Because of race change meta.

Koolio · September 2016

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

Pallio · September 2016

Absolutely, it would only make sence to from a business perspective. That's why you should have both for each class to be safe, they were pretty careful last patch not to over buff say Redguard vs. Kajiit etc. But, I would expect magic vs. stam to always be a tug of war....

Eleusian · September 2016

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

Soon as they announced they would do this I thought of how bad DCUO abbused this every patch. Mainly the reason I left that game. Crossing fingers Zeni has cash flow not to resort to such ridiculous money making scheme. But they did do the gamble boxes so I dunno.

KingYogi415 · September 2016

Balance is amazing and they didnt change much this time around! Evry single of the 8 specs has it's purpose

Wing · September 2016

I played a magicka khajiit for 2 years (started as a khajiit in morrowind), I will continue to play what I want and try to excel at it regardless of what the "meta" dictates

Nestor · September 2016

In any MMO, one thing you can be sure of is your favorite class build this month will get nerfed next month. I have seen all 4 classes be at the top, and all 4 of them pulled down from the top, sometimes to the bottom, sometimes just a notch or two. I have seen Stamina be the red headed step child, I have seen Magic get locked in the basement closet.

As mentioned above, the cheap way to handle this is to have all 8 combos leveled up and ready to go. Or, have some gold for respecs and you can do this with 4 slots. But at least your not spending hard earned cash just to change things around.

PurifedBladez · September 2016

Stamtilldeath

Totalitarian · September 2016

I have a magicka and stamina variant of each class, so I'm safe. XD

QuebraRegra · September 2016

The STAM/MAG pendulum has been winging back and forth so many times over the years, and that was before they might see a real profit.

idk · September 2016

MMOs always work on "balance". Anyone who has played MMOs for awhile can attest to this. Zos has been doing it for over 2 years without race change and no reason to see them stop managing the game.

More so, most avid players have multiple characters and as such would not need to change race merely due to changes Zos makes and many players really don't care how their race matched up anyhow. Would not be as lucrative as some may think.

BrianDavion · September 2016

Nestor wrote: »

In any MMO, one thing you can be sure of is your favorite class build this month will get nerfed next month. I have seen all 4 classes be at the top, and all 4 of them pulled down from the top, sometimes to the bottom, sometimes just a notch or two. I have seen Stamina be the red headed step child, I have seen Magic get locked in the basement closet.

As mentioned above, the cheap way to handle this is to have all 8 combos leveled up and ready to go. Or, have some gold for respecs and you can do this with 4 slots. But at least your not spending hard earned cash just to change things around.

which is why smart players play whats FUN, not nesscarily what the number crunchers have deemed "the best"

Koolio · September 2016

BrianDavion wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

In any MMO, one thing you can be sure of is your favorite class build this month will get nerfed next month. I have seen all 4 classes be at the top, and all 4 of them pulled down from the top, sometimes to the bottom, sometimes just a notch or two. I have seen Stamina be the red headed step child, I have seen Magic get locked in the basement closet.

As mentioned above, the cheap way to handle this is to have all 8 combos leveled up and ready to go. Or, have some gold for respecs and you can do this with 4 slots. But at least your not spending hard earned cash just to change things around.

which is why smart players play whats FUN, not nesscarily what the number crunchers have deemed "the best"

Because getting hit for 14k+ Dawnbreakers and 10k+ Incap wearing full inpen light armor is "fun". Maybe I just don't want them too turn into other titles that do this specifically for profit.

FearlessOne_2014 · September 2016

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

ANet did this same thing in GW2 because they thought. It would be a awesome way squeezing money out of their customers. Now a little over half a year with that company's mindset. In full motion in that game. Both the WvW and the sPvP game modes are complete ghost towns. What the exception of WvW in Tier One for 2 to 4 hours a day now. Tier 4 is completely dead. It's really a far cry from what the game had.

Before ANet decided to go full thrust into promoting sales by putting out completely Overpowered content. Content which is only available if you brought HoT. Before ANet decided to intentionally ruining class and skill balance. By rotating which classs would be completely overpowered, and which classes would be completely either under tuned or nerfed into oblivion. ANet's GW2 was one of the most populated MMOs I've played at the time. Before HoT expansion hit. Now the absolute diehard fan boy community of GW2 are struggling to stay active.

If ZOS goes down this short handed path. It will not only damage the public's view of the company. But also these in it's developer teams. Also ESO will start to suffer from problems as such.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/pvp-is-dead-EU/first#post6324137

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/Queue-times-9/first#post6323150

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Fights-Need-to-be-Addressed/first#post6323246

There I did the leg work for you all. This is what the community, and dev team of ESO have to look forward to. If they completely go down the road ANet has.

