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Heavy armor should have drawbacks.
Devlin69
✭✭✭
In what world can you 'sneak' in a full suit of heavy armor?
It's heavy, noisy and should be harder to fight in than leather and cloth.
And if you are wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster.
It should conduct heat, cold and lightning/shock damage onto the wearer more than other types too.
It's heavy, noisy and should be harder to fight in than leather and cloth.
And if you are wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster.
It should conduct heat, cold and lightning/shock damage onto the wearer more than other types too.
1
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Necrelios✭✭✭✭✭In general, I agree, but there is a saying about video games and logic and how they rarely seem to mix.Terms & Conditions ["We revoke permission to fictional legal constructs or private/public persons for selling of any private data, censorship, surveillance, personage or conversion as a trespass of law. We prohibit the practice of "procedural law" or corporate statues in place of divine law."]2 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.Edited by Bryanonymous on September 12, 2016 11:02AM0
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XDragonDoomX✭✭✭✭✭Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
"Forums are like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea.
massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of
mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it. ”
(with apologies to Eugene H. Spafford, aka Spaf)
I have the power to please one person per day. Today is not your day.
Tomorrow... Tomorrow does not look good either.
82. Victory laps after killing the dragon with my 1d2 bow is considered in poor taste.
83. My gnome does not like big butts and he cannot lie.
84. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying a 220lb pull crossbow.
85. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying an industrial strength flamethrower.
86. Not allowed to make a superhero with a 99% chance of dodging even after the -10 penalty for a successful called shot.
87. There is no such thing as a dwarven katana.
88. My bard does not get a bonus to perform if she is obviously not wearing anything under her tabard.
89. The elf's name is not Legolam.
** Mr Glenn's Forbidden activities list**4 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
Are heavy armor users 100% unable to run? What a ridiculous statement.Edited by Bryanonymous on September 12, 2016 11:10AM1 -
XDragonDoomX✭✭✭✭✭Bryanonymous wrote: »XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
Are heavy armor users 100% unable to run? What a ridiculous statement.
I said =if=
"Forums are like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea.
massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of
mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it. ”
(with apologies to Eugene H. Spafford, aka Spaf)
I have the power to please one person per day. Today is not your day.
Tomorrow... Tomorrow does not look good either.
82. Victory laps after killing the dragon with my 1d2 bow is considered in poor taste.
83. My gnome does not like big butts and he cannot lie.
84. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying a 220lb pull crossbow.
85. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying an industrial strength flamethrower.
86. Not allowed to make a superhero with a 99% chance of dodging even after the -10 penalty for a successful called shot.
87. There is no such thing as a dwarven katana.
88. My bard does not get a bonus to perform if she is obviously not wearing anything under her tabard.
89. The elf's name is not Legolam.
** Mr Glenn's Forbidden activities list**1 -
hrothbern✭✭✭✭✭
✭In what world can you 'sneak' in a full suit of heavy armor?
It's heavy, noisy and should be harder to fight in than leather and cloth.
And if you are wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster.
It should conduct heat, cold and lightning/shock damage onto the wearer more than other types too.
Just some facts on historical Plate Armor:
You say:
"wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster".
Historical fact:
"An entire suit of field armor (that is, armor for battle) usually weighs between 45 and 55 lbs. (20 to 25 kg), with the helmet weighing between 4 and 8 lbs. (2 to 4 kg)—less than the full equipment of a fireman with oxygen gear, or what most modern soldiers have carried into battle since the nineteenth century".
And about that sneaking:
Historical Plate Armor was for more than 99% impenetrable for swords, arrows, spears and one-handed blunt weapons.
IF this game would give Heavy Armor 99% Damage Mitigation, I would see no issue to forbid sneaking in it.
About that cold and lightning damage:
That steel/Iron was not on your naked body: Plate Armor was a complex fabricated multi-layer Armor with layers of non-metal of cloth and leather. So nothing conductive there.
"I still do not understand why I followed the advice of Captain Rana to bring the villagers of Bleakrock into safety. We should have fought for our village and not have backed down, with our tail between our legs. Now my home village is in shambles, the houses burning, the invaders feasting.I swear every day to Shor that after Molag Bal has been defeated, I will hunt down the invaders and restore peace in Bleakrock and drink my mead with my friends at the market place".PC-EU7 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭About that cold and lightning damage:
That steel/Iron was not on your naked body: Plate Armor was a complex fabricated multi-layer Armor with layers of non-metal of cloth and leather. So nothing conductive there.
Am i the only one seeing the irony in demanding realistic interaction between metal armor and lightning shot from one's hands?
7 -
Banana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
I think any melee attack and it would offer no protection.
It's a game people. Deal with it.0 -
Pangnirtung✭✭✭✭✭In what world can you 'sneak' in a full suit of heavy armor?
It's heavy, noisy and should be harder to fight in than leather and cloth.
And if you are wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster.
