakes:

and aren't happy whatever happens.

Balamoor · May 2017

The game is fine
Ignore the haters
Forums are an irreparable cesspool.

Oftentimes the mods will protect those who put the game down continually over everyone else, so do like I do now and stick with the in game community (which for the most part is amazing) instead of this poor excuse for a forum.

Sikthlight08xz · May 2017

Morrowind brought back some of the jerks, give it a few months, they will leave again.

ShedsHisTail · May 2017

I heard Advisor Norion is colluding with the Veiled Heritance...

Oh, is that not the news we're doing?

geonsocal · May 2017

NewBlacksmurf · May 2017

My suggestion....
Play the game (Or stop)
Stay informed (only by the below to avoid opinions and media sway)
Read the dev fracker and official news, patch notes and announcements
Watch ESO Live on a regular basis

Technically you can skip the forums other than checking on a bug or odd occurrence you're experiencing.

Dantaria · May 2017

OldGamerESO wrote: »

My characters seem much more resilient now even though I don't have more than 50 in any one perk. My DPS chars in most cases have higher DPS than before and with no sustain issues at all. Vet Dungeon bosses die just as fast as they did before. I can solo the same world bosses in the same amount of time (or better) now. Normal trials seem even easier now. I can't speak to veteran trials because, like 99.9% of players, I don't do them. I was doubting my sanity so I have been chatting with my guild mates about their experience... and wow, it turns out they feel the same way I do! I heard a couple of gripes about a few things (Templars losing major mending for example) but that was always followed up with "it didn't seem to make a big difference". In general everyone seems very happy with the patch and the changes.

And now try vet HM dungs. Because honestly? Vet non-DLC dungs are nowhere near the indicator.

Try vet HM. Better yet - try levelling new char. I recently made magDK, wanted to long ago, but finally found the time only after Morrowind.

My main is crafter, so this tiny dude has pretty much everything - gear, food, 430CP... Queued in random normal straight on lvl 10 - ended up in BCII with other newbies. Oh. My. God.

~17k group DPS with my 60+%. Tried simplest "rotation" - remember, we're talking lvl 10 here

Burning Embers => Blockade of Fire => Stonefist (for triggering Off-balance with Flame Lash) => spam Flame Lash. One iteration? Time to heavy-attack.

We made it, but it was a freaking mess. The other DD was, apparently, total newbie and well... he was happy. Told "nice, gg", left. But I know how it was before - and I freaking facepalmed, because yeah.

No HA meta... for high-levels with CP and gear. Switched to my main (non-pet) sorc - pulled my standard 27k with very few HAs in another randon normal. Wept all the while.

My tiny magDK has blue gear with blue enchants, blue food and 430CP - 35k magicka. He has to HA. Badly.

Real newbies without all that probably now think that you don't need skills, 'cause you can't use them anyway.

Also haha about Major Mending. I felt the loss of it alright in nHoF, when I went there on healer.

Try to get higher. Or start from the bottom. See s**t becoming very real.

S1ipperyJim · May 2017

Galwylin wrote: »

the only place I've noticed the sustain issues is in groups. Just questing, its as its always been.

...because reading lines of NPC dialogue and collecting X number of Skeever skins doesn't require any kind of sustain...

souravami · May 2017

LioraValkyrie wrote: »

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

@souravami
Although i try not to bash ppl or to insault them at some point when someone is saying that things are even better now as far as dps goes the only thing that comes in my mind is the light attack spammers we've all seen and played at some point,in which case they saw a dps increase since light attacks got buffed.other than that it's confusing to me how someone has better dps now.
But i am still waiting for the OP's answer

Not the OP, but here is m@souravami smile:

I too have had a substantial increase in DPS since the patch (up from 25 to 30k) for the following reasons- 1) as a stam sorc dd, I used to run 5 heavy to compensate the lack of wards, used heavy attacks for increased resource return, got used to this playstyle in vMA (got flawless with it), and stuck with it. However, with the change in the Warrior CP tree allowing for a greater amount of mitigation than before (about 30% flat from any damage source, instead of 25% I believe) and the changes to heavy attack resource recovery, I was encouraged to play more offensively and put on medium armour. 2) I don't like the change to caltrops, which I used to use in almost every encounter for its huge long-term AoE. Consequently, I replaced it with poison injection, which deals much more single target dps. 3) Because this patch played into the wheelhouse of my existing heavy attack playstyle, I was not required to put any cost reduction or recovery glyphs on my jewellry.

In short, I probably could have had more dps in the last patch, but the changes encouraged me to experiment and explore new avenues which resulted in a pretty drastic increase in my damage output.

Yes

LioraValkyrie wrote: »

Judgedread101071 wrote: »

@souravami
Although i try not to bash ppl or to insault them at some point when someone is saying that things are even better now as far as dps goes the only thing that comes in my mind is the light attack spammers we've all seen and played at some point,in which case they saw a dps increase since light attacks got buffed.other than that it's confusing to me how someone has better dps now.
But i am still waiting for the OP's answer

Not the OP, but here is m@souravami smile:

I too have had a substantial increase in DPS since the patch (up from 25 to 30k) for the following reasons- 1) as a stam sorc dd, I used to run 5 heavy to compensate the lack of wards, used heavy attacks for increased resource return, got used to this playstyle in vMA (got flawless with it), and stuck with it. However, with the change in the Warrior CP tree allowing for a greater amount of mitigation than before (about 30% flat from any damage source, instead of 25% I believe) and the changes to heavy attack resource recovery, I was encouraged to play more offensively and put on medium armour. 2) I don't like the change to caltrops, which I used to use in almost every encounter for its huge long-term AoE. Consequently, I replaced it with poison injection, which deals much more single target dps. 3) Because this patch played into the wheelhouse of my existing heavy attack playstyle, I was not required to put any cost reduction or recovery glyphs on my jewellry.

In short, I probably could have had more dps in the last patch, but the changes encouraged me to experiment and explore new avenues which resulted in a pretty drastic increase in my damage output.

It is awesome to know that both you and op have achieved higher DPS this patch. But from what you have written, it is evident that you guys became better at the game with time and as a result your DPS increased. What I am trying to say that the people who are near the skill ceiling/DPS ceiling are affected adversely from the patch. I don't know a single end game raider who said that they are pulling higher numbers this patch. Moreover, the combat feels less fun and more clanky compared to last patch as inadvertently heavy attacks are involved in our rotation for sustain.

Caligamy_ESO · May 2017

Stop complaining and conform already.

Conformity is the jailer of freedom, and the enemy of growth.

disintegr8 · May 2017

Resistance is futile..... you will be assimilated....