CP Display's Negative Side Effects

NewBlacksmurf · June 2016

The_Patriarch wrote: »

When ZOS announced their plan for displaying our total CPs, I expressed my concern that people with less than 501 would get kicked from groups. People responded that surely this would never happen and, even if it did, it would be done by an extreme minority of players.

When it comes to people, it pays to be neither an optimist, nor a pessimist. Be a realist. People are people.

I agree with the suggestion that CP 160+ is sufficient to display. You'll still get PuG members who will insist on knowing your CP stats, but it might help the situation overall.

@The_Patriarch
But why in the world would ZOS display anything?

-because CP is tied to gear requirements....
OK, but then what logic is there because as we all agree, 160 comes pretty fast, so in the course of doing 1 daily once a week even if you start at level 49, you'll hit 160 so fast that you wont have the gear.

The WHOLE POINT IS THIS.
CP rank doesn't matter at all.

What people really want to see is how viable each player is and that doesn't come from a CP level.
It comes from the gear, CP passive choices, enchants, etc.

So my whole suggestion was to only show level 50 but place colored brackets that align with the CP unlocked at 20,....120 because that does tell us more and is meaningful info.

The_Lex · June 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The_Patriarch wrote: »

When ZOS announced their plan for displaying our total CPs, I expressed my concern that people with less than 501 would get kicked from groups. People responded that surely this would never happen and, even if it did, it would be done by an extreme minority of players.

When it comes to people, it pays to be neither an optimist, nor a pessimist. Be a realist. People are people.

I agree with the suggestion that CP 160+ is sufficient to display. You'll still get PuG members who will insist on knowing your CP stats, but it might help the situation overall.

@The_Patriarch
But why in the world would ZOS display anything?

-because CP is tied to gear requirements....
OK, but then what logic is there because as we all agree, 160 comes pretty fast, so in the course of doing 1 daily once a week even if you start at level 49, you'll hit 160 so fast that you wont have the gear.

The WHOLE POINT IS THIS.
CP rank doesn't matter at all.

What people really want to see is how viable each player is and that doesn't come from a CP level.
It comes from the gear, CP passive choices, enchants, etc.

So my whole suggestion was to only show level 50 but place colored brackets that align with the CP unlocked at 20,....120 because that does tell us more and is meaningful info.

I'm down with your suggestion. Notice I said sufficient not efficient.

Soleya · June 2016

I find the CP elitism laughable.

Before the change, I couldn't find anyone to run pledges with my V3 Healer, even though with battle leveling (through group finder) she had way higher stats than my V16. Back then someone would rather play with a V16 with no champion points, than a V3 healer with over 400 CP. Because they had no idea how many CP people had.

Now with 490CP, I'm more likely to get a group with my healer who still is wearing CP 20 (Vet 2) gear.

I'll take a player with low CP who has run dungeons and has some concept or roles and how to group play over someone with 501 CP they got from grinding mobs over and over.

ArcaneBlue · June 2016

currently on a short break due to my PC being broken... but I'd never just kick a player because of low CPs, (not to defend this decision to display CPs) I would rather take a low CP player who's willing to listen and improve than a high CP player who yolos into mobs, die and blame everyone else, refuses to communicate, etc etc

Teridaxus · June 2016

Already seen today peole demanding x cp for the easist dungeons like spindle or wayrest...

Peekachu99 · June 2016

Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »

I find the CP elitism laughable.

Before the change, I couldn't find anyone to run pledges with my V3 Healer, even though with battle leveling (through group finder) she had way higher stats than my V16. Back then someone would rather play with a V16 with no champion points, than a V3 healer with over 400 CP. Because they had no idea how many CP people had.

Now with 490CP, I'm more likely to get a group with my healer who still is wearing CP 20 (Vet 2) gear.

I'll take a player with low CP who has run dungeons and has some concept or roles and how to group play over someone with 501 CP they got from grinding mobs over and over.

Indeed. Who cares if a DPS has 501 CP and is in V1 Blues? You ain't gonna be burning down squat even with those passives.

Toxic as it is, I'd actually take gear check or gear score over this crap. Everyone's 501 CP alts in their CP 40 gear will be giving some folks a rude awakening.

Kalifas · June 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The_Patriarch wrote: »

When ZOS announced their plan for displaying our total CPs, I expressed my concern that people with less than 501 would get kicked from groups. People responded that surely this would never happen and, even if it did, it would be done by an extreme minority of players.

When it comes to people, it pays to be neither an optimist, nor a pessimist. Be a realist. People are people.

I agree with the suggestion that CP 160+ is sufficient to display. You'll still get PuG members who will insist on knowing your CP stats, but it might help the situation overall.

