There are three strains of Vampirism in Tamrielic lore; Porphyric Hemophilia, Sanguinare Vampiris, and Noxiphilic Sanguivoria. The type contracted in ESO is Noxiphilic Sanguivoria. Those afflicted by it are not weak to sunlight unlike those afflicted with Porphyric Hemophilia and Sanguinare Vampiris.

Hircine is known to bless those afflicted with lycanthropy with greater control over their affliction allowing them to transform at will.

Incorrect about the Dragonborn only being allowed to be Emperor. The Longhouse Emperors that preceded Varen were not of Alessia's bloodline. The only reason why being of Alessia's bloodline is considered necessary is to keep the Dragonfires lit. In Oblivion the last of the Septim dynasty caused the Amulet of Kings to break to stop the Oblivion Crisis effectively destroying that need to have someone to light the Dragonfires and maintain the covenant with Akatosh.

Animals of different species are known to live together in close distances. Some animals are however territorial.

As for your point about Liches being incorrectly attired, not all liches are known to dress the same. In fact, all depictions of liches vary on the game so there is no definitive style to them.

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

There are three strains of Vampirism in Tamrielic lore; Porphyric Hemophilia, Sanguinare Vampiris, and Noxiphilic Sanguivoria. The type contracted in ESO is Noxiphilic Sanguivoria. Those afflicted by it are not weak to sunlight unlike those afflicted with Porphyric Hemophilia and Sanguinare Vampiris.

Hircine is known to bless those afflicted with lycanthropy with greater control over their affliction allowing them to transform at will.

Incorrect about the Dragonborn only being allowed to be Emperor. The Longhouse Emperors that preceded Varen were not of Alessia's bloodline. The only reason why being of Alessia's bloodline is considered necessary is to keep the Dragonfires lit. In Oblivion the last of the Septim dynasty caused the Amulet of Kings to break to stop the Oblivion Crisis effectively destroying that need to have someone to light the Dragonfires and maintain the covenant with Akatosh.

Animals of different species are known to live together in close distances. Some animals are however territorial.

As for your point about Liches being incorrectly attired, not all liches are known to dress the same. In fact, all depictions of liches vary on the game so there is no definitive style to them.

Actually there are over 100 Different Strains of Vampirism, High Rock has over 9 of them and the sunlight damage is from an Aedric Curse, why would your bloodline has any effect over that? even Jyggalag wasn't immune to the effects of a curse and he was one of the most powerful gods in the entire series.

"As for your point about Liches being incorrectly attired, not all liches are known to dress the same. In fact, all depictions of liches vary on the game so there is no definitive style to them"

Read again what I wrote, I said all Lichs Dress like Ayleids for some reasons despite the fact very few of them actually are Ayleids., my whole point is they shouldn't all look the same, Gedhna Revel was a Dunmer yet for some reason wears an Ayleid Lich Crown, an Ayleid Lich Robe and so on.

Well, a few of the things you listed aren't actually lore problems.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Werewolves would turn under the moons, only reason the character in Skyrim could have control is unlike the Vestige they could become a werewolf through a ritual, in ESO you get turned by a disease no different to the character in Morrowind and they certainly didn't have control.

Nope, to become a werewolf in ESO you don't get turned just by the disease - you have to actually travel to Hircine's realm and complete a ritual hunt and feeding, after which Hircine personally grants you his blessing. Your lycanthropy in ESO is a much more direct gift from Hircine than even in Skyrim, so it makes much more sense that you'd be able to control it in ESO than it would in any other Elder Scrolls game (including Skyrim).

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Vampires would be harmed by sunlight (their is no reason why their bloodline would change that when the sun harming them was a curse)

Each vampiric bloodline comes from a specific individual who was cursed. Each bloodline has different powers and different weaknesses based on the original curse. The bloodline didn't change - it comes from a different source. The vampires in ESO (or at least the variety that you can become) have Noxiphilic Sanguivoria rather than Porphyric Hemophilia or Sanguinare Vampiris. Heck, the strain of vampirism you could get in Oblivion was a completely different one from the one you could get in Skyrim, and Daggerfall had 9 different versions of vampirism you could get (although they were similar enough that they were probably all variants on the same original bloodline).

