The thing about regular alchemy writs...

QahnaarinDynar · March 2017

Why do I need to have 3 nirnroot or whatever it asks for in my inventory/craftbag to deliver a potion that absolutely does not require its use? Why should I give the game my resources each time? It's been brought up many times before, and really zos it's about time you fixed this. It's a pointless waste of time and loss of resources.

Stopnaggin · March 2017

It's a strange requirement, but has been there forever. Never really bothered me because I keep a supply of all mats.

STEVIL · March 2017

QahnaarinDynar wrote: »

Why do I need to have 3 nirnroot or whatever it asks for in my inventory/craftbag to deliver a potion that absolutely does not require its use? Why should I give the game my resources each time? It's been brought up many times before, and really zos it's about time you fixed this. It's a pointless waste of time and loss of resources.

Well:
Enchanting writs ask for stones in addition to the glyph and each glyph burns three mats on its own.
Equipment writs require far more mats to produce the goods day by day.

With 4-1 ratio for production each alchemy writ consumes 3.75 mats per daily writ and the crates provide an average of 12 plus the gold plus the chances for surveys and if tier-10 plus the chances for master wrtis and alchemy drops them it seems as much or more than the others IMX.

By Boesha, how cheap and easy do you want those to be? The only thing making tier-10 alchemy writs at all something you have to put a trifle of effort into, a smidge of thought into and not an absslute windfall lottery is the nirnroot/tears frequency.

Cut out that entirely or even change it to vary between ingredients and those writs become massively more than self-sustaining with no effort required.

Why not argue for cutting out the need to spend 30+ rubedite when making items for blacksmithing?

Shouldn't all writs be free and easy with no cost or effort involved?

Alchemy writs with the current nirnroot frequency remain one of the best bargains in the game.

QahnaarinDynar · March 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

QahnaarinDynar wrote: »

Why do I need to have 3 nirnroot or whatever it asks for in my inventory/craftbag to deliver a potion that absolutely does not require its use? Why should I give the game my resources each time? It's been brought up many times before, and really zos it's about time you fixed this. It's a pointless waste of time and loss of resources.

Well:
Enchanting writs ask for stones in addition to the glyph and each glyph burns three mats on its own.
Equipment writs require far more mats to produce the goods day by day.

With 4-1 ratio for production each alchemy writ consumes 3.75 mats per daily writ and the crates provide an average of 12 plus the gold plus the chances for surveys and if tier-10 plus the chances for master wrtis and alchemy drops them it seems as much or more than the others IMX.

By Boesha, how cheap and easy do you want those to be? The only thing making tier-10 alchemy writs at all something you have to put a trifle of effort into, a smidge of thought into and not an absslute windfall lottery is the nirnroot/tears frequency.

Cut out that entirely or even change it to vary between ingredients and those writs become massively more than self-sustaining with no effort required.

Why not argue for cutting out the need to spend 30+ rubedite when making items for blacksmithing?

Shouldn't all writs be free and easy with no cost or effort involved?

Alchemy writs with the current nirnroot frequency remain one of the best bargains in the game.

Because unlike rubedite ore, alchemy nodes are not as consistent. Last time I checked my harvest map doesn't record the individual locations of nirnroot/columbine/narmira's rot nodes - all it says is this: "THERE BE SOME KIND OF ALCHEMY THINGEY! GOT GET IT". I could always go check specific locations where they're usually found but the fact is that alchemy mats farming is much more rag tag. Rubedite and ancestor silk nodes are perfectly easy to farm in comparison and I can easily cover all of wrothgar/craglorn in less than 40 mins with a 60 horse plus retreating maneuver. If I want rubedeo leather scraps I just go do that Wayrest I grind for 20 to 40 mins. Assuming that the rubedite and ancestor slik nodes haven't already been nabbed by other players it's still no bigge - just move onto the next node. Plus 160 gear should be expensive to make because at the end of the day end-game players create a big market for the crafters in this game, and fighting for that last 1% alone justifies it. Equipment mats is something I've never been short on, but alchemy ones are.

So no, it's not as easy as you claim. And by the way, some of us don't exactly have 16 hours plus a day to play this game. When I am playing it I prefer to PvP or go on vet PvE content runs instead. I'm a good enough trader to make enough gold to get by for the essential stuff each week, and one of the ways I stockpile my funds is by conserving resources. If I had as much time as some other players did then by all means I wouldn't have even brought this matter up. The fact is also that whenever I do trade I do it the easy way and sell potions, that's easy enough because with enough capital it's easy to get the mats from traders instead of farming them, while breaking-even and making a substantial profit from what was bought.