Koolio · September 2016

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

ANet did this same thing in GW2 because they thought. It would be a awesome way squeezing money out of their customers. Now a little over half a year with that company's mindset. In full motion in that game. Both the WvW and the sPvP game modes are complete ghost towns. What the exception of WvW in Tier One for 2 to 4 hours a day now. Tier 4 is completely dead. It's really a far cry from what the game had.

Before ANet decided to go full thrust into promoting sales by putting out completely Overpowered content. Content which is only available if you brought HoT. Before ANet decided to intentionally ruining class and skill balance. By rotating which classs would be completely overpowered, and which classes would be completely either under tuned or nerfed into oblivion. ANet's GW2 was one of the most populated MMOs I've played at the time. Before HoT expansion hit. Now the absolute diehard fan boy community of GW2 are struggling to stay active.

If ZOS goes down this short handed path. It will not only damage the public's view of the company. But also these in it's developer teams. Also ESO will start to suffer from problems as such.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/pvp-is-dead-EU/first#post6324137

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/Queue-times-9/first#post6323150

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Fights-Need-to-be-Addressed/first#post6323246

There I did the leg work for you all. This is what the community, and dev team of ESO have to look forward to. If they completely go down the road ANet has.

Thank you very much. I just wanted the attention to this matter considering other companies have done this. I waited years for this exact game to come out and don't want these shortcomings to plague this game. Since the balance isn't there it just seems like they are doing this on purpose.

Bigevilpeter · September 2016

Thats why i have (or plan to have) a magika and stamina character for every class at lvl 50

currently got magika and stam templar, stamina DK and stam NB.

4/8 working on the rest now

BlazingDynamo · September 2016

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

You have 8 free slots or 12 if you pay for the other 4. You can always make a second class and not spend the money to switch if it came down to that.

dodgehopper_ESO · September 2016

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

I have multiple characters for reason. It'll be a cold day in hell I pay for the benefit of races being imbalanced. There's a reason that I spoke out loudly against this in the forums (though I moderated my language for certain). Races ought to be balanced, and they need to recognize the game has changed from a system with overcharging to a system without caps. I've explained all this before, so I don't really want to go into that, but I think that all of us as customers should do the same. I realize some players are more limited on time than others, so I suggest to those players to at the very least try to have a couple characters that are divergent enough from one another that you can always comfortably play the game.

FearlessOne_2014 · September 2016

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

Thats why i have (or plan to have) a magika and stamina character for every class at lvl 50

currently got magika and stam templar, stamina DK and stam NB.

4/8 working on the rest now

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

You have 8 free slots or 12 if you pay for the other 4. You can always make a second class and not spend the money to switch if it came down to that.

So if I just don't find running around with swords and bows fun. I should just quit this game. Gotcha! The GW2's sPvP pre made teams said the same thing to the solo queuers. Who didn't wanted to be used of food for others EGOs and profit schemes. The solo players told them. If they don't help out solo players and balancing issues around, Match Maker, and classes. That the pre mades would end up in a game where they'd be in queue most then playing. The pre mades laughed at the solo players. The solo players couldn't bear anymore and left. When the solo players left, the pre mades that was trash and was getting fed by ANet, couldn't get fed anymore. No more food, then they left. And now both sPvP and WvW game modes are pretty empty and unused for the most part. Even after the fact GW2's sPvP and WvW game modes was a huge driving factor for many many players buying the game.

Now the ball is in this community's and ZOS's upper management's court. For this game. Do yall follow the same death spirial is GW2, and it's community did. Or do yall evolve and transcend imminent death as CCP did with Eve Online.

Remember MMOs are not the only games on the market. There are games like Smite, Overwatch, ARMA3, ARK, and others that are starting to filled the void that MMOs are starting to leave behind. As present day most MMO communities are nothing more then glorified multi-player communities. That don't even interact or socialize with each other anymore.

I truly hope I am making a hyperbole. However from my experience with many many MMO's in recent and past years. I am pretty sure we stand in the middle of the MMO-Apocalypse.

Danikat · September 2016

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

ANet did this same thing in GW2 because they thought. It would be a awesome way squeezing money out of their customers. Now a little over half a year with that company's mindset. In full motion in that game. Both the WvW and the sPvP game modes are complete ghost towns. What the exception of WvW in Tier One for 2 to 4 hours a day now. Tier 4 is completely dead. It's really a far cry from what the game had.

Before ANet decided to go full thrust into promoting sales by putting out completely Overpowered content. Content which is only available if you brought HoT. Before ANet decided to intentionally ruining class and skill balance. By rotating which classs would be completely overpowered, and which classes would be completely either under tuned or nerfed into oblivion. ANet's GW2 was one of the most populated MMOs I've played at the time. Before HoT expansion hit. Now the absolute diehard fan boy community of GW2 are struggling to stay active.