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Only a Dragonborn during this time period would be fit to be Emperor which none of the players are.

That's not a lore problem at all. In fact, it's very lore-friendly. Do any player Emperors actually unite Cyrodiil and hold it, let alone form an actual Empire? Nope. The throne changes hands frequently in every campaign. Why? Because none of the players are Dragonborn. Established lore states that during the interregnum (ESO takes place during that period of Tamrielic history) there were many petty warlords who tried to take Cyrodiil and declare themselves Emperor, and until Tiber Septim none of them amounted to much before being dethroned. That's what's happening with the players in Cyrodiil.

UrQuan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

raidentenshu_ESO wrote: »

I'm too tired to go through each one right now but I want to reference this part.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Vampires would be harmed by sunlight (their is no reason why their bloodline would change that when the sun harming them was a curse)

-
The vampirism strain that players have is called Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Noxiphilic_Sanguivoria_(book)

The most important thing to remember about sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria is that, as the name implies, they are not weakened by daylight as in other strains of vampirism, but are, instead, strengthened during the nighttime hours.

Why this is the case is poorly understood. One of the more wild theories is that it is the result of some sort of Daedric backroom deal between Hircine and Molag Bal that has given sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria a werewolf-like love of moonlight.

By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds.

"By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds."

Why do they heal slower then? as far as Im concered all vampires take damage from the sun as it is a curse and not something that is genetic, ZoS's excuse for why they don't take sunlight damage is only to balance it in an MMO setting as has no part in the lore, that's like saying the vampirism cure in ESO is part of the lore when according to previous established lore that should not even be possible.

Well sure, if you make up your own lore then you can make anything lore-unfriendly in your own head...

To be perfectly honest, most of the things that people point to as not being lore friendly are based on that person either making up their own lore based on nothing but what they feel should be right, or it's based on people assuming that in-universe sources are always true and never inaccurate. Which is, frankly, a terrible assumption to make. No historian in real life would make such a terrible mistake, and over the years the Elder Scrolls games have gone out of their way to include things like books that contradict each other, or show distinct biases.

The established lore of the Elder Scrolls games is far far less cut and dry than most people make it out to be.

First of all it's Unlorefriendly not Lore Unfriendly secondly this is not something Im making up, Even dialogue in ESO would suggest you should be taking damage from Sunlight, why are these vampires even bothering with living in darkness then? Lamae Bal herself says that she Rejects the Light so why aren't they harmed by it? that's just game mechanics as far as I'm concerned, infact why do you take more damage from Dawnbreaker or Light Spells then hmm? shouldn't you take normal damage from them if your immune to sunlight?

UrQuan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

raidentenshu_ESO wrote: »

I'm too tired to go through each one right now but I want to reference this part.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Vampires would be harmed by sunlight (their is no reason why their bloodline would change that when the sun harming them was a curse)

-
The vampirism strain that players have is called Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Noxiphilic_Sanguivoria_(book)

The most important thing to remember about sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria is that, as the name implies, they are not weakened by daylight as in other strains of vampirism, but are, instead, strengthened during the nighttime hours.

Why this is the case is poorly understood. One of the more wild theories is that it is the result of some sort of Daedric backroom deal between Hircine and Molag Bal that has given sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria a werewolf-like love of moonlight.

By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds.

"By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds."

Why do they heal slower then? as far as Im concered all vampires take damage from the sun as it is a curse and not something that is genetic, ZoS's excuse for why they don't take sunlight damage is only to balance it in an MMO setting as has no part in the lore, that's like saying the vampirism cure in ESO is part of the lore when according to previous established lore that should not even be possible.

Well sure, if you make up your own lore then you can make anything lore-unfriendly in your own head...

