I am a little confused as to why there is so few stamina morphs for classes in this game.

DragonBound · December 2016

I just think I should be able to run with what class skills I want along with a few melee ones and be just as viable, in my opinion 2 or 3 stam morph choices is way to little. I do not know about you but I am not so fond of the staff I want to run it on every magicka build.

Bryanonymous · December 2016

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

Hateanthem · December 2016

-Stam based crystal frags.
-More stam based crystal frags.
-even more stam based crystal frags.

DragonBound · December 2016

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Darkonflare15 · December 2016

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

DragonBound · December 2016

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways. But that makes sense that all skills where magicka based, hopefully they will have more options later down the road.

Sugaroverdose · December 2016

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways.

it's you, who missing a point here(sorry)
All what stamina should use from class abilities is utility, but someone forget it and broke intended resource pool separation.

Stamina have S&B, DW, Two handed and bow, it's 4 different skill lines which gives a lot of choices how to combine them with class utility skills, meanwhile magicka have destro and restro, so magicka have 2 weapon lines, stamina 4, two of them was boosted resently (like they were weak, hah).

Silver_Strider · December 2016

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways.

it's you, who missing a point here(sorry)
All what stamina should use from class abilities is utility, but someone forget it and broke intended resource pool separation.

Stamina have S&B, DW, Two handed and bow, it's 4 different skill lines which gives a lot of choices how to combine them with class utility skills, meanwhile magicka have destro and restro, so magicka have 2 weapon lines, stamina 4, two of them was bossted resently (like they were weak, hah).

This type of argument is sort of flawed as you don't consider class skills, which are largely magic based.

2 Weapon skill lines + 3 Class skill lines vs 4 Weapon skills lines.

Even if we took out all the class skills that have a stamina morph or are neutral in nature, Magic has more skills to choice from overall. Then, we have to consider the limitations involved with having a majority of those skills locked behind certain weapons, a limitation that does not affect magic users all that much, if at all. Finally, we have to consider that magic user can still utilize Dual Wield and S&B for a purpose, whereas Stamina cannot utilize either Destro or Resto staff for a purpose and this whole whole argument really loses all traction.

Bryanonymous · December 2016

Reston staff doesn't count as a DPS weapon. Any mage looking to do damage is narrowed to a destro staff, and then narrowed to an even smaller list of pretty much force pulse and elemental blockade. Sure, perhaps a few enjoy pulsar for awhile.

Now let's consider how many class abilities can actually be used for DPS as well... hmm? Well, as a sorc, I have liquid lightning, I have a couple buffs, and frags when it procs. Now you tell me how many possibilities stamina users have in any class with say dual wield on one bar, and a great sword or bow on the other. And they can continue to swap weapons freely.

Magic? Stuck with a destro, and a few class abilities. Stop whining about diversity when your choice obviously has more.

Voxicity · December 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways.

it's you, who missing a point here(sorry)
All what stamina should use from class abilities is utility, but someone forget it and broke intended resource pool separation.

Stamina have S&B, DW, Two handed and bow, it's 4 different skill lines which gives a lot of choices how to combine them with class utility skills, meanwhile magicka have destro and restro, so magicka have 2 weapon lines, stamina 4, two of them was bossted resently (like they were weak, hah).

This type of argument is sort of flawed as you don't consider class skills, which are largely magic based.

2 Weapon skill lines + 3 Class skill lines vs 4 Weapon skills lines.

Even if we took out all the class skills that have a stamina morph or are neutral in nature, Magic has more skills to choice from overall. Then, we have to consider the limitations involved with having a majority of those skills locked behind certain weapons, a limitation that does not affect magic users all that much, if at all. Finally, we have to consider that magic user can still utilize Dual Wield and S&B for a purpose, whereas Stamina cannot utilize either Destro or Resto staff for a purpose and this whole whole argument really loses all traction.

Basically this.

''look at all those weapon skills scaling off stamina'' is not a valid argument.

Bryanonymous · December 2016

You people do realize that out of 15 abilities for each class, most of them are not spamable DPS attacks, right?

Voxicity · December 2016

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Reston staff doesn't count as a DPS weapon. Any mage looking to do damage is narrowed to a destro staff, and then narrowed to an even smaller list of pretty much force pulse and elemental blockade. Sure, perhaps a few enjoy pulsar for awhile.

