So am I the only extremely happy person with the patch changes?

PS4_ZeColmeia · April 2017

So consider this, we regularly complain about: (1) HA balance, (2) Class balance, (3) PvP balancing vs PvE balancing, and (4) no unique builds.

What if this is due to 1 issue: there are currently no negatives for going max damage. We discuss HA balance because you gain resources like those in less vulnerable armor, class balance around dps maxes only which gives large resource pools to off set no recovery, anti zerg approaches hurt max damage in PvE upsetting performance, and hybrids can't be made because max damage > all and health chants for nothing.

all end game content is group based (other players needed) outside of achievement hunting. In these scenarios, the race to the max damage, especially when groups are spec'ed to be optimized. Essentially you had to sacrifice nothing to get max damage because armor + weapon + ratios of classes = sustain was no issue.

The change of making sustain more character than group focused shifts the balancing around solo character builds. By doing so, max damage only makes you ineffective. This shifts the focus away from max damage specs, to balancing starts to survive and sustain. Factor this with cp and stats now giving most of the punch way earlier, and it's evident that max stat builds will be so marginally better than a balanced stat in terms of damage that you'll be gimped because you have no health and you have no sustain.

Every balance issue we discuss daily is solved by removing the focus away from max damage and towards individual sustain. Honestly, it's small change in terms of its affect. I do think mob health in the trials may need adjustment, but aside from that this changes the way we play the game but for the better.

Prof_Bawbag · April 2017

I don't mind the changes in a sense. I mean, I don't like them, but at the same time I don't plan on making a huge song and dance about leaving. After all, there are more than enough games out there to be getting on with. How ZoS want to evolve the game is entirely up to them and with all changes, there's always a small section of players who get left behind. Happens with every game. However, most of us don't cause a massive commotion like they themselves are bigger than the game they are about to shelf.

Some bang on like putting time into a game and helping others is akin to going abroad to help out during an epidemic in a 3rd world country or to offer their expertise during a large natural disaster. Nah, it's a game. They should get over themselves.

NeillMcAttack · April 2017

I'm quite impressed with ZOS's decisions. It takes quite a pair of balls to make some what radical changes like we are seeing in the patch notes. They deserve commendation's for choosing a path and going through with it. Of course they haven't gone through with them yet, and I can only hope all the childish whining doesn't sway thier opinion much, or at all.

Kudos ZOS, onward and upward.....

OrphanHelgen · April 2017

I don't agree with all, but still better then homestead.

Mashille · April 2017

I'm actually gonna wait for the patch to hit after all the tweaks have been made rather than jumping straight off the ESO boat just because I see a few of boards bend.

Beesting · April 2017

@PS4_ZeColmeia
i guess you never did a veteran trial, maybe you can do that this weekend and then think about the patch notes and how they will affect your gameplay.

Not everyone runs around aimlessly in cyro zerging or fighting zergs...

Nelson_Rebel · April 2017

No but you are part of a small minority who like it

kylewwefan · April 2017

Nope. I'm looking forward to it! And trying out a warden. And eso plus giving me double bank space. I'm looking forward to a lot of these new changes.

Argawarga · April 2017

Nope. I'm pumped.

Vipstaakki · April 2017

Nope. I'm very pleased with the latest patch!

WalksonGraves · April 2017

So they fixed sorcs being OP by nerfing everything else and called that "balance" and you are happy?

Balamoor · April 2017

I have a wait and see approach, most everyone in my guild and who I have talked to is in favor of the changes....so I think the minority may actually be the Hysteria mongers on youtube and the forums.

Time will tell.

Araviel2 · April 2017

all this came as no surprise to me, i knew it all along that ZOS would have to bring in some heavy nerfs in order for battlegrounds to work. questions is just will it be enough or will we still see unkillable tanktrains in BG and will the Warden overperform?

Pve nerfs i don't care that much about, since we did trials just fine before the champion points system was introduced i don't think the nerfs will be much of an issue.
but if i am wrong about that and it would it be proven to be impossible hard now then its something that is easily adjusted by just tweaking dmg output/HP/resitances to mobs/bosses just like ZOS has done in the past.

Eshelmen · April 2017

Communism even looks good on paper. And we all know how that plays in real life.
I suspect these changes are for the better.
Minimizing the elitist three button click combo to end a zerg while running around a tree for ten minutes... This is what I'm most excited about.

Far too many players are over powered in pvp. It's beyond ridiculous. This will make it harder for players to reach 50k Magicka, while having insane amounts of damage, virtually unlimited regen, can out heal even healers and out shield even tanks... It's ridiculous.

