VMoL Has Ruined PS4's PvE Scene

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

VMoL has turned people into elitists and turned people into liars. Or rather brought those things to the surface, if they've already existed.

You have people comparing DPS scores constantly if you want a chance at getting in a group, and people getting hounded about what gear they're wearing, and who they know. You basically get interviewed at a chance of doing VMoL. And even then the so-called progression teams are a sham. Or so I've experienced from 4 different guilds. It's to the point now some guilds literally break people up as: "Skinned" and "Non-Skinned". The "Non-Skinned" people get treated like ****, and get placed on these strictly timed "progression teams" that really just waste time. And wipe constantly until the time is up for the progression team's "slot", and then at the end give a half-assed speech about how the progress was good. Only for moments later after the run to talk about how the "Skinned" make things so much easier, and how they actually try during those. WTF? And to make matters worse, it's not even like these folks are even applying strategies and methods that they came up with themselves. No. They got it from watching YouTube videos, and communicating with folks who play on PC. Get information from there, and replicate it until it's damn near the same. It's ridiculous.

Oh, and you best believe I'm not leaving out the corrupt side of things. Remember that exploit of Maw? Well there's tons of people with the skin, and don't even know the mechanics. But get treated like royalty whereever they go because of it. I met a CP277 earlier in Grahtwood. Asked how they got the skin, and was told that they, "Got it while the getting was good." Huh? Seriously? And they get treated better than other folks because they exploited for it? Not to mention the carrying nonsense occurring. The so-called "Number 1" end-game PvE guild calling themselves a "Council" on PS4 are selling "Carry Runs" for 2M to anyone wanting the skin. And supposedly the person being carried gets to keep all 12 gold pieces awarded at the end. The hell?

That's where we are as an end-game PvE community right now on console, and it's horrible. It's get shuffled around and bs'd to constantly, unless you know someone who'll "make time for you" to get tested relentlessly. Get thrown in half-added progression teams. Get treated like ****, spoken down to, lied to, and forgotten about for the most part. And hope you just can click-up with the "pros" to let you into a dedicated Maw group.

Why am I even talking about this, being as how I do often speak of preferring solo play and being on my own? Because I witnessed the crap first-hand for myself not too long ago, and am disgusted. And plus I've had experience of what is occurring myself. Even as a guy who solo's vet dungeons on hard mode, has flawless, has beaten all vet trials on hard mode — I'm labeled as "progression" and "subpar" due to not having a damn Maw skin. And because of the bs, I probably won't ever get it. Damn the fact I know mechanics of the place inside and out. Damn the fact I put up with DPS tests in the past from this and that guild, when I hate the stupid tests to begin with. Damn the fact I can do what most can't, and have video footage of me doing so. Damn all that. That means nothing, all because my skin isn't black with shiny blue inserts. I've been lied to by guild after guild, and people who I thought were friends. All because of something Maw related usually being behind it. I'm so sick and tired of the ****, you won't believe it.

And it's not just Maw that this crap started. No. The elitism and segregation REALLY kicked off with the Stormproof emergence. If you weren't Stormproof, you didn't mean squat. And we're ignored and treated like filth. Now it's Maw. And because of the events that happened previously, it's 10x worse than back then. Except when back then (and to this day somewhat people account shared for Stormproof clears. And paid others to get leaderboard runs. This still occurs, but not as much as it used to.

Doctordarkspawn · January 2017

Thus is the way of the hardcore player.

Same thing is happening on PC with the increase in resistance and health for dungeon mobs, dungeon community wants Meta or nothing. If you look like your running it your royalty, and if not, you are treated like ***.

DigitalShibby · January 2017

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

Lukums1 · January 2017

This is why we have my A Australian Team formed with sensible solid people on PS4 and progressing into vMOL at our own pace. Most of us Flawless and solid players, no one needs elitism while playing a video game we just "enjoy".

People need to seriously get over themselves quick smart.

YOU are not "good" because you have the skin, the only reason YOU got the skin was because 12 people banded together for good communication and came out victorious (I'm speaking about the legit clears btw).

YOU as a single player can't classify yourself as "good" when it's about doing something as a TEAM.

Any way my 2 cents, this is why I stick with my 20-30 people (which are "good" as individuals) and we WILL get the kill one day.

OnThaLoose · January 2017

[snip] Thank goodness I came to PC when I did. I couldn't stand playing at 15fps on consoles anyway. The elitism, immaturity, and lack of helpful addons were other factors.

[Edited to remove masked profanity.]

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

Honest to goodness, it's the truth. It's why I stayed low-key and played primarily solo before quitting months ago, and even nowadays still play primarily solo. What is supposed to be fun, is far from a party. It's like a hive of stuckup elitist, who feel superior to everyone else due to a skin they wear.

