Players with Cross faction attitudes have the wrong spirit for 3 faction PvP

Lokey0024 · July 2016

So long on your alt. Stand on the edge of the back of the keep. Let 10 people gapclose up the wall on you because a "majority" of people requested it. Or follow the EP zerg like a stream sniper. I know, lets bash on the guy frustrated with the cheese! Cuz im leet peeveepeer

Im sorry but the amount of dumba$$ on these forums is out of hand.

Rylana · July 2016

Lord_Hev wrote: »

TL;DR: I suck at PvP so blame spies.

Or better yet, farm the hell out of Qaevir when he tries to tank my group. JESUSSSSS BEAMMMS.

No seriously i got like 4kbs on you today with Shondra, PLEASE TO BE FEED ME MORE. Also back to EP pl0x

Hell otherwise idgaf what you do, I only got a little salty with ya today cause we were trying to crown a guildie and you was causing ruckus with jumping into keeps. >_> Legits be your guildie homie, halp him.

Rylana · July 2016

To address the overarching topic, as an OG crossfaction player, I see no beef or issue whatsoever with fighting my allies, friends, guildmates, yo momma, whoever.

It only irks me when a guild member ignores the needs of the guild and plays against us, maliciously and especially when we are struggling to get numbers or group synergies sorted out. Otherwise, its all AP to me, always has been. Hell some of my better fights are against my own guildmates past and present.

Today and yesterday I had to deal with some choices. A friend of mine in AD that ive known for years, and a friend and guildmate in EP who ive known almost as long, were both the top of their respective leaderboards.

I had to block my friend, support my guildie, and deal with a couple of people in our guild playing the other side to support our mutual friend.

it happens. Im not particularly upset about it (though as said before, when Legits was at 5/6 and crowning was imminent, probably should have just accepted it and helped out, Ayrene's push was already dead by then), but it didnt matter at the end of the day, no one got emp due to blue waking up and saying NOPE. I am fine with that, too.

Rylana's priority system for loyalty

DR guildies (especially if they are a friend)
Friends outside of the guild
Non DR factionmates who are allies of DR
Probably you

Notice real quickly that faction doesnt matter, just relationship. If youre a guildie, friend, ally, or otherwise cool person, i probably have your back on whatever faction you play. Sometimes this causes conflict, like today, but thats an important thing to keep in mind, just because youre EP doesnt mean I automatically got you, if youre a tool ill just hop on my DC and wreck you.

AJ_1988 · July 2016

The problem with opening campaigns to all toons is that people will jump on the one that has all the scrolls and let their buddies use the gap closer exploit to get into keeps and take the scrolls. What they usually do is die so the the toon on the faction with scrolls picks it up and runs it back to his buddies alliance and nothing can be done to stop it. They need scrolls in keeps to have kill zones if they arnt flagged and can't be captured if the walls are still up.

That solves a lot of issues then the "spies" arnt so big of an issue.

Rylana · July 2016

AJ_1988 wrote: »

The problem with opening campaigns to all toons is that people will jump on the one that has all the scrolls and let their buddies use the gap closer exploit to get into keeps and take the scrolls. What they usually do is die so the the toon on the faction with scrolls picks it up and runs it back to his buddies alliance and nothing can be done to stop it. They need scrolls in keeps to have kill zones if they arnt flagged and can't be captured if the walls are still up.

That solves a lot of issues then the "spies" arnt so big of an issue.

Funny thing that, maybe im just wired different, but i refuse to play on the dominant side. In fact every time Ep has been on top for Haderus, I have vanished, usually to AD on Trueflame or DC on Had, or something. I dont understand why people only like to play when they are winning or severely outnumber/outclass their opponents.

it disgusts me, personally. Do I lead a large group? Sure, but im normally fighting outnumbered despite that, taking 20ish guys vs zerglords worth of AD or DC, its just how to pans out. Sometimes a smallman gets caught up, it happens, cant always be helped, especially if they attack us.

but you wont see me gatecamping or sitting in back keeps or resources, etc. Hate that stuff.