I'm glad they're catering this patch to the rest of us. I'm quite tired of having to worry about min maxing in cyrodiil. It's exhausting.

I'm all for this patch.

acw37162 · April 2017

Go play PC test for about four hours.

Sometime between hour two and hour four you will go you know this really is not fun.

You think you will enjoy it, cool. You might even if you haven't been on test.

So far at four hours of Mag DK testing it's not fun at all.

kargen27 · April 2017

There are negatives for going max damage. Those are offset now by having a support character in the group. Something like a healer that can work group resource management into their rotation. The really good groups in PvP have a couple of players that devote all their efforts into group sustain. Others provide buffs before and during a fight. Big hitters often count on others to keep a shield up in PvP and PvE. Many tank builds are based on someone in the group managing resources for them.

THe changes might not have a big impact on solo play??? but as they are proposed now it is going to wreck how groups are able to function.

Might not be how it was meant but the OP comes off along the lines of I'm glad Baskin-Robbins only sells vanilla now 32 flavors was just to much.

And personally I think shifting the focus from group to solo in an MMO with most the end game content being group heavy is a mistake.

The way it is now when doing a dungeon with my guild if I am healing I ask the tank if he is magicka or stam based. I also ask the DPS if they have self heals or shields in their rotation and will they need resources. I then decide on my bar set-up.

With the changes my bar set-up isn't going to matter. Instead of a group we will have 4 or 12 individuals running.

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2017

If it reduces constant 0 to 100 healing, perma rooting and the over-the-top damage output in PvP I'm happy with all these changes.

Balamoor · April 2017

[snip]

I think it's attitudes like this that makes ZoS only have a handful of Trials, throwing one as bone in the expansion was smart, I can't imagine how intolerable the community would be if this game ever became Raid Centric.

And honestly if that hysterical YouTube hero and a few elitist with nasty attitudes leave what have we as a community or Zenimax as developers actually lost?

A lot of forum drama?
People in game who are rude and get off on playing mean girl?
Watching someone on YouTube have melt down while food is literally flying from his mouth?

You can count on one hand the number of Raids, hell ZoS refuses to even use the word. With One Tamriel folks are using pick a pug less and less and actually finding like minded players. Iv'e done Trials in this game and it's by far not the best content and usually the company (If I'm not running it with my guild) is by far the worst.

So you can scoff at folks who don't want to group with ranting sociopaths, or play whack a mole on the gear hamster wheel but those people far outnumber the Elitist vocal minority and ZoS understands that their money comes from the many not the few.

[Edit for removed quote]

Tholian1 · April 2017

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

So consider this, we regularly complain about: (1) HA balance, (2) Class balance, (3) PvP balancing vs PvE balancing, and (4) no unique builds.

What if this is due to 1 issue: there are currently no negatives for going max damage. We discuss HA balance because you gain resources like those in less vulnerable armor, class balance around dps maxes only which gives large resource pools to off set no recovery, anti zerg approaches hurt max damage in PvE upsetting performance, and hybrids can't be made because max damage > all and health chants for nothing.

all end game content is group based (other players needed) outside of achievement hunting. In these scenarios, the race to the max damage, especially when groups are spec'ed to be optimized. Essentially you had to sacrifice nothing to get max damage because armor + weapon + ratios of classes = sustain was no issue.

The change of making sustain more character than group focused shifts the balancing around solo character builds. By doing so, max damage only makes you ineffective. This shifts the focus away from max damage specs, to balancing starts to survive and sustain. Factor this with cp and stats now giving most of the punch way earlier, and it's evident that max stat builds will be so marginally better than a balanced stat in terms of damage that you'll be gimped because you have no health and you have no sustain.

Every balance issue we discuss daily is solved by removing the focus away from max damage and towards individual sustain. Honestly, it's small change in terms of its affect. I do think mob health in the trials may need adjustment, but aside from that this changes the way we play the game but for the better.

You might want to go and read what is being shared by players testing these changes over on the PTS forum.

agegarton · April 2017

I'm pretty sure the world will continue to rotate on its axis - yep, even if I dare venture into Hel Ra or some other Trial.

The ONLY thing I'm really unhappy about is that I will have to buy a slot, as well as the game, if I want to play a Warden in Morrowind. As a subscriber I got over needing to buy the game update, but a slot too? That's a bit rubbish.

coop500 · April 2017

I am not happy with the patch, but the game will not end over it. I am bummed I will have to change how I heal as my Templar or just use my Sorc healer khajiit hybrid. But we will survive.

I am more annoyed at all the special snowflakes who are all like "Look at me I am not mad, this makes me better then everyone else!"