When the writs ask for my mats and I just happen to be 12 potions short of finishing a stack it's infuriating.

Taleof2Cities · March 2017

If you enjoy PvP or vet PvE then by all means skip the crafting writs ... they're not mandatory.

I'm with @STEVIL, however, in that you need to put forth a little effort to farm (or purchase) nirnroot. Master crafters don't get to end game crafting on easy mode ... same as combat and gear.

Seriously, how hard is it to find three (3) nirnroot for your writ?

STEVIL · March 2017

@QahnaarinDynar

lotsa odd noise in your post.

First, complaints about add-ons should be directed to the add-on makers not to the game designers to change their game cuz your preferred add-ons dont help as much as you would like. Are you aware that some folks play the game without add-ons?

Second, yes, you can farm rubedite and other mats and again alchemy requires about 3.75 mats per writ vs about ten times that for the alchemy does.

third, as someone who runs a good number of writs for each, i can tell you it comes down to choices - your playstyles and preferences for content have huge impacts on what you gather and what you dont. So when you say "Equipment mats is something I've never been short on, but alchemy ones are." thats really just saying "i dont choose to gather the alchemy in sufficient numbers to support my writs."

Fourth, who said anything about 16 hours a day - its about choices and if your time is limited your objectives should adjust to fit that, right?

however let me give you a hint - guild stores. try them.

See thing is something that does flow in this game fairly well is gold. if your playstyle and preferences dont have you generating alchemy supplies enough to maintain your writ habits, then hey do the rubedite, sell that buy alchemy. or shift to whatever other play you enjoy that yields gold. Heck, the gold from like a day of jmy lower tier writs keeps me in nirnroot based on the choices i have made for what i spend my time on.

i dont grind for mats for anything hardly at all, if ever. i gather on the way to/from my various activities and on the occasions where i need stuff, i guild store it. other than that i make the occasional survey runs when they accumulate enough in one spot or the need arises - though that doesn't help with nirnroot trhree-packs it does keep me in most of the other in-demand reagents.

But i also pay attention to my needs vs supply. I cut back on tier-10 alchemy writs because my reach was exceeding my grasp. Instead i re-tasked some of the chars to run tier-1. No demand on nirnroot specifically, same gold yield, same survey yield but no master writ.

I also worked a few more characters to get to shadowy supplier so they can get more daily alchey mats including a good nirnroot ratio.

if your nirnroot demand exceeds you grasp, its because that is how you choose to tun things - not a flaw in the game system.

there is no promise everybody will be able to run every writ all the times at any level without having to put sufficient effort into that.

And one last thing... regarding this...

"When the writs ask for my mats and I just happen to be 12 potions short of finishing a stack it's infuriating."

Your title is about "regular alchemy writs..." and they all ask for one potion... so my suspicion is this 12 short is a reference to you doing master writs and not being able to make the 20 count they require... if so... asking for making master writs easier... they are the crafting end game not entitled easy peasy tamriele-z content.

Again, alchemy writs are amazingly productive - if planned out right - both for gains and time.

STEVIL · March 2017

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

If you enjoy PvP or vet PvE then by all means skip the crafting writs ... they're not mandatory.

I'm with @STEVIL, however, in that you need to put forth a little effort to farm (or purchase) nirnroot. Master crafters don't get to end game crafting on easy mode ... same as combat and gear.

Seriously, how hard is it to find three (3) nirnroot for your writ?

Reminded of the old adage:

Patient: "Doc, it hurts when i do this."
Doc : "Don't do that."

Jayne_Doe · March 2017

QahnaarinDynar wrote: »

Because unlike rubedite ore, alchemy nodes are not as consistent. Last time I checked my harvest map doesn't record the individual locations of nirnroot/columbine/narmira's rot nodes - all it says is this: "THERE BE SOME KIND OF ALCHEMY THINGEY! GOT GET IT". I could always go check specific locations where they're usually found but the fact is that alchemy mats farming is much more rag tag. Rubedite and ancestor silk nodes are perfectly easy to farm in comparison and I can easily cover all of wrothgar/craglorn in less than 40 mins with a 60 horse plus retreating maneuver. If I want rubedeo leather scraps I just go do that Wayrest I grind for 20 to 40 mins. Assuming that the rubedite and ancestor slik nodes haven't already been nabbed by other players it's still no bigge - just move onto the next node. Plus 160 gear should be expensive to make because at the end of the day end-game players create a big market for the crafters in this game, and fighting for that last 1% alone justifies it. Equipment mats is something I've never been short on, but alchemy ones are.