It should conduct heat, cold and lightning/shock damage onto the wearer more than other types too.
Where do you draw the line?
In what real world do staves do magic and monsters roam the land?
I am fine with things how they are.1 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
Are heavy armor users 100% unable to run? What a ridiculous statement.
I said =if=
If what? If heavier armor has a slight movement penalty, then light armor should be 1hk from arrows? How do you think the two are even comparable? Heavy armor already gives you more protection... And what is the trade? The only answer is passives.0 -
hrothbern✭✭✭✭✭
✭About that cold and lightning damage:
That steel/Iron was not on your naked body: Plate Armor was a complex fabricated multi-layer Armor with layers of non-metal of cloth and leather. So nothing conductive there.
Am i the only one seeing the irony in demanding realistic interaction between metal armor and lightning shot from one's hands?
haha
That's Magic
"I still do not understand why I followed the advice of Captain Rana to bring the villagers of Bleakrock into safety. We should have fought for our village and not have backed down, with our tail between our legs. Now my home village is in shambles, the houses burning, the invaders feasting.I swear every day to Shor that after Molag Bal has been defeated, I will hunt down the invaders and restore peace in Bleakrock and drink my mead with my friends at the market place".PC-EU0 -
Devlin69✭✭✭About that cold and lightning damage:
That steel/Iron was not on your naked body: Plate Armor was a complex fabricated multi-layer Armor with layers of non-metal of cloth and leather. So nothing conductive there.
Am i the only one seeing the irony in demanding realistic interaction between metal armor and lightning shot from one's hands?
Yea I realize there are other factors involved. I mean we have the use of magic here but some conformity to an items material type would be nice.0 -
Rosveen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Sounds good. In the name of realism, we should also adjust weapon damage and armor rating in such a way that people in light armor will die to a single well-placed hit. We also have to remove the costume slot because wearing a flimsy dress over a suit of heavy plate is entirely absurd. Moreover, bag capacity should be reduced to a dozen or so slots for potions and food rations - for bigger things, like extra suits of armor or whole trebuchets, we need to rent a cart. All of this, combined with removal of infinite mount sprint, will turn the alliance war into a much nicer, slow-paced adventure with an added thrill of death waiting at every corner - tread carefully and scout the terrain before you engage, because a fall from a castle wall might result in badly broken bones and immediate dismissal from active duty. You don't want to weaken your alliance with reckless behavior, do you?2 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
I think any melee attack and it would offer no protection.
It's a game people. Deal with it.
People seem to have this idea that because it is light, it does not have any armor, however many of the light armor styles show metal on it, because it is just lighter, but is armor, not just some leather suit.0 -
Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It has, comparatively to other armor weights and their passives, or rather those passives are an advantage over heavy armor ones:
- light armor has magicka regeneration, reduced spell cost, spell penetration, spell critical
- medium armor has stamina regeneration, reduced ability cost, weapon critical, increased sprinting speed, decreased cost of roll dodge, decreased sneak cost and detection area
In conclusion there is not an absolute penalty, but a damage and sustain penalty vs. both light and medium armor, and a sneak and speed penalty vs. medium armor only.Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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hrothbern✭✭✭✭✭
✭About that cold and lightning damage:
That steel/Iron was not on your naked body: Plate Armor was a complex fabricated multi-layer Armor with layers of non-metal of cloth and leather. So nothing conductive there.
Am i the only one seeing the irony in demanding realistic interaction between metal armor and lightning shot from one's hands?
Yea I realize there are other factors involved. I mean we have the use of magic here but some conformity to an items material type would be nice.
Since the early Dungeons & Dragons games of the seventies,
There has been arisen a kind of general consensus of the magic reality of these games, just like the wormholes and beaming of Science Fiction since the late fifties."I still do not understand why I followed the advice of Captain Rana to bring the villagers of Bleakrock into safety. We should have fought for our village and not have backed down, with our tail between our legs. Now my home village is in shambles, the houses burning, the invaders feasting.I swear every day to Shor that after Molag Bal has been defeated, I will hunt down the invaders and restore peace in Bleakrock and drink my mead with my friends at the market place".PC-EU1 -
XDragonDoomX✭✭✭✭✭Bryanonymous wrote: »XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »XDragonDoomX wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »Past TES games did have a movement penalty for heavier equipment, but when this was argued for this game, players would always bring up that heavy armor is weak and light armor is OP. Now, what is the trade off for more protection? Well, in general, just the Magic/Stamina/Health passives. I personally think tanks in heavy armor should be slower, and mages in light armor should be more mobile, even if like a cheetah, they only have a short amount of sprint before they run out of steam. Min/maxers might disagree.
That's fine - if light armour users are then 100% vulnerable to arrows, etc.
Are heavy armor users 100% unable to run? What a ridiculous statement.