Argawarga · April 2017

coop500 wrote: »

I am more annoyed at all the special snowflakes who are all like "Look at me I am not mad, this makes me better then everyone else!"

The patch will be awesome. You sound triggered. You need a safe space to ride out this flurry of scary snowflakes?

Tornaad · April 2017

People who are upset will always speak louder and more often than those who are happy.

I'm not excited about the changes but I did think they were interesting and I was looking forward to seeing how things change because of the patch.

I'm also interested in seeing if they back out of the patch and go a different way. In some ways I hope they don't in others I hope they do.

jedtb16_ESO · April 2017

change is in the air.

i am very happy about it....

Ep1kMalware · April 2017

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

So consider this, we regularly complain about: (1) HA balance, (2) Class balance, (3) PvP balancing vs PvE balancing, and (4) no unique builds.

What if this is due to 1 issue: there are currently no negatives for going max damage. We discuss HA balance because you gain resources like those in less vulnerable armor, class balance around dps maxes only which gives large resource pools to off set no recovery, anti zerg approaches hurt max damage in PvE upsetting performance, and hybrids can't be made because max damage > all and health chants for nothing.

all end game content is group based (other players needed) outside of achievement hunting. In these scenarios, the race to the max damage, especially when groups are spec'ed to be optimized. Essentially you had to sacrifice nothing to get max damage because armor + weapon + ratios of classes = sustain was no issue.

The change of making sustain more character than group focused shifts the balancing around solo character builds. By doing so, max damage only makes you ineffective. This shifts the focus away from max damage specs, to balancing starts to survive and sustain. Factor this with cp and stats now giving most of the punch way earlier, and it's evident that max stat builds will be so marginally better than a balanced stat in terms of damage that you'll be gimped because you have no health and you have no sustain.

Every balance issue we discuss daily is solved by removing the focus away from max damage and towards individual sustain. Honestly, it's small change in terms of its affect. I do think mob health in the trials may need adjustment, but aside from that this changes the way we play the game but for the better.

Look, i've done everything in this game pve wise. I'll inform you.

Eso is centered around dps. It's not our fault, zos forcdd it. Take vmol. They've been doing good latelt aboit making mechanica important by using mechanics that kill your group if ignored. Skipping mechanics is not a big deal. It's what makes uber content 'uber hard'. Take for instance wgt. You don;t take pinion, you kill somebody. Take lord warden. Fall in a portal? Somebody else pays for your mistake.

Then take vmol. You know whar kills ppl in vet maw? The hardest content in all of eso? You know what makes it so hard? Other players. My first solid go at vmaw out raid leader told us that bosses don't kill anyone in vmol. Players kill you. It was a long ass lecture but half the group was #1 leaderboards. Super good group. Amazing what these folks had fornpatience. Turns out the man was right. Every god damn death in that trial was caused by other players. Even ruins/shadow. Shadow is considered harder because of 2 main bosses where your groupmates kil you. Bottom line, forced group play mechanics force you to not skip mechanics. People that burn these dungeons don't skip mechanics, they are just very in tune with them.

What makes it harder is there are timers for these bosses. I think 2nd boss vmol is likw 60m hp. Is that right? You have less than 5 minutes to kill it. It. Is. A. Big. Deal.

This content exposes these constant complainers for how worthless they really are to the community. They think they're god's gift to the internet because they can walk into a dungeon, or trial, whipe an experiences group, refuse to listen, rage out at helpful advicd and decide to take instruction as some kind of personal attack, and come here demanding changes.

^zos doesn't have a spine, these monstrous morons are ruining the game because they're being catered to. If content was designed more intelligetly, players will adapt. This to me is zos saying '*** you' to the crybabies and giving up, while forcing everyone else to pay tribute to a cash only solution to our problems.

I'm not maf at the nerfs. Actually I am. But they added too much insult to injury here.

PS4_ZeColmeia · April 2017

Beesting wrote: »

@PS4_ZeColmeia
i guess you never did a veteran trial, maybe you can do that this weekend and then think about the patch notes and how they will affect your gameplay.

Not everyone runs around aimlessly in cyro zerging or fighting zergs...

I have not run a vet trial in awhile, I've been working on my crafting alts. I've played a mageblade since PS4 launch as my only character until about 3 months ago, but again all my alts are for crafting. I have 314 sp, most achievements and titles all on my mageblade.

My point I ended with us I think end game PvE will likely need to town down boss health, unless zos wants us to raid like it's wow and I hope that is not the intention.