So no, it's not as easy as you claim. And by the way, some of us don't exactly have 16 hours plus a day to play this game. When I am playing it I prefer to PvP or go on vet PvE content runs instead. I'm a good enough trader to make enough gold to get by for the essential stuff each week, and one of the ways I stockpile my funds is by conserving resources. If I had as much time as some other players did then by all means I wouldn't have even brought this matter up. The fact is also that whenever I do trade I do it the easy way and sell potions, that's easy enough because with enough capital it's easy to get the mats from traders instead of farming them, while breaking-even and making a substantial profit from what was bought.

When the writs ask for my mats and I just happen to be 12 potions short of finishing a stack it's infuriating.

While alchemy nodes vary, Nirnroot is ALWAYS found near water. Look at your add-on and see which ones are near water and you'll only be harvesting Water Hyacinth or Nirnroot.

Or, while you're farming the entirety of Wrothgar/Craglorn for your rubedite and silk, check the areas with water, and you should find a few. Seriously, if you're taking the time to cover all of these two zones - well, there's water in those zones and if you're covering ALL of it, you should see a few Nirnroot along the way.

QahnaarinDynar · March 2017

STEVIL wrote: »

@QahnaarinDynar

lotsa odd noise in your post.

First, complaints about add-ons should be directed to the add-on makers not to the game designers to change their game cuz your preferred add-ons dont help as much as you would like. Are you aware that some folks play the game without add-ons?

Second, yes, you can farm rubedite and other mats and again alchemy requires about 3.75 mats per writ vs about ten times that for the alchemy does.

third, as someone who runs a good number of writs for each, i can tell you it comes down to choices - your playstyles and preferences for content have huge impacts on what you gather and what you dont. So when you say "Equipment mats is something I've never been short on, but alchemy ones are." thats really just saying "i dont choose to gather the alchemy in sufficient numbers to support my writs."

Fourth, who said anything about 16 hours a day - its about choices and if your time is limited your objectives should adjust to fit that, right?

however let me give you a hint - guild stores. try them.

See thing is something that does flow in this game fairly well is gold. if your playstyle and preferences dont have you generating alchemy supplies enough to maintain your writ habits, then hey do the rubedite, sell that buy alchemy. or shift to whatever other play you enjoy that yields gold. Heck, the gold from like a day of jmy lower tier writs keeps me in nirnroot based on the choices i have made for what i spend my time on.

i dont grind for mats for anything hardly at all, if ever. i gather on the way to/from my various activities and on the occasions where i need stuff, i guild store it. other than that i make the occasional survey runs when they accumulate enough in one spot or the need arises - though that doesn't help with nirnroot trhree-packs it does keep me in most of the other in-demand reagents.

But i also pay attention to my needs vs supply. I cut back on tier-10 alchemy writs because my reach was exceeding my grasp. Instead i re-tasked some of the chars to run tier-1. No demand on nirnroot specifically, same gold yield, same survey yield but no master writ.

I also worked a few more characters to get to shadowy supplier so they can get more daily alchey mats including a good nirnroot ratio.

if your nirnroot demand exceeds you grasp, its because that is how you choose to tun things - not a flaw in the game system.

there is no promise everybody will be able to run every writ all the times at any level without having to put sufficient effort into that.

And one last thing... regarding this...

"When the writs ask for my mats and I just happen to be 12 potions short of finishing a stack it's infuriating."

Your title is about "regular alchemy writs..." and they all ask for one potion... so my suspicion is this 12 short is a reference to you doing master writs and not being able to make the 20 count they require... if so... asking for making master writs easier... they are the crafting end game not entitled easy peasy tamriele-z content.

Again, alchemy writs are amazingly productive - if planned out right - both for gains and time.

And you've got several other strawmans in there. Try guild stores? If you actually read what I wrote you'll see I said that I buy the mats for crafting potions... from where? Guild stores obviously... not gonna waste tel var on the alchemy satchels. Also I didn't complain about the addon, I simply said that it doesn't do that and because of this it's not as easy to farm alchemy mats, it's not at all because it's a crap addon - it's great. I played this game without addons as well until about 6 months ago, because previously I didn't see a need for them. For your further information I have 3 crafters as well and I basically use those for master writs which I happen to be in love with.

