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Potential cheating fix, crowdsourced and working
yodased
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Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.
5
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SwaminoNowlino✭✭✭✭✭Closed and moved to another thread by mod attempting to hide cheating scandal in T-Minus 10 minutes...Xbox NA : CP 160 StamPlar, MagNB, MagSorc, StamSorc, StamDK, StamNB, Level 10 MagDK & MagPlar, StamWarden, MagWarden
"We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome." - The Balance Lord Wrobel
- And now it sure does, better learn how to bash folks!
I get by with a little help from logic.3 -
Lenikus✭✭✭✭✭
So if for some reason, this not 100% surething system fails, you might end up broadcasting to the whole zone that a honest player is cheating?Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?... Mai cave. >:32 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If I understood what you just said I'd probably be for it . Also , I like Pina coladas . In the desert with no rain .0 -
Pomaikai✭✭✭✭✭
✭This certainly sounds interesting. I'd like to see ZOS support this further by putting a bright green dot next to our player name if we pass the check, and a bright red dot if we don't. That way you know if you're up against a cheater or not.0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
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So if for some reason, this not 100% surething system fails, you might end up broadcasting to the whole zone that a honest player is cheating?Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
no its a recursive check that needs to be 100% positive.
and its more for saying I am not cheating than to catch a cheater.
Basically its a crowdfunded policing software that simply checks known variables for cheaters and broadcasts that they are known to NOT be cheatingTl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
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So if for some reason, this not 100% surething system fails, you might end up broadcasting to the whole zone that a honest player is cheating?Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
no its a recursive check that needs to be 100% positive.
and its more for saying I am not cheating than to catch a cheater.
Basically its a crowdfunded policing software that simply checks known variables for cheaters and broadcasts that they are known to NOT be cheatingTl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
Reverb✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sounds great in theory. I would want to be certain it didn't get triggered by any legitimate addons before endorsing or using something like this.Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you. ~Friedrich Nietzsche1 -
SwaminoNowlino✭✭✭✭✭Also it would be easy enough to modify this to ignore if you were cheating and you'd just have cheaters running around with it saying they weren't. A creative solution but alas, probably wouldn't do the trick.Xbox NA : CP 160 StamPlar, MagNB, MagSorc, StamSorc, StamDK, StamNB, Level 10 MagDK & MagPlar, StamWarden, MagWarden
"We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome." - The Balance Lord Wrobel
- And now it sure does, better learn how to bash folks!
I get by with a little help from logic.0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sounds great in theory. I would want to be certain it didn't get triggered by any legitimate addons before endorsing or using something like this.
Yeah would obviously have to be something passive and would require admin permissions to read windows hooks, but this could be made relatively easily and would allow us to see who is actually willing to put up or shut upTl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SwaminoNowlino wrote: »Also it would be easy enough to modify this to ignore if you were cheating and you'd just have cheaters running around with it saying they weren't. A creative solution but alas, probably wouldn't do the trick.
Well that isn't true actually because I would put a server check to make sure that they were not messing with my detection. You know, like ZOS should have done in the first place.
Try to modify my *** and you getting pimp slapped.Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭But wouldn't putting out a notice that I'm not cheating , without stopping the cheaters , just encourage them to come roll me ? Wait .. I'm confused .
Zone chat is just my factions chat . I'd be relying on them to read zone chat one and then what ? Come to my defense if accused ?
DC is pretty rough . This might just be a lol generator ...0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Roehamad_Ali wrote: »But wouldn't putting out a notice that I'm not cheating , without stopping the cheaters , just encourage them to come roll me ? Wait .. I'm confused .
Zone chat is just my factions chat . I'd be relying on them to read zone chat one and then what ? Come to my defense if accused ?
DC is pretty rough . This might just be a lol generator ...
Well initially, yes the plugin will show those who are not cheating to those who are, but when the majority uses it, we identify those who will not.
At that time you can determine pretty well who is cheating and who is not.
Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Roehamad_Ali wrote: »But wouldn't putting out a notice that I'm not cheating , without stopping the cheaters , just encourage them to come roll me ? Wait .. I'm confused .