To be perfectly honest, most of the things that people point to as not being lore friendly are based on that person either making up their own lore based on nothing but what they feel should be right, or it's based on people assuming that in-universe sources are always true and never inaccurate. Which is, frankly, a terrible assumption to make. No historian in real life would make such a terrible mistake, and over the years the Elder Scrolls games have gone out of their way to include things like books that contradict each other, or show distinct biases.

The established lore of the Elder Scrolls games is far far less cut and dry than most people make it out to be.

First of all it's Unlorefriendly not Lore Unfriendly

lol no it's not... Unlorefriendly isn't a word.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

secondly this is not something Im making up, Even dialogue in ESO would suggest you should be taking damage from Sunlight, why are these vampires even bothering with living in darkness then? Lamae Bal herself says that she Rejects Arkay's Light so why aren't they harmed by it? that's just game mechanics as far as Im concerned.

It is something you're making up. We know that other strains of vampirism are harmed by sunlight, but we know that this strain isn't. There are tons of strains of vampirism that we haven't actually seen in any Elder Scrolls game: most likely some of them are harmed by sunlight, and most likely others aren't. We also know that even though this strain isn't harmed by sunlight it is still stronger in the dark than in sunlight, and that's why vampires of this strain usually stay in darkness where possible.

As I said then why do you take greater damage from Light Related Spells and the Dawnbreaker then? shouldn't you be taking normal damage due to being immune to sunlight, can you explain that?

All that other stuff aside...

If you look down into the water while being ripped apart by slaughterfish.... You can most defnitely see them! (as you can other types of fish while fishing).

They're not one bit invisible!

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Established lore of the Single Player games

No such thing.

Recremen wrote: »

Half of your arguments are failing to respect that game experience != character experience and the other half looks like complete conjecture. In all of the Elder Scrolls games, the density of creatures/buildings/interesting locations, creature interaction, etc., are best interpreted as "highlights" of your character's experience. You need to use a little bit of imagination to fill in the blanks, since it's downright impossible to actually code and populate a world as large as Nirn "should" be. Those items don't fail to abide by the lore, they are just helpful constructs to illustrate the themes of the world.

Azra may have been a powerful shadowmage, but that does not mean that Nightblades are heirs to world-sundering arcana. Most adventurers are just not going to be as good as such a singular, legendary figure. Ordinators wouldn't be rude because they have been instructed by Almalexia to put on their diplomat masks, to better serve Morrowind in her hour of plight. We haven't necessarily seen a proper Cliff Racer yet, just some flying creatures that some folks interpret as them. In any case, most were probably egged on by the Blight, and they may not necessarily be as hostile normally. People dressing up as Aylieds is very popular this era and it is no surprise that many famous heroes and villains are in that armor. Heck, look at the entire Mage's Guild. Claiming the title of Emperor is not equivalent to actually lighting the dragonfires, so even if the player isn't a Dragonborn (debatable), it's not a necessity to claim the Emperor title.

Bleh, use some imagination!

There are cliffracers in stonefalls, I'm not talking about the vultures and how hard is it to create a mesh for Ayleid Lichs and a Mesh for Non-Ayleid Lichs.

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Nightblades would be leagues above all other classes (They utilize Shadow-magic which is a form of sorcery powerful enough to rival the power of the elder scrolls themselves, one particular shadow-mage named Azra nightwielder became so powerful he ended up losing control of his own magic and blew a giant crater in the ground which became later known as Azra's Crossing)

Illusion magic, summoned weapons and lifedrain (aka Restoration magic) are not "leagues above" anything else.

- The Vestige according to lore should be harmed by Silver on account of what Lyrus Titanborn says near the start of the game.

Game mechanics.
There should be pvp differences between a human, werewolf and vampire, right?
Also, if I remember correctly, in Skyrim Silver Hand's swords didnt do any extra damage to daedric beings, only to undead and wws. And ofc you could wear silver jewelry as a vampire, and even loot if from other vampires.

