Are you ok with Crown Store ONLY Motifs like the Grim Harlequin?

Streega · October 2016

No.

First, I can get along with Crown Store exclusive items, as long as they don't give any advantage. I could get along with the GR Motiff "exclusiveness" too, (however IMO it is the first minor step to P2W model), but not with the Mimic Stones requirement. Long time ago I used to live in Moscow for few years, and there was an "exclusive" shop for dignitaries and diplomats, with high quality goods and food, mostly imported. The thing is it wasn't available to the general public, even if they had the money. This is what ZOS is doing now. As an ingame character I cannot make the armour I like because there is no way I could get the necessary knowledge (technology?) and materials: nor for money, nor as a reward for slaying a dragon or hordes of undead. Now, there may be a master crafter somewhere who can craft the armour for me, but the stones we need are unobtainable!
Very disappointing, I thought ZOS wouldn't fall so low. Do you really want goldsellers back? Furthermore, this motiff is the first thing you can actually turn into a real money, not ingame gold (without selling a whole account, that is)... Very slippery slope.

Vipstaakki · October 2016

Yes.

Reykice wrote: »

The Grim Harlequin motif is now only found in the Crown Store. I thought motifs were supposed to also be in the Crown Store but not exclusive to it.

ZOS, will you stop here or will we see other surprises added? Why are you even doing this, is the game in financial trouble?

What makes you think they are in financial trouble? Aren't they just giving out THREE trips to locations around the world for free?

notimetocare · October 2016

Yes.

My only issue is the lack of a dropping style material. Makes crafting for others more difficult

notimetocare · October 2016

Yes.

zadrotscrolls wrote: »

Its goldconvertor. NO!

Yea, that like 5k max someone would pay. P2W argument is next, yea?

Iluvrien · October 2016

No.

notimetocare wrote: »

zadrotscrolls wrote: »

Its goldconvertor. NO!

Yea, that like 5k max someone would pay. P2W argument is next, yea?

This is boiling the frog. And so far people have accepted every increase in temperature.

Personofsecrets · October 2016

No.

More pay to win

Alucardo · October 2016

Can you change "Don't know" to "Don't care"?

kevlarto_ESO · October 2016

Don`t know.

Does not matter if I like it or not it will not change the fact they will add them anyway regardless of my opinion.

SamboJ · October 2016

The crown store needs more motifs to support the unlucky players that never seem to get good item drops.

TheDarkRuler · October 2016

Yes.

I rather have them add cosmetics for real-money purchase than having them add functional stuff for sale because they need to make money.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar · October 2016

No.

Wow wrote: »

Consumers defending bad business practices of companies to justify their own purchases are worse than the companies that made bad business descisions in the first place.
Stop defending ZOS over the grim harlequin thing, they *** up, they are a big company they dont need your support or your petty downvoting of people that dont want to be screwed over.

This kind of thing pisses me off. You are the consumers, you are not the PR people of a company. Stop beeing unpaid shills and have some dignity.

Couldnt say it better. Can I use this quote in a youtube video pls?

Peekachu99 · October 2016

Yes.

branstark wrote: »

Have your forgotten Zenimax is a business? And at the same time, they're giving a full motif (which is pretty badass looking) out for free? Or do you just want everything for free??

Using this logical argument will get you called one or all of the following around here: "white knight, pay to player, ZoS schill."

Also, you've probably triggered the avalanche of "slippery slope" SOON THEY'LL COME FOR OUR CHILDREN!!! Hysterics.

Peekachu99 · October 2016

Yes.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

Consumers defending bad business practices of companies to justify their own purchases are worse than the companies that made bad business descisions in the first place.
Stop defending ZOS over the grim harlequin thing, they *** up, they are a big company they dont need your support or your petty downvoting of people that dont want to be screwed over.

This kind of thing pisses me off. You are the consumers, you are not the PR people of a company. Stop beeing unpaid shills and have some dignity.