K4RMA · July 2016

Bromburak wrote: »

When ZOS says that "One Tamriel" has no impact on Cyrodiil it's actually not true and here is why.

The amount of cross faction players acting like spies or help other factions in farming APs or flip keeps is alarming.
And the way how ESO supports them is pretty bad, such players not only use whisper or TS , they are following stealthers
from their own faction just to show other factions where everyone is hiding etc..

Seriously, how can you screw over your own faction like that on a daily basis? It's ridiculous.
That such players have no faction pride is one thing but their obvious non existing team spirit is the worst of all.
How can a PvP system support such cross faction noobs?

It's ok to have friends in other factions and you can PvE as much as you like within other factions.
Just don't bring your social real life into Cyrodiil, because your cross faction mentality has nothing todo with 3 faction PvP.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
We cannot avoid spies but at least you should improve your campaign system that doesn't allow players joining the same campaign on different factions on the same account.
Please discuss this before "One Tamriel" hits the server because "cross faction friends" are rising and will have impact on Cyrodiil.

I love reading posts on how if you play multiple factions then you're a traitor. I've said it before and I'll say it again, no one cares about you and your apparent patriotic mindset. People play multiple factions because, just as @Rylana said, they hate playing on the winning side, they hate outnumbering and outclassing their opponents. Who finds it fun zerging down players that you outnumber 10:1?

"cross faction noobs"
I laugh.

AJ_1988 · July 2016

Rylana wrote: »

AJ_1988 wrote: »

The problem with opening campaigns to all toons is that people will jump on the one that has all the scrolls and let their buddies use the gap closer exploit to get into keeps and take the scrolls. What they usually do is die so the the toon on the faction with scrolls picks it up and runs it back to his buddies alliance and nothing can be done to stop it. They need scrolls in keeps to have kill zones if they arnt flagged and can't be captured if the walls are still up.

That solves a lot of issues then the "spies" arnt so big of an issue.

Funny thing that, maybe im just wired different, but i refuse to play on the dominant side. In fact every time Ep has been on top for Haderus, I have vanished, usually to AD on Trueflame or DC on Had, or something. I dont understand why people only like to play when they are winning or severely outnumber/outclass their opponents.

it disgusts me, personally. Do I lead a large group? Sure, but im normally fighting outnumbered despite that, taking 20ish guys vs zerglords worth of AD or DC, its just how to pans out. Sometimes a smallman gets caught up, it happens, cant always be helped, especially if they attack us.

but you wont see me gatecamping or sitting in back keeps or resources, etc. Hate that stuff.

I'm loyal to my faction the only time I would have a toon on another one is to farm motifs that's it. If the campaign goes poo and is full of bs I just leave. I'm with you, it's pathetic that people must play on the winning side, if everyone did that it wouldn't be much of pvp as there would be no one to fight.

People don't seem to understand that if you want to be on the winning side you have to put an effort in.

americansteel · July 2016

Lord_Hev wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

TL;DR: I suck at PvP so blame spies.

If you need to make use of the described behavior apparently you are a bad loser.
However, this thread is about the idea of 3 faction PvP and not about player skill.

Since you have no arguments it's off topic.

The decision to allow any alt to access any server was a recent deliberate change after majority request. Spies are a myth created by sore losers like you, or faction purists. ZOS not going to restrict people from freedom of choice. Deal with it.

yea spy tactics exists and rampant on xbx1.

has nothing to do with being a sore loser.

americansteel · July 2016

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

while zenimax has made some questionable decisions in regards to pvp i cannot for a second believe they have made one decision for this game based on popular demand. people use that excuse to generally push an idea that only they support, like cross faction cheating being ok because you can talk to an enemy player in game. The fact that people are getting so agressive in thread over cross faction shinanigans just shows how badly they want some kind of edge over other players no matter how bad it makes them look

this is the truth, how ever these people seem to have an ego in which they think theyre gods at gaming.

join 1 faction stay there.

Bromburak · July 2016

K4RMA wrote: »

I love reading posts on how if you play multiple factions then you're a traitor.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, no one cares about you and your apparent patriotic mindset. People play multiple factions because, just as @Rylana said, they hate playing on the winning side, they hate outnumbering and outclassing their opponents. Who finds it fun zerging down players that you outnumber 10:1?