- Werewolves would turn under the moons, only reason the character in Skyrim could have control is unlike the Vestige they could become a werewolf through a ritual, in ESO you get turned by a disease no different to the character in Morrowind and they certainly didn't have control.

Actually in TESO you're making a pact with HIrcine himself. So its not any different.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1i0-Bjyq4w

- Vampires would be harmed by sunlight (their is no reason why their bloodline would change that when the sun harming them was a curse)

As it was already mentioned, there are different types of vampirism.
Also, it was needed because in a mmo, unlike single-player games, a player doesnt have control over game time. In Morrowind you could just press a button and wait a bit, in ESO it would just make characters unplayable for the most of time.

- Many books would not exist (Yes Im aware of the Hermaeus Mora/Apocyrpha theory explainging why books that have even been written yet are in the game)

Could be a side effect of a dragon break.
When the whole reality is being dragged to another dimension, something like this can easily happen.

Actually the reason you should be harmed by silver is simply due to the vestige technically being dead, lyrus Titanborn even states that in one of the first few things she says when you first meet her that "you won't believe it but your dead", nothing from that point on to you going through the portal shows any sign of a Resurrection, the closet would be absorbing the Sky Shard but that only attunes you to Nirn which prevents you from respawning in Oblivion, as for vampirism and lycanthropy, on a more serious note the vestige logically shouldn't even beable to become a vampire, It is a curse which is proven by the fact that it follows you into death but when someone dies they still have a soul, the vestige however doesn't so what part of them exactly is the vampiric curse latching onto? can't be their body as that keeps getting remade after you die so how does the Vestige even stay a vampire? in the absence of a soul you should technically be cured everytime you are killed.

As for the Nightblades., right from the book "Shadow Draining A hypothesis"

By the Glimmering Foxbat
"Anyone who studies the so-called "shadow magic" of the underworld's nightblades is familiar with the siphoning spells, which drain life force and health from the injured to the injurer. The question before the scholar-arcanist is to explain how and why this works. After prolonged study, primarily through low-grade siphoning of my menials and their families while they slept, I have arrived at a hypothesis.
It appears to me that the magical siphoning of health is related to the instant translocation spells insofar as it creates a transliminal flow of essence from the target to the caster. Through the hyperagonal magicka sense, the nightblade perceives the target's transpontine deformation and "pierces" it, and in the resulting disruption absorbs the essence that is lost by the target. Thus, instead of "stepping through shadows" as in translocation, the mage is "shadow draining" from one location to another.
Or so my experiments indicate."

They use Shadow Magic and according to the USEP

"Shadow Magic is an obscure but powerful form of magic. It was first harnessed by Azra Nightwielder, who was the first to discover that shadow was not simply an absence of light, but a reflection of possible worlds created by forces in conflict. Shadows can be produced by mundane forces such as light hitting a rock, or by more powerful forces such as nations at war. Shadow Magic involves the manipulation of shadows to affect the forces creating it.[1] In this way, Shadow Magic rivals even the power of the Elder Scrolls themselves, having the power to potentially change the past, present, and future through the manipulation of shadow. Shadow magics by their nature will twist on their casters, and shadowmages are often distrusted because of this.[2] Shadow Magic is common around the Hammerfell-Skyrim-High Rock border, but is rarely used elsewhere.[3] During the Second Era, it was harnessed by so-called "Nightblades"

Drummerx04 wrote: »

I don't understand your issue with vampires not taking sunlight damage in ESO... The developers/loremasters/whatever you want to call them give a direct explanation as to why ESO's vamps don't take sun damage: a different strain of a disease/curse. What more could you possibly want than that?

Do you want to now what my problem is? do you know why vampires are harmed by sunlight at all? its because of a curse most likely bestowed upon them by either Arkay or perhaps even Meridia, Why would their bloodline render them immune to an Aedric Curse.

dsalter wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

I don't understand your issue with vampires not taking sunlight damage in ESO... The developers/loremasters/whatever you want to call them give a direct explanation as to why ESO's vamps don't take sun damage: a different strain of a disease/curse. What more could you possibly want than that?

