Be Honest... Sorcerers Got Hit Too Hard? (or didn't)

Molag_Crow · July 2016

I know it's a little old now but who else thinks Magicka Sorcs got hit too hard? specifically their shield duration, from 20 to 6 seconds (Not talking about the other morph.) that's a bit ridiculous to be honest

I'm a Templar as well, I don't even play my Sorc, just saying..

Edit: ok ok it was justified and had its reasons etc etc

they're performing well! it's just that shields lasting 6 secs from 20 secs is what struck me

Thevorpal1 · July 2016

All my sorc buddies have changed with the meta and are adapting their builds to compensate. The shield change has not impacted their pve at all. Most never ran shields in dungeon or trial content. The biggest hit to them was in pvp and their survivability with shield stacking.

DRXHarbinger · July 2016

Surge was the biggest pain for them. No more frag to full health and overload invicibillity. Shield changes were nothing but surge requires everything to go a lot slower rather than face tank vma last boss just relying on surge heals and overload lol.

Clarkieson · July 2016

Nerf Sorcs
Buff DK’s
No one dare say anything about nightblades or there will be tears before bedtime
Templars are perfectly balanced

Thelon · July 2016

Ep1kMalware · July 2016

Molag_Crow wrote: »

I know it's a little old now but who else thinks Magicka Sorcs got hit too hard? specifically their shield duration, from 20 to 6 seconds (Not talking about the other morph.) that's a bit ridiculous to be honest I'm a Templar as well, I don't even play my Sorc, just saying..

are you for real? you got elegant set just last update. -.-

also, my stam dps probably has the same hp you do, and NO shield and I guarantee dies way less than you do.

l2p w/ mechanics -.-

Flaminir · July 2016

I think too much has hung on the whole shield nerf tbh.

Its never nice getting a nerf to any iconic class defining skills.... but I don't think the shield duration is the reason fewer people seem to be running Sorcs at the minute. Shield duration is pretty easy to adapt to if I'm honest.

Of the good sorcs I know, the people who are playing other characters at the minute just got bored of Sorcs in their current state.

One build... one role.... nothing that isn't a bit better & more fun/engaging on another class.

That's why I'm in that boat too... I can still pull good competitive numbers & do all content on my Sorc... but I can pull higher numbers on almost all my other classes, and its more fun & engaging, & I bring more to a group as well.

Which is a shame.... my Sorc was my first, & fave character. Hopefully his time to shine will come again

Molag_Crow · July 2016

I don't just mean PvE though O.O PvP too...

They are strong, yes, but the surge nerfs AND 6 sec shield duration? come on, when nerfs are needed, you don't just go nerfing this ability then this, oh and maybe that one too, I mean.. 6 seconds is nothing, at least 10-12 seconds would have been more fair (not talking about the other weak morph)

Wollust · July 2016

Sorc > mDK for open world easily. Can't be that bad then.
Though I wouldn't mind nor care if their shield was 10-12s instead of 6. it's their main defense after all so yeah.

Reykice · July 2016

Sorcerers are still #1 in Veteran Maelstrom and still considered easy and that is the hardest content there is for solo...

So they did not get hit that hard and shields had to go, you had them tanking anything and while they still can do it the duration makes mistakes more likely to happen.

In the end they can still pop a shield and laugh at the opposition, but it now requires better timing and can`t be on 24/7.

I doubt they will see buffs when they can top the charts...

Abeille · July 2016

Surge nerf is what hurt on PvE. Yes, they were hit too hard. But this isn't the core of the sorcerer issue. We got repeatedly pigeonholed. The class isn't as forgiving and variated as the others and doesn't allow for a lot of diversity, which in my opinion make them less fun to play. With at least two characters of each class, I have little reason to play my sorcerers.

Molag_Crow · July 2016

Flaminir wrote: »

I think too much has hung on the whole shield nerf tbh.

Its never nice getting a nerf to any iconic class defining skills.... but I don't think the shield duration is the reason fewer people seem to be running Sorcs at the minute. Shield duration is pretty easy to adapt to if I'm honest.

Of the good sorcs I know, the people who are playing other characters at the minute just got bored of Sorcs in their current state.

One build... one role.... nothing that isn't a bit better & more fun/engaging on another class.

That's why I'm in that boat too... I can still pull good competitive numbers & do all content on my Sorc... but I can pull higher numbers on almost all my other classes, and its more fun & engaging, & I bring more to a group as well.

Which is a shame.... my Sorc was my first, & fave character. Hopefully his time to shine will come again

Oh, well fair enough! my Sorc knowledge isn't great, but when I was playing mine, I felt that there weren't much variety with builds (magicka) and it felt quite bland... Streak is still one of the best spells in the game though lol, too fun.

