Can one be banned for this?

Khajiit_Ri · June 2016

Last night this one was in Cyrodiil, and he was about to attack a lone enemy player, until he saw two others enemy players in stealth, so Khajiit watched and observed members from my alliance (about 10) walk up to where the enemy player was, the other two enemy players came out of stealth, no fighting, then the two go back into stealth, and the unstealthed enemy player starts killing each of my alliance members one by one, until only 9 are dead, then the one left standing resurrects the recently deceased. Then 9 are killed and a different one is left standing and she ressurects.

Then they switch roles and the enemy faction lets my alliance attack them but not to the point of death, they just heal one below a certain amount, what the heck is happening there?

Pomaikai · June 2016

Khajiit_Ri wrote: »

Last night this one was in Cyrodiil, and he was about to attack a lone enemy player, until he saw two others enemy players in stealth, so Khajiit watched and observed members from my alliance (about 10) walk up to where the enemy player was, the other two enemy players came out of stealth, no fighting, then the two go back into stealth, and the unstealthed enemy player starts killing each of my alliance members one by one, until only 9 are dead, then the one left standing resurrects the recently deceased. Then 9 are killed and a different one is left standing and she ressurects. Then they switch roles and the enemy faction lets my alliance attack them but they just heal, what the heck is happening there?

Guild members farming one another for AP to increase Leaderboard rankings. It's certainly not within the spirit of the game, and is rather sleazy, that's for sure. Whether it's an actual exploit is another matter entirely. ZOS seems to believe that if they play See No Evil, Hear No Evil, Speak No Evil, then exploits will just magically vanish, so I highly doubt that they'll ever come out an acknowledge it as an actual exploit and tell people that it's against the rules.

Tavore1138 · June 2016

Well I think anyone with a conscience would see this as cheating - basically they are feeding each other AP points in various ways to climb the leader boards which may be to get emp, which is bad enough, but also denies people who play honestly their fair chance at good end of campaign rewards.

Without getting overly angry here this is something that has been going on for ages and so far I am not aware of Zenimax taking any action to prevent it or punish it.

Orlacc · June 2016

I have seen this. One guild likes to do it next to Sej. I just jump in an kill everyone I can. Not an exploit per se, just lame. But then again, many seem to place their self worth in how they are perceived in a video game.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · June 2016

Yes, that's not supposed to be allowed. In the future take a screen shot and report them. It's called boosting.

Rohamad_Ali · June 2016

The not so glorious road to Emperor AP farm .

Esquire1980g_ESO · June 2016

This is called "fight clubbing" and it's been around for a long time. SWG seen this with the Jedi system just before CU when they added the FRS, CU, and the NGE when the PVP system required points to keep your PVP rating.

It's just about going to happen expecially with "leaderboards" and any other system that requires constant participation and/or an "alpha" prof (like emp here). People will game the system.

I'm actually surprised there isn't a lot more of it gong on.

Pomaikai · June 2016

"Fight Clubbing?" What a wonderful attempt to give a nice name to being a sleaze bag cheater. Scumming might be a better word for it, don't you think?

Khajiit_Ri · June 2016

oh

this is sad news.

Turelus · June 2016

This is a weird one because in the past ZOS have said yes this is bad and they will enforce it, then at later times they have ignored reports of it entirely and said nothing.

The person to ask would be @ZOS_BrianWheeler however I am not sure if he would be willing to make an official statement because if he does it either commits them to enforcing it or tells everyone it's fine and we see a proliferation of it.

Other issues like this are jumping into keeps via bad world design of rocks etc, running scrolls for your own alliance with an alt in a rival faction neither of which ZOS has been willing to make a statement on in a very long time.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · June 2016

Turelus wrote: »

This is a weird one because in the past ZOS have said yes this is bad and they will enforce it, then at later times they have ignored reports of it entirely and said nothing.

The person to ask would be @ZOS_BrianWheeler however I am not sure if he would be willing to make an official statement because if he does it either commits them to enforcing it or tells everyone it's fine and we see a proliferation of it.

Other issues like this are jumping into keeps via bad world design of rocks etc, running scrolls for your own alliance with an alt in a rival faction neither of which ZOS has been willing to make a statement on in a very long time.

I had a guy tell me 2 days ago that he had a "special ops" character to run scrolls back for his alliance. #mentalgymnastics

Khajiit_Ri · June 2016

This one has never understood why they allowed you to have multiple accounts in the same alliance. It makes about as much sense as finding lint in Ya'Tirrje's pockets.

