Why do the warden stam morphs not have additional effects?

leepalmer95 · May 2017

Dive:

Magicka - 15% increased dmg from rnage
Stamina - ?

Netch:

Magicka - Purges 1 thing on cast
Stamina - ?

Veiled strike:

Magicka - 25% movement when in sneak or invisible
Stamina - Applies major fracture

Any particular reason? Every other stam morph has an additional effect.

KeiruNicrom · May 2017

Because ZOS is highly unimaginative when it comes to stamina.

"It deals damage...... yea thats good enough"

Tryxus · May 2017

Cuz Stam OP

Taleof2Cities · May 2017

KeiruNicrom wrote: »

Because ZOS is highly unimaginative when it comes to stamina.

"It deals damage...... yea thats good enough"

Troll post is troll.

According to ZOS, the class is intended to be a "jack-of-all-trades" ... and shines in an off-heals or off-tank role.

Sure, the class emphasis is magicka ... but players will eventually find a suitable stam build that synergizes with their needs and the class.

I like my stam characters just like the next guy/gal.

But all the complaining about why the Warden isn't pure stamina (or pure magicka DPS - another common rant) gets tiring to read.

leepalmer95 · May 2017

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

KeiruNicrom wrote: »

Because ZOS is highly unimaginative when it comes to stamina.

"It deals damage...... yea thats good enough"

Troll post is troll.

According to ZOS, the class is intended to be a "jack-of-all-trades" ... and shines in an off-heals or off-tank role.

Sure, the class emphasis is magicka ... but players will eventually find a suitable stam build that synergizes with their needs and the class.

I like my stam characters just like the next guy/gal.

But all the complaining about why the Warden isn't pure stamina (or pure magicka DPS - another common rant) gets tiring to read.

Did you read the op?

Taleof2Cities · May 2017

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Did you read the op?

Here is the link to the class abilities in case you missed it:

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2017/04/13/warden-guide-skill-lines-and-abilities

leepalmer95 · May 2017

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Did you read the op?

Here is the link to the class abilities in case you missed it:

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2017/04/13/warden-guide-skill-lines-and-abilities

Ok?

But again why do the stam morphs not have additional effects?

Are you ok there?

D0ntevenL1ft · May 2017

My DK stam abilities are no different… Add that in the title.

Lord_Eomer · May 2017

Troll Post! Pass on

leepalmer95 · May 2017

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

My DK stam abilities are no different… Add that in the title.

You mean the 12% increases dmg per tick of claw
Or the major fracture of breath?

KochDerDamonen · May 2017

>no stamina morph for fletcher flies
>no additional effects for stamina cliffracer

Well, looks like my warden is going to be another magicka character.

Taleof2Cities · May 2017

leepalmer95 wrote: »

But again why do the stam morphs not have additional effects?

Are you ok there?

Did you not read the link?

Or are you trying to bait me into giving a stance on each skill morph when only ZOS knows why each was created?

Here's an example of a stam morph that adds an extra effect (from the link):

Bull Netch – Call a Bull Netch that restores Stamina over 25 seconds. Grants Major Brutality, increasing weapon damage by 20% over 27 seconds, and Major Sorcery, increasing Spell Damage by 20% over 27 seconds. This ability has no cost.

olsborg · May 2017

Being undodgeable and able to hit ppl from max range with more dmg then surprise atk is "special" enough if you ask me.

KochDerDamonen · May 2017

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

But again why do the stam morphs not have additional effects?

Are you ok there?

Did you not read the link?

Or are you trying to bait me into giving a stance on each skill morph when only ZOS knows why each was created?

Here's an example of a stam morph that adds an extra effect (from the link):

Bull Netch – Call a Bull Netch that restores Stamina over 25 seconds. Grants Major Brutality, increasing weapon damage by 20% over 27 seconds, and Major Sorcery, increasing Spell Damage by 20% over 27 seconds. This ability has no cost.

@Taleof2Cities All that's done is made it do what it does for magicka already in the base version, having sorcery in addition to the brutality isn't really different. Could have noted that the bears have different secondary actives. Or that Soothing Spores (Fungal Growth) is the only class-based (and second-only) stamina ally heal, and has increased healing for closer allies. Those two don't really do much in terms of making wardens interesting to theorize on though.

Vaoh · May 2017

Well, when we look how Stamina Wardens are performing they are not even slightly lackluster in any content.

• Subterranean Assault applies to enemies Major armor/spell debuffs. It serves as a sort of AoE stamina curse/debuff. Very strong.
• Cutting Dive (Stam morph) has a slight damage buff over Screaming Cliff Racer (Mag morph). However, Screaming Cliff Racer has a bigger damage boost only at a distance past 15m.
• The Stamina morph of the Bear ultimate deals a good amount of increased damage on all of its attacks over the Magicka morph. whereas the Magicka morph can respawn once per minute without recasting.