Couldnt say it better. Can I use this quote in a youtube video pls?

It's actually a terrible, complete straw man argument since it completely ignores the wants and decisions of how almost 50% of this thread (who voted "yes") choose to spend their money.

It's myopic and one-sided.

STEVIL · October 2016

Yes.

I have to vote no because of the +10% damage while wearing and the... oh.. wait... its purely cosmetic?

Ok no its fine.

k9mouse · October 2016

No.

UrQuan wrote: »

I'm not OK with it, but the reason I'm not OK with it is because I think it's bad game design. Or, more accurately, it's a step backwards for the design of ESO.

I mean, the price of this particular bundle with the motif and the mimic stones is OK by me, and actually pretty damn reasonable. I also don't have a problem in general with motifs being available in the crown store, or with the general idea of having things available exclusively in the crown store that don't give you any in-game advantages.

The reason I'm not OK with it, though, is because most of the motifs that have been added to the game have been done in ways that encourage people to play the game. I'm not really OK with ZOS moving away from that model. I know lots of people who get excited to go and do certain content in order to get motifs - I'm often one of them. A lot of the time doing content to grind out motifs ends up being a lot of fun, and involves grouping with people and enjoying doing stuff that you couldn't do solo (and sometimes it involves doing solo stuff). And most importantly, a lot of times you're having fun doing content that you wouldn't have been running if it wasn't for the motif.

I don't know anyone who logs on, buys something from the crown store and says "wow, I had so much fun going to the crown store just now, and I wouldn't have done that or had that fun if it hadn't been for that motif that's there exclusively".

tl;dr: well designed motif grinds can help make lots of content fun for people. Putting a motif exclusively in the crown store doesn't.

This is how I feel as well.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar · October 2016

No.

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

Consumers defending bad business practices of companies to justify their own purchases are worse than the companies that made bad business descisions in the first place.
Stop defending ZOS over the grim harlequin thing, they *** up, they are a big company they dont need your support or your petty downvoting of people that dont want to be screwed over.

This kind of thing pisses me off. You are the consumers, you are not the PR people of a company. Stop beeing unpaid shills and have some dignity.

Couldnt say it better. Can I use this quote in a youtube video pls?

It's actually a terrible, complete straw man argument since it completely ignores the wants and decisions of how almost 50% of this thread (who voted "yes") choose to spend their money.

It's myopic and one-sided.

Oh so buying gold for real money is ok, ok.

Tryxus · October 2016

Yes.

STEVIL wrote: »

I have to vote no because of the +10% damage while wearing and the... oh.. wait... its purely cosmetic?

Ok no its fine.

This describes it best: the motif is a perk, not an unfair advantage

Lunarhound · October 2016

Yes.

I'm okay with them, but I'd prefer if they were clearly marked as Crown Store exclusives, simply so that it's easy to know which ones can be obtained in the game and which ones can't, without having to do research. And by clearly marked, I mean an actual label of some sort, prominently displayed, not just an "only in the crown store!" line tacked on to the end of the description. Maybe the Grim Harlequin has such a label? I don't know. I can't remember, and I'm at work, so can't log in right now.

And I should add that while I'm okay with them, that doesn't mean I prefer them. Being able to obtain them in game as well is always preferable.

Peekachu99 · October 2016

Yes.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

Consumers defending bad business practices of companies to justify their own purchases are worse than the companies that made bad business descisions in the first place.
Stop defending ZOS over the grim harlequin thing, they *** up, they are a big company they dont need your support or your petty downvoting of people that dont want to be screwed over.

This kind of thing pisses me off. You are the consumers, you are not the PR people of a company. Stop beeing unpaid shills and have some dignity.

Couldnt say it better. Can I use this quote in a youtube video pls?

It's actually a terrible, complete straw man argument since it completely ignores the wants and decisions of how almost 50% of this thread (who voted "yes") choose to spend their money.

It's myopic and one-sided.