Do you want to now what my problem is? do you know why vampires are harmed by sunlight at all? its because of a curse most likely bestowed upon them by either Arkay or perhaps even Meridia, Why would their bloodline render them immune to an Aedric Curse.

because this particular strand is a direct curse from Molag Bal himself, being shunned, a desire for blood, the craving. THAT is the curse.
but those who gained it from being passed on embraced it's features.
later strands were either magically manipulated or "blessings" from Molag to make them better night hunters since if they failed to stay in the shadows they'd just be seen as weaklings.

How would her clan be any different from Say the Volkihar vampires? Harkon was turned directly by Molag Bal as well, what makes her so different? shouldn't he be immune to sunlight as well despite the fact the whole dawnguard questline was to shroud the sun darkness to eliminate that very weakness that they had.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

I don't understand your issue with vampires not taking sunlight damage in ESO... The developers/loremasters/whatever you want to call them give a direct explanation as to why ESO's vamps don't take sun damage: a different strain of a disease/curse. What more could you possibly want than that?

Do you want to now what my problem is? do you know why vampires are harmed by sunlight at all? its because of a curse most likely bestowed upon them by either Arkay or perhaps even Meridia, Why would their bloodline render them immune to an Aedric Curse.

Same reason the flu is different from a cold, despite having similar symptoms. They're not the same disease. There are in fact many such diseases that have symptoms resembling each other, but treatments for one won't do anything for the other or possibly even make it worse.

altemriel wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

raidentenshu_ESO wrote: »

I'm too tired to go through each one right now but I want to reference this part.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

- Vampires would be harmed by sunlight (their is no reason why their bloodline would change that when the sun harming them was a curse)

-
The vampirism strain that players have is called Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Noxiphilic_Sanguivoria_(book)

The most important thing to remember about sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria is that, as the name implies, they are not weakened by daylight as in other strains of vampirism, but are, instead, strengthened during the nighttime hours.

Why this is the case is poorly understood. One of the more wild theories is that it is the result of some sort of Daedric backroom deal between Hircine and Molag Bal that has given sufferers of Noxiphilic Sanguivoria a werewolf-like love of moonlight.

By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds.

"By night, these hunters are possessed of extreme fortitude and a powerful ability to recover from wounds."

Why do they heal slower then? as far as Im concered all vampires take damage from the sun as it is a curse and not something that is genetic, ZoS's excuse for why they don't take sunlight damage is only to balance it in an MMO setting as has no part in the lore, that's like saying the vampirism cure in ESO is part of the lore when according to previous established lore that should not even be possible.

your argument is invalid: as far as Im concered all vampires take damage from the sun as it is a curse and not something that is genetic,

a curse has efects on the body, which encode in the genetic structure, so the transformation is both magical and physical. the same vice versa - if there is a mutation, there must be a magical precedesor for that. so being able to walk in sunlight is a natural result of magical evolution of a vampiric bloodline. there can be even bloodlines there, which still maintained the vampire lord form and in the same time are able to walk in the sunlight with no harm.

Just so you know that form is of Harkon's Bloodline, no other vampire clan can transform into it, ES legends for example has It so the only vampire card that can be upgraded into a vampire lord card just so happens to be a volkihar card.

There is only one other theory that I would accept and it is this one, The vampire's of Lamae Bal's clan may actually be a primitive unevolved bloodline, they were the first clan and do not have fangs for one thing...they may not have evolved them yet, the clan for all we know might actually be weaker by 3rd and 4th era vampire standards, sure they may be powerful in the 2nd era where they are still among the strongest of vampires but ask yourself where are they by the 3rd and 4th eras? they are immortal are they not, they should of still lived into that time period unless they were destroyed, one theory is that they may have been surpassed by more evolved forms of vampire like the Order of Cyrodiil, their is the concept that when a vampire's strength increases so does their weakness's and since these vampire's don't have many weakness's they mustn't have much strength either.