Great that you love to read posts but you should understand them too.

Good guilds are well organized and they always would fight to make their faction (DAOC, ESO) or server (GW2) succeed.
The good guilds also accept the fact that they might playing for a weak faction but they don't give up , they
will work as a team to make their faction become more succesful, thats a proper solution by players that doesn't require
any faction hopping especially not in ESO during a running campaign.

But what you are doing with your post is confirming symptoms without any solution because you keep on ignoring the fact that we as players are not responsible for a bad campaign system that unfortunately supports WTJ hopping. So you never become a stable faction as long the root of the problem doesn't change.

KisoValley · July 2016

americansteel wrote: »

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

while zenimax has made some questionable decisions in regards to pvp i cannot for a second believe they have made one decision for this game based on popular demand. people use that excuse to generally push an idea that only they support, like cross faction cheating being ok because you can talk to an enemy player in game. The fact that people are getting so agressive in thread over cross faction shinanigans just shows how badly they want some kind of edge over other players no matter how bad it makes them look

this is the truth, how ever these people seem to have an ego in which they think theyre gods at gaming.

join 1 faction stay there.

Personally have more mates in DC/EP than AD and I main AD. I'd be pissed if I couldn't PVP with mates from other factions cause guys like you are crying over spying on a game lol.

K4RMA · July 2016

Bromburak wrote: »

K4RMA wrote: »

I love reading posts on how if you play multiple factions then you're a traitor.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, no one cares about you and your apparent patriotic mindset. People play multiple factions because, just as @Rylana said, they hate playing on the winning side, they hate outnumbering and outclassing their opponents. Who finds it fun zerging down players that you outnumber 10:1?

Great that you love to read posts but you should understand them first.

Good guilds are well organized and they always would fight to make their faction (DAOC, ESO) or server (GW2) succeed.
The good guilds also accept the fact that they might playing for a weak faction but they don't give up , they
will work as a team to make their faction become more succesful, thats a proper solution by players that doesn't require
any faction hopping especially not in ESO during a running campaign.

But what you are doing with your post is confirming symptoms without any solution because you keep on ignoring the fact that we as players are not responsible for a bad balanced campaign system that supports WTJ hopping. So you never become a stable faction as long the root of the problem doesn't change.

What to you is the root problem?

I don't know about you, but I have friends on all 3 factions. Sometimes I want to kill them, and sometimes I want to help them kill. This is a vital social feature of ESO PVP, if we had ZOS enforce a 1 faction per account law, would you have fun? Would you be happy if you were forced to fight in gigantic zergs that devote themselves to zerging down lesser players, even your friends? The main reason I come back to this game every week is the community of friends I've come to love playing with. Just because their on a different faction, should I be forced to hate them?

Truth of the matter is that your scenario for a perfect AvAvA world will never exist in ESO because the big changes that would need to happen for it to work would break up the already small community of PVPers and inevitably kill Cyrodiil.

Lord_Hev · July 2016

Rylana wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

TL;DR: I suck at PvP so blame spies.

Or better yet, farm the hell out of Qaevir when he tries to tank my group. JESUSSSSS BEAMMMS.

No seriously i got like 4kbs on you today with Shondra, PLEASE TO BE FEED ME MORE. Also back to EP pl0x

Hell otherwise idgaf what you do, I only got a little salty with ya today cause we were trying to crown a guildie and you was causing ruckus with jumping into keeps. >_> Legits be your guildie homie, halp him.

I understand. Me and Ayrene go back some though, we played a lot together, so when he personally asked me to help, I wasn't going to say no.

Those were good fights, idk or care about the yappering between you and Unruh and all that, none of my bznz. I personally find the gap-close into keeps funny and can create some pretty interesting and chaotic fights if enough people do it, lol.

Bromburak · July 2016

K4RMA wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

K4RMA wrote: »

I love reading posts on how if you play multiple factions then you're a traitor.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, no one cares about you and your apparent patriotic mindset. People play multiple factions because, just as @Rylana said, they hate playing on the winning side, they hate outnumbering and outclassing their opponents. Who finds it fun zerging down players that you outnumber 10:1?

