Would you like to see ESO go free-to-play?

Dracindo · December 2016

Other

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Bring back sub only

You mean with the monthly fees? No way! I paid good money and got screwed over big time when I realized I had to pay monthly to play. I paid €40,00 at release, while the gold edition is even cheaper now. Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play? Games should either be free, a one-time purchase, or as monthly payments. Buying the game makes it fall in the one-time purchase category. Forcing players to then pay for a temporary subscription is a bigger scam than the Crown store (with crates still taking the lead).

ThePaleItalian · December 2016

Other

Dracindo wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Bring back sub only

You mean with the monthly fees? No way! I paid good money and got screwed over big time when I realized I had to pay monthly to play. I paid €40,00 at release, while the gold edition is even cheaper now. Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play? Games should either be free, a one-time purchase, or as monthly payments. Buying the game makes it fall in the one-time purchase category. Forcing players to then pay for a temporary subscription is a bigger scam than the Crown store (with crates still taking the lead).

Wait... a scam? I know we all hate to talk about it. But WoW is still running and has always been a monthly sub game. ESO should go back to it.

Do away with crates, Enough over priced mounts....ELK!!
15$ a month to play our game.

How do you expect to continue to run a game, let alone an MMO without cashflow?

Stovahkiin · December 2016

No

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Dracindo wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Bring back sub only

You mean with the monthly fees? No way! I paid good money and got screwed over big time when I realized I had to pay monthly to play. I paid €40,00 at release, while the gold edition is even cheaper now. Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play? Games should either be free, a one-time purchase, or as monthly payments. Buying the game makes it fall in the one-time purchase category. Forcing players to then pay for a temporary subscription is a bigger scam than the Crown store (with crates still taking the lead).

Wait... a scam? I know we all hate to talk about it. But WoW is still running and has always been a monthly sub game. ESO should go back to it.

Do away with crates, Enough over priced mounts....ELK!!
15$ a month to play our game.

How do you expect to continue to run a game, let alone an MMO without cashflow?

Agreed

Elsonso · December 2016

No

Dracindo wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Bring back sub only

You mean with the monthly fees? No way! I paid good money and got screwed over big time when I realized I had to pay monthly to play. I paid €40,00 at release, while the gold edition is even cheaper now. Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play? Games should either be free, a one-time purchase, or as monthly payments. Buying the game makes it fall in the one-time purchase category. Forcing players to then pay for a temporary subscription is a bigger scam than the Crown store (with crates still taking the lead).

Not a scam. This is how the game developers are kept honest. It is only with the subscription that the players and game developers naturally have the same goals.

Right now, ESO has a cash store with gambling boxes. The devs have to "promise" to stay focused on the game and make it better because the truth in B2P/F2P is that it is the cash shop the makes the money. It is the cash shop that needs new stuff, and better stuff, so that people will continue to buy in the cash shop. The game is important to keep people around, but it only needs enough attention to do that, and nothing more. The "promise" is that they will do more to the game than what is financially optimal for the cash shop.

This is what such a "promise" might look like: "We'll talk a lot more about the amazing new things that are coming to ESO as early as we can in the new year. We had a huge year in 2016, and I fully expect 2017 to be an even more successful year for ESO and will set us up for many more years of growth and success."

(I put "promise" in quotes because B2P/F2P studios are not stupid enough to actually make it a commitment. At best, it is a convenient happenstance that can go away at any time.)

When the game is subscription, they actually have to work to make the game experience good enough to subscribe to. They can't just toss out a cute recolor of a bear cub to look like a panda and slap 5000 Crowns on it. They have to provide areas, quests, events, dungeons, and things to do, or people will simply leave. It is expensive, it is work, and it requires a top notch studio that is on the ball. The goals of the players and the studio are in alignment, to make a better game.

Yeah, subscriptions cost money, and that sucks for people who cannot pay for them. When the developers can make a game worth subscribing to, it will be one awesome game.

Sogreth · December 2016

This game....is....free....to....play.....