And true story, when I'd confront a lot of these knuckleheads and ask them to solo some vet dungeons HM if so they're so "pro", and can have players swarming all around — they usually laugh or type: "lol" before walking off. The couple who were ballsy enough to take my challenge got annihilated even trying to take on world bosses. Let alone vet dungeon bosses. Got obliterated, and ended-up rage quitting with a barrage of cussing and saltiness. I told them to do it with any class they want, or setup. Just get it done, being as they think so highly of themselves. Meanwhile they're pros who people look up to, and idol so dearly. Lmao. Yeah ok. You're so mighty this and that, but get chumped solo. Riiiiight.

DannyLV702 · January 2017

This is why I just do my own thing. No stress. I log on to pvp and maybe farm some gear. Pvp is life

Doctordarkspawn · January 2017

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

Callous2208 · January 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

That has nothing to do with this, lol. My 2 year old daughter can beat the overland pve content in eso. A little less braindead questing on trash mobs wouldn't kill the game. The issue op is having is pretty lame though. Folks are just petty as hell.

Mojmir · January 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

Hardly, the game lacks challenges aside from 2-3 areas if you can't see that your holding yourself back. Not everyone comes to play and chill. Some people like a workout and push themselves. If the game stays "easy" it gets boring quite fast.that also kills games.

Doctordarkspawn · January 2017

Mojmir wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

Hardly, the game lacks challenges aside from 2-3 areas if you can't see that your holding yourself back. Not everyone comes to play and chill. Some people like a workout and push themselves. If the game stays "easy" it gets boring quite fast.that also kills games.

And designing content souly for a audience that grows bored and leaves once it's completed without a regular dev cycle is a waste of resources.

Third difficulty setting. Would solve all problems.

Mojmir · January 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

Hardly, the game lacks challenges aside from 2-3 areas if you can't see that your holding yourself back. Not everyone comes to play and chill. Some people like a workout and push themselves. If the game stays "easy" it gets boring quite fast.that also kills games.

And designing content souly for a audience that grows bored and leaves once it's completed without a regular dev cycle is a waste of resources.

Third difficulty setting. Would solve all problems.

Agreed, and less RNG.

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

Sounds like PS4 just became more like PC.
This is why people eventually stop doing anything in game that involves other people lol.

And yet there's a thread asking for overland content to be more difficult with upcoming DLC's.

People are just doing their best to kill this game.

Hardly, the game lacks challenges aside from 2-3 areas if you can't see that your holding yourself back. Not everyone comes to play and chill. Some people like a workout and push themselves. If the game stays "easy" it gets boring quite fast.that also kills games.

And designing content souly for a audience that grows bored and leaves once it's completed without a regular dev cycle is a waste of resources.

Third difficulty setting. Would solve all problems.

I personally have always believed in a third difficulty setting, or perhaps a slider.

Or even better, something similar to the system Blizzard incorporated in Diablo 3. To be specific their "Torment System". The higher the torment, the higher the XP is given, the higher the chance at receiving better (and more sought-after) loot is, and of course the higher the difficulty is. Something like that being incorporated into ESO I believe would work wonders.

SnubbS · January 2017

The best thing you can do is try to get a team of other people who haven't completed it and then progress towards a completion with them. There are quite a few videos on Youtube to give you an idea of how to complete it, it's just about executing. The only other option is to play the "game" by which I mean you become an amazing DD and therefore a valuable asset to an existing raid group. There is a fair bit of elitism, but it's not elitism to just not accept new members into a guild -- or to not run with/try out underperforming players. If you aren't seen as a valuable asset, you shouldn't expect to be treated as one.

Another option is to be friends with some people in a decent PVE group, and get carried through vMoL. Of course -- that's only if you want the skin, and aren't really concerned with anything else.

Edit: Also, selling "Carry runs" is great way for PVErs to make gold, it shouldn't be punished at all -- it's a great thing for everyone involved.

acw37162 · January 2017

As much as I do think the OP is painting an overly bleak teary eyed picture of the PS4 he is for the most part correct.

VMA and VMOL are segregation points in the community and like all gaming communities end game players can be high strung. The have and haves for PS4 or skinned and not skinned are particularly toxic.

But I don't blame the players I blame the game and developers not any one developer either going to lump them all together.

There are players who will demand hard content hell there are already threads asking for the as yet unreleased DLC to be insanely difficult with little care or thought given to the ghost towns these places turn into three and even less care and thought to the player who come behind them because they will have got "theirs" already.

Players who can beat it will demand compensation worthy of their invemnet of time.

Developers will give it because it makes sense be it a weapon or a title or a skin or a trinket or some new as yet unseen thing.

