What If ESO Had Bloodbourne/Souls Combat?

Ch4mpTW · March 2017

https://youtu.be/N_4RgJ7OQ3E

Take a look at the video above. That is the tutorial boss of Dark Souls 3, and I can assure you that they are no joke. If you get too close, you will pay for it severely. Because in Dark Souls, you're not the only one that do combos per say. Lol. Let an enemy grab you, or get too close if you want to. And you'll end-up getting massacred. There's consequences to every move you make just about in that game, thus adding to depth in regards to combat. Why can't ESO be similar in that regards?

Tabbycat · March 2017

Dark Souls is a single player game, is it not?

You think that that kind of twitchy life or death combat would really work in an MMO with lag?

Especially ESO with its weird lag spikes that happen at the most inopportune times.

Also, you have different players with different playstyles and abilities. You don't want an MMO that caters only to the top 1% of players or you will very swiftly have a very empty game.

t3hdubzy · March 2017

Bloodbourne was fun but the difficulty of that game for me was just frustrating mostly. Without having a friend to play with i just couldnt do it.

If there was a happy balance between the 2, sure.

Egonieser · March 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

What if by a chance the combat in this game could somehow have the complexity in say Bloodbourne or Dark Souls for an example? Where certain movements were critical to life and death, and each move you made had to be tactically done. Would you all like it, or dislike it?

In my opinion, it would make things far more smoother. And make combat both more engaging and fluid. To tank for an example, you'd have to masterfully tank bosses properly. Or else face crushing bows that'd leave you horribly wounded or worse. As a damage dealer, you'd have to be light on your feet. And not just spam out skills while weaving and landing the same rotations over and over again. You'd actually have to be cautious of everything occurring, or face a swift death. As for PVP? Omfg. Imagine that type of combat in Cyrodiil. Yum! It'd be absolutely amazing to watch from a distance.

So what do you all think? Would it be good or bad?

Edit: For those curious, playing Bloodbourne again made me start thinking about how much there is lacking to ESO's combat system. And I was just imaging how awesome (in my opinion) things would be, if it adapted a system from the Bloodbourne or Souls games. And got rid of the mindless button combo memorization that we do so regularly here on ESO.

The game wouldn't work with such combat system when you have mobs sometimes in packs of 6 or more quite regularly.
Dark Souls/BB work on facing a single enemy at the time but at an increased difficulty not against swarms of mobs all the time - such combat would make it ever so frustrating to play even for seasoned players. The entire game would have to be revamped, physics added to the game, mobs and their mechanics remade - everything from the ground up, frankly. And we all know that will never happen.

Not to mention majority of players wouldn't play it in the first place as both DS/BB are niche games, quite far from the mainstream.

Ch4mpTW · March 2017

Egonieser wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

What if by a chance the combat in this game could somehow have the complexity in say Bloodbourne or Dark Souls for an example? Where certain movements were critical to life and death, and each move you made had to be tactically done. Would you all like it, or dislike it?

In my opinion, it would make things far more smoother. And make combat both more engaging and fluid. To tank for an example, you'd have to masterfully tank bosses properly. Or else face crushing bows that'd leave you horribly wounded or worse. As a damage dealer, you'd have to be light on your feet. And not just spam out skills while weaving and landing the same rotations over and over again. You'd actually have to be cautious of everything occurring, or face a swift death. As for PVP? Omfg. Imagine that type of combat in Cyrodiil. Yum! It'd be absolutely amazing to watch from a distance.

So what do you all think? Would it be good or bad?

Edit: For those curious, playing Bloodbourne again made me start thinking about how much there is lacking to ESO's combat system. And I was just imaging how awesome (in my opinion) things would be, if it adapted a system from the Bloodbourne or Souls games. And got rid of the mindless button combo memorization that we do so regularly here on ESO.

The game wouldn't work with such combat system when you have mobs sometimes in packs of 6 or more quite regularly.
Dark Souls/BB work on facing a single enemy at the time but at an increased difficulty not against swarms of mobs all the time - such combat would make it ever so frustrating to play even for seasoned players. The entire game would have to be revamped, physics added to the game, mobs and their mechanics remade - everything from the ground up, frankly. And we all know that will never happen.

Not to mention majority of players wouldn't play it in the first place as both DS/BB are niche games, quite far from the mainstream.

