What's the current magicka sorc meta?

Nightsbane__ · March 2017

I've been gone for a few months and I'm wondering what's the latest must haves for gear/setups for magicka sorcs. Judging by the guild trader prices I'm guessing Spinner's is still popular.

psychotic13 · March 2017

PvE or PvP ?

PvE I think it's BSW Ilambris and Aether/moondancer

Nightsbane__ · March 2017

Sorry, PvP

EldritchPenguin · March 2017

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

Sorry, PvP

Spinner, Lich, and Infernal Guardian. 4 body Lich, 3 Jewelry and 1 body Spinner (or the other way around, as long as you have 4 of each). Spinner Inferno front bar, Lich Resto back bar.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · March 2017

psychotic13 wrote: »

PvE or PvP ?

PvE I think it's BSW Ilambris and Aether/moondancer

Yes. (Moondancer>Aether)

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

Sorry, PvP

Spinner, Lich, and Infernal Guardian. 4 body Lich, 3 Jewelry and 1 body Spinner (or the other way around, as long as you have 4 of each). Spinner Inferno front bar, Lich Resto back bar.

And Yes. Haha. My only pushback is that the monster helm is debatable. I carry both infernal guardian and pirate skeleton. Pirate Skeleton is borderline OP. It's basically like wearing an extra set of heavy armor, and the main drawback (15% reduced healing) doesnt sting so much on a shield stacking sorc. Infernal Guardian was also ignoring line of sight for a while, hence its popularity. That part has been fixed. It is still strong, however. IG=Offense, PS=Defense.

Edit: One thing to consider is how you set it up. You basically go front bar Spinner staff, and back bar lich staff, but the debate is what to make jewelry. If you have gold jewelry, its a moot point. If your jewelry is purple, then make your jewelry Lich for more Offense (spell pen will be higher), and Spinner for more Sustain (regen will be higher). I elected to run spinner body pieces because I had lich jewelry from farming COH, and that way I get the full 4k spell pen when I made the armor and staff gold.

There is another "meta" (might not be the right term) emerging with Amberplasm. It's a little unorthodox, but it is definitely becoming more popular. The idea is to run amberplasm and the serpent stone to get really high stam regen. You can then have virtually infinite magic sustain with dark conversion. I havent personally tried this one yet, but have seen it be very effective by others.

Nightsbane__ · March 2017

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

Sorry, PvP

Spinner, Lich, and Infernal Guardian. 4 body Lich, 3 Jewelry and 1 body Spinner (or the other way around, as long as you have 4 of each). Spinner Inferno front bar, Lich Resto back bar.

Yeah, that's what I was working on. Finally got the Spinner inferno staff to make it work, it seems good, but hasn't blown my mind--albeit I only have the non-CP week as my comparison. I'm still confused by the resto on the back bar? I understand it's to have healing ward right? But is that really necessary when you can just spam hardened?

Oreyn_Bearclaw · March 2017

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

Sorry, PvP

Spinner, Lich, and Infernal Guardian. 4 body Lich, 3 Jewelry and 1 body Spinner (or the other way around, as long as you have 4 of each). Spinner Inferno front bar, Lich Resto back bar.

Yeah, that's what I was working on. Finally got the Spinner inferno staff to make it work, it seems good, but hasn't blown my mind--albeit I only have the non-CP week as my comparison. I'm still confused by the resto on the back bar? I understand it's to have healing ward right? But is that really necessary when you can just spam hardened?

Yes it is. The idea is that you basically do a rotation of 3. Shields take damage in reverse order of cast. So you always cast Healing ward first, so it has the potential to burst heal you if there is some left after 6 seconds. I typically go Healing Ward, Harness Magic, Hardened Ward. Harness magic could theoretically go last. It is the one you want consumed first as it gives magic back, but since ward has a longer duration, I go last with it. Some people like to put all three shields on their back bar. I like Hardened on my front bar. That way I dont have to swap for a quick shield, and it has a chance to proc my frags each time I stack up.

Edit: Take all this with a grain of salt. I am very experienced on a sorc in PVE, but it is still new to me in PVP. I will say that after one night on the Spinner/lich build, I was all in. I have been trying to make DK my main in PVP, and it is definitely strong this patch, but this just fits my playstyle better.

Edit2: Also realize that if you just spam ward, you shield will never be all that big. If you rotate three shields, they stack. So the idea is shield stack, soften them up, shield stack, burst. You can basically get 3-4 skills in between each shield stack. It is definitely a lot of buttons to press, but it can be very effective.

EldritchPenguin · March 2017

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Nightsbane__ wrote: »

Sorry, PvP

Spinner, Lich, and Infernal Guardian. 4 body Lich, 3 Jewelry and 1 body Spinner (or the other way around, as long as you have 4 of each). Spinner Inferno front bar, Lich Resto back bar.