The 16 hours a day comment was obviously an over-exaggeration, but that wasn't hard to detect either. Do I need to be any more obvious? No problem. In future I will point out any exaggerations on my part in full caps.

Next this: "Your title is about "regular alchemy writs..." and they all ask for one potion... so my suspicion is this 12 short is a reference to you doing master writs and not being able to make the 20 count they require... if so... asking for making master writs easier... they are the crafting end game not entitled easy peasy tamriele-z content. "

No, it's got nothing to do with master writs. It's about SELLING stuff in guildstore. I just said in the paragraph before that that I do the easy thing and sell potions, and when I'm 12 potions short of a stack of 100 it infuriates me. That part also wasn't hard to figure out.

You're treating this conversation as if it were a pvp n00b calling for core class ability to be nerfed, so if anything the odd noise is coming from you. At best your replies are merely an overreaction. All I'm saying is that it's wasteful and serves no purpose, to what degree that actually stands at you're welcome to dispute. But so far you've contributed nothing truly productive to the conversation other than trying extra hard to sound like a macho e-psychiatrist. I know it's not a game intended for ez-pz content (thank the gods it's not), and changing a basic thing about the alchemy writs won't make it ez-pz. THAT'S THE POINT. The fact is that this requirement for completing the writ is so trivial that it just begs the question why it's there in the first place. Will your (or my) status as a master crafter be destroyed by such a small change? I don't think so.

When time permitted, I spent the better part of the last year collecting motifs/recipes either through stocking up on gold or farming them through pve, plus I've gotten to 9 traits only with patience and lots of gold. I've never complained about that, because I agree - newer players should not have an advantage over older players. The strong and dedicated gamers of this place should be aptly rewarded for their efforts. So there goes that stupid argument about me wanting the game to be "ez-pz". Taleof2cities is right, it's not difficult to find 3 nirnroot at all but it is annoying once you've run out of them because of constant potion crafting the previous night and then finding that the next morning before you gotta go to work and just quickly wanted to finish those writs, you find yourself saying "oh crap... I used them all last night and I gotta go."

In my case that's a detriment because when I wake up I usually have little to no time, and I like getting my dailies done each day because I don't want to miss out even once on a chance at a master writ. Sometimes I'm not back home for days because of the nature of my work. It's an OCD thing, you wouldn't understand.

Maybe you should stop presuming things, chill out and actually think your comments through before making them. I mean seriously what is up with you? You're the one who's making a bigger deal of this than it needs to be, not me.

*Edited for typos plus one addition.

Feric51 · March 2017

First off... @STEVIL - I can always count on you to be the voice of logic on these message boards (not just the crafting forum) and for that good sir; I say, "Thank you!"

As far as my response to OP's complaint: 3 Nirnroot is cheap for comparison's sake when looking at all writs across the board. Harvesting 3 Nirn means visiting a maximum of 3 nodes, potentially 2 if your plentiful harvester passive kicks in on one of them. Other max writs take much more materials than you could possibly gather in 3 nodes (unless we're discussing survey nodes which are much richer), and vary depending on which armor/weapons the daily writ assignment is.

As @Jayne_Doe mentioned, Nirnroot also has the convenient propensity to always grow near water and, in fact, gives off an audible proximity beacon whenever you're close - just in case you can't see it! Long before I started doing writs it was evident to me that Nirn and water hyacinth are quite possibly the two most common alchemy reagents available, and at no point should anyone have an issue keeping stocked. Would you prefer to search random alchemy node spawns for mountain flower, or be looking behind every tree for emetic russula perhaps? ZOS has done us a favor by requiring a known ingredient for every writ, and chose the one that is the easiest to locate.

And one last point regarding a QoL complaint you stated: I play on console without any available add-ons, so I have no idea where material nodes will spawn outside of what I can remember through game play. So the fact that I can run to any body of water on a map and almost always count on Nirnroot being there makes alchemy writ material harvesting easier for me than the other writs. With no offense intended towards all the competent and considerate PC players out there, I get tired of all the complaints on these forums when a game mechanic seems "unfair" because there isn't a Game Genie-esque add-on to sugarcoat the process for you. Again, I don't discredit PC players who use add-ons, but being on console and never having played with add-ons makes a lot of the "problems" I read on here laughable to say the least.

