So after a break from PVP I decided to give it another shot

Alucardo · November 2016

Nope.

Alucardo · November 2016

@Wrobel any chance you could look at tanks killing medium armor builds in 2 punctures please? No rush. Just whenever you get around to it.

Thanks.

Alcast · November 2016

No Widowmaker proc in that death recap?

Alucardo · November 2016

Alcast wrote: »

No Widowmaker proc in that death recap?

Nah man. They were feeling generous

kevlarto_ESO · November 2016

I wonder how many people have stopped pvp'ing since the proctard builds ? I do see the population seems to be off, TF/NA still locks across the board but the other campaigns in NA seem very light unless they are picking up late at night or early in the morning.

They need to fix these stuff, I think they really need to restrict how these proc sets work, one set proc another set having more than one proc set on, it is crazy, and believe me it is getting over used and exploited to beyond it's max potential. For a while pvp was kind of balanced the ttk was not to short fights could happen, now I feel like I am playing Call of duty or some first person shooter with insta kills, this is NOT mmo combat, and NOT Elder Scrolls combat either. But we have devs that do not seem to understand how mmo's work /sigh

Kutsuu · November 2016

Zero procs in my build and I'm still killing far more than I die. Most of my deaths are to Magsorcs honestly. Yeah it can be annoying when you die really fast because someone's procs went off, but it's far from unplayable. I also choose not to look at death recaps and just get back in the fight...

@Alcast some of us still remember your heavy attack 1 shots buddy

Alcast · November 2016

Kutsuu wrote: »

Zero procs in my build and I'm still killing far more than I die. Most of my deaths are to Magsorcs honestly. Yeah it can be annoying when you die really fast because someone's procs went off, but it's far from unplayable. I also choose not to look at death recaps and just get back in the fight...

@Alcast some of us still remember your heavy attack 1 shots buddy

Member Berries membeeeee lol
member-berries.jpg?quality=90

At least back then it had style

Minnesinger · November 2016

Alucardo wrote: »

Nope.

It has become dangerous to run around these builds, but I feel players are adapting. I use u

Kutsuu wrote: »

Zero procs in my build and I'm still killing far more than I die. Most of my deaths are to Magsorcs honestly. Yeah it can be annoying when you die really fast because someone's procs went off, but it's far from unplayable. I also choose not to look at death recaps and just get back in the fight...

@Alcast some of us still remember your heavy attack 1 shots buddy

Remember the wreckin blow in death recap?

Alucardo · November 2016

Let's just remove normal abilities altogether and kill each other with proc sets. This is a *** joke. I'm so done with PVP until all these sets are removed from Cyrodiil/IC. If they're not, then I have no hope for PVP in this game at all. I want to fight players, not their *** armor.

Sugaroverdose · November 2016

Alucardo wrote: »

Let's just remove normal abilities altogether and kill each other with proc sets. This is a *** joke. I'm so done with PVP until all these sets are removed from Cyrodiil/IC. If they're not, then I have no hope for PVP in this game at all. I want to fight players, not their *** armor.

Proctards don't want to show they're skill, cause they just don't have it, and don't want to have it.

WillhelmBlack · November 2016

I know who that is.

Ankael07 · November 2016

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

I know who that is.

Half of the pvp player base ?

Rylana · November 2016

lol

Rohamad_Ali · November 2016

A fully loaded proctatoe with butter , sour cream and chives . Sprinkle of cheese .

Alucardo · November 2016

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

A fully loaded proctatoe with butter , sour cream and chives . Sprinkle of cheese .

