Woah, Hold Up, ZOS... Please Elaborate on Volatile Familiar Nerf

GrumpyDuckling · May 2017

I'm struggling to understand why you plan to nerf Volatile Familiar.

- The skill requires 2 ability slots to use.
- Has a cast time to summon before one can activate the pulse.
- Has 2 second down time between each pulse.
- Has an 8 second wait for CC that isn't guaranteed (enemy must be hit by final pulse).

I know you said Sorcerers are currently too high for trials DPS, but please explain why that targets Volatile Familiar, specifically. A nerf has potential to hurt pet-focused builds outside of trials.

@ZOS_RichLambert
@Wrobel

MarriedWithChildren · May 2017

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

Turelus · May 2017

Removed from the game.

Probably just damage numbers, but could be minor mechanics.

GrumpyDuckling · May 2017

I'm all for Sorcerer nerfs, but nerfing a pet!?

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

Laughing at the poor people who use pet builds, I see.

Aedaryl · May 2017

I'm playing pet sorc since long time in PvP, and I'm afraid of how big the nerf hammer will hit Volatile familiar.

A damage nerf on the volatile familiar is needed, about 10-15%, I hope it's not more.

They nerf it because it's the first damage done in pet sorc DPS.

But yeah, they can't nerf it too much. In anyway, before it was OP, the scamp was doing 55% less damage because of deadric pray bug, and no one used him. So the nerf can't go further than ~ 50%.

Comparing to liquid lightning, it's does about 1k more dps.

But you need :

1 Set needed
2 slot for it
1 skill for make it work
Manage the pet
protect the pet
recast it with a deadly long cast time (extremely hard to do in PvP).

If ZoS nerf VF by 15% for PvE, but make pets 1s cast time for PvP, it would be a great balance.

MehrunesFlagon · May 2017

They should leave it as is.

Darlgon · May 2017

Elaboration will commence....

IN THE PATCH NOTES ON THE 22nd for UPDATE 14. It wont appear on the PTS, so its probably not finalized.

olsborg · May 2017

Dmg could get nerfed, thats fine, but they should make it so if you get hit by 3 pulses, the 3rd will stun you, not just the last one, just like the wardens ultimate.

Darlgon · May 2017

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm all for Sorcerer nerfs, but nerfing a pet!?

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

Laughing at the poor people who use pet builds, I see.

Well. he IS Al Bundy...

Waffennacht · May 2017

Back when I posted my trinimac build I hypothesised that Familiar being boosted by Prey (the AoE) would be OP.

Years later, I was right.

SleepyTroll · May 2017

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm all for Sorcerer nerfs, but nerfing a pet!?

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

Laughing at the poor people who use pet builds, I see.

Poor people who run pet builds? Lol you mean people who use bis skills? People who watch Netflix while farming vma? Pve that pet is broken strong.

GrumpyDuckling · May 2017

SleepyTroll wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm all for Sorcerer nerfs, but nerfing a pet!?

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

Laughing at the poor people who use pet builds, I see.

Poor people who run pet builds? Lol you mean people who use bis skills? People who watch Netflix while farming vma? Pve that pet is broken strong.

Pets... BIS? Haha never thought I'd ever see anyone say that.

Tremors · May 2017

The dmg does need a nerf, but the brain of the pet needs a buff. Honestly if it simply survived 1 shot mechanics based on the casters survivability and died to regular dmg the same as players, but had slightly less dps. This thing would be where it's supposed to be.

Instead it stays dumb as *** and puts out insane dmg lol.

Mojmir · May 2017

that what happens when you post videos of solo'ing vet content. LOL

Juhasow · May 2017

Well maybe because Volatile Familiar is able to do over 8,5k DPS on target skeleton itself if You do rotation perfectly.
However on Morrowind PTS damage of Familiar dropped down to ~5-6k DPS due to CP changes so I am not sure is huge dmg nerf is needed but we need to remember that familiar still is mobile AoE with stun so slight dmg lowering could be helpfull.