Hm... Very valid points that I previously didn't consider. Very well then. It's just that I really would like some combat depth in ESO, more so than linking rotations and spamming certain skills. I mean sure, every game has spammables. But, ESO I feel could be so much more if ZOS tried.

LadyLavina · March 2017

I have a feeling there would be 10x as many rage filled & irrational forum threads

Cpt_Teemo · March 2017

We can always make an NGE and let everyone play Jedi's, oh wait woops.

wolfdoggie_ESO · March 2017

Guess it'd be better than just having someone point at you and you explode like it is currently. There's a lot of cheap poorly telegraphed things in this game to the point where Dark Souls is far simpler.

Would I also get to play naked so I can evade everything easier?

idk · March 2017

Each game has it's own challenges in the premier content which is vMoL at this time for ESO. Movement and area awareness is critical or one can kill much of the raid.

I do not think that needs to be made more challenging that it is already.

Anti_Virus · March 2017

I would love it so much this would be great especially for stam builds, atm Weapon skill lines sucks in terms of damage for the most part.

Spamming upper cut/ Snipe/ Flurry is boring as hell.

Sibenice · March 2017

I already struggle with the game randomly deciding to drop me from 60+ fps to 10 at the most random of times and having to sometimes hit my buttons multiple times for them to actually go off. You throw in a twitchy, challenging, Dark Souls-esque combat system into these servers and you'll just have people leaving in droves.

It's a fun system and it works in a single player game so well. But in an MMO that's well known for its laggy servers all it would do is cause frustration.

Arthmoor · March 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

What if by a chance the combat in this game could somehow have the complexity in say Bloodbourne or Dark Souls for an example?

Then I would never have bought the game because all the videos I've seen of people playing those games would be enough to infuriate me.

Ch4mpTW · March 2017

Arthmoor wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

What if by a chance the combat in this game could somehow have the complexity in say Bloodbourne or Dark Souls for an example?

Then I would never have bought the game because all the videos I've seen of people playing those games would be enough to infuriate me.

@Arthmoor What exactly do you mean? In those games you simply have to plan out your course of attack, and move accordingly. You have to essentially always adjust on the fly, and be very careful about "over-extending" in regards to attacking. You can't just attack constantly in those games, and not be punished for it. Just as you can't constantly block in those games. You have to parry, dodge, block, etc.

Take a glance at the video I posted of me doing the tutorial boss fight for an example. It may look like what I was doing was easy, but I promise you that it wasn't. That's because there are consequences to each and every action I made. Something as simple as being slashed once by the boss, could escalate into being combo'd and insta-gibbed into a death. And so on. And don't get grabbed. Lmao. Bad idea.

dday3six · March 2017

Neither Bloodborne nor any Souls title actually has complex combat. In both, and even with the health regen via melee of Bloodborne, they melt down to passively waiting for an opening to attack and/or exploiting enemy weaknesses. Most comboes are limited in use and outshined by controlled R1-R1-R1 attack chains. Combat is very methodical and reactive, but I don't think that equals complexity. The pacing is different because of the upfront threat enemies pose to those rushing in head long and unprepared, but once level familiarity is achieved much of a level can be skipped by running past it.

I also don't think it would translate well to ESO. Multiplayer trivialize much of the difficulty in a Souls-borne game, and Nioh is the same way. Then PVP though very fun has many balance issues which need to be continually tweaked in order to not only keep builds in check, but also keep the meta transformational.

If anything I wish ZOS went with more of a Black Desert approach to combat. Taking ques from fighting games as well as hack 'n, slash more than Soulsborne, or the typical ability bar-rotation method they chose. I'd much prefer classes to be built as individual and unique, with few or no shared abilities, as well as less active skills and more combo chains with useful combat applications.

Arthmoor · March 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

@Arthmoor What exactly do you mean?

Take a glance at the video I posted of me doing the tutorial boss fight for an example. It may look like what I was doing was easy, but I promise you that it wasn't.

You more or less answered the question

Every video I've seen, someone attempts a boss fight, gets mangled 50 times, and either gets lucky eventually, or ragequits and wonders why the spent the money. I would fall into the ragequit category within a matter of minutes.

So if ESO had this type of combat, I wouldn't have bought it. If they were to implement it in a future patch, I'd delete the game and walk away for good.

This kind of thing might be what some people like, but the larger majority just wants to play and have a fun time. Heck, I don't even run 12 man trials because of the horror stories I hear about how insanely over the top hard they are.