PS - If cross-platform CoD-ing were a thing, I'd send you a couple stacks of Nirnroot to help ease the pain.

PPS - If you don't know what a Game Genie is, ask your parents...

QahnaarinDynar · March 2017

Feric51 wrote: »

First off... @STEVIL - I can always count on you to be the voice of logic on these message boards (not just the crafting forum) and for that good sir; I say, "Thank you!"

As far as my response to OP's complaint: 3 Nirnroot is cheap for comparison's sake when looking at all writs across the board. Harvesting 3 Nirn means visiting a maximum of 3 nodes, potentially 2 if your plentiful harvester passive kicks in on one of them. Other max writs take much more materials than you could possibly gather in 3 nodes (unless we're discussing survey nodes which are much richer), and vary depending on which armor/weapons the daily writ assignment is.

As @Jayne_Doe mentioned, Nirnroot also has the convenient propensity to always grow near water and, in fact, gives off an audible proximity beacon whenever you're close - just in case you can't see it! Long before I started doing writs it was evident to me that Nirn and water hyacinth are quite possibly the two most common alchemy reagents available, and at no point should anyone have an issue keeping stocked. Would you prefer to search random alchemy node spawns for mountain flower, or be looking behind every tree for emetic russula perhaps? ZOS has done us a favor by requiring a known ingredient for every writ, and chose the one that is the easiest to locate.

And one last point regarding a QoL complaint you stated: I play on console without any available add-ons, so I have no idea where material nodes will spawn outside of what I can remember through game play. So the fact that I can run to any body of water on a map and almost always count on Nirnroot being there makes alchemy writ material harvesting easier for me than the other writs. With no offense intended towards all the competent and considerate PC players out there, I get tired of all the complaints on these forums when a game mechanic seems "unfair" because there isn't a Game Genie-esque add-on to sugarcoat the process for you. Again, I don't discredit PC players who use add-ons, but being on console and never having played with add-ons makes a lot of the "problems" I read on here laughable to say the least.

PS - If cross-platform CoD-ing were a thing, I'd send you a couple stacks of Nirnroot to help ease the pain.

PPS - If you don't know what a Game Genie is, ask your parents...

> I get tired of all the complaints on these forums when a game mechanic seems "unfair" because there isn't a Game Genie-esque add-on to sugarcoat the process for you.

Thing is I didn't say that process should be sugar coated did I? All I said was that the requirement is wasteful and pointless, and that I'm short on time. I know it won't get changed, but all I was saying is that it would be nice. It's a small detail that a big deal is being made out of that it doesn't need to be. Seriously...

STEVIL · March 2017

I must say, i love the logic... or whatever you call it...

Two consecutive posts by the OP where the angle of claiming the issue is "so trivial" or a "small detail" that too much opposition is somehow out of whack. I must admit its a unique approach to start a thread complaing, asking for a change, insisting for a change only to keep running down its own significance this way.

If its not significant enough of a change to argue against, how is it significant enough to atgue for?

But then, its apparently actually not about the difficulty of three nirnroot pack for writs at all but about what that does for reaching 100 counts on nirnroot based potions for guild stores sales?

"It's about SELLING stuff in guildstore. "
"Taleof2cities is right, it's not difficult to find 3 nirnroot at all"
"The fact is that this requirement for completing the writ is so trivial "

To which i have to say WTF???

One of the reasons its good for nirnroot to be consumed as opposed to say almost any other ingredient is for potions one would use in play its basically useless. Does anyone know a good selling stack of 100 nirnroot based potion? Ingredients key to in play used or in guild store sales are ones with 2-3 good aspects and not those with three negative traits and i am afraid i have to point out that nirnroot is one of the latter.

Sure nirnroot is one of the invisibility sources but there are lots of oft-used potions that are not invisibility based. maybe cutting the one invisibility potion out of your sales list or even reducing it a small amount in order to help your master writs chances is a thing to consider?

What night of crafting potions to be used for guild store sales uses up nirnroot for someone who loves master writs and knows about the nirnroot requirement?

this is making less and less sense with each defense.

As for this...

" but all I was saying is that it would be nice. It's a small detail that a big deal is being made out of that it doesn't need to be. Seriously"

In the original post the point was made pretty clearly... when it was asked or inststed on as a fix, not a small QoL improvement.as a fix

"Why do I need to have 3 nirnroot or whatever it asks for in my inventory/craftbag to deliver a potion that absolutely does not require its use? Why should I give the game my resources each time? It's been brought up many times before, and really zos it's about time you fixed this. It's a pointless waste of time and loss of resources."