Nemeliom · June 2016

I play pvp and every day advance on strategies, timing, ideas. And I see a reward for this when I get an ítem at the end of campaign or by reward of the worthy. My real goal is have fun as long as I can. I usually get bored of games when I can't get any better.
So cheating the way those guys did may prove an advantage for a month. But in the end they won't be able to enjoy it as much as I did, because they will have the best (and same) items for the rest of this patch. Completely boring from my point of view.

Khajiit_Ri · June 2016

@ZOS_BrianWheeler this one wonders if you can be antagonized into answering a question my friend?

Or perhaps, it is true that you are a Jekosiit, as they whisper on other forums, this one does not know you, but Khajiit-Ri wonders about your integrity or does the community perception of you not matter?

Xylphan · June 2016

Looks like a case for some PvP justice. Why isn't it happening?

Khajiit_Ri · June 2016

Jekosiit Confirmed

Turelus · June 2016

I don't think insulting the developer you want to hear from or taunting them into talking is the best way to get a response.

Pomaikai · June 2016

Turelus wrote: »

I don't think insulting the developer you want to hear from or taunting them into talking is the best way to get a response.

Asking nicely hasn't worked so far. NOTHING has worked so far. You have a better idea that would actually result in someone with authority at ZOS answering a question?

Turelus · June 2016

Pomaikai wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I don't think insulting the developer you want to hear from or taunting them into talking is the best way to get a response.

Asking nicely hasn't worked so far. NOTHING has worked so far. You have a better idea that would actually result in someone with authority at ZOS answering a question?

Nope, but you're just going to get moderated and a warning, eventually a forums ban if it continues.

Brian is actually one of the better developers for coming on the forums and answering questions or diving into a thread for feedback. The issue here is more he can't make an official statement without forcing ZOS to commit resources to Cyrodiil law enforcement or telling everyone these actions are fine and keep doing them.

Either way there will be an outcry from people over it.

ZedalisDesign · June 2016

Something I don't quite understand...

How hard would it really be to have an internal cooldown/tracking mechanism for player characters? That way, for instance, you wouldn't see an AP gain for killing the same character multiple times in a given amount of time.

Seems to me that it would cut down on some of the griefing while also eliminating this issue - or at least mitigating it

My .02

Dromede · June 2016

It would be really hard to prevent this from happenning since dueling also falls under AP feeding from a certain point of view. With no viable alternative, the outcry for banning those who genuinly practice duels/small group pvp fights for learning and practice will be too much.

The intent is not always obvious, unfortunately, and is even harder to see through game logs.

Pomaikai · June 2016

Except the time has come to poop or get off the pot when it comes to enforcing the rules against exploiters and cheaters. Either spend the danged money, put real live boots on the ground in the game, and start busting abusers on the spot and warning/banning them, or acknowledge that you don't have the resources and/or the will to do so. That way the rest of us can start using the same tools and exploits that the cheaters are currently using so we'll all be on a level playing field.

That's it in a nutshell.

Management needs to talk to us and make real decisions and stop sending the hired help, no matter how nice they are, to sweep things under the carpet.

yodased · June 2016

This is actually a pretty clear case of users doing something that is pretty *** and low-brow, but it's unenforceable to a point of absurdity.

I mean, what is the potential fix to this? If a player kills x amount of players without dying then cheating?

Nah, they are not doing anything outside the scope of the game code, they area not using broken or buggy functions to get an unfair advantage and they are not doing anything that gives them the opportunity to advance at a faster rate of speed than anyone else.

I mean resource boosting is the biggest way that you can farm AP, with diminishing returns of player kills, even with a 9 person rotation you have a finate amount of AP.

Turelus · June 2016

ZedalisDesign wrote: »

Something I don't quite understand...

How hard would it really be to have an internal cooldown/tracking mechanism for player characters? That way, for instance, you wouldn't see an AP gain for killing the same character multiple times in a given amount of time.

Seems to me that it would cut down on some of the griefing while also eliminating this issue - or at least mitigating it

My .02

Already in the game but I believe the reset time is about 1min. It's been a couple of years since I last tested/experienced AP feeding.

SilentFox22 · June 2016

There is a group of cross-faction folks who do actual "fight-clubbing" in the sense that dueling matches are set up for the enjoyment of sparring. I mention this to clarify the difference of what the OP is describing above so as the terminology used is not confused for the other. Due to the nature of the group I described, I cannot speak more of it less I break the first and only rule of Tamriel's Fight-Club. lol

Xundiin · June 2016

Esquire1980g_ESO wrote: »

This is called "fight clubbing" and it's been around for a long time. SWG seen this with the Jedi system just before CU when they added the FRS, CU, and the NGE when the PVP system required points to keep your PVP rating.