I said =if=
If what? If heavier armor has a slight movement penalty, then light armor should be 1hk from arrows? How do you think the two are even comparable? Heavy armor already gives you more protection... And what is the trade? The only answer is passives.
the cheetah like mobility has a downside - high vulnerability. The heavy armour downside is lack of mobility but much greater protection, however the question is a moot point, since I doubt it's going to be changed - at least anytime soon.
"Forums are like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea.
massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of
mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it. ”
(with apologies to Eugene H. Spafford, aka Spaf)
I have the power to please one person per day. Today is not your day.
Tomorrow... Tomorrow does not look good either.
82. Victory laps after killing the dragon with my 1d2 bow is considered in poor taste.
83. My gnome does not like big butts and he cannot lie.
84. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying a 220lb pull crossbow.
85. Not allowed to talk my fellow inquisitors into buying an industrial strength flamethrower.
86. Not allowed to make a superhero with a 99% chance of dodging even after the -10 penalty for a successful called shot.
87. There is no such thing as a dwarven katana.
88. My bard does not get a bonus to perform if she is obviously not wearing anything under her tabard.
89. The elf's name is not Legolam.
** Mr Glenn's Forbidden activities list**0 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭These threads always get derailed by exaggerations. Smh... Suggest a small penalty, they suggest 1hk's...0
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Gargath✭✭✭✭✭
✭I agree, player in full heavy armor should sink in deep water (new restriction after slaughterfish) and this armor should take more damage from rust depending on amount of time a player stepped into water. PC EU (PL): 14 characters. ESO player since 06.08.2015. Farkas finest quote: "Some people don't think I'm smart. Those people get my fist. But you, I like."0 -
Devlin69✭✭✭I agree, player in full heavy armor should sink in deep water (new restriction after slaughterfish) and this armor should take more damage from rust depending on amount of time a player stepped into water.
And you should be able to hire a Baldric to polish your chestpiece.
I have a cunning plan!Edited by Devlin69 on September 12, 2016 11:31AM1 -
AnviOfVai✭✭✭✭✭
✭3 words:
Unfair in PVP."I appear at my lord's behest, or perhaps I was always here, and you merely lacked the ability to see me."
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Destruent✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It has, comparatively to other armor weights and their passives, or rather those passives are an advantage over heavy armor ones:
- light armor has magicka regeneration, reduced spell cost, spell penetration, spell critical
- medium armor has stamina regeneration, reduced ability cost, weapon critical, increased sprinting speed, decreased cost of roll dodge, decreased sneak cost and detection area
In conclusion there is not an absolute penalty, but a damage and sustain penalty vs. both light and medium armor, and a sneak and speed penalty vs. medium armor only.
never noticed that sustain/damage penalty when switching from light to heavy armor in pvp....Noobplar0 -
Hluill✭✭✭Sounds good. In the name of realism, we should also adjust weapon damage and armor rating in such a way that people in light armor will die to a single well-placed hit. We also have to remove the costume slot because wearing a flimsy dress over a suit of heavy plate is entirely absurd. Moreover, bag capacity should be reduced to a dozen or so slots for potions and food rations - for bigger things, like extra suits of armor or whole trebuchets, we need to rent a cart. All of this, combined with removal of infinite mount sprint, will turn the alliance war into a much nicer, slow-paced adventure with an added thrill of death waiting at every corner - tread carefully and scout the terrain before you engage, because a fall from a castle wall might result in badly broken bones and immediate dismissal from active duty. You don't want to weaken your alliance with reckless behavior, do you?
I would love to see a game more like this.
Only EQ actually had encumbrance rules. Many Pen and Paper RPGs did the same. It's interesting, and frustrating, to me that MMOs tended to favor the Dungeons and Dragons model for hit and damage mechanics.
It's silly how heavy armor offers relatively poor protection, medium armor offers bonuses to sneak and melee while light armor only benefits magic.
At least this game has armor skills. All those soldiers wearing thirty-five to sixty pounds of gear train in it, as did armored knights, back in the day. It takes a while to learn how to roll and jump and ride in the stuff. The Medieval Knight trained his combat skills to a level most of us can't even imagine.
I could rant for pages concerning the sillyness of fantasy armor and combat, but what's the point?Black-handed Hluill and his daughter Leyek of House Numaril.0 -
Cherryblossom✭✭✭✭✭
✭In what world can you 'sneak' in a full suit of heavy armor?
It's heavy, noisy and should be harder to fight in than leather and cloth.
And if you are wearing it mounted it should make your mount pay the penalty too, slower and loses stamina faster.
It should conduct heat, cold and lightning/shock damage onto the wearer more than other types too.
Firstly,
A well made suit of full plate shouldn't be noisy
If your riding a horse in full Plate, its been specially bred for stamina and speed.
Metal cage around you would keep you safe from lightning!
Heat disapates out of metal quicker!
Most importantly this is a Fantasy Game.1 -
Berenhir✭✭✭✭✭
✭Inb4 Skallagrim videos are posted.PC EU - Ebonheart Pact - Gray Host - Death Recap -#zergfarming -0