You certainly know how to make *** PVP sound delicious

Lexxypwns · November 2016

This meta is garbage, but it can be beaten. The counter is keeping your health topped off and keep pressure on the proctato, he can't kill you if you don't let him and eventually he's gotta stop his 1 button win combo and heal, at this point if he's a stam sorc you make sure you're interrupting those dark deals, otherwise you'll run his resources out and beat him. The only REAL issue I have with viper+tremor+X is that sometimes even when you outplay them you can't close the deal, just never get too aggressive and lose sight of the fact that there's 20k instant damage loaded up ready to burst you every 4 seconds.

edit: you gotta run at least 25k health if not closer to 30 on medium armor to make it viable, HP actually has value this patch though since you get yourself out of the 1 hit threshold, once you do that you've got room to outplay and get work done.

Alucardo · November 2016

Lexxypwns wrote: »

This meta is garbage, but it can be beaten. The counter is keeping your health topped off and keep pressure on the proctato, he can't kill you if you don't let him and eventually he's gotta stop his 1 button win combo and heal, at this point if he's a stam sorc you make sure you're interrupting those dark deals, otherwise you'll run his resources out and beat him. The only REAL issue I have with viper+tremor+X is that sometimes even when you outplay them you can't close the deal, just never get too aggressive and lose sight of the fact that there's 20k instant damage loaded up ready to burst you every 4 seconds.

edit: you gotta run at least 25k health if not closer to 30 on medium armor to make it viable, HP actually has value this patch though since you get yourself out of the 1 hit threshold, once you do that you've got room to outplay and get work done.

Appreciate all the advice there, but do you see a small problem? To get 30k on his heavy armor build he sacrifices nothing, because HA just gives you that by wearing it - with medium armor you have to give up something to get that kind of health. To get high burst he sacrifices nothing; just has to wear proc sets. To get sustain he sacrifices nothing because that's built into heavy armor as well. They also get bonus healing to top it all off.
Proc sets enable these guys to play lazily and get away with it. It allows them to sacrifice very little to gain a lot. If you're still wearing medium armor though, be prepared to make some changes if you intend to fight them.
Now I'm not saying heavy armor is the issue. Proc sets are. It throws heavy armor out of balance, because not only do they have defence, but they have insane burst damage as well. This is the problem I have. I mean, god forbid they're using vitality pots as well.

Armitas · November 2016

Alucardo wrote: »

Nope.

20% active effort from the attacker, that is very similar to the amount of active effort ZOS has put into making a quality PvP combat experience. Development seems to be working under an "implement it now fix it later" policy which might be fine for PvE but it's destroying PvP.

sirston · November 2016

I ll make this comment again since it go wobbled last time I posted it. It gives trash players a purpose....

WillhelmBlack · November 2016

sirston wrote: »

I ll make this comment again since it go wobbled last time I posted it. It gives trash players a purpose....

Whilst I agree with this post, I'm 99% sure who killed him. He runs that exact set up and is the only person capable of killing him with or without the procs. Which is a shame because player who can't be named isn't a trash player, far from.

He is always one of the first to find the exploits though, you can see in the screenshot he knows how to make his procs ignore cooldowns, he doesn't seem a sore loser but he will use every exploit to beat you.

MaximillianDiE · November 2016

I don't have a problem with individual proc sets but for the love of god put a cooldown on them so you can't stack sets and get multiple procs off a single attack.

Alucardo · November 2016

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

sirston wrote: »

I ll make this comment again since it go wobbled last time I posted it. It gives trash players a purpose....

Whilst I agree with this post, I'm 99% sure who killed him. He runs that exact set up and is the only person capable of killing him with or without the procs. Which is a shame because player who can't be named isn't a trash player, far from.

He is always one of the first to find the exploits though, you can see in the screenshot he knows how to make his procs ignore cooldowns, he doesn't seem a sore loser but he will use every exploit to beat you.

I've bolded the two contradicting statements. To be honest it's hard to tell who is a good player and who isn't these days. The guy literally just pierced me a couple of times and my 24k health was gone. Hell, he hasn't even bothered to morph puncture yet. Just run around in loaded armor and you're good to go.

Alucardo · November 2016

MaximillianDiE wrote: »

I don't have a problem with individual proc sets but for the love of god put a cooldown on them so you can't stack sets and get multiple procs off a single attack.