Clarkieson · July 2016

Flaminir wrote: »

I think too much has hung on the whole shield nerf tbh.

Its never nice getting a nerf to any iconic class defining skills.... but I don't think the shield duration is the reason fewer people seem to be running Sorcs at the minute. Shield duration is pretty easy to adapt to if I'm honest.

Of the good sorcs I know, the people who are playing other characters at the minute just got bored of Sorcs in their current state.

One build... one role.... nothing that isn't a bit better & more fun/engaging on another class.

That's why I'm in that boat too... I can still pull good competitive numbers & do all content on my Sorc... but I can pull higher numbers on almost all my other classes, and its more fun & engaging, & I bring more to a group as well.

Which is a shame.... my Sorc was my first, & fave character. Hopefully his time to shine will come again

shields are now used to help cast buffs, then back to dps with crit heals.

if you PVP use healing ward, then hardened ward and then harness. by the time 6 seconds is up you should be healed enough to carry on fighting. unless your CC’d then your dead.

Molag_Crow · July 2016

Reykice wrote: »

Sorcerers are still #1 in Veteran Maelstrom and still considered easy and that is the hardest content there is for solo...

So they did not get hit that hard and shields had to go, you had them tanking anything and while they still can do it the duration makes mistakes more likely to happen.

In the end they can still pop a shield and laugh at the opposition, but it now requires better timing and can`t be on 24/7.

I doubt they will see buffs when they can top the charts...

True that. Almost every single Flawless Conq I've seen is a Sorc ^^

Jaronking · July 2016

The good Sorcs are still good and the bad Sorcs are no longer playing Sorcs.

Lord_Eomer · July 2016

Molag_Crow wrote: »

I don't just mean PvE though O.O PvP too...

They are strong, yes, but the surge nerfs AND 6 sec shield duration? come on, when nerfs are needed, you don't just go nerfing this ability then this, oh and maybe that one too, I mean.. 6 seconds is nothing, at least 10-12 seconds would have been more fair (not talking about the other weak morph)

Harness magica is much stronger than before, it is also reduced to 6 sec. Except sorcerers everyone was relying on harness magica in trials, PvP.

Sorcer shield stack with harness magicka is very powerful combo, if they not nerf duration than sorcers would have been very harder to kill.

This is also about balance with other damage shields including HM, HW..

Magicka was very strong with damage shields but now average comparing stamina. I even now rely on major evasion than these shields.

Vaoh · July 2016

Jaronking wrote: »

The good Sorcs are still good and the bad Sorcs are no longer playing Sorcs.

You are half right.....

The (few) good Sorcs are still good.

The bad sorcs can no longer play that class half-decently anymore.

Both good and bad sorcs are often rerolling to the other three classes which were all buffed significantly, rather than nerfed. Vet rank removal also made this easy and gave people the ability to easily switch out of Sorcerer to try new classes. Many good Sorcs are playing other classes now too because they're good players who play by the meta.

Now Sorcerers are rare in Cyrodiil. If I had to realisticly lay this out, I'd say the general Cyrodiil population these days is around:
Dragonknights: 23%
Nightblades: 35%
Templars: 32%
Sorcerers: 10%

Shield duration nerf should not apply to PvE. Surge needs to be buffed. Pets need to get massive buffs. Bound Armaments needs a buff..... nothing's gonna happem though

Ep1kMalware · July 2016

Reykice wrote: »

Sorcerers are still #1 in Veteran Maelstrom and still considered easy and that is the hardest content there is for solo...

So they did not get hit that hard and shields had to go, you had them tanking anything and while they still can do it the duration makes mistakes more likely to happen.

In the end they can still pop a shield and laugh at the opposition, but it now requires better timing and can`t be on 24/7.

I doubt they will see buffs when they can top the charts...

wrong. magica nb is.

Docmandu · July 2016

Surge might have been a bad change for Magicka sorcs in PvE.. but for Stamina sorcs, it was a nice change. These days stamina sorc for vMSA is actually very nice.

Sandman929 · July 2016

Too hard? Probably, from their perspective, since most Sorcs seemed to want to be light armor high DPS tanks and now it's not as easy to do that in PvP. But I still see very effective casters in Cyrodiil that are much more careful now. My own sorc is 5H/2L now with loads of Impen...less damage but still survivable.

NBrookus · July 2016

Flaminir wrote: »

One build... one role.... nothing that isn't a bit better & more fun/engaging on another class.