Great that you love to read posts but you should understand them first.

Good guilds are well organized and they always would fight to make their faction (DAOC, ESO) or server (GW2) succeed.
The good guilds also accept the fact that they might playing for a weak faction but they don't give up , they
will work as a team to make their faction become more succesful, thats a proper solution by players that doesn't require
any faction hopping especially not in ESO during a running campaign.

But what you are doing with your post is confirming symptoms without any solution because you keep on ignoring the fact that we as players are not responsible for a bad balanced campaign system that supports WTJ hopping. So you never become a stable faction as long the root of the problem doesn't change.

What to you is the root problem?

Again, ESO supports real 3 factions and it's one of the best PvP concepts since DAOC siege and mass pvp but unfortunately the ESO campaign system it self works like WvW in GW2 where factions doesn't matter because they are faked by 3 servers only and you basically can play side by side with your enemies from last campaign next time because of hopping and WTJ cycles.

As described in my previous post, any afford by a faction doesn't really have any impact in ESO. Usually faction guilds would get organized to make their faction become more successful but their influence actually doesn't matter because we all don't really fight other factions, we fight a system that supports hopping during campaigns are running.

So why do we need a 3 faction game when it works like GW2? It totally makes no sense.

Humphie · July 2016

If I want to be a red potato today, I will be red. If I feel yellow tomorrow, I am going to do that. Nobody tells me who I can or can't play with. Spying is just a stupid claim since people can...you know...read a map. And eso pvp doesn't exactly need briliant strategy since...you know...people can read a map.

I am tired of this. If you don't like playing another faction...THEN DON'T! But don't force your playstyle on me.
My loyality is with my friends and not a color. If the map is completely yellow, I am sure not going to jump on that train.

Bromburak · July 2016

Humphie wrote: »

If I want to be a red potato today, I will be red. If I feel yellow tomorrow, I am going to do that. Nobody tells me who I can or can't play with. Spying is just a stupid claim since people can...you know...read a map. And eso pvp doesn't exactly need briliant strategy since...

With this statement I highly doubt that you understand the design principles of three faction PvP.
Would you please remind us why 3 faction systems and alliances actually exist in ESO when your choice doesn't matter?

Arguments are welcome.

TooskSG · July 2016

Don't feed the RAMZerg troll: they're known to PvDoor for Yellow with a locked pop vs 2 bars EP/DC.

Humphie · July 2016

Bromburak wrote: »

Humphie wrote: »

If I want to be a red potato today, I will be red. If I feel yellow tomorrow, I am going to do that. Nobody tells me who I can or can't play with. Spying is just a stupid claim since people can...you know...read a map. And eso pvp doesn't exactly need briliant strategy since...

With this statement I highly doubt that you understand the design principles of three faction PvP.
Would you please remind us why 3 faction systems and alliances actually exist in ESO when your choice doesn't matter?

Arguments are welcome.

Didn't you get the part about being a potato?

I play EP mainly. Most of my friends are EP and I care about the faction. But that doesn't mean I am forced to play EP all the time. If the map is completely red and I want to PvP, I am going to play yellow and get some fights.

I don't know why you are asking for arguments. This is how I play the game. I don't really care if you like this or not.

If you play one faction only...cool. But don't tell me I don't understand game concepts please.
Choices matter...that doesn't mean you have to like other people's choices.

Humphie · July 2016

TooskSG wrote: »

Don't feed the RAMZerg troll: they're known to PvDoor for Yellow with a locked pop vs 2 bars EP/DC.

Do I have to put you on ignore here too?

Rylana · July 2016

Bromburak wrote: »

Humphie wrote: »

If I want to be a red potato today, I will be red. If I feel yellow tomorrow, I am going to do that. Nobody tells me who I can or can't play with. Spying is just a stupid claim since people can...you know...read a map. And eso pvp doesn't exactly need briliant strategy since...