That's one of the biggest issues, yeah. It wasn't so bad when red mountain/viper were the only proc sets around. People only started complaining when you could incorporate 2 or 3 in one build. When that fad caught on everyone started doing it.

olsborg · November 2016

The worst about proccsets isnt that they are "abused" hard right now, and its not that bad pvpers actually can burst you now..No.

The worst is, ZOS stupidly made this meta possible and whats worse, they will spend probably 2-4 months from today to try and fix it...and the solution/outcome will be far from what is needed. The result is: PvP will suffer and may not ever recover. Half my friendlist has quit and a big portion of those probably wont bother coming back, since the devs are making halfassed decisions/updates as we have seen lately.

DannyLV702 · November 2016

The very least they could do is make it so that onc proc activates the cool down timer on all your other procs. At the LEAST

Solariken · November 2016

DannyLV702 wrote: »

The very least they could do is make it so that onc proc activates the cool down timer on all your other procs. At the LEAST

This is a reasonable suggestion. I think most players would be fine with this.

I think it should be taken a step further and make all the monster set procs highly avoidable like Stormfist.

I also think Viper should have its damage spread over the 4 second window instead of being instant. Viper on top of Incap etc is just stupid.

susmitds · November 2016

Alcast wrote: »

No Widowmaker proc in that death recap?

They need to slip that Black Rose in, right?

Alucardo · November 2016

susmitds wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

No Widowmaker proc in that death recap?

They need to slip that Black Rose in, right?

Absolutely. Can't be wearing medium armor when there's perfectly good heavy ones out there!

aidenmoore · November 2016

I hate Tremorscale set and EoTS in PVP.

Lexxypwns · November 2016

Alucardo wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

This meta is garbage, but it can be beaten. The counter is keeping your health topped off and keep pressure on the proctato, he can't kill you if you don't let him and eventually he's gotta stop his 1 button win combo and heal, at this point if he's a stam sorc you make sure you're interrupting those dark deals, otherwise you'll run his resources out and beat him. The only REAL issue I have with viper+tremor+X is that sometimes even when you outplay them you can't close the deal, just never get too aggressive and lose sight of the fact that there's 20k instant damage loaded up ready to burst you every 4 seconds.

edit: you gotta run at least 25k health if not closer to 30 on medium armor to make it viable, HP actually has value this patch though since you get yourself out of the 1 hit threshold, once you do that you've got room to outplay and get work done.

Appreciate all the advice there, but do you see a small problem? To get 30k on his heavy armor build he sacrifices nothing, because HA just gives you that by wearing it - with medium armor you have to give up something to get that kind of health. To get high burst he sacrifices nothing; just has to wear proc sets. To get sustain he sacrifices nothing because that's built into heavy armor as well. They also get bonus healing to top it all off.
Proc sets enable these guys to play lazily and get away with it. It allows them to sacrifice very little to gain a lot. If you're still wearing medium armor though, be prepared to make some changes if you intend to fight them.
Now I'm not saying heavy armor is the issue. Proc sets are. It throws heavy armor out of balance, because not only do they have defence, but they have insane burst damage as well. This is the problem I have. I mean, god forbid they're using vitality pots as well.

Everything you're saying is true and I 100% agree with you. I'm just trying to help you find a way to enjoy Pvp ATM and for med/light builds there's only a few ways; shields, dodge roll, block+burst heals, or spec more health. I'd recommend running tri stat glyphs and a 5/1/1 setup for undaunted Passives, you have to make more sacrifices than the proctatoe but if they're not able to kill you with their "I win" button they get out of their comfort zone and you open yourself up to a world of counter play. I'm running 30k health on my light armor magplar setup but that's the price to pay for non-meta burst

Kutsuu · November 2016

I just don't let them see me until they're dead.

@Alcast it takes more hits now but bow heavy attack isn't dead yet!

https://youtu.be/OdJcrovAowY