Now let's consider how many class abilities can actually be used for DPS as well... hmm? Well, as a sorc, I have liquid lightning, I have a couple buffs, and frags when it procs. Now you tell me how many possibilities stamina users have in any class with say dual wield on one bar, and a great sword or bow on the other. And they can continue to swap weapons freely.

Magic? Stuck with a destro, and a few class abilities. Stop whining about diversity when your choice obviously has more.

Magicka nightblade can use dual wield or resto with funnel/concealed, magicka templar can use dual wield with jabs. They can also use force pulse if they wish to. 3 choices of spammable on a magblade... compared to only 2 on a stamblade

plz buff stamina!!

FoolishHuman · December 2016

I wish there was a way to actually play physical character in this game, with stamina morphs that are not just spells with poison/disease damage, but actual physical attacks. Everyone is a mage in this game.
Also needs a stamina morph for all those self-healing skills.

As is now, stamina classes are very boring to play, because it's all the same with a slight variation of support skills based on your class.

Lieblingsjunge · December 2016

Sigh. Another "everything need to be viable for everyone and every spec, because I want to use xx for my yy character". Just no. There have been recently changes on a lot of classes thato has given them a Stamina Morph.

Besides. This is NOT TES, it's a MMO based off it. Meaning. Your options will not be as limitless as in TES games.

It's like if I play a tank - and demand that staves should be just as good as S&B to play with.

Or if I choose to spec as MDK and I want to use a 2H, because it looks cool (big sticks and all..) Where are my magicka 2h morphs??! QQQQ

Sugaroverdose · December 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways.

it's you, who missing a point here(sorry)
All what stamina should use from class abilities is utility, but someone forget it and broke intended resource pool separation.

Stamina have S&B, DW, Two handed and bow, it's 4 different skill lines which gives a lot of choices how to combine them with class utility skills, meanwhile magicka have destro and restro, so magicka have 2 weapon lines, stamina 4, two of them was bossted resently (like they were weak, hah).

This type of argument is sort of flawed as you don't consider class skills, which are largely magic based.

2 Weapon skill lines + 3 Class skill lines vs 4 Weapon skills lines.

Even if we took out all the class skills that have a stamina morph or are neutral in nature, Magic has more skills to choice from overall. Then, we have to consider the limitations involved with having a majority of those skills locked behind certain weapons, a limitation that does not affect magic users all that much, if at all. Finally, we have to consider that magic user can still utilize Dual Wield and S&B for a purpose, whereas Stamina cannot utilize either Destro or Resto staff for a purpose and this whole whole argument really loses all traction.

So stamblades didn't used cloak, relentless focus, stamdk didn't used take flight, obsidian shield, wings, dragon blood(when it was viable), etc?

Don't dumb people, stamina also used class skills so it's not only 4 weapon lines. It's ridiculous that developers gives 100% magic(where the f you've seen a guy who breath poison?) to physical characters.

VampiricByNature · December 2016

I think there are two sides to every coin.

I have a Stam blade and a magplar and I feel like they have a lot of diversity/abilities.

I tried to make a stamplar and THAT was a different story. I ended up race rolling so it could be a magplar, it was so bad.
I also do not enjoy my magsorc. (Which everyone seems to play but the skills are just blah to me) I simply do not play it.

I am starting a magdk and that is a blast so far. (The whip is great! The chains are a wonderful utility. Deep breathe is... omg. Love it. )

I also only pve so my opinion is biased and I play BiS rather than play-my-way. Certain classes just seem more fun to play and have more variety/individuality versus others.

Sugaroverdose · December 2016

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Sigh. Another "everything need to be viable for everyone and every spec, because I want to use xx for my yy character". Just no. There have been recently changes on a lot of classes thato has given them a Stamina Morph.

Besides. This is NOT TES, it's a MMO based off it. Meaning. Your options will not be as limitless as in TES games.

It's like if I play a tank - and demand that staves should be just as good as S&B to play with.