Oh so buying gold for real money is ok, ok.

You're missing the player part of that transaction, for which people can barter/ trade or simply ask. THERE IS NO "1 million gold" for 1000 crowns purchase in the Crown Store. It doesn't exist.

Does this make the style exclusive, as so many things have been before? Yes. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that since it's ENTIRELY cosmetic. You do not need a spooky motif, and no benefits are conferred upon your character by wearing that style. You only want it, therefore it can not and will never be a "pay to win" item. The flow of cash thereafter all occurs in game through legitimate player mercantile. Wanting it, even so bad it hurts, does not increase the statistical value of the motif. People are conflating need/ want and adding all sorts of fearmongering and worst case scenarios into the mix. I know I'm not going to change your or anyone else in your camp's mind, but the lengths people are going to in order to slap some kind of pay to win label on this game are stratospherically delusional.

Go play Forsaken World, or the thousands of other cash-shop driven MMORPGs and get back to me after you've gone bankrupt and sold your kidneys for their version of pay to win.

Elsonso · October 2016

No.

GDOFWR420 wrote: »

Zos employees still have to pay bills just like us.

That is their responsibility, not ours. That is why they have a job and get paid by ZOS. If you are looking for a good charity to give your money to, I can suggest a few.

By this logic, we should be giving @ZOS_DaryaK and co-workers a cash tip every time a thread is moved to the proper forum. Not that they would complain, I suppose.

Reykice · October 2016

No.

lordrichter wrote: »

GDOFWR420 wrote: »

Zos employees still have to pay bills just like us.

That is their responsibility, not ours. That is why they have a job and get paid by ZOS. If you are looking for a good charity to give your money to, I can suggest a few.

By this logic, we should be giving @ZOS_DaryaK and co-workers a cash tip every time a thread is moved to the proper forum. Not that they would complain, I suppose.

Yea if your game is good enough sub only is fine, WOW proved it. If not you need to do free to play where the shady deals begin... all i`m saying is stick to the stuff you already have no need for motifs and crates and such.

Iluvrien · October 2016

No.

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

Consumers defending bad business practices of companies to justify their own purchases are worse than the companies that made bad business descisions in the first place.
Stop defending ZOS over the grim harlequin thing, they *** up, they are a big company they dont need your support or your petty downvoting of people that dont want to be screwed over.

This kind of thing pisses me off. You are the consumers, you are not the PR people of a company. Stop beeing unpaid shills and have some dignity.

Couldnt say it better. Can I use this quote in a youtube video pls?

It's actually a terrible, complete straw man argument since it completely ignores the wants and decisions of how almost 50% of this thread (who voted "yes") choose to spend their money.

It's myopic and one-sided.

Oh so buying gold for real money is ok, ok.

You're missing the player part of that transaction, for which people can barter/ trade or simply ask. THERE IS NO "1 million gold" for 1000 crowns purchase in the Crown Store. It doesn't exist.

Does this make the style exclusive, as so many things have been before? Yes. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that since it's ENTIRELY cosmetic. You do not need a spooky motif, and no benefits are conferred upon your character by wearing that style. You only want it, therefore it can not and will never be a "pay to win" item. The flow of cash thereafter all occurs in game through legitimate player mercantile. Wanting it, even so bad it hurts, does not increase the statistical value of the motif. People are conflating need/ want and adding all sorts of fearmongering and worst case scenarios into the mix. I know I'm not going to change your or anyone else in your camp's mind, but the lengths people are going to in order to slap some kind of pay to win label on this game are stratospherically delusional.

Go play Forsaken World, or the thousands of other cash-shop driven MMORPGs and get back to me after you've gone bankrupt and sold your kidneys for their version of pay to win.

1) It is not entirely cosmetic. It is cosmetic in its effect, not in its nature. This is the function of a craftable motif. If this was yet another polymorph or costume, I suspect that the outcry would be far less vociferous.

