Alchemy regents are getting out of control, need hirelings ASAP

ManDraKE · August 2016

I guess this is happening in other servers too, but at least on PC NA, the alchemy regents prices are getting out of hand.
Columbine is already to expensive to be manipulated, but people is inflating prices of other regents like namira's roots, blessed trissle, etc. I literaly went to 15 guilds stores and found ZERO of them, just to go to reapers march (where the main trading guilds are) to found dozens of stacks with prices inflated beetwen 100-200% according to MM.

This need to stop. With the new trials, a lot of people is starting to use more brutality/spellpower pots, so the demand is way higher than a couple months ago, plus the always steady demand of tripots/inmmobile pots for PvP. This is not some rare endgame gear that is being manipulated, we are talking about something as basic as pots that are essencial to PvE and PvP, is a sink of gold that many players can't afford, specially new players that are also using the gold to get their gear. Where are getting to the point where people will stop doing trials cause they can't afford pots.

We need alchemy hirelings, please ZoS.

UltimaJoe777 · August 2016

Hirelings are not going to change anything regarding the player market as they only happen up to twice a day and do not give more than you could simply go find in a node, but a hireling would definitely be far more useful than Snakeblood aka the completely useless passive.

STEVIL · August 2016

I disagree.

Alchemy hireling would likely be Op and in fact the Db requestioner is pretty close to one, just a bit random (only cvosts one skill tho.)

if the price is going up due to demand, thats gonna stay. The alchemy stuff is plentiful, literally, everywhere and the flowers you farm at lvl 3 work fine for cp150 spell power.

I drown in the stuff and watch potions sit in the stores not selling.

NeillMcAttack · August 2016

Alchemy ingredients aren't level restricted you see.

If we had alchemy hirelings than I could create the maximum number of characters and level their alchemy enough to get hireling level 1on each. Then I could just log them everyday and recieve tons of ingredients for essentially nothing. That would hurt the farmers that rely on farming them for income.

What changes woud you suggest?

Tavore1138 · August 2016

These are not being manipulated but behaving exactly as predicted with the new crafting bags - it's a fair bet that many crafters and hoarders are also subscribers and whereas before they would sell of stacks to keep bank spots working now they can have as many columbine or anything else in their bag as they can collect with no need to sell.

Therefore the goods get more scarce and the prices rise, this is happening with other crafting items too - wood. cloth, leather and metal are all creeping up too. The only real exception are runes but that is because ZOS ripped the bottom out of the potency market and the new double runes everywhere have actually put more orange/green runes into the market.

So demand is up, supply is down, prices rise - that's how economies work.

For the best results go and gather your own materials and then sell your surplus

UltimaJoe777 · August 2016

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

Alchemy ingredients aren't level restricted you see.

If we had alchemy hirelings than I could create the maximum number of characters and level their alchemy enough to get hireling level 1on each. Then I could just log them everyday and recieve tons of ingredients for essentially nothing. That would hurt the farmers that rely on farming them for income.

What changes woud you suggest?

I believe there is an account-wide cooldown on hirelings though, so you'd still only get 2 a day at Rank 3.

Decado · August 2016

Same thing is happening on the EU-PC server a select group of people have pissed almost everyone off by making the prices of pots outrageous, and what makes this worse is it is common knowledge one of the main people involved in doing this is a known EXPLOITER, he exploited the banker/survey exploit and got 1000s of these materials which he was allowed to keep by zos, so he's actually using exploited materials to help him do this, great isn't it?

Now because of ZoS name and shame policy I can't say who it is but most people on the EU server know who I'm referring too.

Asgari · August 2016

Alchemy hireling should have been added a long time ago.

BRogueNZ · August 2016

Pick you're own herbs- make your own.. do the whole opportunity cost thang and you discover why people who gather sell at the prices they do.

ManDraKE · August 2016

STEVIL wrote: »

I disagree.