Yeah, that's what I was working on. Finally got the Spinner inferno staff to make it work, it seems good, but hasn't blown my mind--albeit I only have the non-CP week as my comparison. I'm still confused by the resto on the back bar? I understand it's to have healing ward right? But is that really necessary when you can just spam hardened?

Healing Ward is there for two reasons: to provide the instant heal that Spinner + Lich builds usually lack, and to make your defense far more powerful at low health than high health (increasing your defense when you need it most). Sure, Hardened Ward is very powerful on its own, but pairing it with Healing Ward and maybe even Dampen Magic makes you basically indestructible.

Lexxypwns · March 2017

I'd sub BSW for spinners, it's more overall damage for the 5 PC with better 2-4pc as well. The crit synergies so well with surge also.
Pirate is insane on shield stacking builds(and strong on some other builds)
Lich is great, if you've taken streak off your bar and replaced it with mist due to the bugs then warlock will outperform lich in open world most likely

EldritchPenguin · March 2017

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I'd sub BSW for spinners, it's more overall damage for the 5 PC with better 2-4pc as well. The crit synergies so well with surge also.
Pirate is insane on shield stacking builds(and strong on some other builds)
Lich is great, if you've taken streak off your bar and replaced it with mist due to the bugs then warlock will outperform lich in open world most likely

I dunno about that. Spinner is much more consistent than BSW, especially on Sorcerers lacking Blockade of Fire. You probably won't have a great uptime on it, and it also gives you set windows to attack, which is something you should probably avoid if you can. Alchemist would be a lot stronger than BSW on a PvP MagSorc.

In PvE, I would absolutely agree with you. But I don't think it's a good PvP choice for Sorcerers. Dragonknights, absolutely. They can get insane uptime on that buff. But Sorcerers can't really do the same thing with it in PvP.

Biro123 · March 2017

I generally favour necropotence (no need for resto) - but sometimes switch to spinners if I seem to be seeing a lot of tanks.
Always lich for sustain. Pirate skelly is bugged for me - so I can't use it..so I usually mix monster sets for max mag

Lexxypwns · March 2017

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I'd sub BSW for spinners, it's more overall damage for the 5 PC with better 2-4pc as well. The crit synergies so well with surge also.
Pirate is insane on shield stacking builds(and strong on some other builds)
Lich is great, if you've taken streak off your bar and replaced it with mist due to the bugs then warlock will outperform lich in open world most likely

I dunno about that. Spinner is much more consistent than BSW, especially on Sorcerers lacking Blockade of Fire. You probably won't have a great uptime on it, and it also gives you set windows to attack, which is something you should probably avoid if you can. Alchemist would be a lot stronger than BSW on a PvP MagSorc.

In PvE, I would absolutely agree with you. But I don't think it's a good PvP choice for Sorcerers. Dragonknights, absolutely. They can get insane uptime on that buff. But Sorcerers can't really do the same thing with it in PvP.

You may think the uptime isn't great, but you're wrong. Its as simple as that. There's tons of uptime just from force pulse+inferno weaves and its reliable since force pulse is guaranteed damage. BSW, even at only 65% uptime, is WAY more damage than spinners and I'm quite certain that 65% is a very very easy to maintain uptime. If you prefer to have 100% uptime on your damage then go spinner, but you're not gonna hit nearly as hard.

Furthermore, spinners over penetrates light armor builds and doesn't help against shields AND has worse 2-4 piece bonuses. Its not even close, BSW is by far BiS if you want an aggressive 5 pc on sorc. The farm is real tho...

Aedaryl · March 2017

Sorc usualy run a regen set (lich/amberplasm) with a damage set (BSW> Spinner) and 1 or 2 monsters set (infernal guadian 1 piece/grohdar 1 piece/1 kena/ 2 skeletons/ 2 slimecraw)

Lexxypwns · March 2017

Biro123 wrote: »

I generally favour necropotence (no need for resto) - but sometimes switch to spinners if I seem to be seeing a lot of tanks.
Always lich for sustain. Pirate skelly is bugged for me - so I can't use it..so I usually mix monster sets for max mag

If you wear a costume you don't get the pirate skelly bug.

grannas211 · March 2017

Aedaryl wrote: »

(BSW> Spinner)

I dont know about that. What is your uptime with BSW in pvp? I mean you have Crushing Shock on a fire staff, but still..

grannas211 · March 2017

grannas211 wrote: »

Aedaryl wrote: »

(BSW> Spinner)

I dont know about that. What is your uptime with BSW in pvp? I mean you have Crushing Shock on a fire staff, but still..

