Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Black Rose is OP
-
![[Deleted User]](https://us.v-cdn.net/5020507/uploads/06301530861bfae62d56b72eef4ac33d.png)
[Deleted User]Soul ShrivenHello there,
Recently we've removed some off topic banter, along with some random singular word posts as well, please be sure to keep the thread on topic while being respectful towards your fellow community members. Keep in mind that baiting and flaming is against the Forum Rules, and can lead to action on one's account.
Thank you for understanding.2 -
Magus✭✭✭✭✭vamp_emily wrote: »I wear Black Rose and I died, does that mean it needs a buff?
No, it means you need more candy crush practice.Duraeon / Maoh
Former Emperor of Haderus, Trueflame, and Azura's Star
PC/NA1 -
SRIBES✭✭✭✭✭\
*It is essentially giving 450 stamina/magic back per second if the player is in 7 heavy, on top of this it gives x2 max stamina, weapon damage, and health. This increases the users damage, tankiness, and sustain all in one set; it is just to much. It's a must for all stamina builds.*
It's not per second. It's once every 4 seconds. I don't remember it increasing constitution by 450, but if that is the number then 450 S/M divided by 4 is 112.5 Stamina and Magicka a theoretical second which is not increased by CP or 20% magicka recovery from potions. It also only occurs if you get hit, so if you are chasing someone while attacking you have 0 recovery.
Look at amberplasm, it gives max magicka, crit, spell damage, and 300 stamina and magicka recovery which is (should) be increased by CP and recovery buffs such as from potions. Even with all that recovery it comes with cost reduction and more recovery via the passives for wearing it.How much stamina and magicka per second does blackrose provide? In general could you explain why this set is OP/ needs nerfing?
You asked me specifically per second, I answered it via the OP. I was in a rush and trying to add it in, you're right it's roughly 112, I was including it with the constitution passive. Stamina does not have something like amberplasm, it is also not heavy armor. I am addressing black rose as an issue with stamina. It is the best option for stamina users and limits the stamina playstyle into a very specific and narrow build type. While magic builds have better or just as good options as amber plasm.
1 -
Forestd16b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....6 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
People like killing stuff, and they dislike stuff they can't kill or stuff that kills them. But that's really as far as most people think when it comes to balance.7 -
Magus✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
How dare you not die instantly from out of stealth hit by 3+ abilities/weapon enchants proc/etc at the same time, amirite? lol
Instead they will have to coordinate dawnbreakers on you, it's very annoying for them to spend the extra time killing you. Darn zerging casual baddies who hold block need to L2P.Duraeon / Maoh
Former Emperor of Haderus, Trueflame, and Azura's Star
PC/NA5 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Because seducer is a DPS set.3 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Why is saying ya a thing now on alliance forums. Is everyone friends in game and just sit in team speak saying ya to each other?
It's a joke among NA teens... it's just a thing they are trying to do so it catches on. Just one of those things kids do. Will probably die down a bit with school now starting. Just ignore it.
Why would it die down, we can just our phones in class.
But for real , why do you talk so much trash to me and my friends. I don't even know who you are
My friends and I.
His grammar was actually correct here. Ref: http://www.english-for-students.com/My-Friend.html
Also, I've been meaning to try black rose for a while but since you mention it's OP, I will give it a try right away. Thanks? Not sure what your agenda is here.
I'm a French model. Bonjour.2 -
SRIBES✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.0 -
juhasman✭✭✭✭\
*It is essentially giving 450 stamina/magic back per second if the player is in 7 heavy, on top of this it gives x2 max stamina, weapon damage, and health. This increases the users damage, tankiness, and sustain all in one set; it is just to much. It's a must for all stamina builds.*
It's not per second. It's once every 4 seconds. I don't remember it increasing constitution by 450, but if that is the number then 450 S/M divided by 4 is 112.5 Stamina and Magicka a theoretical second which is not increased by CP or 20% magicka recovery from potions. It also only occurs if you get hit, so if you are chasing someone while attacking you have 0 recovery.
Look at amberplasm, it gives max magicka, crit, spell damage, and 300 stamina and magicka recovery which is (should) be increased by CP and recovery buffs such as from potions. Even with all that recovery it comes with cost reduction and more recovery via the passives for wearing it.
If only amberplasm could be heavy impen.....5 -
Magus✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.
The only drawback is lower shuffle immunity bonus and lower overall weapon damage, roll dodge cost reduction which is better damage mitigation than anything in the game, lower regen which is irrelevant if they are choosing to be a block hero. 7 heavy would give no snare immunity, 5 heavy 2 medium would give 1 sec of immunity with shuffle, so on the surface to me it seems both have their own benefits.