Alchemy hireling would likely be Op and in fact the Db requestioner is pretty close to one, just a bit random (only cvosts one skill tho.)

if the price is going up due to demand, thats gonna stay. The alchemy stuff is plentiful, literally, everywhere and the flowers you farm at lvl 3 work fine for cp150 spell power.

I drown in the stuff and watch potions sit in the stores not selling.

How a hireling passives would be OP? you will capture keeps on cyrodrill with it? or you will get 1st place on leaderboards? LOL

And no, i can't farm enought regents to cover my own demand, no withouth spending considerable amount of time that would stop me from doing PvE/PvP.

Tavore1138 wrote: »

So demand is up, supply is down, prices rise - that's how economies work.

Those regents are required to being able of perform in endgame PvE and PvP, putting them behind a gold wall will only affect the players ability to enjoy that content. Is fine if price rise, but right know is being heaviliy manipulated, and even in real life, there are laws to mitigate those practices, so no, that is not how economies work.

NeillMcAttack · August 2016

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

Alchemy ingredients aren't level restricted you see.

If we had alchemy hirelings than I could create the maximum number of characters and level their alchemy enough to get hireling level 1on each. Then I could just log them everyday and recieve tons of ingredients for essentially nothing. That would hurt the farmers that rely on farming them for income.

What changes woud you suggest?

I believe there is an account-wide cooldown on hirelings though, so you'd still only get 2 a day at Rank 3.

I understand. But I would greatly assume that the reason we never had alchemy hirelings is due to how inflated the market would be with them if we did. The fact that hireling material is always tied to your crafting level means that what you gain at low levels becomes redundant as you level. Alchemy ingredients are totally different though in the sense that they are used for all level pots with only the one ingredient changing, the water, which is by far the easiest and quickest to farm.

UltimaJoe777 · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

I disagree.

Alchemy hireling would likely be Op and in fact the Db requestioner is pretty close to one, just a bit random (only cvosts one skill tho.)

if the price is going up due to demand, thats gonna stay. The alchemy stuff is plentiful, literally, everywhere and the flowers you farm at lvl 3 work fine for cp150 spell power.

I drown in the stuff and watch potions sit in the stores not selling.

How a hireling passives would be OP? you will capture keeps on cyrodrill with it? or you will get 1st place on leaderboards? LOL

And no, i can't farm enought regents to cover my own demand, no withouth spending considerable amount of time that would stop me from doing PvE/PvP.

Tavore1138 wrote: »

So demand is up, supply is down, prices rise - that's how economies work.

Those regents are required to being able of perform in endgame PvE and PvP, putting them behind a gold wall will only affect the players ability to enjoy that content. Is fine if price rise, but right know is being heaviliy manipulated, and even in real life, there are laws to mitigate those practices, so no, that is not how economies work.

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

ManDraKE · August 2016

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

any competitive build requires potions, specially for PvP. Is true that some builds require more potions, but still, you need a lot of them.

Decado · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

any competitive build requires potions, specially for PvP. Is true that some builds require more potions, but still, you need a lot of them.

In my raid guild in the message of the day it advises to bring a stack of 200 potions minimum, and if we are practising MoL HM I can easily consume close to 300 pots in 1 night, using the current prices on the EU market as of the other night that would be roughly 30k a night on potions alone, and my guild raids almost every night when we can get a raid going and I know some who do raid every night so that's 200K+ a week on potions alone, and that's a magicka user I don't even wanna imagine the price of a PvPer who goes through that amount on tri stat pots a day

DRXHarbinger · August 2016

Need that wizards tower from oblivion that had your own garden in.

Oh wait...player housing..5k crowns...how about garden to grow your own food, reagents and even your own personal mine and slaughter house for all your leather and ore needs. ..see where this leads.

Tavore1138 · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

I disagree.

Alchemy hireling would likely be Op and in fact the Db requestioner is pretty close to one, just a bit random (only cvosts one skill tho.)

if the price is going up due to demand, thats gonna stay. The alchemy stuff is plentiful, literally, everywhere and the flowers you farm at lvl 3 work fine for cp150 spell power.