The combination of the damage nerf, defense nerf and healing nerf on top of the mobility nerfs really hurts in PvP. Add in the buffs to sharpened and it's rough out there for all light armor builds. Mag sorcs have gotten really scarce in Cyrodiil outside of coordinated groups running with negate monkeys.

I detoured for a while playing templar (which is far flexible with tons of utility) and magicka DK (which needs love more than sorcs do). I went back to my sorc this week to see how it went. I refuse to play a shield stacking overload spammer and I'm over resto/destro.

I made a few tweaks, but ultimately the only major changes are to my playstyle. I have accepted the fact I am wearing paper armor and have no effective defense other than to not be where I can get CCd and killed. I am more careful about where I am positioning myself and picking my fights - even if it means I slink away sometimes from that crit rush/dizzying swing/executioner stam DK stacking 5k weapon damage. If I get caught out of position, I'm probably dead.

Being forced to focus on positioning is making me a better player overall, and honestly I'm doing better than before the nerfs. It's not because the class is stronger: it's because I'm compensating for the nerfs. And I'm not an elite player -- adaptation is not out of reach for most players. If you want it.

If I were a new sorc trying to PvP I would be very, very frustrated. I'm all for teamwork, but it's hard to find a viable role for sorcs that doesn't require other players doing their job. PUG zergs are not a place where you are going to find that reliably.

Tryxus · July 2016

I believe the only true nerfs were:

- Surge: it was definitely a bad change for Sorcs
- Lack of a direct damage attack: before Sorcs used Trapping Webs if they didn't want to use Destro Staff and make use of the boost to Spell Damage with DW. With the skill becoming Stamina, Sorcs are now forced to use a Destro Staff for both PvE and PvP

The Shield Duration changes were needed imo since 20 secs is a bit overkill. 6 secs is still plenty of time to get a heal and some buffs in, and on top of that Harness Magicka now grants Physical Protection too

Eshelmen · July 2016

Best pvp players that I've faced since DB are Stam Sorcs

Reevster · July 2016

Lets be "Real Honest" here, some people whine to much...

VizigothAlaric · July 2016

Clarkieson wrote: »

Nerf Sorcs
Buff DK’s
No one dare say anything about nightblades or there will be tears before bedtime
Templars are perfectly balanced

lol "perfectly balanced" yeah..

RinaldoGandolphi · July 2016

Thevorpal1 wrote: »

All my sorc buddies have changed with the meta and are adapting their builds to compensate. The shield change has not impacted their pve at all. Most never ran shields in dungeon or trial content. The biggest hit to them was in pvp and their survivability with shield stacking.

Yup

I never run shields in PVE either, in PVP however IMO Defensive Rune has become a must if your wanting to run Light Armor.

Front Bar Hardened Ward on your DPS bar and put Healing Ward on your back bar and keep Defensive Rune up(it has a 2 min duration) if your opponent trys to CC and burst you, Defensive Rune will mess up his combo and stun him giving you time to Break Free and Roll while Re-sheilding and Reapplying the Rune. Its a real life saver. Nothing is perfect mind you, but i have found Defensive Rune to be very very valuable in Cyrodiil for a Light Armored Sorc. YYMV

NewBlacksmurf · July 2016

I got kicked due to low dps on a non level 50 alt so it's more of a are-L2P I'm sure so id say it was a hard hit but not that Sorcs can't be viable in another way. I am upset that I deleted my old Sorc whose race and build now would be ideal. It was a VR2 Sorc but this was a year ago. Didn't know about removal of Vr then

luen79rwb17_ESO · July 2016

Biggest issues with sorcs remain the same before and after the nerf. IMO they are: too many toggles, near useless skills (pets for example) and morphs, unattractive passives, almost 0 diversity for magicka builds, overall dps performance seems lacking compared to other classes.

6s duration for shields means more magicka management, increased awareness, but is not the end of the world at all.

psychotic13 · July 2016

Shield duration isn't a problem at all, if you think it is then you were never a good sorc before it was cut, simples.

What hurt sorcs was the surge change, as others have said. I'd be happy if they gave us a decent DoT that sticks and made dark exchange scale.

Oh and fix all of the bugs with the clannfear

mistermutiny89 · July 2016

Healing and shields and blocking has been nerfed and dodging got a buff.

Time to add a cool down between dodging attacks me thinks!

RebornV3x · July 2016

I think the shield duration is fine I mean I don't like it but at this point the sorc has bigger problems we got absolutely no buffs to offset this shield change no damage buff to any abilities would have like to see something done with Mines increase stun time and damage something or buff Defensive rune, and we need a spammable spell on par with old Trapping Webs. Sorcs need some love this class is in critical condition and on life support Its the weakest class overall in the game.