The Netch is more complicated:
• Bull Netch returns Stamina and applies both Major Sorcery and Brutality to the caster. Blue Netch returns Magicka but only gives Major Sorcery, and is topped off by a purge of 1 effect.

This is a very small purge...... Temps purge 5 effects. Many skills apply 3-4 negative effects at once when they hit you, and a Warden cannot choose which to purge. They have cast other skills to survive as well.

Also restoring Stamina is much stronger than returning Magicka. Only a Magicka Warden PvE DPS must take the Magicka morph. In PvP, a Magicka Warden can take the Stamina morph because it'd save them a lot of trouble with dodging/CC breaks which is why the "Stam" morph still gives Major Sorcery. You'll have to trade reliable Stam (better) for a tiny bit more Magicka recovery and the option to purge 1 measly effect if you don't get killed/5 more effects applied to you every time you cast this purge.

In general I'd say things are well balanced. Stamina Warden is strong and has plenty of options, including the first Stamina-based class healing skill thanks to Soothing Spores!

If you want to make an arguement about buffing Stamina Warden, then maybe some sort of slight buff to the caster from using Cutting Dive could be asked for. Maybe. I think everything is fine though. Stamina Wardens will be everywhere next patch and not because they need their skills buffed

goldnugget · May 2017

stam warden does not need a buff. it is competitive with other classes. magicka warden is extremely low dps and actually the worst thing in the game.

leepalmer95 · May 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

Well, when we look how Stamina Wardens are performing they are not even slightly lackluster in any content.

• Subterranean Assault applies to enemies Major armor/spell debuffs. It serves as a sort of AoE stamina curse/debuff. Very strong.
• Cutting Dive (Stam morph) has a slight damage buff over Screaming Cliff Racer (Mag morph). However, Screaming Cliff Racer has a bigger damage boost only at a distance past 15m.
• The Stamina morph of the Bear ultimate deals a good amount of increased damage on all of its attacks over the Magicka morph. whereas the Magicka morph can respawn once per minute without recasting.

The Netch is more complicated:
• Bull Netch returns Stamina and applies both Major Sorcery and Brutality to the caster. Blue Netch returns Magicka but only gives Major Sorcery, and is topped off by a purge of 1 effect.

This is a very small purge...... Temps purge 5 effects. Many skills apply 3-4 negative effects at once when they hit you, and a Warden cannot choose which to purge. They have cast other skills to survive as well.

Also restoring Stamina is much stronger than returning Magicka. Only a Magicka Warden PvE DPS must take the Magicka morph. In PvP, a Magicka Warden can take the Stamina morph because it'd save them a lot of trouble with dodging/CC breaks which is why the "Stam" morph still gives Major Sorcery. You'll have to trade reliable Stam (better) for a tiny bit more Magicka recovery and the option to purge 1 measly effect if you don't get killed/5 more effects applied to you every time you cast this purge.

In general I'd say things are well balanced. Stamina Warden is strong and has plenty of options, including the first Stamina-based class healing skill thanks to Soothing Spores!

If you want to make an arguement about buffing Stamina Warden, then maybe some sort of slight buff to the caster from using Cutting Dive could be asked for. Maybe. I think everything is fine though. Stamina Wardens will be everywhere next patch and not because they need their skills buffed

It doesn't even need to be something amazing.

Something like minor fracture on dive
Or a small heal when using the stam betty (stam betty is more useful for a magicka warden)

Just not completely leave it out, thats just laziness.

Vaoh · May 2017

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Well, when we look how Stamina Wardens are performing they are not even slightly lackluster in any content.

• Subterranean Assault applies to enemies Major armor/spell debuffs. It serves as a sort of AoE stamina curse/debuff. Very strong.
• Cutting Dive (Stam morph) has a slight damage buff over Screaming Cliff Racer (Mag morph). However, Screaming Cliff Racer has a bigger damage boost only at a distance past 15m.
• The Stamina morph of the Bear ultimate deals a good amount of increased damage on all of its attacks over the Magicka morph. whereas the Magicka morph can respawn once per minute without recasting.

The Netch is more complicated:
• Bull Netch returns Stamina and applies both Major Sorcery and Brutality to the caster. Blue Netch returns Magicka but only gives Major Sorcery, and is topped off by a purge of 1 effect.

This is a very small purge...... Temps purge 5 effects. Many skills apply 3-4 negative effects at once when they hit you, and a Warden cannot choose which to purge. They have cast other skills to survive as well.

Also restoring Stamina is much stronger than returning Magicka. Only a Magicka Warden PvE DPS must take the Magicka morph. In PvP, a Magicka Warden can take the Stamina morph because it'd save them a lot of trouble with dodging/CC breaks which is why the "Stam" morph still gives Major Sorcery. You'll have to trade reliable Stam (better) for a tiny bit more Magicka recovery and the option to purge 1 measly effect if you don't get killed/5 more effects applied to you every time you cast this purge.