It's just about going to happen expecially with "leaderboards" and any other system that requires constant participation and/or an "alpha" prof (like emp here). People will game the system.

I'm actually surprised there isn't a lot more of it gong on.

CU didn't have FRS. THey took it out along with messing up pearl drops. That's why the BH's during this time sucked, they'd face a Pre-CU jedi with a maxed saber one out of every 20 or so bounties. Then scream hack because they never seen or don't see those damage numbers often. I got reported by BH's multiple times because they didn't understand a capped dam/speed saber.

Pomaikai wrote: »

"Fight Clubbing?" What a wonderful attempt to give a nice name to being a sleaze bag cheater. Scumming might be a better word for it, don't you think?

It's what it's been called for just about 10-15 years. If this name was used prior to SWG I don't know, but it's what we called it.

yodased · June 2016

ZedalisDesign wrote: »

Something I don't quite understand...

How hard would it really be to have an internal cooldown/tracking mechanism for player characters? That way, for instance, you wouldn't see an AP gain for killing the same character multiple times in a given amount of time.

Seems to me that it would cut down on some of the griefing while also eliminating this issue - or at least mitigating it

My .02

Diminishing returns for anyone killing the same player has been in the game since 1.6. Basically you get up to around 1k AP for a v16 solo kill that hasn't been killed in x amount of time.

That number drops down to like 50AP after a kill and climbs back up as they stay alive, like I said up above, this isn't the main way of farming AP as its finite, but with a big enough group (like 40+) you can get serious AP this way, with 10 people its not that big, more than likely its someone trying to catch up to EMP from #2 real fast

Capsaica · June 2016

It is possible (albeit unlikely) that these people were PvE players who were trying to get their alliance war assault and support skill lines leveled up to gain access to caltrops, prox det, warhorn, barrier, etc. The way to tell would be to check their positions on the leaderboard. If they were "boosting," then you can be sure their names will be on the leaderboard, and relatively high up there. If they were merely trying to gain AP for skill line leveling or perhaps just to buy items from the AP vendors, they most likely won't be on the leaderboards. If they were truly trying to gain AP in a "do-no-harm" manner, then they would not be doing this in their home campaign at all.

DaveMoeDee · June 2016

Khajiit_Ri wrote: »

Last night this one was in Cyrodiil, and he was about to attack a lone enemy player, until he saw two others enemy players in stealth, so Khajiit watched and observed members from my alliance (about 10) walk up to where the enemy player was, the other two enemy players came out of stealth, no fighting, then the two go back into stealth, and the unstealthed enemy player starts killing each of my alliance members one by one, until only 9 are dead, then the one left standing resurrects the recently deceased. Then 9 are killed and a different one is left standing and she ressurects.

Then they switch roles and the enemy faction lets my alliance attack them but not to the point of death, they just heal one below a certain amount, what the heck is happening there?

This is a clear case where video footage showing identifying info on players should be find to post. The only way to stop such behavior IS to shame. Shaming is often needed to enforce norms.

yodased · June 2016

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Khajiit_Ri wrote: »

Last night this one was in Cyrodiil, and he was about to attack a lone enemy player, until he saw two others enemy players in stealth, so Khajiit watched and observed members from my alliance (about 10) walk up to where the enemy player was, the other two enemy players came out of stealth, no fighting, then the two go back into stealth, and the unstealthed enemy player starts killing each of my alliance members one by one, until only 9 are dead, then the one left standing resurrects the recently deceased. Then 9 are killed and a different one is left standing and she ressurects.

Then they switch roles and the enemy faction lets my alliance attack them but not to the point of death, they just heal one below a certain amount, what the heck is happening there?

This is a clear case where video footage showing identifying info on players should be find to post. The only way to stop such behavior IS to shame. Shaming is often needed to enforce norms.

hmm, I wish there was a website where one could submit videos of people suspected of cheating at ESO where we could discuss said videos without fear of forum retribution. maybe we could call it like esocheaters.com or something

DaveMoeDee · June 2016

Khajiit_Ri wrote: »

This one has never understood why they allowed you to have multiple accounts in the same alliance. It makes about as much sense as finding lint in Ya'Tirrje's pockets.

Do you mean multiple alliances in a single account? Because not allowing multiple accounts in the same alliance means only 3 people can play ESO, one per alliance.

The Elder Scrolls Online

Can one be banned for this?

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