I drown in the stuff and watch potions sit in the stores not selling.

How a hireling passives would be OP? you will capture keeps on cyrodrill with it? or you will get 1st place on leaderboards? LOL

And no, i can't farm enought regents to cover my own demand, no withouth spending considerable amount of time that would stop me from doing PvE/PvP.

Tavore1138 wrote: »

So demand is up, supply is down, prices rise - that's how economies work.

Those regents are required to being able of perform in endgame PvE and PvP, putting them behind a gold wall will only affect the players ability to enjoy that content. Is fine if price rise, but right know is being heaviliy manipulated, and even in real life, there are laws to mitigate those practices, so no, that is not how economies work.

Not to be unduly contentious but manipulating the markets in the way you suggest would require a vast sum of money to be able to buy every single herb placed for sale in any guild store and then stage the resale at your own chosen price.

This would be tough in a market with limited resources but herbs are freely available to anyone at all in open world.

If someone has amassed that much money and is willing to take that gamble then frankly good luck to them. Because all everyone else has to do is take the time to collect their own ingredients and they end up looking pretty silly. Plus anyone else selling is going to be doing so based on MM prices too so their profit margin will reduce as well.

Similarly those that have a bundle of mats from the survey abuse exploit would tend to end up lowering prices (which was what actually happened at the time this exploit was happening and the prices of materials fell through the floor for a couple of months).

I am not saying that market manipulation is impossible but it would require epic gold reserves and massive co-ordination to achieve and because materials are freely available in all zones it would ultimately fail.

WreckfulAbandon · August 2016

I like how the alchemy system in this game is useful and meaningful, but there are some things out there that shouldn't exist (imo):

-Cost increase poisons

-Immovability being available from a potion

-Some potions having really powerful multiple effects (like immovable detection pots)

It's basically pay to win, you just have to spends tens of thousands of gold instead of RL money. I used immovable pots for a week and it was unreal how much my survivability went up (hint: it wasn't me who magically got more skilled that week)

Runs · August 2016

I'm not saying we shouldn't have them. I would also like to see them.

This is happening because everybody wants to buy the mats instead of farming them combined with less people selling them because there is simply no need to sell craft supplies when you have the crafting bags. Add to that that there is no decent gold sink in the game. What reason would I have to sell any of my mats when I'm sitting at 8 million gold? Hirelings really wont solve the lazy nor will they help the hoarding.

Don't get me started on people's reliance on MM. It's a heavily flawed system when used to base price on highly fluctuating items. Past sales do not dictate future trends, especially on alchemy mats. If there's no trader that has Columbine for sale under 750gold per... it doesn't matter what MM says, it is now worth 750gold per till someone offers it for cheaper. Why? Because even at 750g per, it's extremely cheaper than the time it would take me to farm it.

As far as people going to stop doing trials because they can't afford pots... Trial gear is some of the most desired and highest sold for gear there is, but they can't afford the price of admission(needed items) to run it? If that's truly the case then they should farm the items themselves.

Taleof2Cities · August 2016

Tavore1138 wrote: »

So demand is up, supply is down, prices rise - that's how economies work.

For the best results go and gather your own materials and then sell your surplus

^This.^

Pyr0xyrecuprotite · August 2016

You don't need to spend the gold if you spend the time to find ingredients instead. If alchemy mats are suddenly super-expensive - go out and farm them. (I haven't done this yet - still have some stacks left in my bank from when i collected everything when I was out questing to level up my eight alts).

STEVIL · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

I disagree.

Alchemy hireling would likely be Op and in fact the Db requestioner is pretty close to one, just a bit random (only cvosts one skill tho.)

if the price is going up due to demand, thats gonna stay. The alchemy stuff is plentiful, literally, everywhere and the flowers you farm at lvl 3 work fine for cp150 spell power.

I drown in the stuff and watch potions sit in the stores not selling.