Now, again to the "pointless" pit that keeps getting repeated as if gospel... as i said and others have agreed with - the nirnroot is about the only even slightly difficult aspect of the tier-10 alchemy writ that takes any time or effort. if it were removed, the writs would be practically self-sustaining and honestly way better than self-sustaining.

MATH: Each standard tier-10 writ requires 1 potion that can be made from 1 solvent and 2 reagents and at tier-10 alchemy each use of these makes four doses. So the imagined "pointless" requirement to "give the game my resources each time" raises the requirement from less than one ingredient per writ (paying back 12 ingredients in the typical reward box plus up to 664 gold plus 1/10 chance of survey plus small chance of master writ) to 3.75 and the requirement that three out of four times that additional three is nirnroot is the only thing that makes these take a little bit of effort.

So, the "point" is - it makes the writ have a little bit of - but not an onerous amount of - time or effort involved. Even if that effort is as little as when one is at a guild store doing commerce on all those nirnroot based potions one makes a few additional clicks to buy the nirnroot one needs for the next couple of days writs?

If your issue continues to be that in order to run end-game content about which you claim "I happen to be in love with" taking the time to keep up nirnroot to meet that demand along with your other activities then maybe you should consider either:
1 - rethinking whether its more important to sell 100 stack valuable nirnroot potions vs say 88 stack nirnroot potions or do your end-game content that according to you you "which I happen to be in love with"
2 - Remember to spend a little of your guild store potion haul on mirnroot to support your beloved end-game content
3 - See if maybe there are other more easily accessible reagents than nirnroot that you can use in your awesome potion selling machine that provide "invisibility" or to redirect those sales to other potions - so that you can not burn up your nirnroot supplies that you need for your beloved content on that.

Nerouyn · March 2017

QahnaarinDynar wrote: »

It's a pointless waste of time and loss of resources.

Yeah I usually just skip these. Most of the time it wants 3 nirnroot and I don't have an endless supply of those.

Very rarely it wants 3 waters instead and that's the only time I'll do these writs.

STEVIL · March 2017

Hey an idea for a compromise...

ZOS can add a click box for "short on the rent" on the alchemy writs.
if you click "short on the rent" , the mats three-pack requirement is removed. That reduces the mats required by 80% given the 4 to 1 yield.
however, if you click "short on the rent", the gold outlay, number of mats rewarded, chance of survey and chance of master writ are all reduced by 40% ( only half as much as the mats required were reduced.)

thats an obvious major win for those who have deficiency issues in the nirnroot department.80% off the spending for only 40% reduction in gains - man - what a deal?.

this way those who have no deficiencies in nirnroot can continue to reap their well deserved full rewards while those less willing to satisfy the demands can get a cheaper alternative.

win-win..

Dagoth_Rac · March 2017

Nirnroot is so easy to farm. Just run alongside streams and rivers. Tend to be inland, though, not along coastlines. It glows and is easy to see without Keen Eye, plus it makes a ringing noise. By far the easiest alchemy ingredient to farm. And with double drops in Hews Bane this week, just run up and down the stream/river that runs behind the Abah's Landing wayshrine. Take that river south to the sea, then turn back. Rinse, repeat. There is double Nirnroot up and down that river. And really, any lake or stream or river in Tamriel has Nirnroot growing along the banks.

Soella · March 2017

@STEVIL

As of now, nirnroot cost on PC/NA is above 350G and continue to grow. It means that alternative cost of making alchemy writ is closing to 1300 G. Declining price on all other herbs makes surveys next to meaningless taking into account travel time.
IMHO as soon as master writs will be below 1500G, alchemy writs with nirn will not make any sence and more profitable will be just sell all nirnroot you are getting occasionally.

STEVIL · March 2017

Soella wrote: »

@STEVIL

As of now, nirnroot cost on PC/NA is above 350G and continue to grow. It means that alternative cost of making alchemy writ is closing to 1300 G. Declining price on all other herbs makes surveys next to meaningless taking into account travel time.
IMHO as soon as master writs will be below 1500G, alchemy writs with nirn will not make any sence and more profitable will be just sell all nirnroot you are getting occasionally.

prices for nirnroot were more like 500g and up to 700g a few weeks ago. the resurgence in 300-400g options represents from what i have seen at guild stores more of a recent downward trend or correction in prices, not an ongoing raise.