Then the players who have/can will do everything in their power to control acces and control who gets invited to their group of special snowflakes.

It's happened a thousand times over in thousand different games.

It will happen again and I blame developers, they will come up with mechanics, new challenges, and achievements, and let the same perpetually toxic dividing lines be drawn again.

timidobserver · January 2017

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

It's ridiculous. The typical PvE guild lists their ranks as usually as: Recruit, Untested, Tested, Member, Progression/Progression Team, Non-Skinned, Skinned, Raid Core Member, Raid Leader, Guildmaster. Or something in that order or like it.

And as I mentioned, you have tested for damn near everything trial-oriented on PS4. And interviewed about everything. "How long have you been playing?" "Please link all your gear." "Who do you know?" "Why were you tested?" "What are your titles?" "Why haven't you gotten Flawless Conqueror?" "How long did it take you to get Flawless Conqueror?" "Have you ever been in _____ guild, and if so what were your DPS times and when?" "Do you follow _____ on YouTube and Twitch?" "What's your forum account, if you have 1?" "Do you mind doing another DPS test for us?" "Why do you deserve this spot in our trial group?" "We'll think about adding you, just try to do better next time." "Why aren't you using _____rotation?" "That was pretty good, we'll get back to you." "We may have to put you on _____ progression team, but we need to consider what you bring to the table."

DannyLV702 · January 2017

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

His exaggeration level is over 9,000, I promise you. Check his previous threads and you will see. Yes, there is elitism, but that always exist.

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

DannyLV702 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

His exaggeration level is over 9,000, I promise you. Check his previous threads and you will see. Yes, there is elitism, but that always exist.

I would screen shoot it and list out some guilds right now, but I don't want to get into trouble for "naming and shaming". If you don't believe me that certain end-game PvE guilds are separating by the classifications of "skinned" and "non-skinned" you're strongly mistaken.

DannyLV702 · January 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

DannyLV702 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

His exaggeration level is over 9,000, I promise you. Check his previous threads and you will see. Yes, there is elitism, but that always exist.

I would screen shoot it and list out some guilds right now, but I don't want to get into trouble for "naming and shaming". If you don't believe me that certain end-game PvE guilds are separating by the classifications of "skinned" and "non-skinned" you're strongly mistaken.

Yes, but this elitism is between them. Outside of their circle it means absolutely nothing.

FloppyTouch · January 2017

I could care less about the skin it looks horrible for one does not make me look at a player and go OMFG he is amazing same with PvPers with 5 star rank it means nothing so you farmed AP get these guys alone in open world they drop super fast.

Same people on xb1 that "theory craft" and made that build first, please stop you just look like an idiot. Yh players are getting really annoying and if ur not rocking that gear that they "theory crafted" and spent months crunching numbers to come up with the build aka watched YouTube then ur less then.

Cpt_Teemo · January 2017

DannyLV702 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

DannyLV702 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

His exaggeration level is over 9,000, I promise you. Check his previous threads and you will see. Yes, there is elitism, but that always exist.

I would screen shoot it and list out some guilds right now, but I don't want to get into trouble for "naming and shaming". If you don't believe me that certain end-game PvE guilds are separating by the classifications of "skinned" and "non-skinned" you're strongly mistaken.

Yes, but this elitism is between them. Outside of their circle it means absolutely nothing.

Reminds me of Dangerous Minds, "Living in a gangster's paradise"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6voHeEa3ig

OutLaw_Nynx · January 2017

Lol these posts....

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

DannyLV702 wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

DannyLV702 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Wow console is a backwater. PC has some problems, but separating people by skinned and non-skinned is a bit much lol.

His exaggeration level is over 9,000, I promise you. Check his previous threads and you will see. Yes, there is elitism, but that always exist.

I would screen shoot it and list out some guilds right now, but I don't want to get into trouble for "naming and shaming". If you don't believe me that certain end-game PvE guilds are separating by the classifications of "skinned" and "non-skinned" you're strongly mistaken.

Yes, but this elitism is between them. Outside of their circle it means absolutely nothing.

Reminds me of Dangerous Minds, "Living in a gangster's paradise"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6voHeEa3ig

Lmao. That's a classic right there. And yeah, I can see where you drew the connection.

It's just sad though the state of PvE on console. There's a ton of elitism, and at the same time — a ton of folks are "clueless". And then there's those in the middle ground. The people who just observe both sides of the coin, and are on the edge of both faces.