How a hireling passives would be OP? you will capture keeps on cyrodrill with it? or you will get 1st place on leaderboards? LOL

And no, i can't farm enought regents to cover my own demand, no withouth spending considerable amount of time that would stop me from doing PvE/PvP.

Well according to the OP, the potion demand is up because of trials and others mentioned it needed in end game builds... so my guess is thats where its sudden free surge of potions would be felt the most if they are correct. but like anything in the game, its all by comparison. In my opinion based on my experience with master crafters in every type, several in some, who crafst alchemy for my own PCs and for selling or others for free, alchemy mats right now are dropping a plenty and especially since my lvl 4 character harvests fully useful alchemy mats that my cp160 can use... having a hireling would be over-powered by comparison to the other crafts - especially once you take the Db requisitioner into account.

So, LOL all you want, but while i can understand someone not wanting to puil time in to get the mats or skills they need to be self-sufficient or to pay for the stuff they want at common market prices and wants it delivered for free - for alchemy thats not something i believe would be in line with the other crafting skills balance-wise.

YMMV.

Gargath · August 2016

I don't understand OP, it's so easy to get herbs in ESO, even Columbine grows everywhere. I feel this is just laziness that brought that request up

. Why don't you go to Coldharbour and manually farm the herbs, so you could also have a lot, and problem solved...

I'm satisfied that price for Columbine raised from ~300g to ~450g on PC EU recently, because I was keeping around 300 pcs. in my bank. When prices went up I sold all and got a lot of shiny coins for my new sets. Nothing makes me more happy in eso than shiny stakes of golden coins

. If there is demand, there is supply. If you don't want to manually farm - you must pay

.
And btw I'm not billionaire, just reached my +300k gold, and I'm not eso plus

.

ManDraKE · August 2016

Gargath wrote: »

I don't understand OP, it's so easy to get herbs in ESO, even Columbine grows everywhere. I feel this is just laziness that brought that request up . Why don't you go to Coldharbour and manually farm the herbs, so you could also have a lot, and problem solved...

I'm satisfied that price for Columbine raised from ~300g to ~450g on PC EU recently, because I was keeping around 300 pcs. in my bank. When prices went up I sold all and got a lot of shiny coins for my new sets. Nothing makes me more happy in eso than shiny stakes of golden coins . If there is demand, there is supply. If you don't want to manually farm - you must pay .
And btw I'm not billionaire, just reached my +300k gold, and I'm not eso plus .

You don't understand because you don't play at endgame level, that is why. Here is a comment from another user that explains it pretty well:

Decado wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

any competitive build requires potions, specially for PvP. Is true that some builds require more potions, but still, you need a lot of them.

In my raid guild in the message of the day it advises to bring a stack of 200 potions minimum, and if we are practising MoL HM I can easily consume close to 300 pots in 1 night, using the current prices on the EU market as of the other night that would be roughly 30k a night on potions alone, and my guild raids almost every night when we can get a raid going and I know some who do raid every night so that's 200K+ a week on potions alone, and that's a magicka user I don't even wanna imagine the price of a PvPer who goes through that amount on tri stat pots a day

So @Gargath, please show me how you manage to cover that amount of potions per day just by running around in Coldharbor? And no, you are not making money, in the long run your are lossing money, when you get to endgame and you have to spent 150k gold per week in regents, you will understand. Your 300k gold are nothing, the people that manipulate prices like this are sitting over 50+ millon gold, you are not even close to understand how the market works. Same for you @Pyr0xyrecuprotite

Gargath · August 2016

Lets see, I have 7 alts CP460+, each with 100 pcs. tri-effect potions based on columbine and in bank I have another 100 pcs. that makes 800 pcs. potions in my possesion. I can quickly craft another 800 pcs. from my stack of 200 columbines and those other 2 herbs. Really not a big deal - for someone who plays a lot, like me playing few hours every day.
And, did I write somewhere that I don't play at endgame level?

ManDraKE wrote: »

you are not even close to understand how the market works.

This sounds pretty funny

.