@The_Patriarch
But why in the world would ZOS display anything?

-because CP is tied to gear requirements....
OK, but then what logic is there because as we all agree, 160 comes pretty fast, so in the course of doing 1 daily once a week even if you start at level 49, you'll hit 160 so fast that you wont have the gear.

The WHOLE POINT IS THIS.
CP rank doesn't matter at all.

What people really want to see is how viable each player is and that doesn't come from a CP level.
It comes from the gear, CP passive choices, enchants, etc.

So my whole suggestion was to only show level 50 but place colored brackets that align with the CP unlocked at 20,....120 because that does tell us more and is meaningful info.

The issue is ZoS is trying to make CP like an ilvl. It won't work because CP is not a measure of skill currently. CP just means you do something in the game. Veteran Gear dropping from progressively difficult encounters would separate the skilled from the less skilled but could also lead to the same effect, which is people not getting invited to certain contents.

There needs to be a defined minimum of gear for certain contents.
There needs to be a defined role for certain contents.(Meaning some visual system that announces what role your skills are outfitted towards.
There needs to be a skill rating systems. Gives you a performance score on well you executed mechanics in previous slightly less difficult content.(Number of Deaths, DPS number totals, Percentage of the red you avoided,etc)
There needs to be a solo versions of multiplayer content where you can work on your performance for certain contents.

Skitttles · June 2016

What you do is join an "elite" group with your max CP then disable all of your CP without telling them. Complete the dungeon effortlessly and blow their minds at the end by telling them you had them off the whole time.

OrphanHelgen · June 2016

Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »

I find the CP elitism laughable.

Before the change, I couldn't find anyone to run pledges with my V3 Healer, even though with battle leveling (through group finder) she had way higher stats than my V16. Back then someone would rather play with a V16 with no champion points, than a V3 healer with over 400 CP. Because they had no idea how many CP people had.

Now with 490CP, I'm more likely to get a group with my healer who still is wearing CP 20 (Vet 2) gear.

I'll take a player with low CP who has run dungeons and has some concept or roles and how to group play over someone with 501 CP they got from grinding mobs over and over.

Yeah pledges.
We dont care if you use v2 gear in elden hollow.
But if you do this in a trial where 11 others have spent crazy amount of time getting gold gear and potions, you are bringing the final score down and thats just sad.

FearlessOne_2014 · June 2016

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

rotaugen454 wrote: »

I have 597CP and don't mind running with people well below the cap.

jrgray93 wrote: »

I also feel I should add there are plenty of 501 folks who don't care. That's not stopping the hordes of kids who do kick based on CP.

Also, I've already grouped with at least a few 501 players who were far worse at the game than some other 200-ish players. CP isn't the ultimate determination of usefulness, but it is being treated as such.

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

rotaugen454 wrote: »

I have 597CP and don't mind running with people well below the cap.

Same. I'm above the current cap, and I don't mind running content with players with lower champion points/veteran ranks than me. I never did.

Some people who classify themselves as "elite" and "superior" tend to forget that if you want to get more competent and "elite" players (overall), it helps to teach those with a lesser amount of experience than you. If they are interesting in learning, and show a drive to learn? You mold the homie, and teach them your ways. You don't teach them everything, but teach them enough that they can start to learn on their own. You teach 'em the bread-'n-butters, the build staples, and then EXPLAIN what it is you just taught. You go in-depth with your teachings, and provide examples that the person learning can relate to. And before you know, you'll have more and more people who not only can perform better? But people who will one day provide knowledge to the next roaming "random", and person in search of knowledge. And if you're lucky, they'll big you up when they see you in town and speak highly of you. They'll say, "Hey, there's ______ who showed me the ropes when I was coming up. Let me go see if they need anything, and just go say hello."

I applaud you all for being adults, and not caring about that CP501, or participating in the Elitist firestorm that is working its way into any/all end-game content.

Unfortunately, the three of you and those like you are in the minority. The vast minority.

This change to only CP's (while great for impatient kids who want seven separate Alt characters for their PvP grinding...) is what is causing this. Had they implemented a more regular level system to progress after level 50, and left CP's as a support/background system where it would work better, then this might not be an issue.

As it is right now, we are entering the days of "No 501 = no play in the end-game".

And this is a really sad turn for a great MMO like ESO is.