2) You specify that gold transactions occur through "legitimate player mercantile". Does having this, Crown store exclusive, motif offer you any benefit whatsoever in the marketplace by, for example, having access to something that cannot be achieved through play alone?

3) This isn't about P2W now. This is about the people who have been watching the progression that ZOS has been following and have concerns about the likely destination.

4) I've played P2W games. I have no desire to see ESO become one... hence my taking parts in threads like this one.

KingMagaw · October 2016

No.

Iluvrien wrote: »

3) This isn't about P2W now. This is about the people who have been watching the progression that ZOS has been following and have concerns about the likely destination.

My thoughts exactly. No company jumps in with Buy your maelstorm weapons here, its plain stupid. They softly introduce stuff until its mainly accepted that crown store exclusive purchases will happen. In 6 months from now, when Z0$ does add P2W items, or crown store exclusive items that do have a benefit in game, it will be said, sure 6 months ago there was crown store exclusives hardly anyone had a problem then why now...

Z0$ are obviously on the fast progression to increase revenue from here, thus this crown store exclusive motif. Once hardly any of the cosmetic *** sells, or the greed increases, items to the crown store will get buffed to make them more viable for a player to spend on, which basically means better items and/or more useful in game and/or offers an advantage over someone who didnt pay for it.

it was only ~9months ago Z0$ said they werent introducing gamble boxes. dont even have the integrity to stand over what they state.

Aquanova · October 2016

Yes.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »

Aquanova wrote: »

It's cosmetic only and has no effect on actual game play so yeah why not?

They need to make money to keep the game going.

buy motif, sell crafted gear in game for gold. AKA gold converter.

And that effects the game how by having more gold in your pocket?

Is there a set like Imperial physique that uses gold instead?

Also, who the he'll makes gold selling crafted armor? You act like this is a thriving industry that no one's attempted yet.

In case you didn't know, everyone is farming for dropped set's after this patch. Function > Style. At least it is for those of us who have played this game since 2014.

Go ahead and try to do that "Gold Converter" thing. You'd be better off selling tempers, raw mats, motifs, alchemical ingredients, dropped gear from both pve and pvp.

If ZOS allowed us to convert styles of dropped gear than maybe.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar · October 2016

No.

What I hear is buying gold for real money is ok because its not direct gold but gold you have to pay real money then sell junk in game for, sounds fine. /sarcasm.

Troneon · October 2016

No.

jeevin wrote: »

These cash store shenanigans are getting worse. Pushing cash motifs and mimic stones is just lazy development. If Zos wants my cash they need to make more game and less crown store crap.

Exactly....but as long as sheeple keep throwing money away we have to keep putting up with it and will only get worse....better to find a game company that does not stoop so low.

BlueViolet · October 2016

I bought it because I could see up front exactly what I was getting, and it wasn't stuffed into a stupid RNG crate.
The price was also extremely reasonable. I wish they would sell motifs ( not exclusive ) at this price all the time.
I didn't vote because I bought it as I really liked it, but I would prefer it not be exclusive.

That said, I do think that it would have been a lot nicer if the full book had been a rare drop from the Plunder Skulls like the Masks.
I still don't have one of those damned things

FelixTheCatt · October 2016

Don`t know.

I just voted "Don't know". Reason being it's their game , do with it what you will. I'd like the option of being able to earn the motifs in-game but what can you do?

dodgehopper_ESO · October 2016

No.

My complaint with it has to do with the sense of achievement that cash shops steal away from MMO's. Ultimately they have a way of sucking the air (fun) out of the room over time, and this gets dangerously close to that. For a player who enjoyed earning things like motifs, I was already unhappy with having motifs on the store as an option to farming them. Their existence as a motif earned only on the store really rubs me wrong.

Hortator Indoril Nerevar · October 2016

No.

I was about to buy the EP horse and when the motif was a exclusive I decided then and there to not buy anything again.... why pay now so later we can see the game fall apart... small bit by bit...