Zone chat is just my factions chat . I'd be relying on them to read zone chat one and then what ? Come to my defense if accused ?
DC is pretty rough . This might just be a lol generator ...
Well initially, yes the plugin will show those who are not cheating to those who are, but when the majority uses it, we identify those who will not.
At that time you can determine pretty well who is cheating and who is not.
You can skip the technical jargon , I'm in .0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭rfennell_ESO wrote: »Hehe of course people can just fake the broadcast to zone...
Nope, because it would be a server check that would go to esocheaters.com which I just purchased.
This will also be an active, scrubbed list of known cheating son of *** in ESO.
*** it, ZOS doesn't want to handle this, I will.Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.2 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭clocksstoppe wrote: »So what if they hack your anti hacking executable?
I will have server sanity checks and all my known responses will be server side.
Hack the expected return variable and you get a killed client and a lua broadcast that not only are you a ESO hacker, but you tried to go above and beyond and hack the intrusion detectionTl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭rfennell_ESO wrote: »Hehe of course people can just fake the broadcast to zone...
Nope, because it would be a server check that would go to esocheaters.com which I just purchased.
This will also be an active, scrubbed list of known cheating son of *** in ESO.
*** it, ZOS doesn't want to handle this, I will.
I get you, but if someone just fakes the zone broadcast and never runs the program... how would you know?
They won't show up as cheating on your site... but most the zone will see the broadcast and think it's legit.0 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭rfennell_ESO wrote: »Hehe of course people can just fake the broadcast to zone...
Nope, because it would be a server check that would go to esocheaters.com which I just purchased.
This will also be an active, scrubbed list of known cheating son of *** in ESO.
*** it, ZOS doesn't want to handle this, I will.
I get you, but if someone just fakes the zone broadcast and never runs the program... how would you know?
They won't show up as cheating on your site... but most the zone will see the broadcast and think it's legit.1 -
dtm_samuraib16_ESO✭✭✭✭
Oh, you played America's Army Online then?Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
It featured a similar thing.Earthdawn Game Master Role Play Quotes by me:
"If it looks like a bear, if it feels like a bear, smells and tastes like a bear, then be VERY aware, it could be something ENTIRELY different..."
"Be careful what you wish for, you might get plenty of it..."0 -
dtm_samuraib16_ESO✭✭✭✭
Oh, you played America's Army Online then?Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
It featured a similar thing.Earthdawn Game Master Role Play Quotes by me:
"If it looks like a bear, if it feels like a bear, smells and tastes like a bear, then be VERY aware, it could be something ENTIRELY different..."
"Be careful what you wish for, you might get plenty of it..."0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭rfennell_ESO wrote: »rfennell_ESO wrote: »Hehe of course people can just fake the broadcast to zone...
Nope, because it would be a server check that would go to esocheaters.com which I just purchased.
This will also be an active, scrubbed list of known cheating son of *** in ESO.
*** it, ZOS doesn't want to handle this, I will.
I get you, but if someone just fakes the zone broadcast and never runs the program... how would you know?
They won't show up as cheating on your site... but most the zone will see the broadcast and think it's legit.
Because the zone chat will have a link to verify it came from my server
With a tracking code that is created from a server/client connection that is verified by server only variables. Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1 -
FriedEggSandwich✭✭✭✭✭
✭I would use something like this to prove I wasn't cheating, great idea. Idk why they couldn't implement punk buster or something.
I'm sorry but I can't stand pina coladas or pina colada flavoured vape juice. I enjoy getting caught in the rain in SE Asia but not in England.PC | EU0 -
wayfarerx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ideas like this have been implemented in other games and can work... to a point. Ultimately what you are proposing is a form of DRM, i.e. attempting to limit what a user can do with data on a machine that they control. ALL forms of DRM are exploitable by a suitably motivated attacker. The only way such a system could be made to work reliably would require something akin to TPM enabled on the target devices and a secure chain of trust from the hardware all the way up to the software in question. From there things get messy as you begin to wade into topics around free speech, privacy, the war on general purpose computing, etc.