Nearly every ability adds a snare now, Elder Snares Online: Debuffs Unlimited. Which is the main reason I haven't tried BR yet, since I enjoy the benefit shuffle provides to medium armor users but since you are insisting that BR is so good, I have to try it now. So, I'm still confused at your agenda, do you want more people to run BR?Duraeon / Maoh
Former Emperor of Haderus, Trueflame, and Azura's Star
PC/NA4 -
juhasman✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.Edited by juhasman on August 8, 2016 8:47PM2 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.
Sounds like a problem with too much damage potential, not a Black Rose problem.2 -
Lord_Hev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Sandman929 wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.
Sounds like a problem with too much damage potential, not a Black Rose problem.
Yeah this sounds like an issue with Stamina in general. You nerf Blackrose just because Stam can abuse it, you destroy it's viability for magic tanks to use.
8 -
Magus✭✭✭✭✭Sandman929 wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.
Sounds like a problem with too much damage potential, not a Black Rose problem.
Yeah this sounds like an issue with Stamina in general. You nerf Blackrose just because Stam can abuse it, you destroy it's viability for magic tanks to use.
At least there is no weapon/jewlery for BR so they can't backbar alchemist with it, that would be woooo.
They could convert one of the two max stamina bonuses to a max magicka to balance the set a little bit more since a lot of newer sets follow that trend of 1 of each attribute pool. Small stam DPS hit, small magicka user buff.Duraeon / Maoh
Former Emperor of Haderus, Trueflame, and Azura's Star
PC/NA2 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭\
*It is essentially giving 450 stamina/magic back per second if the player is in 7 heavy, on top of this it gives x2 max stamina, weapon damage, and health. This increases the users damage, tankiness, and sustain all in one set; it is just to much. It's a must for all stamina builds.*
It's not per second. It's once every 4 seconds. I don't remember it increasing constitution by 450, but if that is the number then 450 S/M divided by 4 is 112.5 Stamina and Magicka a theoretical second which is not increased by CP or 20% magicka recovery from potions. It also only occurs if you get hit, so if you are chasing someone while attacking you have 0 recovery.
Look at amberplasm, it gives max magicka, crit, spell damage, and 300 stamina and magicka recovery which is (should) be increased by CP and recovery buffs such as from potions. Even with all that recovery it comes with cost reduction and more recovery via the passives for wearing it.How much stamina and magicka per second does blackrose provide? In general could you explain why this set is OP/ needs nerfing?
You asked me specifically per second, I answered it via the OP. I was in a rush and trying to add it in, you're right it's roughly 112, I was including it with the constitution passive. Stamina does not have something like amberplasm, it is also not heavy armor. I am addressing black rose as an issue with stamina. It is the best option for stamina users and limits the stamina playstyle into a very specific and narrow build type. While magic builds have better or just as good options as amber plasm.
NP.
I think it's just heavy armor development that limits stamina. Most of the HA sets are really obscure, narrowly focused, and lacking completeness. It's the same for magicka users looking for a heavy armor set. Blackrose is just the most well thought out and well rounded set. Most heavy armor sets have to be wrapped with a jewelry set to complete it's viability. Thats not the case with L/M, each set is self contained in completeness. Blackrose is just one of the few, self contained, once and done sets in the HA line.
As a mDK I don't know how it is for stamina users but I can only meet sustain viability with blackrose and drinks. Too much magicka is lost to dodges and shields, and burst builds that only intermittently proc constitution. I think if you lose the constitution bonus then this will be another HA set that requires a second set to complete it rather than increase the direction you are focusing on.
If your purpose is solely to increase diversity it would be better to move blackrose constitution into heavy armor constitution as it's base. That would allow HA users to double stack 2 directly beneficial sets rather than having to use two sets to make one complete functional set (sustain + damage).
Edited by Armitas on August 8, 2016 9:22PMRetired.
Nord mDK2 -
umagon✭✭✭✭✭Why do we have to nerf everything that gives survivability in this game? lets just make it so we stand across from each other and spam attack until the other person dies.... sounds like a much better game.
#NERFANYTHINGTHATGIVESDEFENCE
Some people don't like counter play and for the longest time heavy armor setups where not every effective. And because of this some people got use to their high damage output builds being effective in most situations; however now with the changes to heavy, new sets, and zos upgrading the old sets there is now some counter play to high damage builds. Which is upsetting people whom are unwilling to adapt to change. So when they are defeated instead of analyzing the build they loss to and finding the weakness to defeat it, they ask for it to be removed or changed.Edited by umagon on August 8, 2016 9:24PM10 -
Forestd16b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.
Then blame Wronel he is the one who thought tanks needed a DPS boost he's he one who made thses changes he's the one who made the game horrbily un-balanced0 -
emma666✭✭✭✭✭Sandman929 wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Problem with Black Rose is that mostly people that are using it on PvP are tough like a tank but also doing dmg like DD and have resource managment and selfhealing like healer.