Edit: Saw post above your's. I guess I should test before commenting. My bad.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · March 2017

Lexxypwns wrote: »

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I'd sub BSW for spinners, it's more overall damage for the 5 PC with better 2-4pc as well. The crit synergies so well with surge also.
Pirate is insane on shield stacking builds(and strong on some other builds)
Lich is great, if you've taken streak off your bar and replaced it with mist due to the bugs then warlock will outperform lich in open world most likely

I dunno about that. Spinner is much more consistent than BSW, especially on Sorcerers lacking Blockade of Fire. You probably won't have a great uptime on it, and it also gives you set windows to attack, which is something you should probably avoid if you can. Alchemist would be a lot stronger than BSW on a PvP MagSorc.

In PvE, I would absolutely agree with you. But I don't think it's a good PvP choice for Sorcerers. Dragonknights, absolutely. They can get insane uptime on that buff. But Sorcerers can't really do the same thing with it in PvP.

You may think the uptime isn't great, but you're wrong. Its as simple as that. There's tons of uptime just from force pulse+inferno weaves and its reliable since force pulse is guaranteed damage. BSW, even at only 65% uptime, is WAY more damage than spinners and I'm quite certain that 65% is a very very easy to maintain uptime. If you prefer to have 100% uptime on your damage then go spinner, but you're not gonna hit nearly as hard.

Furthermore, spinners over penetrates light armor builds and doesn't help against shields AND has worse 2-4 piece bonuses. Its not even close, BSW is by far BiS if you want an aggressive 5 pc on sorc. The farm is real tho...

It's an 8 second buff with a 12 second cooldown. 66% is the max possible uptime. Sorry, but you are not keeping it up 65% on a target dummy, let alone in PVP. I am not for one second saying it's a bad set, I use it on my DK in pvp all the time, but let's make sure the numbers are correct.

On a sorc in PVP, I prefer spinner, but not saying its always the better choice. I just don't do that much flame damage in PVP. In PVE, BSW is certainly BIS and spinner is frankly trash unless solo.

Edit: I also carry both a fire and lighting spinner staff. Solo or small group, I like fire, but in big battles, I think lighting is superior. That wouldnt work too well with BSW.

Lexxypwns · March 2017

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I'd sub BSW for spinners, it's more overall damage for the 5 PC with better 2-4pc as well. The crit synergies so well with surge also.
Pirate is insane on shield stacking builds(and strong on some other builds)
Lich is great, if you've taken streak off your bar and replaced it with mist due to the bugs then warlock will outperform lich in open world most likely

I dunno about that. Spinner is much more consistent than BSW, especially on Sorcerers lacking Blockade of Fire. You probably won't have a great uptime on it, and it also gives you set windows to attack, which is something you should probably avoid if you can. Alchemist would be a lot stronger than BSW on a PvP MagSorc.

In PvE, I would absolutely agree with you. But I don't think it's a good PvP choice for Sorcerers. Dragonknights, absolutely. They can get insane uptime on that buff. But Sorcerers can't really do the same thing with it in PvP.

You may think the uptime isn't great, but you're wrong. Its as simple as that. There's tons of uptime just from force pulse+inferno weaves and its reliable since force pulse is guaranteed damage. BSW, even at only 65% uptime, is WAY more damage than spinners and I'm quite certain that 65% is a very very easy to maintain uptime. If you prefer to have 100% uptime on your damage then go spinner, but you're not gonna hit nearly as hard.

Furthermore, spinners over penetrates light armor builds and doesn't help against shields AND has worse 2-4 piece bonuses. Its not even close, BSW is by far BiS if you want an aggressive 5 pc on sorc. The farm is real tho...

It's an 8 second buff with a 12 second cooldown. 66% is the max possible uptime. Sorry, but you are not keeping it up 65% on a target dummy, let alone in PVP. I am not for one second saying it's a bad set, I use it on my DK in pvp all the time, but let's make sure the numbers are correct.

On a sorc in PVP, I prefer spinner, but not saying its always the better choice. I just don't do that much flame damage in PVP. In PVE, BSW is certainly BIS and spinner is frankly trash unless solo.

Edit: I also carry both a fire and lighting spinner staff. Solo or small group, I like fire, but in big battles, I think lighting is superior. That wouldnt work too well with BSW.

You're totally right, if you're running a lightning staff then BSW is totally off the table.

I tested BSW with a friend on console(given, only for like 10 minutes before he became utterly convinced and left) and he seems to feel he can pre-proc it while still on cooldown, if he's mistaken then that's my bad, sorry.

However, I've personally run both spinners and BSW and I really never lack the bonus damage from BSW when I need it. Its up a lot and I perform much much better with BSW than spinners(especially this patch as compared with last since there's many many more magika builds and as such more shields)