Or if I choose to spec as MDK and I want to use a 2H, because it looks cool (big sticks and all..) Where are my magicka 2h morphs??! QQQQ

Actually, TES have resource pool separation, people who use "play how you want" while asking for conversion magicka ability into stamina just don't have arguments.

starkerealm · December 2016

FoolishHuman wrote: »

Everyone is a mage in this game.

Yeah... that said, ESO was the first TES game in over a decade that allowed you to begin play without already knowing a couple spells. If you really want to limit yourself to weapon and armor skills, that is an option.

FoolishHuman · December 2016

starkerealm wrote: »

FoolishHuman wrote: »

Everyone is a mage in this game.

Yeah... that said, ESO was the first TES game in over a decade that allowed you to begin play without already knowing a couple spells. If you really want to limit yourself to weapon and armor skills, that is an option.

That's not my point. It never bothered me in Skyrim to have a spell and just not use it or rarely use the heal etc. However I'm pretty sure that in ESO things like Volley, Blade Cloak or the armor skills are spells and not physical feats. Limiting myself to certain skill because of that is also not really an option if I am going to be terrible. I'm just saying being able to play a simple rogue or warrior would be refreshing.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · December 2016

I would have loved to see it planned out differently. More stam morphs in the class skills, and more magika morphs in the weapon skill lines. I think it would have added a lot of variety to the game. But maybe that was the role spell crafting was suppose to fill before it got lost on the back burners.

I know variety in mmos is sometimes mostly smoke and mirrors since there is usually a handfull of skill sets that come out as 'best'. But i would love to be a magika templar with a glowing 2-handed sword of badassery.

Blackfyre20 · December 2016

Another thing to point out is how stamina classes can afford to (and should) use magicka skills for utility. Meanwhile magicka classes are either limited to one stamina skill that can be used only with the unchained passive or no stamina skills because they have to conserve their stamina to break free.

Glurin · December 2016

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

I would have loved to see it planned out differently. More stam morphs in the class skills, and more magika morphs in the weapon skill lines. I think it would have added a lot of variety to the game.

No, it really wouldn't. What it would actually do is completely void the separation between the magical and the physical. You may as well just get rid of magicka and stamina altogether and just have one resource pool that everything draws from.

We've already broken the rules enough. No need to pee all over them and toss them into a bonfire.

DPG76 · December 2016

when i started playing ESO i tought i had to play hybrid way like use weapon skills with stam and the class skills with magic with a few options to morph some of them to stamina to extend some abilities .
but then damage scales off max attribute , there goes hybrid for dps..

did someone mention that the fighters guild is also only stamina based skills unlike mages guild skills and where undaunted are mixed

Dagoth_Rac · December 2016

I think a lot of the problems go back to hybrid builds being just about useless in PvE and only useful in a few niche PvP builds. If hybrid builds were somehow enhanced, where running like 28k magicka and 28k stamina could be a viable option, instead of 45k magicka and 10k stamina because anything else loses too much DPS, you would be less concerned about what resource each skill used. Would there still be a "meta" and min/max builds? Of course. But I think it would open up build diversity nonetheless. Right now, there are just so many skills that are completely unthinkable for a given build. A Stamplar would never use Sun Fire as his DoT. It is not like it is a little below a min/max DoT like Trap Beast or Volley, but could still be pretty good outside of, say, hard mode Trials. It is just garbage for a Stamplar. You would not want it in a normal dungeon! I am OK with hybrid builds being non-optimal. But we are not talking 5% or 10% difference in DPS. Hybrid builds are probably losing out on 30% or 40% DPS compared to a build with 45K magicka or whatever. That is insane. They don't need to be meta builds, but they could at least be good.

So I think that there being this huge wall between "magicka builds" and "stamina builds" is a bigger problem than exactly what skill uses which resource.

Danksta · December 2016

There's many class skills that consume magicka but are very much intended for stamina users.

idk · December 2016

CosmicSoul wrote: »

I just think I should be able to run with what class skills I want along with a few melee ones and be just as viable, in my opinion 2 or 3 stam morph choices is way to little. I do not know about you but I am not so fond of the staff I want to run it on every magicka build.

First, it seems you did not start the game with the PC launch when any stam character was ether hybrid or only used weapon skills. There were no stam morphs of class skills.