I'm all for community-led efforts to reduce cheating in ESO, but the only people that can truly crack this nut work at ZOS.@wayfarerx - PC / North America / Aldmeri Dominion2 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ideas like this have been implemented in other games and can work... to a point. Ultimately what you are proposing is a form of DRM, i.e. attempting to limit what a user can do with data on a machine that they control. ALL forms of DRM are exploitable by a suitably motivated attacker. The only way such a system could be made to work reliably would require something akin to TPM enabled on the target devices and a secure chain of trust from the hardware all the way up to the software in question. From there things get messy as you begin to wade into topics around free speech, privacy, the war on general purpose computing, etc.
I'm all for community-led efforts to reduce cheating in ESO, but the only people that can truly crack this nut work at ZOS.
Yeah I mean I am acutely aware of the 'real' fix to the situation, as obviously from your post you are as well.
The thing is, we both know that, if EVER, will be very much long time.
I can do this NOW in a few days for relatively little money. Why shouldn't I at least TRY to do something, when everyone else is just bitching about it, or cheating there little asses off and laughing about it.
I truly enjoy the people in my guild and would like to continue to hang out with them in this game, I fear that will not be an option if people are allowed to run around unchecked.Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.3 -
wayfarerx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ideas like this have been implemented in other games and can work... to a point. Ultimately what you are proposing is a form of DRM, i.e. attempting to limit what a user can do with data on a machine that they control. ALL forms of DRM are exploitable by a suitably motivated attacker. The only way such a system could be made to work reliably would require something akin to TPM enabled on the target devices and a secure chain of trust from the hardware all the way up to the software in question. From there things get messy as you begin to wade into topics around free speech, privacy, the war on general purpose computing, etc.
I'm all for community-led efforts to reduce cheating in ESO, but the only people that can truly crack this nut work at ZOS.
Yeah I mean I am acutely aware of the 'real' fix to the situation, as obviously from your post you are as well.
The thing is, we both know that, if EVER, will be very much long time.
I can do this NOW in a few days for relatively little money. Why shouldn't I at least TRY to do something, when everyone else is just bitching about it, or cheating there little asses off and laughing about it.
I truly enjoy the people in my guild and would like to continue to hang out with them in this game, I fear that will not be an option if people are allowed to run around unchecked.
Have at it! While you may not be able to completely solve the problem you might very well be able to do some good.
One suggestion: don't write and deploy your ESO-punk-buster in Java. Java libraries, even ones that have been thoroughly obfuscated, are trivial to modify (see the Minecraft modding community). If you want to write a secure, tamper-resistant application something like obfuscated Rust would be a much better choice.Edited by wayfarerx on June 7, 2016 5:45PM@wayfarerx - PC / North America / Aldmeri Dominion1 -
gard✭✭✭✭✭Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
Right, because someone smart enough to alter the game client in-memory probably couldn't do the same to a 3rd party app.
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Troneon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I disabled java on my computer years ago due to
1) It is very very very unsecure...
2) Most viruses/exploits/vulns are written in java...or used to be anyway...
Do yourself a favor and get rid of java, then disable it completely from your OS.
Only good thing it ever did was help run minecraft mods...which I don't play anymore.Edited by Troneon on June 7, 2016 5:45PMPC EU ADMaster Crafter - Anything you need!!High Elf Magicka Templar Healer/DPS/TankTrials / Dungeons / PVP / Everything3 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Potential solution to memory hacking:
Create a java program that you would run alongside eso.exe similar to ohgma infinium that checks for known memory hacks. When you zone into pvp, check for hacks and then broadcast to zone if memory is altered by a third party hook.
It's not foolproof, but it would keep the honest thieves honest.
Would you all use something like this? Would you run something that proved you were not using a cheat engine?
Do you like pina coladas? and getting caught in the rain?
Right, because someone smart enough to alter the game client in-memory probably couldn't do the same to a 3rd party app.
No they literally can't if there is a server checking the expected response of the client Thanks for playing. Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.1