With this statement I highly doubt that you understand the design principles of three faction PvP.
Would you please remind us why 3 faction systems and alliances actually exist in ESO when your choice doesn't matter?

Arguments are welcome.

If crossfactioning was not allowed, ever, since the launch of this game, it is a guarantee that PvP would also no longer exist.

Reasons:

1. At launch AD was by far the most populated faction, they had enough numbers to poplock FOUR campaigns (wabba, auriels bow, hopesfire, and dawnbreaker) in primetime and completely dominated seven of the original ten campaigns back when campaigns held a lot more people. EP had enough for one, possibly two (ep usually poplocked on wabba and sometimes chrysamere or goldbrand), and DC was lucky if they ever locked on wabba (usually three bar wabba, two bar bloodthorn),

2. When the campaigns were downsized to four, that leaves every single campaign with a glut of AD, completely locked up, huge queues, and EP might be able to compete on two, DC maybe on one, IF they all were there.

3. When campaigns were again reconsolidated to three (now two), do you get the point yet? We would live entirely in a world where AD has basically shoved the entire rest of the playerbase out of cyrodiil, anyone who dares show up as red or blue meets a literal thousand AD on any campaign they enter (assuming server cap never changes). Hell no for the 600+ person queue time if I was AD in this situation.

How many AD rerolled to blue or red to balance this from launch? PROTIP - a metric crapton did. Why did they? Because youre assuming people are going to research campaign balances and just magically pick something nice and even.

Hell I rolled AD at launch, a great multitude then, and I am sorry I did, I would have rolled EP from go had I known how screwed up the balance would be.

Maybe in your fantasy world you can think in terms of fairness, but imagine being DC today had no one ever been able to switch. You probably wouldnt even exist now, crushed under the AD horde and even the EP zerg once campaigns consolidated.

Your entire premise is misinformed and frankly laughable. Stop being mad that someone switched sides on you, fricken kill em if they make you that mad. Otherwise sit down, youre taking it way too serious for one thing, and for another you clearly have no idea what lack of crossrealming would do to this game. This is but ONE example out of all sorts of other reasons (racial balances - not everyone has explorers pack, ongoing self policing of the playerbase when one side gets too big or we lose another major guild throwing entire campaigns into chaos and one sidedness, destruction of communities within our already small community...) i mean get freaking real man.

TooskSG · July 2016

Humphie wrote: »

TooskSG wrote: »

Don't feed the RAMZerg troll: they're known to PvDoor for Yellow with a locked pop vs 2 bars EP/DC.

Do I have to put you on ignore here too?

You can ignore the truth all you want: it won't change the fact that your actions have contradicted your words.

Humphie wrote: »

If the map is completely yellow, I am sure not going to jump on that train.

Inb4 you try to justify not hopping off the zerg faction. You be EG all you want, but don't get upset when you get called out on it.

Xv9CGFL.jpg?1

Humphie · July 2016

TooskSG wrote: »

Humphie wrote: »

TooskSG wrote: »

Don't feed the RAMZerg troll: they're known to PvDoor for Yellow with a locked pop vs 2 bars EP/DC.

Do I have to put you on ignore here too?

You can ignore the truth all you want: it won't change the fact that your actions have contradicted your words.

Humphie wrote: »

If the map is completely yellow, I am sure not going to jump on that train.

Inb4 you try to justify not hopping off the zerg faction. You be EG all you want, but don't get upset when you get called out on it.

I actually don't have to justify anything to you but this time...I will. RAM switched factions. Yes. At that time we decided that it made sense. There was EP doing nothing but PvEdooring all day long. AD was basically non existent. So we rerolled. In my eyes this is for the greater good of a campaign.

Did I like playing AD much? Did I miss EP? I don't have to answer these questions to you but to give you one answer to these questions: yes.

RAM has amazing people and players in guild and they play the map. No AP farming, no brigde fights.

But just for you: I left RAM so please stop calling me anything on here or ingame.

Rylana · July 2016

I am pondering a DR raid night on Trueflame now, sounds to me like AD has swarmed the hell out of that map. Not surprising, they sorta got kicked off Azuras by DC.