Second, all class skills should. It have a stamina morph. Buffs especially as ideally magika so one is not using their stam just to buff them. Fragments would seem odd as a stam skill.

Finally, the bold sentence makes no sense. You don't like staffs yet want to run them on all characters. How does this even fit with stam builds to begin with.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · December 2016

Glurin wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

I would have loved to see it planned out differently. More stam morphs in the class skills, and more magika morphs in the weapon skill lines. I think it would have added a lot of variety to the game.

No, it really wouldn't. What it would actually do is completely void the separation between the magical and the physical. You may as well just get rid of magicka and stamina altogether and just have one resource pool that everything draws from.

We've already broken the rules enough. No need to pee all over them and toss them into a bonfire.

I guess we disagree because in not sure why that is a bad thing. The only difference in them now is stam has it easier dodging. Im not sure why opening up choices further would all of a sudden break things.

Glurin · December 2016

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

Glurin wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

I would have loved to see it planned out differently. More stam morphs in the class skills, and more magika morphs in the weapon skill lines. I think it would have added a lot of variety to the game.

No, it really wouldn't. What it would actually do is completely void the separation between the magical and the physical. You may as well just get rid of magicka and stamina altogether and just have one resource pool that everything draws from.

We've already broken the rules enough. No need to pee all over them and toss them into a bonfire.

I guess we disagree because in not sure why that is a bad thing. The only difference in them now is stam has it easier dodging. Im not sure why opening up choices further would all of a sudden break things.

Because you're rewriting the laws of physics as they apply to the ES universe. That and you're turning skill and attribute choices into one giant grey blob of homogenized goo.

Glurin · December 2016

Danksta wrote: »

There's many class skills that consume magicka but are very much intended for stamina users.

Which does not mean that said skills should pull from the stamina pool.

DragonBound · December 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Darkonflare15 wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Yea? And how many weapon morphs are there for magicka?

What weapon morphs? All weapon dps except for staffs are based off stamina for damage.

Yeah and most class skills are base off Magicka. When this game first came out, all class skills was base off Magicka.

Your missing the point considering your choosing a class you should be able to use your class skills with whatever weapon you want to use to an extent, the class skills are far more then the weapon skills anyways.

it's you, who missing a point here(sorry)
All what stamina should use from class abilities is utility, but someone forget it and broke intended resource pool separation.

Stamina have S&B, DW, Two handed and bow, it's 4 different skill lines which gives a lot of choices how to combine them with class utility skills, meanwhile magicka have destro and restro, so magicka have 2 weapon lines, stamina 4, two of them was bossted resently (like they were weak, hah).

This type of argument is sort of flawed as you don't consider class skills, which are largely magic based.

2 Weapon skill lines + 3 Class skill lines vs 4 Weapon skills lines.

Even if we took out all the class skills that have a stamina morph or are neutral in nature, Magic has more skills to choice from overall. Then, we have to consider the limitations involved with having a majority of those skills locked behind certain weapons, a limitation that does not affect magic users all that much, if at all. Finally, we have to consider that magic user can still utilize Dual Wield and S&B for a purpose, whereas Stamina cannot utilize either Destro or Resto staff for a purpose and this whole whole argument really loses all traction.

That and the fact your essentially making classes pointless by making them mostly magicka based, you really only get the weapons for stamina. He is missing the point.

DragonBound · December 2016

Bryanonymous wrote: »

Reston staff doesn't count as a DPS weapon. Any mage looking to do damage is narrowed to a destro staff, and then narrowed to an even smaller list of pretty much force pulse and elemental blockade. Sure, perhaps a few enjoy pulsar for awhile.

Now let's consider how many class abilities can actually be used for DPS as well... hmm? Well, as a sorc, I have liquid lightning, I have a couple buffs, and frags when it procs. Now you tell me how many possibilities stamina users have in any class with say dual wield on one bar, and a great sword or bow on the other. And they can continue to swap weapons freely.

Magic? Stuck with a destro, and a few class abilities. Stop whining about diversity when your choice obviously has more.

Are you talking to me? If you are I am not whinning stop trolling my post, what I am doing is pointing out the fact the class abilities do not have enough choice for stamina users period, it does not matter about weapons in my opinion magicka should have more weapon choice then staves as well but that is not the topic at the moment.