Bug: BoP Trial sets in new traits dropping BoE.

Erraln · June 2016

Seems to be the same problem that was noticed in ICP/WGT in PTS.

Saw party members getting BoE Moondancer etc in Normal Maw today. Probably not intended.

Vaoh · June 2016

If this is true.... I'd kinda want it to stay tbh.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · June 2016

Best "problem" ever. Watch it get hotfixed.

BOP is cancer.

Septimus_Magna · June 2016

Wasnt this intended?

I thought I read in the the PTS patch notes a while back that the BoP trail sets would become BoE.

Lava_Croft · June 2016

ESO: The only game where BoE gear is considered a bug.

Erraln · June 2016

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Wasnt this intended?

I thought I read in the the PTS patch notes a while back that the BoP trail sets would become BoE.

I don't remember anything along those lines, could you find the reference?

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · June 2016

They should remove the entire Bound system...
It makes as much sense as a cube of sugar walking on the moon.

mtwiggz · June 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

They should remove the entire Bound system...
It makes as much sense as a cube of sugar walking on the moon.

Agree with this. BoE gear is great for the economy. Players that can't or don't want to complete certain aspects of the game still have access to the gear and are usually willing to pay a premium price.

BoP gear should be limited to very few things. Such as monster sets and vMA weapons. Everything else should be BoE.

Lava_Croft · June 2016

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

DDuke · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

STEVIL · June 2016

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

"I spent x hours playing thru trials, getting good at the trial puzzles/challenges and got this cool staff. It was so much fun."

"I spent x hours ]laying the crafting and economy, getting good at the market side challenges and got enough gold to buy this cool ataff. It was so much fun."

I see NOT ONE IOTA of difference in merit between those two statements.

BOP locked behind combat puzxles says one FUN is worth more than the other.

If an awesome new BIS meta-gotta-get combat set was locked behind a "sales rate" leaderboards so 95% or more of pvpers could not get to it, did not have status and contacts to compete with it, there would imo be outrage from some of the combat elite.

Ymmv.

Polysemy · June 2016

ESO where everyone wants everything handed to them

Nifty2g · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

Trials set should be BoP...

Lava_Croft · June 2016

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

If you like the reward you can keep it, if you don't like it you can use that reward to get gold and/or other items. I don't see why this freedom should be limited.

I won't even mention the crazy RNG in ESO, which makes the whole 'reward' thing kind of iffy. (OK, I just did.)

Nifty2g · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

If you like the reward you can keep it, if you don't like it you can use that reward to get gold and/or other items. I don't see why this freedom should be limited.

Well here is the thing, Trials is competitive play, the gear in there is complete Best in Slot stuff, being able to buy that and get it just handed to you ruins the gear grind.
Not only that but majority of the gear needed is mostly crafted anyway. But to do burns on certain bosses Moondancer comes in which makes it Best in Slot, so I don't think it should be able to be sold at all, and I hope it gets hotfixed quickly

NateAssassin · June 2016

@ those saying MoL gear is BiS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Fyar4wJ3-Y

Nifty2g · June 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

@ those saying MoL gear is BiS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Fyar4wJ3-Y

Alkosh and Moondancer are best in slot for certain classes.

Lava_Croft · June 2016

If competitive play is the requirement, then I guess it's time to make all gear that you can only acquire in PvP BoE too?

DDuke · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

If you like the reward you can keep it, if you don't like it you can use that reward to get gold and/or other items. I don't see why this freedom should be limited.

I won't even mention the crazy RNG in ESO, which makes the whole 'reward' thing kind of iffy. (OK, I just did.)

By making things BoE, you discourage people from running the content, because why do the difficult thing when you can just farm flowers & purchase the special gear from Hodor?

Don't tell me "for fun", because nothing is "fun" after you've done it a billion times - and nothing is "fun" if it doesn't serve a purpose.

You do raise a good point about the RNG though, it's really atrocious in this game - I much prefer the group loot model other MMOs are using, where boss drops a bunch of loot & group decides who gets what. That way, it's much less RNG and a much more social experience. It's not just you cursing your own bad luck every time.

Septimus_Magna · June 2016

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

Some players simply dont have the time/skill to run vMA 50 times to get the sharpened fire staff.

Picking rare flowers worth 300g each doesnt compare to gear that sells for 100k a piece.
Players that get the rare items will become richer because they dont have to buy it and can sell what they dont use.

Lava_Croft · June 2016

By making things BoE, you encourage trading and player interaction, giving people a reason to run the content for the mere purpose of selling the rewards, while also making people unwilling to run the content able to get their hands on the rewards, for a price.

If you think this kind of freedom is a bad thing, then we just have a fundamentally different view on what kind game design is considered 'good'.

Nifty2g · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

If competitive play is the requirement, then I guess it's time to make all gear that you can only acquire in PvP BoE too?

I think all the gear in PvP is BoE, well it is mostly is from what I can think of.
In terms of competitive, that means leaderboards, in the sense of comparing PvE and PvP to the likes of leaderboards, PvP doesn't exactly have a competitive leaderboard more so just ranked upon an AP system which I personally don't identify as competitive if we were going to compare it to a PvE system leaderboard.

Anyway, if they make this gear BoE I benefit mostly from it, I run the new trials all the time and have far too much loot that I would be willing to sell, however I don't think its fair, it took ages to get this trial on farm and I think it's an accomplishment and gear should be rewarded for the accomplishment, it's barely an increase to wear moondancer on certain boss fights but it gives the edge for those players who put the effort in to acquire it.