We had the new content, the surge in tier-10s, the sudden surge in prices and now the corrections.

But i am amazed at your final conclusion - once master writs are so cheap that doing alchemy at tier-10 isn't worth blah blha then it will be more profitable to stop doing them and sell nirnroot - but of course you may be not aware that once people stop doing the nirnroot demanding writs as much the value of nirnroot will drop accordingly - only a few lags here and there. You seem to be Ok with linking master writs to the rise in prices then conveniently divorce the drop in prices to any sort of drop in nirnroot pricing.

You see, alchemy allows you to do tier-1 writs to your heart's content, earn the same reagents, same chance of surveys and only loss is the chance at master writs (solvents in and solvents out are at tier-1 of course.) Gold out remains the same.

of course any player has several ways to get nirnroot and ways to balance out their demand. I myself dropped back from 12 tier-10 alche a day to 8 with four tier-1s to get to a good balance point.

others will do that too.

but the key to this is - this surge is for what amounts to end-game elite level crafting - the hunt for master writs. Even if acquiring nirn costs - the folks pursuing that content having to pay lots a for it in time or gold - how is that a problem? Folks devoting their time to say end-game trials - they spend tons of time and gold and effort on all sorts of stuff for that including alchemical potions by the bucket full if you listen to their threads about how many they burn.

There is tons of nirnroot for sale for those who want to run the end-game alche craft content of master writs. That allows lots of opportunities for those not interested in it to sell of the otherwise mostly useless nirnroot for big gains.

Except for maybe shocking some folks who might feel they have an entitlement to run lots of end-game content fully with little effort or expense in how the game works - not sure where the downside is.

And i am not holding my breath for when a 5 voucher master writ hits 1500g standard price or even the 2 voucher ones.

hmmm.. thanks for reminding me - i did not go thru mine earlier today and i have three master writs to do... so...

Wreuntzylla · March 2017

The use of Nirnroot stems from the fact that it was almost never used in alchemy prior to poisons.and it sees little use even now. ZoS implemented this scheme to make it easier on players and reduce the large stores of Nirnroot in the game. It was also an on again off again complaint by franchise followers that Nirnroot had no importance in this game.

The reason it's difficult to find Nirnroot right now is because up until recently, a large number of Nirnroot nodes were accidentally changed to solvent nodes, and of course writs are now a fundamental part of the furnishing game.

The scarcity of Nirnroot annoys me, but sometimes I run a metric ton of writs across multiple accounts. I usually need to farm it in the 3am-5am window on a particular regional server, and can farm large quantities over that window. If you haven't done that, you have no idea of how many over-farmed Nirnroot nodes there actually are in the game.

Some people will switch instances to farm. I'm not sure how that works, but one poster mentioned that characters mid-way through the Coldharbour quests will have almost empty instances to farm, and another mentioned that changing instances in Craglorn will often get you unfarmed nodes.

STEVIL · March 2017

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

The use of Nirnroot stems from the fact that it was almost never used in alchemy prior to poisons.and it sees little use even now. ZoS implemented this scheme to make it easier on players and reduce the large stores of Nirnroot in the game. It was also an on again off again complaint by franchise followers that Nirnroot had no importance in this game.

The reason it's difficult to find Nirnroot right now is because up until recently, a large number of Nirnroot nodes were accidentally changed to solvent nodes, and of course writs are now a fundamental part of the furnishing game.

The scarcity of Nirnroot annoys me, but sometimes I run a metric ton of writs across multiple accounts. I usually need to farm it in the 3am-5am window on a particular regional server, and can farm large quantities over that window. If you haven't done that, you have no idea of how many over-farmed Nirnroot nodes there actually are in the game.

Some people will switch instances to farm. I'm not sure how that works, but one poster mentioned that characters mid-way through the Coldharbour quests will have almost empty instances to farm, and another mentioned that changing instances in Craglorn will often get you unfarmed nodes.

Instead, i farm "gold" which is available in good quantities. Combined with my incoming nirnroot from writs and from supplier and the modest amounts i get overland between adventure locations... makes it easy to run a lot of tier-10 writs.

i have averaged taking about one day of my "gold payout from writs" a week for nirnroot purchases. The rest was all gravy.

Narvuntien · March 2017

If you are looking for Nirnroot try Fort Amol in Eastmarch.

I am not having too much trouble finding it and I am making gold selling it.