I don't know about you, but I just bought ESO for a friend off of Steam for 20 bucks for Christmas, and he is playing it for free. Soooooooo....how is it not free to play? The subscription isn't mandatory, and you still have full access to the game without it.

Me thinks you don't know what free-to-play actually means.

ESO - Free-to-Play
League of Legends - Free-to-Play
World of Warcraft - Pay-to-Play
Hearthstone - Pay-to-Win

etc etc

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play?

Umm. That's what World of Warcraft does. And they obviously have no issues with it. Considering they are still the biggest MMO right now, regardless of the sub losses over the years, they still top the charts.

Stovahkiin · December 2016

No

Sogreth wrote: »

This game....is....free....to....play.....

I don't know about you, but I just bought ESO for a friend off of Steam for 20 bucks for Christmas, and he is playing it for free. Soooooooo....how is it not free to play? The subscription isn't mandatory, and you still have full access to the game without it.

Me thinks you don't know what free-to-play actually means.

ESO - Free-to-Play
League of Legends - Free-to-Play
World of Warcraft - Pay-to-Play
Hearthstone - Pay-to-Win

etc etc

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play?

Umm. That's what World of Warcraft does. And they obviously have no issues with it. Considering they are still the biggest MMO right now, regardless of the sub losses over the years, they still top the charts.

Soo, you're saying that just because your friend didn't have to pay for it (you payed for him) that it's free to play? Despite the fact that you payed for him so that he could have access to it at all? That is called buy to play. "Me thinks that you don't know what free-to-play actually means"

JKorr · December 2016

No

Sogreth wrote: »

This game....is....free....to....play.....

I don't know about you, but I just bought ESO for a friend off of Steam for 20 bucks for Christmas, and he is playing it for free. Soooooooo....how is it not free to play? The subscription isn't mandatory, and you still have full access to the game without it.

Me thinks you don't know what free-to-play actually means.

ESO - Free-to-Play
League of Legends - Free-to-Play
World of Warcraft - Pay-to-Play
Hearthstone - Pay-to-Win

etc etc

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play?

Umm. That's what World of Warcraft does. And they obviously have no issues with it. Considering they are still the biggest MMO right now, regardless of the sub losses over the years, they still top the charts.

Unless you stole the game dear, HE is playing for FREE because YOU PAID FOR IT.

He is enjoying a gift that you BOUGHT. Doesn't matter how much you paid for it, You PAID for it.

Free to play is go to the company site, download the game, make your account, and play. No monetary transactions of any kind at any point.

Until the player has to buy stuff in the free game so they're not spending the next 5 years to level up to 10. Then there will be financial transactions.

starkerealm · December 2016

No

Sogreth wrote: »

This game....is....free....to....play.....

I don't know about you, but I just bought ESO for a friend off of Steam for 20 bucks for Christmas, and he is playing it for free. Soooooooo....how is it not free to play? The subscription isn't mandatory, and you still have full access to the game without it.

Me thinks you don't know what free-to-play actually means.

ESO - Free-to-Play
League of Legends - Free-to-Play
World of Warcraft - Pay-to-Play
Hearthstone - Pay-to-Win

etc etc

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play?

Umm. That's what World of Warcraft does. And they obviously have no issues with it. Considering they are still the biggest MMO right now, regardless of the sub losses over the years, they still top the charts.

Three kinds of MMOs:

Free to Play, Buy to Play, and Box & Sub.

A free to play MMO is one with no financial barrier for entry. It's not actually a "free" game, but you can start playing, and keep playing, until you get bored or hit a hard wall that requires you to cough up cash to advance. Neverwinter The Old Republic and Path of Exile are examples.

Buy to Play are MMOs where you need to purchase the initial box, but can then play without paying a subscription. Examples would include The Elder Scrolls Online or The Secret World. Also, the original Guild Wars, and depending on how you classify it, possibly Diablo III.

Box & Sub games are ones where you need to buy the base product, and then pay a monthly subscription to retain access. WoW is one of the only remaining examples of this business model. You dubbed this Pay-to-Play, which isn't entirely wrong, but the term's a little misleading.