If ZOS goes down this short handed path. It will not only damage the public's view of the company. But also these in it's developer teams. Also ESO will start to suffer from problems as such.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/pvp-is-dead-EU/first#post6324137

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/Queue-times-9/first#post6323150

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Fights-Need-to-be-Addressed/first#post6323246

There I did the leg work for you all. This is what the community, and dev team of ESO have to look forward to. If they completely go down the road ANet has.

Does anyone else ever have those moments when you have to double check which forum you're on?

At the risk of taking this even more off-topic I have to ask: how do balance changes make money in GW2? You can't buy a race change or class change in that game, so even if they change the flavour of the month builds and the few people who actually follow the meta-game all switch I can't see how it makes them any money. Unless you mean people buy 4 extra character slots so they can have all 9 classes at once, if that's the case they'd do better to keep pushing cosmetics and make money off the people who want every class/race/gender combination (90 characters currently).

Going back to ESO I agree with the people who said if you're worried about always having the current favourite build the simple solution is to use your 8 character slots to make a magicka and a stamina version of each class, and then just play whichever one is popular at the moment.

But my personal favourite solution is to just play whatever build I think is fun and not worry about whether someone else's calculator says it's the best possible combination of all factors in the entire game this week.

acw37162 · September 2016

Considering that race is only one of several factors taken into account in this game and that while they push a beta build character to min max a little bit more I'm not as worried as most people here seem to be.

Will there always be "one build to rule them all" and will the minions flock to this build absolutely.

FearlessOne_2014 · September 2016

Danikat wrote: »

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Do you think we will see swings from stam to magic meta regularly? Purely for them charging to change race as a profitable endeavor. DCUO would buff a class for an update. Everyone would switch $10. Then nerf that class while buffing another so people would pay to switch again $10. They did this consistently for years it seemed.

ANet did this same thing in GW2 because they thought. It would be a awesome way squeezing money out of their customers. Now a little over half a year with that company's mindset. In full motion in that game. Both the WvW and the sPvP game modes are complete ghost towns. What the exception of WvW in Tier One for 2 to 4 hours a day now. Tier 4 is completely dead. It's really a far cry from what the game had.

Before ANet decided to go full thrust into promoting sales by putting out completely Overpowered content. Content which is only available if you brought HoT. Before ANet decided to intentionally ruining class and skill balance. By rotating which classs would be completely overpowered, and which classes would be completely either under tuned or nerfed into oblivion. ANet's GW2 was one of the most populated MMOs I've played at the time. Before HoT expansion hit. Now the absolute diehard fan boy community of GW2 are struggling to stay active.

If ZOS goes down this short handed path. It will not only damage the public's view of the company. But also these in it's developer teams. Also ESO will start to suffer from problems as such.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/pvp-is-dead-EU/first#post6324137

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/Queue-times-9/first#post6323150

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Fights-Need-to-be-Addressed/first#post6323246

There I did the leg work for you all. This is what the community, and dev team of ESO have to look forward to. If they completely go down the road ANet has.

Does anyone else ever have those moments when you have to double check which forum you're on?

At the risk of taking this even more off-topic I have to ask: how do balance changes make money in GW2? You can't buy a race change or class change in that game, so even if they change the flavour of the month builds and the few people who actually follow the meta-game all switch I can't see how it makes them any money. Unless you mean people buy 4 extra character slots so they can have all 9 classes at once, if that's the case they'd do better to keep pushing cosmetics and make money off the people who want every class/race/gender combination (90 characters currently).

Going back to ESO I agree with the people who said if you're worried about always having the current favourite build the simple solution is to use your 8 character slots to make a magicka and a stamina version of each class, and then just play whichever one is popular at the moment.

But my personal favourite solution is to just play whatever build I think is fun and not worry about whether someone else's calculator says it's the best possible combination of all factors in the entire game this week.

While you see ANet decided to try and make sales. By making the new Elite spec lines completely over-powering to it community. After that didn't succeed because not many players bought the expansion. ANet though it'll make money by intentionally making the classes imbalanced. All the players that wanted free wins cheered all the way. Just like the sheep they are. Then ANet rotated which class would be over powered, and which classes would be nuked to oblivion. Every three months or so. Until their once dedicate and vibrant community left that crap show. Now GW2 has barely any sPvP or WvW community to speak of.

Good point unless you are a PvPer. Then not caring at all about balance leads to people instantly killing others. With only gear procs. Or being completely gimped because you like playing with Staves and Spells instead of physical melee weapons and bows. At this point all of the magicka "all pun intended" that made ESO a decent addition to the TES series is completely gone.