Waffennacht · May 2017

Mojmir wrote: »

that what happens when you post videos of solo'ing vet content. LOL

Fortunately the familiar's damage has never been necessary to solo the content, and the fact he rarely holds aggro has taught me the familiar actually had very little to do with soloing content.

As far as my experience goes, I've soloed v dungeons on: NB, Sorc, and Templar - all magicka - I haven't really tried on Stam though

Mojmir · May 2017

Waffennacht wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

that what happens when you post videos of solo'ing vet content. LOL

Fortunately the familiar's damage has never been necessary to solo the content, and the fact he rarely holds aggro has taught me the familiar actually had very little to do with soloing content.

As far as my experience goes, I've soloed v dungeons on: NB, Sorc, and Templar - all magicka - I haven't really tried on Stam though

im just saying, the videos didnt help

acw37162 · May 2017

The Nerf Hammer of Dreams is out and has destination Oblivion for the Daderic Scamp.

I am so on board with the scamp having its DPS reduced it's not even funny.

PSA don't buy Necro less you want it for your Warden.

Minalan · May 2017

acw37162 wrote: »

The Nerf Hammer of Dreams is out and has destination Oblivion for the Daderic Scamp.

I am so on board with the scamp having its DPS reduced it's not even funny.

PSA don't buy Necro less you want it for your Warden.

Or for my new magblade!

dpencil1 · May 2017

@ZOS_BrianWheeler
I agree with the OP. The operational cost of Familiar is so high compared to skills like Liquid Lightning or Blockade of Elements. The fact that the Sorcerer pets take 2 skill slots each is a HUGE sacrifice. The Familiar's base damage is totally negligable, and to get the best use out of him you need to keep Daedric Prey up constantly. Not to mention he does stupid things like standing in red and dying to other boss mechanics. Yes, he does follow enemies, so is harder to avoid than ground based dots, but he is slow and CCable.

I would recommend looking at Daedric Prey's 55% buff to pets, if anything. Reduce it to 40 or 45% if need be.

Personally, I feel that if he's got to take up 2 skill slots, he should be as potent as 2 skills.

ViciousBunnii · May 2017

dpencil1 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Personally, I feel that if he's got to take up 2 skill slots, he should be as potent as 2 skills.

Exactly what I was thinking.

Gilvoth · May 2017

this nerf to sorcerer pet has nothing to do with what people are asking for about sorcerers.
very rarely do i see people with pets in pvp, it is sometimes seen but not often, and when you Do see that volatile familiar, the damage coming from the pet is not the problem. the problem is from the sorcerers shields and the massive amount of damage they produce with lightning and killing people with 2 hits of magicka damage. [pets not an issue]
when your son asks for food, do you give him a stone ?

ADarklore · May 2017

I would prefer them to nerf Daedric Prey instead of Familiar, however, running with DP, VF and Necropotence makes for a very potent combination... and I'm sure they are taking the Necro set into consideration when doing the upcoming nerf. Of course since many players will be running Necro with Warden, they didn't want to nerf the set.

Ankael07 · May 2017

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

And the endless cycle of nerfs and laughter continues. The forum community is degenerating.

Gilvoth · May 2017

Ankael07 wrote: »

MarriedWithChildren wrote: »

Hahahahahhaahhahahahaha

And the endless cycle of nerfs and laughter continues. The forum community is degenerating.

we continue to try our best. and be patient.
we have been trying for a few years to be nice and be polite, we have been very patient and done our best to hold back our anger for a very long time.
and we will continue to be patient and do our best to speak kindly and make our requests.

Juhasow · May 2017

kissesandbunnies wrote: »

dpencil1 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Personally, I feel that if he's got to take up 2 skill slots, he should be as potent as 2 skills.

Exactly what I was thinking.