Jaeysa · March 2017

The only reason I do max lvl alchemy writs are for the sealed writs. Otherwise, it's highly unlikely that the herbs contained in the satchel is worth 3 nirnroot. If you're not looking for sealed writs, but still want your 600 each day, respect and just do Alchemy I writs. These don't ask for nirn, give you the same gold, and same amount of surveys.

Taleof2Cities · March 2017

Jaeysa wrote: »

The only reason I do max lvl alchemy writs are for the sealed writs. Otherwise, it's highly unlikely that the herbs contained in the satchel is worth 3 nirnroot. If you're not looking for sealed writs, but still want your 600 each day, respect and just do Alchemy I writs. These don't ask for nirn, give you the same gold, and same amount of surveys.

Great point.

That may not deter some more whiney posts to follow in this thread, however.

FrancisCrawford · March 2017

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

The only reason I do max lvl alchemy writs are for the sealed writs. Otherwise, it's highly unlikely that the herbs contained in the satchel is worth 3 nirnroot. If you're not looking for sealed writs, but still want your 600 each day, respect and just do Alchemy I writs. These don't ask for nirn, give you the same gold, and same amount of surveys.

Great point.

That may not deter some more whiney posts to follow in this thread, however.

It's also a matter of convenience. If you're turning your other crafting writs in in Belkarth, it's a pain to delivery your alchemy writs somewhere else. My roster is:

-- One character who does 3 consumable writs plus woodworking daily, all in Belkarth.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs plus woodworking daily, 2 in Belkarth and 2 in Auridon.
-- Two characters who do 3 consumable writs daily, all in Belkarth.
-- Two characters who do 3 consumable writs daily, 1 in Belkarth and 2 in Stormhaven.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs daily, all in Auridon.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs daily, all in Shornhelm.

lagrue · March 2017

Anybody who cries about nirnroot should just flat out quit the game. You're trash.

Seriously port to the wayshrine in the Hollow City in Coldharbour and there is literally 6-8 nodes right at the spawn. I went there last night and there was 3 plants side by side... Not to mention the other 40 roots I grabbed in a 10 minute period lol

Nirnroot is the single easieat reagent to find. Glows and hums naturally, always near water - and Hollow City. All those factors make nirnroot the single most consistent reagent in the game besides water hyacinthe.

STEVIL · March 2017

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

The only reason I do max lvl alchemy writs are for the sealed writs. Otherwise, it's highly unlikely that the herbs contained in the satchel is worth 3 nirnroot. If you're not looking for sealed writs, but still want your 600 each day, respect and just do Alchemy I writs. These don't ask for nirn, give you the same gold, and same amount of surveys.

Great point.

That may not deter some more whiney posts to follow in this thread, however.

It's also a matter of convenience. If you're turning your other crafting writs in in Belkarth, it's a pain to delivery your alchemy writs somewhere else. My roster is:

-- One character who does 3 consumable writs plus woodworking daily, all in Belkarth.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs plus woodworking daily, 2 in Belkarth and 2 in Auridon.
-- Two characters who do 3 consumable writs daily, all in Belkarth.
-- Two characters who do 3 consumable writs daily, 1 in Belkarth and 2 in Stormhaven.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs daily, all in Auridon.
-- One character who does 3 consumable writs daily, all in Shornhelm.

yes you are correct, a player can choose to make their play more inconvenient by choosing to advance characters in a way that so that they add extra zone shifts in the course of daily writs they elect to do.

But there are lots and lots of ways players can choose to make their play more inconvenient than just that, right?

Choosing to do things the way you did instead of more efficient means is not a fault in the system. its a fault in your pkanning IF it is something you would rather not be doing.

As the doctor said when the patient told him "it hursts when i do this.", "Dont do that."

To be more explicit, i respeced characters to let them run only writs at one location because the gains per time are not worth it to me if i have to jump back and forth for one writ or another.

My characters who run tier-1 writs (six each daily) run them in one spot, no swapping.)

My characters who run tier-10 writs (three to six each daily) run them in one spot, no swapping and yes, holy cow, that means some of them only run three tier-10s and no other writs each day.

But the avg completion time for a character doing writs (3-6 each daIly) is under 7m and that is very convenient for the gains.

Inefficiency is a choice and in this case that type of inconvenience is also a choice.

Especially since the difference between tier-1 alche and tier-10 alche is so minimal.

As Yoda said "Do or do not, there is no cry."