Pay to Win games are ones where microtransactions allow the players to purchase direct statistical advantages over other players. Hearthstone's iffy, but Neverwinter is certainly an example of this. They're not a different kind of MMO (hence, "three kinds" not four), but since you brought them up.

Phica_Lovic · December 2016

No

Isn't this the guy that tripped out on the forums a few days ago?
And a few days before that he said he was quitting, as we all stood and applauded?

starkerealm · December 2016

No

Phica_Lovic wrote: »

Isn't this the guy that tripped out on the forums a few days ago?
And a few days before that he said he was quitting, as we all stood and applauded?

Yes.

TerraDewBerry · December 2016

No

Sausage wrote: »

Expansion should be tried before F2P, imho. If they do it right they might be able to pull it off. Ive a feeling most devs are going to survival online genre, at least Funcom is with Conan Exiles, so Zen still have a chance with this. Theres no big MMORPG coming in next 2 or 3 year at least. Its almost stupid to give up now. Amazon Game Studio's New World is probably the next big thing and even it is survival online type of game with a MMO-twist.

Endgame streamlining, sea-battles, one more class, thats the start for expansion. Throw in flying mounts and you might have it.

Just FYI, Revelation Online is due out in I think sept 2017, and that will be a big MMORPG release, and it has flying..
I would really love to see an expansion for ESO. I think it's about time. I have no interest in Revelation Online simply because it's a game made in China, and I have no desire to line their pockets with money, but I imagine many other people won't have any problems with it being a Chinese release, and have no doubt many people will play it.

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

starkerealm · December 2016

No

Ahnastashia wrote: »

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

Vvardenfell?

TerraDewBerry · December 2016

No

starkerealm wrote: »

Ahnastashia wrote: »

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

Vvardenfell?

YES! Please

WhiteCoatSyndrome · December 2016

No

starkerealm wrote: »

Ahnastashia wrote: »

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

Vvardenfell?

If they come out with Vvardenfell next year I doubt many would object.

Though wasn't the latest guess May, to line up with the PC anniversary of Morrowind?

DorianDragonRaze · December 2016

No

The more money they get, the longer the game will live. B2P is more than enough.
You spend more then the game price just for one eatery hit, damn it.

Nemeliom · December 2016

Yes

Yes, but only if it doesn't become a P2W.

Danikat · December 2016

No

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

There is a lot of confusion it seems. The game is "free to play". Yes you have to buy it the box copy, but that then doesn't make it any different than any other single player game out there like Skyrim. You buy it, you don't have to pay another dime to get access to all content outside of expansions.

That business model is called Buy-to-Play, because you have to buy it before you can play it.

Free-to-Play means you can literally start playing the game without paying anything at all. Like phone games you just have to download but never pay even a penny to access.

The 3rd option is Pay-to-play, where instead of or as well as buying a copy of the game you have to pay regularly simply to access it.

I think B2P is a less well known term than the other two because until relatively recently it was the only option for single-player games and unheard of for MMOs so it wasn't named often.

TerraDewBerry · December 2016

No

Nemeliom wrote: »

Yes, but only if it doesn't become a P2W.

That's just it.. I have yet to see a free 2 play not eventually become an all out, no holds barred pay to win disaster. Please trust the many people in this thread who have indicated the mess free to play would become for the game. Just say oh heck NO to free to play!!

Stovahkiin · December 2016

No

Why is it that we've seen multiple examples of MMOs being ruined after going f2p, and yet some people still look at eachother and go, "Yup, free-to-play sounds like an excellent idea and will save this game!!!"

starkerealm · December 2016

No

WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Ahnastashia wrote: »

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

Vvardenfell?

If they come out with Vvardenfell next year I doubt many would object.

Though wasn't the latest guess May, to line up with the PC anniversary of Morrowind?

I honestly doubt we'll see it next year. Just based on the time things have been spending in development. But, still... it'd be cool.

Elsonso · December 2016

No

starkerealm wrote: »

WhiteCoatSyndrome wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Ahnastashia wrote: »

If I were ZOS, I'd come out with an awesome expansion right before the Revelation Online game launches.