I for 1 feel I am on the edge of the coin. I wouldn't classify myself as an elitist, and do not belittle others. I sometimes will agree to help others if asked, and honestly play solo for the most part. However, I don't like it when I encounter "cringeworthy builds" (e.g. Double bow builds, tanks with restoration staves, etc.). And will often politely explain to them the error of their setup, and try to lead these people down a path that will result in success. But! I will immediately back off and cease assistance, if my bits of advice being given are met with hostility and refusal to acknowledge what is wrong. Especially if greeted with a response of how the "pros" do this and that. Or how their favorite YouTuber or streamer does this and that.

Metafae · January 2017

I'm beginning to like @Ch4mpTW
The threads hes made are entertaining.

mb10 · January 2017

Have you heard any of those guys speak on headset?

Absolute social losers in real life you can tell. ESO is their limelight lmao let them have it. The skin isnt even that nice imo who actually cares?

I play ps4 EU and stay away from people like that and I know im better than most of them anyway

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

Metafae wrote: »

I'm beginning to like @Ch4mpTW
The threads hes made are entertaining.

I try to be entertaining, but in this case was being sincere. Lol. I like you too, let's get some skooma together 1 day.

mb10 wrote: »

Have you heard any of those guys speak on headset?

Absolute social losers in real life you can tell. ESO is their limelight lmao let them have it. The skin isnt even that nice imo who actually cares?

I play ps4 EU and stay away from people like that and I know im better than most of them anyway

Bruh, I can definitely tell. But again, I try not to cast judgments. Even though I'm often cringing, and or laughing hard as a MF'er over the e-peen measuring I hear and see. The DPS time bragging is what gets me every time though. Because seeing how fast you can kill a stationary boss while it's being tanked, and you're being healed and buffed definitely is a clear indicator of your skill and knowledge of the game overall. And should definitely decide whether or not you're "worthy" to be brought along. Pffffft. Yeah okay. You learned a rotation. Nice. Cool beans, brah.

MaxwellC · January 2017

@Ch4mpTW
Best thing to do is make your own guild honestly. I'm trying to make my own but until they add some features to guilds I won't bother doing such a tedious thing. I've ran a lot of progression runs already myself and have been kicked out of two because of people selling the skins lol. Those two times I was the tank too so that definitely pissed me off after the wasted time.

I forgot to add one time I did beat it with a progression run but here's the thing for some reason I died in the backyard and when I died the wall came through since I was the runner I was back there. I thought "Awesome all that time finally get the skin people are crazy about" well unfortunately for some reason even though I did a lot of DPS I didn't receive the kill for rahkat or h/e his name is spelt thus meaning no skin for me. I contacted support and they basically told me "oh well"

Ch4mpTW · January 2017

MaxwellC wrote: »

@Ch4mpTW
Best thing to do is make your own guild honestly. I'm trying to make my own but until they add some features to guilds I won't bother doing such a tedious thing. I've ran a lot of progression runs already myself and have been kicked out of two because of people selling the skins lol. Those two times I was the tank too so that definitely pissed me off after the wasted time.

I forgot to add one time I did beat it with a progression run but here's the thing for some reason I died in the backyard and when I died the wall came through since I was the runner I was back there. I thought "Awesome all that time finally get the skin people are crazy about" well unfortunately for some reason even though I did a lot of DPS I didn't receive the kill for rahkat or h/e his name is spelt thus meaning no skin for me. I contacted support and they basically told me "oh well"

@MaxwellC You know what? You're onto something, and are making a ton of sense. Perhaps I should make my own guild. I had been asked numerous times in the past to by lots of folks, but always shrugged off. Partially because I thought they were just teasing, and also because I'm lazy when it comes to those kinds of things. But, yeah. I feel that would be the best route to take. You and I may have had our differences of opinions here and there in the past, but you brought up a very valid bit of logic right now. And I agree with you.

Also, I apologize to hear about that. It must suck having earned something and not be properly rewarded for it.

Metafae · January 2017

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Metafae wrote: »

I'm beginning to like @Ch4mpTW
The threads hes made are entertaining.

I try to be entertaining, but in this case was being sincere. Lol. I like you too, let's get some skooma together 1 day.

I know you are being sincere. As others have said in this thread, your only real option is to make your own progression group/guild. You want to get dedicated players that haven't completed it yet but are willing to put in the time and pain to get it done together. No longer at the mercy of other people who don't really care for your completion.

You may end up completing it with them after weeks of trying and getting further. Only to find at the end that you become what you hate, and denying others the chance to learn simply because you've gone through all the pain and now you just want to farm it.

Will you be a Hero or will you be a Tyrant?

MaxwellC · January 2017

@Ch4mpTW
Yeah it's all good discussions usually are about difference in opinions but ZOS really needs to make making a guild easier with features to make it easier for those whose life styles are rather busy. Auto bids would be nice and even auto weekly/monthly payments,etc.