NO actually they are a quite majority. The asses that are demanding 501CPs are the loud minority, that you see in zone chat.

alainjbrennanb16_ESO · June 2016

what everyone is missing is the point when they say gear etc, cp points are pointless saying you must have this cp point is pointless, for what we must understand is that skill lvl in skills is more important but that takes is in to what happened in wow. for if we take the old vet system by the time you hit v8 to v10 your skills like talons, crystal frags and jesus beam was lvl 50, with the new system you can have an alt to lvl 50 in 8 hours and if you have 501 cp points everyone thinks your end game which your not, all i can say is way to go zos bringing in elite behaviour to eso in great style

Farorin · June 2016

I for one, am super happy VR were removed. But as someone with over 501 CP I am very much against CPs being visible to everyone because of the elitist mentality it foster and creates. We don't need everyone seeing how much you have.

STEVIL · June 2016

radiostar wrote: »

If the gear cap is 160, why is any information about beyond 160 showing? If the allocation cap is 501, why isn't that the gear cap too? Just wondering.

Because any system provided value should be accurate and not deceptive or misinformative.

Either show a stat accurately or dont.

If you want displayed a gear level number, show the min amd max gesr level WORN and the quality.

Showing CP160 as "gear rating" is USELESS given they may be wearing non-set green snd whites in the 46-50 level range.

Showing CP501 as a measure of how many cp they are ACTUALLY USING is in itself accurate. It is by no means a universal measure of ability but it is acvirately shpeing what they have spent.

Khamira · June 2016

Character named Gorias the Void Eater, account name XxKitten69Decomposer69xX. WTB Immershun plz.
What's the ducking difference between having 345 CP and 346 CP? I don't careeeee, really, that's first thing, second thing is that others care and kick you because U have 345 CP and not 346 as they advertised in zone chat.
What's the problem with simply displaying lvl when you have level, and VET when you have CPs? As I said I don't care. I only need to know if you are leveling or simply palying for fun on endgame content.
My eyes hurts from numbarz. Everywhere I look, everything I see are floating numbers, Geeeeeeez..... In account names and instead of seeing VR1 I see CP123756.

NewBlacksmurf · June 2016

Kalifas wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The_Patriarch wrote: »

When ZOS announced their plan for displaying our total CPs, I expressed my concern that people with less than 501 would get kicked from groups. People responded that surely this would never happen and, even if it did, it would be done by an extreme minority of players.

When it comes to people, it pays to be neither an optimist, nor a pessimist. Be a realist. People are people.

I agree with the suggestion that CP 160+ is sufficient to display. You'll still get PuG members who will insist on knowing your CP stats, but it might help the situation overall.

@The_Patriarch
But why in the world would ZOS display anything?

-because CP is tied to gear requirements....
OK, but then what logic is there because as we all agree, 160 comes pretty fast, so in the course of doing 1 daily once a week even if you start at level 49, you'll hit 160 so fast that you wont have the gear.

The WHOLE POINT IS THIS.
CP rank doesn't matter at all.

What people really want to see is how viable each player is and that doesn't come from a CP level.
It comes from the gear, CP passive choices, enchants, etc.

So my whole suggestion was to only show level 50 but place colored brackets that align with the CP unlocked at 20,....120 because that does tell us more and is meaningful info.

The issue is ZoS is trying to make CP like an ilvl. It won't work because CP is not a measure of skill currently. CP just means you do something in the game. Veteran Gear dropping from progressively difficult encounters would separate the skilled from the less skilled but could also lead to the same effect, which is people not getting invited to certain contents.

There needs to be a defined minimum of gear for certain contents.

There needs to be a defined role for certain contents.(Meaning some visual system that announces what role your skills are outfitted towards.

There needs to be a skill rating systems. Gives you a performance score on well you executed mechanics in previous slightly less difficult content.(Number of Deaths, DPS number totals, Percentage of the red you avoided,etc)

There needs to be a solo versions of multiplayer content where you can work on your performance for certain contents.

I disagree with the 4 suggestions because people seem to quickly forget that this gear is the same gear that was in the game before the VR change. No one complained about it previously and often times unless in a trial, we were scaled so honestly none of that is needed.

This isn't Destiny or The Division, World of Warcraft, etc and I see no reason to go down those paths.
I've not read any logical ways to touch on the CP advancement other than something similar to identifying the CP tree milestones. That does matter but CP level is largely silly to show

Have a gear level min is silly too cause CP is account wide so it's not like this progression is character based.

xblackroxe · June 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Have a gear level min is silly too cause CP is account wide so it's not like this progression is character based.

But that was the exact reason for removing vet ranks. So that people who want to have many chars don´t need to grind everytime to v16 but only to 50 and have full endgame reached already.

Kalfis · June 2016

People ask for X number of CPs because they don't know if you're any good. They don't have any other way to verify your ability to play this game.

Just like in WoW, I recommended you join a guild and play with them. Pugging is not worth the headache.

phobossion · June 2016

People who are "elite" have groups they play with. You don't become "elite" by pugging, lol.