The same can be said about Maelstrom, though I think that place definitely needs a token system added to it to reward peoples efforts, I know people who have gone in there for 7 months and never gotten their Inferno Staves while I'm sitting here with 8 or 9 on me.

So in short, honestly just put the effort in and work towards getting your gear, in the mean time, just wear Julianos and kena. Julianos is crafted and so is Twice Born Star.

DDuke · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

If competitive play is the requirement, then I guess it's time to make all gear that you can only acquire in PvP BoE too?

When there is competitive PvP, I truly hope they add BoP gear to that.

Competitive PvP isn't farming noobs in a resource tower, competitive PvP is Arenas/BGs with even numbers against even numbers & leaderboard with matchmaking system.

Nifty2g · June 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

By making things BoE, you encourage trading and player interaction, giving people a reason to run the content for the mere purpose of selling the rewards, while also making people unwilling to run the content able to get their hands on the rewards, for a price.

If you think this kind of freedom is a bad thing, then we just have a fundamentally different view on what kind game design is considered 'good'.

By making things BoE you discourage the player(s) to want to keep running stuff for the gear they want. Once they get it, content becomes pointless for a lot of people.

I don't think it is a good thing what so ever to make trial gear BoE, a lot of players are not competitive, most of them just want to get their gear and leave.

Nifty2g · June 2016

Anyway I'll tag @Wrobel and @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
If it is intended I'm going to make quite a bit of gold, but I really don't think it is healthy, I remember this happened once with AA and HRC gear where they all became BoE and was hotfixed instantly. I was selling stuff for 800k a piece.

NateAssassin · June 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

NateAssassin wrote: »

@ those saying MoL gear is BiS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Fyar4wJ3-Y

Alkosh and Moondancer are best in slot for certain classes.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2965296#Comment_2965296

No, it isn't.

Nifty2g · June 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

NateAssassin wrote: »

@ those saying MoL gear is BiS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Fyar4wJ3-Y

Alkosh and Moondancer are best in slot for certain classes.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2965296#Comment_2965296

No, it isn't.

5 Moondancer 5 Julianos 2 Willpower gold swords is Best in Slot for a Templar.
Having someone in your raid with 5 Alkosh is necessary too.

That post is just comparing the gear sets as a stand alone, I wouldn't suggest wearing 5 Moondancer over Julianos or Twice Born Star
Plus most of my theory crafting comes from @Asayre

Zheg · June 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

By making things BoE, you encourage trading and player interaction, giving people a reason to run the content for the mere purpose of selling the rewards, while also making people unwilling to run the content able to get their hands on the rewards, for a price.

If you think this kind of freedom is a bad thing, then we just have a fundamentally different view on what kind game design is considered 'good'.

By making things BoE you discourage the player(s) to want to keep running stuff for the gear they want. Once they get it, content becomes pointless for a lot of people.

I don't think it is a good thing what so ever to make trial gear BoE, a lot of players are not competitive, most of them just want to get their gear and leave.

BoE is better than BoP without a token system. The RNG is so laughable I'd never even want to bother with the content unless I felt absolutely forced to to remain competitive in pvp. As an aside, how many trial runners bought pvp gear when it was best in slot? The argument that BiS gear from content should be farmed by the individual and not purchased should have applied back when morag tong and shadow walker were a thing, it shouldn't be one-sided where pve gear is all BoP and pvp gear is BoE. And I'm not suggesting pvp gear go the way of BoP because we're the poorest SOBs in the game and need to sell it to make enough gold for pots and gold mats.

Septimus_Magna · June 2016

Nifty2g wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

By making things BoE, you encourage trading and player interaction, giving people a reason to run the content for the mere purpose of selling the rewards, while also making people unwilling to run the content able to get their hands on the rewards, for a price.

If you think this kind of freedom is a bad thing, then we just have a fundamentally different view on what kind game design is considered 'good'.

By making things BoE you discourage the player(s) to want to keep running stuff for the gear they want. Once they get it, content becomes pointless for a lot of people.

I don't think it is a good thing what so ever to make trial gear BoE, a lot of players are not competitive, most of them just want to get their gear and leave.

By making gear BoE you dont force players to run content they dont enjoy to get BiS gear.

Players who do enjoy the end-game PVE content can make some gold while doing what they like.

Someone that farms rare flowers that sell for 300g each will never make more gold than someone that farms good items that sell for 50-200k per piece.

Right now PVP players are forced to farm vMA to get the weapons.
Most PVP players I know dont really like to farm PVE content solo for hours and hours.

Lava_Croft · June 2016

To add to what @Zheg said: The Elder Scrolls is about freedom of choice. The freedom to choose to run the content or not, the freedom to sell the rewards or not, the freedom to buy the rewards or not. People won't stop running the content if the gear becomes BoE, because there's nothing to be sold if people who do run the content don't put their rewards up for sale.

It's all about freedom of choice, one of the pillars of The Elder Scrolls.

DDuke · June 2016

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Everything should be BoE, no exceptions. There's not a single compelling reason to make gear BoP.

How about: having to actually complete that difficult content?

The gear is there as a reward for being a skilled player capable of overcoming difficult feats - not for picking up flowers all day & having a crap ton of gold.

Some players simply dont have the time/skill to run vMA 50 times to get the sharpened fire staff.

Picking rare flowers worth 300g each doesnt compare to gear that sells for 100k a piece.
Players that get the rare items will become richer because they dont have to buy it and can sell what they dont use.

And what exactly is wrong with that some people dont have the time/skill to clear vMSA?

If you can't do it, train, get better - don't complain about players who put in more effort & demand to get the same things they do. That's insulting towards the players who put in all that time to beat the challenges.

There's no room for communism in video games.