In general I'd say things are well balanced. Stamina Warden is strong and has plenty of options, including the first Stamina-based class healing skill thanks to Soothing Spores!

If you want to make an arguement about buffing Stamina Warden, then maybe some sort of slight buff to the caster from using Cutting Dive could be asked for. Maybe. I think everything is fine though. Stamina Wardens will be everywhere next patch and not because they need their skills buffed

It doesn't even need to be something amazing.

Something like minor fracture on dive
Or a small heal when using the stam betty (stam betty is more useful for a magicka warden)

Just not completely leave it out, thats just laziness.

There's already a passive though that makes it so whenever a pet (including Netch/Cliff Racer) is desummoned/killed is restores some health to you.

I totally understand why you'd ask for extra effects, and I used to be on the same side agreeing with you, but now that the class is being played Cutting Dive is already strong and Bull Netch is practically a "superior" morph to Blue Betty. Bull Netch gives both Major damage buffs. No need to buff that skill at all.

If a tiny effect was added to Cutting Dive it'd be fine though imo. As long as it doesn't buff the damage on this skill.

TheNuminous1 · May 2017

I just want a stam morph of swarm.

leepalmer95 · May 2017

Stam wardens got nerfed for magicka wardens ...

Vaoh wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Well, when we look how Stamina Wardens are performing they are not even slightly lackluster in any content.

• Subterranean Assault applies to enemies Major armor/spell debuffs. It serves as a sort of AoE stamina curse/debuff. Very strong.
• Cutting Dive (Stam morph) has a slight damage buff over Screaming Cliff Racer (Mag morph). However, Screaming Cliff Racer has a bigger damage boost only at a distance past 15m.
• The Stamina morph of the Bear ultimate deals a good amount of increased damage on all of its attacks over the Magicka morph. whereas the Magicka morph can respawn once per minute without recasting.

The Netch is more complicated:
• Bull Netch returns Stamina and applies both Major Sorcery and Brutality to the caster. Blue Netch returns Magicka but only gives Major Sorcery, and is topped off by a purge of 1 effect.

This is a very small purge...... Temps purge 5 effects. Many skills apply 3-4 negative effects at once when they hit you, and a Warden cannot choose which to purge. They have cast other skills to survive as well.

Also restoring Stamina is much stronger than returning Magicka. Only a Magicka Warden PvE DPS must take the Magicka morph. In PvP, a Magicka Warden can take the Stamina morph because it'd save them a lot of trouble with dodging/CC breaks which is why the "Stam" morph still gives Major Sorcery. You'll have to trade reliable Stam (better) for a tiny bit more Magicka recovery and the option to purge 1 measly effect if you don't get killed/5 more effects applied to you every time you cast this purge.

In general I'd say things are well balanced. Stamina Warden is strong and has plenty of options, including the first Stamina-based class healing skill thanks to Soothing Spores!

If you want to make an arguement about buffing Stamina Warden, then maybe some sort of slight buff to the caster from using Cutting Dive could be asked for. Maybe. I think everything is fine though. Stamina Wardens will be everywhere next patch and not because they need their skills buffed

It doesn't even need to be something amazing.

Something like minor fracture on dive
Or a small heal when using the stam betty (stam betty is more useful for a magicka warden)

Just not completely leave it out, thats just laziness.

There's already a passive though that makes it so whenever a pet (including Netch/Cliff Racer) is desummoned/killed is restores some health to you.

I totally understand why you'd ask for extra effects, and I used to be on the same side agreeing with you, but now that the class is being played Cutting Dive is already strong and Bull Netch is practically a "superior" morph to Blue Betty. Bull Netch gives both Major damage buffs. No need to buff that skill at all.

If a tiny effect was added to Cutting Dive it'd be fine though imo. As long as it doesn't buff the damage on this skill.

Bull netch is more beneficial for magicka wardens than it is for stamina. The both weapon types makes it ideal for magicka wardens who have enough magicka sustain but want more stamina sustain, however the major sorcery is useless for stamina wardens which is strage because i assume this morph is based for stamina warden yet the additional effect doesn't benefit them?

theher0not · May 2017

olsborg wrote: »

Being undodgeable and able to hit ppl from max range with more dmg then surprise atk is "special" enough if you ask me.

that is part of the magicka too. By that logic it shouldn't do anything either

leepalmer95 · May 2017

theher0not wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

Being undodgeable and able to hit ppl from max range with more dmg then surprise atk is "special" enough if you ask me.

that is part of the magicka too. By that logic it shouldn't do anything either

Exactly the magicka morph hits 21% more than the stamina one now because of it actually having an additional effect on its morph + the passive it got at the expense of magicka.