My other thought is since most will spread stats and cp, health will matter and so keeping the group alive will be easier. I don't think trials will be harder, it will be excessively longer without HP adjustment to mobs, but but harder. Pick ups will be harder without group sets being right, but organized will not see a problem.

Not seeing your concern completely

PS4_ZeColmeia · April 2017

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

So consider this, we regularly complain about: (1) HA balance, (2) Class balance, (3) PvP balancing vs PvE balancing, and (4) no unique builds.

What if this is due to 1 issue: there are currently no negatives for going max damage. We discuss HA balance because you gain resources like those in less vulnerable armor, class balance around dps maxes only which gives large resource pools to off set no recovery, anti zerg approaches hurt max damage in PvE upsetting performance, and hybrids can't be made because max damage > all and health chants for nothing.

all end game content is group based (other players needed) outside of achievement hunting. In these scenarios, the race to the max damage, especially when groups are spec'ed to be optimized. Essentially you had to sacrifice nothing to get max damage because armor + weapon + ratios of classes = sustain was no issue.

The change of making sustain more character than group focused shifts the balancing around solo character builds. By doing so, max damage only makes you ineffective. This shifts the focus away from max damage specs, to balancing starts to survive and sustain. Factor this with cp and stats now giving most of the punch way earlier, and it's evident that max stat builds will be so marginally better than a balanced stat in terms of damage that you'll be gimped because you have no health and you have no sustain.

Every balance issue we discuss daily is solved by removing the focus away from max damage and towards individual sustain. Honestly, it's small change in terms of its affect. I do think mob health in the trials may need adjustment, but aside from that this changes the way we play the game but for the better.

Look, i've done everything in this game pve wise. I'll inform you.

Eso is centered around dps. It's not our fault, zos forcdd it. Take vmol. They've been doing good latelt aboit making mechanica important by using mechanics that kill your group if ignored. Skipping mechanics is not a big deal. It's what makes uber content 'uber hard'. Take for instance wgt. You don;t take pinion, you kill somebody. Take lord warden. Fall in a portal? Somebody else pays for your mistake.

Then take vmol. You know whar kills ppl in vet maw? The hardest content in all of eso? You know what makes it so hard? Other players. My first solid go at vmaw out raid leader told us that bosses don't kill anyone in vmol. Players kill you. It was a long ass lecture but half the group was #1 leaderboards. Super good group. Amazing what these folks had fornpatience. Turns out the man was right. Every god damn death in that trial was caused by other players. Even ruins/shadow. Shadow is considered harder because of 2 main bosses where your groupmates kil you. Bottom line, forced group play mechanics force you to not skip mechanics. People that burn these dungeons don't skip mechanics, they are just very in tune with them.

What makes it harder is there are timers for these bosses. I think 2nd boss vmol is likw 60m hp. Is that right? You have less than 5 minutes to kill it. It. Is. A. Big. Deal.

This content exposes these constant complainers for how worthless they really are to the community. They think they're god's gift to the internet because they can walk into a dungeon, or trial, whipe an experiences group, refuse to listen, rage out at helpful advicd and decide to take instruction as some kind of personal attack, and come here demanding changes.

^zos doesn't have a spine, these monstrous morons are ruining the game because they're being catered to. If content was designed more intelligetly, players will adapt. This to me is zos saying '*** you' to the crybabies and giving up, while forcing everyone else to pay tribute to a cash only solution to our problems.

I'm not maf at the nerfs. Actually I am. But they added too much insult to injury here.

I don't think it's that bad, if you consider everyone will have to do it. The new meta will be with lower damage. If the new max damage with reasonable sustain is 30k and you do 30k does it matter other than the old max was 55k and you used to do 55k? The nerf is universal.

Your issue might be that a cp 100 will do 28k. I would counter that now leader boards will depend more on rotation, ultimate, gear, sustain, and cp. Whereas now rotation and sustain are marginal and an afterthought, respectively.

Sets that return resources now are valuable to max damage builds instead of damage sets, regen monkeys, will want current meta, hybrids will exist by utilizing 2 resources instead of 1. Health will be invested in.

Other than sadness over the numbers you currently put up, understandable, there is a greater balance and diversity of game play which doesn't currently exist. I think that's better.

Ep1kMalware · April 2017

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

PS4_ZeColmeia wrote: »

So consider this, we regularly complain about: (1) HA balance, (2) Class balance, (3) PvP balancing vs PvE balancing, and (4) no unique builds.