Vvardenfell?

If they come out with Vvardenfell next year I doubt many would object.

Though wasn't the latest guess May, to line up with the PC anniversary of Morrowind?

I honestly doubt we'll see it next year. Just based on the time things have been spending in development. But, still... it'd be cool.

Well, given how quickly they rolled out Clockwork City, Mephala's Realm, and Murkmire, you are probably right. These things were revealed ages ago. They have "reinvented" the game, what, three times since we first saw them? If they take any longer, the next version of Duke Nukem will beat them.

Still, there is a reason for Vvardenfell to roll out in 2Q 2017. They might not do it that way, but there is a reason.

Jerezad · December 2016

Given the crappy state of other so-called "Free To Play" games in terms of content and community, I say "HELL NO!"

bulbousb16_ESO · December 2016

No

Is there an "I want it to go Subscription-only" option?

Valethar · December 2016

No

Nope. B2P keeps the worst of the trash out. Once you go F2P, you basically open the floodgates and let the sewage in.

Sogreth · January 2017

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play? Games should either be free, a one-time purchase, or as monthly payments. Buying the game makes it fall in the one-time purchase category. Forcing players to then pay for a temporary subscription is a bigger scam than the Crown store (with crates still taking the lead).

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Sogreth wrote: »

This game....is....free....to....play.....

I don't know about you, but I just bought ESO for a friend off of Steam for 20 bucks for Christmas, and he is playing it for free. Soooooooo....how is it not free to play? The subscription isn't mandatory, and you still have full access to the game without it.

Me thinks you don't know what free-to-play actually means.

ESO - Free-to-Play
League of Legends - Free-to-Play
World of Warcraft - Pay-to-Play
Hearthstone - Pay-to-Win

etc etc

Dracindo wrote: »

Why would you buy a game to pay for it every month to play?

Umm. That's what World of Warcraft does. And they obviously have no issues with it. Considering they are still the biggest MMO right now, regardless of the sub losses over the years, they still top the charts.

Soo, you're saying that just because your friend didn't have to pay for it (you payed for him) that it's free to play? Despite the fact that you payed for him so that he could have access to it at all? That is called buy to play. "Me thinks that you don't know what free-to-play actually means"

This post is claiming that you can't play without paying each month. What...do you expect to just get the game for free and play for free? Wtf. This game is FREE TO PLAY.

[Edit to remove flaming]

Don't edit my post without my permission. If I want to "flame" I'll do it.

TheBonesXXX · January 2017

Needs to be yoinked off the market and put back into development since there are so many glaring problems it makes ones eyes bleed.

free to play always translates into a loss of quality of work. plain and simple, no game that has ever went free to play remained good in quality and craftsmanship.

Being forgiving with their grevious errors, decisions, and putting marketing before putting the game on the shelf is the problem with the industry.

look at every game that has went that direction, straight down the crapper with crash-grabs and lazy designing furthermore, Bethesda needs complete control of it and Zenimax needs to go away.

SLaytanic · January 2017

No

If a monthly subscription fee is to expensive for you, maybe you should game less and make more money.

A_Pig · January 2017

No

I play on console and before ESO came out I played Neverwinter for a bit which was enjoyable enough I thought at the time not having much MMO experience.

Then ESO came out and thousands of hours in i have not stopped enjoying it. The other week I tried out Neverwinter again for a bit and the clutter on screen and all the currencies. Don't know how I liked it. Also tried Start Trek which is same and the horrid DC Universe.

Nothing like ESO on console despite its flaws. I guess FF might be good but not a fan of series or universe. Even if I did play on PC I think ESO would be my choice, I love Elder Scrolls too much and B2P with choice for sub (which I do since crafting bags) is perfect for it.

Not saying Zenimax wouldn't handle F2P better than others and maybe more foolish people who have never tried it and criticize it on old reviews would join in. But it is cheap enough as it is and I don't want it down that path.

SHADOW2KK · January 2017

No

TBH wish the game went back to sub only.

Kodrac · January 2017

No

Not no, but hell no!