Sounds like a problem with too much damage potential, not a Black Rose problem.
Yeah this sounds like an issue with Stamina in general. You nerf Blackrose just because Stam can abuse it, you destroy it's viability for magic tanks to use.
Exactly. Stam redguards, especially stamplars, can stack damage but still have good regen (especially in blackrose), it's probably the most cheesiest and fotm of all builds available right now and why there are so many templar rerolls. Unlike stam builds, a magicka build can't spec all into DPS and still have decent regen, it's just not the same. It's a stam issue, and there is a reason the majority of PvPers are stam and most of them wearing the same gear and using the same bars.Edited by emma666 on August 8, 2016 10:01PMNymeria - Ebonheart - Grand Overlady - Imperial Templar - HavocI wish you good fortune in the wars to come.8 -
KisoValley✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.
So why weren't you writing threads about BR before?0 -
Calboy✭✭✭✭✭It's a stam issue, and there is a reason the majority of PvPers are stam and most of them wearing the same gear and using the same bars.
The reason why stam builds are the same is because there is no variety aside from swapping x damage skill from one weapon line with y damage skill from another and changing a couple of class utilities. And naturally with that the same sets will be the strongest for most builds and so all stam build are essentially the same.
0 -
Sypher✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.
So why weren't you writing threads about BR before?
Because it wasn't as popular and now that everyone is running it he can't stand out as much.
#exposed #yagood
KappaEdited by Sypher on August 8, 2016 11:28PMDC Dragonknight 'Sypher - AD Nightblade Sypher Ali - AD Sorcerer Sypher Sensei - EP Sorcerer Sypharian - DC Templar Ali Sypher
Youtube: www.youtube.com/SypherPK
Twitch: www.twitch.tv/SypherPK18 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭All these cry babies. No wonder the game is slowly going decrepate. Hey man I found a kuta today. Guess we need to nerf the drop rate on them and on soul assault because you were killed by it.
0 -
SRIBES✭✭✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.
So why weren't you writing threads about BR before?
Because it wasn't as popular and now that everyone is running it he can't stand out as much.
#exposed #yagood
Kappa
I'm not even playing a stamina build, nice try though. Haven't used it since IC came out.4 -
IxskullzxI✭✭✭✭Why do we have to nerf everything that gives survivability in this game? lets just make it so we stand across from each other and spam attack until the other person dies.... sounds like a much better game.
#NERFANYTHINGTHATGIVESDEFENCE
I'm not asking to nerf everything that gives survivability. If you actually read the post maybe you would understand the set also gives damage and makes you tanky. It's the FOTM set for stamina builds and is just OP in general. We might as well just remove all the sets that aren't FOTM because that's what the game has come down to.
#REMOVEEVERYSETINTHEGAMETHATISN'TFOTM
Soooooo remove magicka classes?#HowDoYouLikeYourDK?1 -
Sypher✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Great every one is back at "nerf tanks" ............. Fine then nerf hundings rage, laws of Julionos, seducer, and all those wonderful DPS sets.....
Black rose isn't just a tank set, its everything for a stamina build.
So why weren't you writing threads about BR before?
Because it wasn't as popular and now that everyone is running it he can't stand out as much.
#exposed #yagood
Kappa
I'm not even playing a stamina build, nice try though. Haven't used it since IC came out.
Was obviously pulling your leg don't get all defensive lol
DC Dragonknight 'Sypher - AD Nightblade Sypher Ali - AD Sorcerer Sypher Sensei - EP Sorcerer Sypharian - DC Templar Ali Sypher
Youtube: www.youtube.com/SypherPK
Twitch: www.twitch.tv/SypherPK2 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Nerf every set over-performing in duels until there is many competitive options. The reason i agree with SRIBES is because in a 1v1 situation this set far exceeds any other heavy set.
People are mentioning this set got nerfed in DB dlc but fail to consider the constitution passive was buffed by well over what Black Rose was reduced by on DB (the reason for the nerf in the first place). Black Rose was a good set and was balanced when Imperial City came out. Its now over-performing with the changes to heavy Armour.
Reduce the bonus to constitution or reduce the weapon damage. Before, heavy Armour granted no increase to damage like it does now. The additional damage and constitution buffs to heavy Armour make Black Rose over the top compared to when it released in Imperial City dlc.
Thank you for stepping up. We need more competent players like you who know what is over-performing who also speak up about them for balance purposes. @SRIBES
Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on August 9, 2016 2:28AMPS4 NA DC6 -
Lyrander✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »
Make them walk/run slower! there should be a downfall to it x.x
its really hard to be in light armor against someone in heavy. thats okay...kinda....but them running faster than someone in clothes?
NO WAY!
let me at least get away from them xD1