Tavore1138 · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

Gargath wrote: »

I don't understand OP, it's so easy to get herbs in ESO, even Columbine grows everywhere. I feel this is just laziness that brought that request up . Why don't you go to Coldharbour and manually farm the herbs, so you could also have a lot, and problem solved...

I'm satisfied that price for Columbine raised from ~300g to ~450g on PC EU recently, because I was keeping around 300 pcs. in my bank. When prices went up I sold all and got a lot of shiny coins for my new sets. Nothing makes me more happy in eso than shiny stakes of golden coins . If there is demand, there is supply. If you don't want to manually farm - you must pay .
And btw I'm not billionaire, just reached my +300k gold, and I'm not eso plus .

You don't understand because you don't play at endgame level, that is why. Here is a comment from another user that explains it pretty well:

Decado wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

any competitive build requires potions, specially for PvP. Is true that some builds require more potions, but still, you need a lot of them.

In my raid guild in the message of the day it advises to bring a stack of 200 potions minimum, and if we are practising MoL HM I can easily consume close to 300 pots in 1 night, using the current prices on the EU market as of the other night that would be roughly 30k a night on potions alone, and my guild raids almost every night when we can get a raid going and I know some who do raid every night so that's 200K+ a week on potions alone, and that's a magicka user I don't even wanna imagine the price of a PvPer who goes through that amount on tri stat pots a day

So @Gargath, please show me how you manage to cover that amount of potions per day just by running around in Coldharbor? And no, you are not making money, in the long run your are lossing money, when you get to endgame and you have to spent 150k gold per week in regents, you will understand. Your 300k gold are nothing, the people that manipulate prices like this are sitting over 50+ millon gold, you are not even close to understand how the market works. Same for you @Pyr0xyrecuprotite m

I can usually find maybe 100-150 of the 'big' herbs in the course of a few hours running around spread across a few days. I don't tear through 300 pots in a night though that would be almost 4 hours of full potion up time. I probably burn around 50-60 in a 2.5 hr trials session and maybe the same in a 4 hour PvP session, so if I am active in content all week I might get through 420 pots so I can cover that with what I find and if I get lucky then I sell what is left.

At the same time I am doing that I am also grabbing every other herb I see plus all other nodes and monster kills so I then have a bunch of other stuff I can refine and sell, maybe even some gold tempers which go at good rates. Probably enough spare to even cover potions at the rates you are going through them.

It really is just a matter of putting in that bit of time to make the economy work for you.

And if you are constantly running high end content you should be getting a decent number of BoE sets pieces which you could be sticking into traders for sale or refining for purple tempers which sell at decent prices too. Just be a bit creative.

FriedEggSandwich · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

Gargath wrote: »

I don't understand OP, it's so easy to get herbs in ESO, even Columbine grows everywhere. I feel this is just laziness that brought that request up . Why don't you go to Coldharbour and manually farm the herbs, so you could also have a lot, and problem solved...

I'm satisfied that price for Columbine raised from ~300g to ~450g on PC EU recently, because I was keeping around 300 pcs. in my bank. When prices went up I sold all and got a lot of shiny coins for my new sets. Nothing makes me more happy in eso than shiny stakes of golden coins . If there is demand, there is supply. If you don't want to manually farm - you must pay .
And btw I'm not billionaire, just reached my +300k gold, and I'm not eso plus .

You don't understand because you don't play at endgame level, that is why. Here is a comment from another user that explains it pretty well:

Decado wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Actually I can manage just fine without Potions. The requirement is dependent on your build I suppose.

any competitive build requires potions, specially for PvP. Is true that some builds require more potions, but still, you need a lot of them.