Bromburak · July 2016

We all have different opinions but your personal attacks actually confirm that you have nothing to say.

On topic:
@Rylana
Nobody claimed that changing your faction should not be allowed in general.
But it always should be discussed why it's allowed while a campaign is running.

You cannot really play 3 faction PvP while players keep on hopping to the other team during campaign runtime.
Maybe we cannot compare this with seasons in real sports but that doesn't mean that we don't need rules.

Ghettokid · July 2016

So you think that people shouldnt do anything in cyrodiil with players from other factions? No dolmens, no bosses, no quests, no arena in IC... ?

I am pretty sure that also in irl people may ally with "enemies" against greater danger. So why not in game?

Bromburak · July 2016

So you think that people shouldnt do anything in cyrodiil with players from other factions? No dolmens, no bosses, no quests, no arena in IC... ?

I am pretty sure that also in irl people may ally with "enemies" against greater danger. So why not in game?

You make no sense, why would you release a game that follows design principles of 3 faction PvP when the target group prefers to play side by side with enemies?

Beside that ZOS said "One Tamriel" has no impact on Cyrodiil and this is not true either because with One Tamriel we all make more cross faction friends while playing PvE and it's common sense that this will increase the hopper rate in Cyrodiil too.

RedisSennegath · July 2016

This is only natural to happen. After all in the end you only care about a circle that surrounds you which isn't your faction. It's the people you play with on a daily basis and you are more likely to help them then a bunch of people who you don't really give a crap about. I honestly doubt there are people just spying on people and screaming in zone chat what the other faction is *** about in zone chat, at least I've never seen that (Probably because no one really gives a hell where the pugs are going since they won't flip anything anyway most of the times they just make for nice canon fodder). Besides, to all you factionpriders, spying should make the game more realistic to you, nah?

Ghettokid · July 2016

Bromburak wrote: »

So you think that people shouldnt do anything in cyrodiil with players from other factions? No dolmens, no bosses, no quests, no arena in IC... ?

I am pretty sure that also in irl people may ally with "enemies" against greater danger. So why not in game?

You make no sense, why would you release a game that follows design principles of 3 faction PvP when the target group prefers to play side by side with enemies?

Beside that ZOS said "One Tamriel" has no impact on Cyrodiil and this is not true either because with One Tamriel we all make more cross faction friends while playing PvE and this will increase the hopper rate in Cyrodiil too.

"You make no sense" :Dd
How does it affect on PvP if you do quests in cyrodiil with players from other factions? It doesnt! Will it give it you AP? No! So whats the problem with that?

Farming ap/ helping enemies on keeps is different, but doing pve content in cyrodiil with other factions is allright.

Bromburak · July 2016

RedisSennegath wrote: »

Besides, to all you factionpriders, spying should make the game more realistic to you, nah?

As already explained on first page in this thread, don't act like that their motivation to spy has a role playing background that would give the game more value because their motivation is simply own profit ...

Nice try though ...

Bromburak · July 2016

Ghettokid wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

So you think that people shouldnt do anything in cyrodiil with players from other factions? No dolmens, no bosses, no quests, no arena in IC... ?

I am pretty sure that also in irl people may ally with "enemies" against greater danger. So why not in game?

You make no sense, why would you release a game that follows design principles of 3 faction PvP when the target group prefers to play side by side with enemies?

Beside that ZOS said "One Tamriel" has no impact on Cyrodiil and this is not true either because with One Tamriel we all make more cross faction friends while playing PvE and this will increase the hopper rate in Cyrodiil too.

"You make no sense" :Dd
How does it affect on PvP if you do quests in cyrodiil with players from other factions? It doesnt! Will it give it you AP? No! So whats the problem with that?

Farming ap/ helping enemies on keeps is different, but doing pve content in cyrodiil with other factions is allright.

You can turn and twist the facts as much as you like, you are still confirming that "One Tamriel" does have impact on Cyrodiil.

Btw. in one of your other threads you said that you were asking an enemy Emp per /whisper if he would let you kill him just to get the achievement ... Here we go again, players like you proved once again that they would do anything even if the method of achievement was not intentional by game design ...