What if this is due to 1 issue: there are currently no negatives for going max damage. We discuss HA balance because you gain resources like those in less vulnerable armor, class balance around dps maxes only which gives large resource pools to off set no recovery, anti zerg approaches hurt max damage in PvE upsetting performance, and hybrids can't be made because max damage > all and health chants for nothing.

all end game content is group based (other players needed) outside of achievement hunting. In these scenarios, the race to the max damage, especially when groups are spec'ed to be optimized. Essentially you had to sacrifice nothing to get max damage because armor + weapon + ratios of classes = sustain was no issue.

The change of making sustain more character than group focused shifts the balancing around solo character builds. By doing so, max damage only makes you ineffective. This shifts the focus away from max damage specs, to balancing starts to survive and sustain. Factor this with cp and stats now giving most of the punch way earlier, and it's evident that max stat builds will be so marginally better than a balanced stat in terms of damage that you'll be gimped because you have no health and you have no sustain.

Every balance issue we discuss daily is solved by removing the focus away from max damage and towards individual sustain. Honestly, it's small change in terms of its affect. I do think mob health in the trials may need adjustment, but aside from that this changes the way we play the game but for the better.

Look, i've done everything in this game pve wise. I'll inform you.

Eso is centered around dps. It's not our fault, zos forcdd it. Take vmol. They've been doing good latelt aboit making mechanica important by using mechanics that kill your group if ignored. Skipping mechanics is not a big deal. It's what makes uber content 'uber hard'. Take for instance wgt. You don;t take pinion, you kill somebody. Take lord warden. Fall in a portal? Somebody else pays for your mistake.

Then take vmol. You know whar kills ppl in vet maw? The hardest content in all of eso? You know what makes it so hard? Other players. My first solid go at vmaw out raid leader told us that bosses don't kill anyone in vmol. Players kill you. It was a long ass lecture but half the group was #1 leaderboards. Super good group. Amazing what these folks had fornpatience. Turns out the man was right. Every god damn death in that trial was caused by other players. Even ruins/shadow. Shadow is considered harder because of 2 main bosses where your groupmates kil you. Bottom line, forced group play mechanics force you to not skip mechanics. People that burn these dungeons don't skip mechanics, they are just very in tune with them.

What makes it harder is there are timers for these bosses. I think 2nd boss vmol is likw 60m hp. Is that right? You have less than 5 minutes to kill it. It. Is. A. Big. Deal.

This content exposes these constant complainers for how worthless they really are to the community. They think they're god's gift to the internet because they can walk into a dungeon, or trial, whipe an experiences group, refuse to listen, rage out at helpful advicd and decide to take instruction as some kind of personal attack, and come here demanding changes.

^zos doesn't have a spine, these monstrous morons are ruining the game because they're being catered to. If content was designed more intelligetly, players will adapt. This to me is zos saying '*** you' to the crybabies and giving up, while forcing everyone else to pay tribute to a cash only solution to our problems.

I'm not maf at the nerfs. Actually I am. But they added too much insult to injury here.

I don't think it's that bad, if you consider everyone will have to do it. The new meta will be with lower damage. If the new max damage with reasonable sustain is 30k and you do 30k does it matter other than the old max was 55k and you used to do 55k? The nerf is universal.

Your issue might be that a cp 100 will do 28k. I would counter that now leader boards will depend more on rotation, ultimate, gear, sustain, and cp. Whereas now rotation and sustain are marginal and an afterthought, respectively.

Sets that return resources now are valuable to max damage builds instead of damage sets, regen monkeys, will want current meta, hybrids will exist by utilizing 2 resources instead of 1. Health will be invested in.

Other than sadness over the numbers you currently put up, understandable, there is a greater balance and diversity of game play which doesn't currently exist. I think that's better.

It kind of is a big deal. 33k is what people demand for vmol. So if 30k is the new 50k, there will be alot less people running it. Also mag dps sustain? Fuckkkkk no. Magdps doesn't sustain at all. We get resourdes back from synergies. Have you ever tried to get 33k on a magdk? It's fuckimf hard as ***.

Molydeus · April 2017

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

I'm quite impressed with ZOS's decisions. It takes quite a pair of balls to make some what radical changes like we are seeing in the patch notes. They deserve commendation's for choosing a path and going through with it. Of course they haven't gone through with them yet, and I can only hope all the childish whining doesn't sway thier opinion much, or at all.

Kudos ZOS, onward and upward.....

How much kudos will you give ZOS when the game is dead in two years?

zyk · April 2017

Most of the new changes are awesome. A lot of refinement is required, but so far it is a step in the right direction. Sustain and resource management have become far too easy.

akl77 · April 2017

I'm neutral, and haven't we already got used to the constant nerfs in the game.
It's how it is, learn to adapt and enjoy the fun and game.
If no, then play other games.