Hmm so if bound aegis takes 2 slots it should give 16% magicka because inner light takes 1 slot ?

dpencil1 · May 2017

Juhasow wrote: »

kissesandbunnies wrote: »

dpencil1 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Personally, I feel that if he's got to take up 2 skill slots, he should be as potent as 2 skills.

Exactly what I was thinking.

Hmm so if bound aegis takes 2 slots it should give 16% magicka because inner light takes 1 slot ?

@Juhasow No. It has no business being a double slotted skill in the first place. I think NBs get something similar to it as a passive. If anything, they should rework it as a long duration buff that can be kept on one bar. Maybe let the Bound Armor break into shards that deal a burst of aoe damage at the end, something like 30 seconds, similar to Power Surge. Refreshing the skill before it expires would keep you from dropping 8% magicka at the end, but would prevent the aoe. That would be way more interesting than the boring, inactive, space-hogging skill it is now.

Magdalina · May 2017

Uhhh....OP, it doesn't seem you're aware of recent (relatively) meta changes. Pet sorcs is literally highest dps in the game right now, outperforming anything else by a fair margin. I don't even use Necro nor Prey on mine yet my Familiar is like 3rd highest damage source for me. I don't remember the exact number, and I'm far from best, but it's op alright. Some of the changes they made also made pets far more resilient(which was needed), admittedly I don't do trials(but from what I've seen people use pets on Rakhat alright) but familiar dies significantly less than in rom/cos than players normally do

The nerf was long needed. I do hope they don't overdo it and nerf pets back into uselessness but frankly it's been getting pretty ridiculous.

Asmael · May 2017

One of the few reasons they're getting nerfed I guess:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7046Snz0IU

EDIT: Related parse: imgur.com/a/C0H58

Biro123 · May 2017

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

this nerf to sorcerer pet has nothing to do with what people are asking for about sorcerers.
very rarely do i see people with pets in pvp, it is sometimes seen but not often, and when you Do see that volatile familiar, the damage coming from the pet is not the problem. the problem is from the sorcerers shields and the massive amount of damage they produce with lightning and killing people with 2 hits of magicka damage. [pets not an issue]
when your son asks for food, do you give him a stone ?

That's a very one-sided view.
Yes people have been complaining about shields in PVP - but that has already been addressed by both CP and the Pirate Skeleton nerf.

But have you not seen all the damage complaints about why sorc is top-DPS for PVE? Its largely this pet that puts them so far ahead. Its the right thing to target imho..
I mean I'm not much of a pve-er - but have solo'd a bunch of vet dungeons with my volatile familiar. Being able to hit one button to do 3 strong aoe damage pulses - while doing the rest of your rotation while the pet is also doing these hits is pretty strong.

They recently buffed pets. I can't see the nerf making them weaker than they were before that buff - it will be somewhere inbetween.. It would be nice if they stopped being a toggle to compensate - but people have been asking for that for years, so I doubt very much it will happen.

GrumpyDuckling · May 2017

Magdalina wrote: »

Uhhh....OP, it doesn't seem you're aware of recent (relatively) meta changes. Pet sorcs is literally highest dps in the game right now, outperforming anything else by a fair margin. I don't even use Necro nor Prey on mine yet my Familiar is like 3rd highest damage source for me. I don't remember the exact number, and I'm far from best, but it's op alright. Some of the changes they made also made pets far more resilient(which was needed), admittedly I don't do trials(but from what I've seen people use pets on Rakhat alright) but familiar dies significantly less than in rom/cos than players normally do

The nerf was long needed. I do hope they don't overdo it and nerf pets back into uselessness but frankly it's been getting pretty ridiculous.

If Familiar is your "3rd highest damage source," then why should it be nerfed when it has these restrictions?

- takes up 2 skill slots
- cast time
- takes 2 button presses to activate
- needs to be kept alive

Maybe, just maybe I could get behind discussion about lowering Daedric Prey, but it just doesn't make sense to nerf Familiar if it's "3rd highest damage source" under the restrictions listed above.