In my raid guild in the message of the day it advises to bring a stack of 200 potions minimum, and if we are practising MoL HM I can easily consume close to 300 pots in 1 night, using the current prices on the EU market as of the other night that would be roughly 30k a night on potions alone, and my guild raids almost every night when we can get a raid going and I know some who do raid every night so that's 200K+ a week on potions alone, and that's a magicka user I don't even wanna imagine the price of a PvPer who goes through that amount on tri stat pots a day

So @Gargath, please show me how you manage to cover that amount of potions per day just by running around in Coldharbor? And no, you are not making money, in the long run your are lossing money, when you get to endgame and you have to spent 150k gold per week in regents, you will understand. Your 300k gold are nothing, the people that manipulate prices like this are sitting over 50+ millon gold, you are not even close to understand how the market works. Same for you @Pyr0xyrecuprotite

If I run around Hollow City for an hour in the early hours of the morning I can amass about 100 of each type of herb. With alchemy passive that's 400 pots, from an hours farming.

Gargath · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

. Your 300k gold are nothing, the people that manipulate prices like this are sitting over 50+ millon gold, you are not even close to understand how the market works.

Why don't you manipulate these prices in opposite direction? Just join few of those biggest trading guilds, and keep selling Columbines for 1 single gold, you can do it with your trusted friend to avoid loosing too much. After many transactions you should see the price decreases in MM average. Be a good guy and help the market voluntarily. Actually imho anyone can manipulate prices for MM this way and we can either accept that or join the manipulators

.

Troneon · August 2016

On PC EU, Ladysmock and Cornflower are pretty much impossible to find on guild traders and if you do, it's all over the top pricing....

Asking in zone chat is only way to get a good amount at decent price.

I agree something should be done to increase amount of them slightly but not too much because it's a good thing there is a decent economy with them or "should" be anyway...

Troneon · August 2016

Gargath wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

. Your 300k gold are nothing, the people that manipulate prices like this are sitting over 50+ millon gold, you are not even close to understand how the market works.

Why don't you manipulate these prices in opposite direction? Just join few of those biggest trading guilds, and keep selling Columbines for 1 single gold, you can do it with your trusted friend to avoid loosing too much. After many transactions you should see the price decreases in MM average. Be a good guy and help the market voluntarily. Actually imho anyone can manipulate prices for MM this way and we can either accept that or join the manipulators .

So power traders can buy up the entire stock on all guild traders and re list them back at insane pricing to make insane profits.....

Not sure if serious...

ManDraKE · August 2016

Gargath wrote: »

Why don't you manipulate these prices in opposite direction? Just join few of those biggest trading guilds, and keep selling Columbines for 1 single gold, you can do it with your trusted friend to avoid loosing too much. After many transactions you should see the price decreases in MM average. Be a good guy and help the market voluntarily. Actually imho anyone can manipulate prices for MM this way and we can either accept that or join the manipulators .

I'm really trying to keep it polite here, ....are you serious? lol Use the brain for half a second and think what you are saying. /facepalm

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

If I run around Hollow City for an hour in the early hours of the morning I can amass about 100 of each type of herb. With alchemy passive that's 400 pots, from an hours farming.

100 wormwoods and 100 water hyraince and a few columbines lol. Good luck making tripots and inmmovable pots with that.

altemriel · August 2016

ManDraKE wrote: »

I guess this is happening in other servers too, but at least on PC NA, the alchemy regents prices are getting out of hand.
Columbine is already to expensive to be manipulated, but people is inflating prices of other regents like namira's roots, blessed trissle, etc. I literaly went to 15 guilds stores and found ZERO of them, just to go to reapers march (where the main trading guilds are) to found dozens of stacks with prices inflated beetwen 100-200% according to MM.

This need to stop. With the new trials, a lot of people is starting to use more brutality/spellpower pots, so the demand is way higher than a couple months ago, plus the always steady demand of tripots/inmmobile pots for PvP. This is not some rare endgame gear that is being manipulated, we are talking about something as basic as pots that are essencial to PvE and PvP, is a sink of gold that many players can't afford, specially new players that are also using the gold to get their gear. Where are getting to the point where people will stop doing trials cause they can't afford pots.

We need alchemy hirelings, please ZoS.

what did you expect? demand always makes the prices rise. ZOS added poison making, you can use the reagents which we used previously only for potions, now you can use them for poisons. so of course people want them, so the prices get higher...