Player Created Lore Books Concept

Katahdin · May 2016

k9mouse wrote: »

I am not against player made lore per say... Lore is the reason I play TES / ESO after all, but I have some DEEP, DEEP concerns about player made lore... Some players will go off the deep end with stupid ideas like flying camels mounts or make some people too powerful and God like or put the known events in the wrong time line. I do not want player made lore in MY game.

I have no problem if your RP make up some lore, (aka fan fiction); it is YOUR RP, not mine. BGS and ZOS both have some goals and rules that us players do not know about to make lore in the 1st place. Therefore, it is best to let them make and keep the lore in the game, not players.

I agree with this.
I think player created lore or anything would create and be a major mess and cause more problems than is worth it.

Volkodav · May 2016

If a player creates a new book,it isnt Lore.Lore is what has been there for a very long time.
Having said that,it is fun to write ingame books.
I have a mod that lets me do that.It gives me three notebooks to write anything I want in.As many pages as I need.

Taisynn · May 2016

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

Volkodav · May 2016

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

Gidorick · May 2016

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

And that is a perfectly reasonable stance to take @Taisynn, the great thing about games such as these is players don't need to partake in every single aspect of the game. Don't like fishing? don't fish? don't like crafting? don't craft. Don't like fan-fic type content? don't buy or read these books... simple.

I personally find the "ESO must be exactly the game that I deem it to be" more destructive to the future of ESO than the idea of allowing players and fans to add their own flavor into Tamriel.

And yea, I realize the irony of ME saying that.

JD2013 · May 2016

I like this idea. To a point.

I like the idea of creating books and journals from my characters (I RP a little, and would love to write up some of their scholarly findings and adventures!) but I don't think players should create lore about the world and Tamriel in itself. Bethesda and ZOS have carte blanche on the lore of the Elder Scrolls world, and it should stay that way. They own the property. That's not to say we have to take everything as written, but still.

Maybe we could create some storybooks too (Like the charming "Goodnight Mundus") but all lore falls to Bethesda and ZOS. Canon or otherwise.

Gidorick · May 2016

Volkodav wrote: »

If a player creates a new book,it isnt Lore.Lore is what has been there for a very long time.
Having said that,it is fun to write ingame books.
I have a mod that lets me do that.It gives me three notebooks to write anything I want in.As many pages as I need.

You know @Volkodav , this concept started with the idea of submitting lore to ZOS for a quarterly "Adventurer's Tales" publication (something no one has even mentioned on this thread, but was included in the OP) , then the idea went to players being able to write and publish books to have in their home. THEN the idea went to being able to give those books to friends and those books are bound there in the friend's inventory. Then the idea went crazy from there.

My initial concerns were much like all of yours, not flooding the market with... well... junk fan-fic. This is why I thought it would make sense to limit the sharing of these books to friends or at most guilds.

But then I thought: Hey, I make these concepts as pie-in-the-sky what if concepts. might as well go wild with them.

Gidorick · May 2016

JD2013 wrote: »

I like this idea. To a point.

I like the idea of creating books and journals from my characters (I RP a little, and would love to write up some of their scholarly findings and adventures!) but I don't think players should create lore about the world and Tamriel in itself. Bethesda and ZOS have carte blanche on the lore of the Elder Scrolls world, and it should stay that way. They own the property. That's not to say we have to take everything as written, but still.

Maybe we could create some storybooks too (Like the charming "Goodnight Mundus") but all lore falls to Bethesda and ZOS. Canon or otherwise.

How would that be regulated without being a HUGE task @JD2013 ?

This is the whole reason for the "Canonization" submission. I think players are smart enough to know that the books they are collecting and finding are not official lore, and as I said before:

gidorick wrote:

ZOS could even have a pop up when a player opens a community lore book stating that the book is a community creation and that ZOS is not to be held liable for the content... blah blah so on and so forth. The pop up would obviously have to have a "do not show this again" check box so as to not be annoyingly there every time you open a book.

Daraugh · May 2016

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

I actually find the reverse to be true. TES games have been modded by players extensively without the mods becoming canon.
A quick look on just Nexus will show about 4 thousand files for Morrowind, 28 thousand for Oblivion and 47 thousand for Skyrim. Skyrim mods have 912 million downloads. So players having an impact on TES games has been pretty well established. It's also something you can ignore entirely and @Gidorick provided a method to prevent player made books becoming lore, thus enabling a player to keep non-canon out of her game if she should choose to.

It's more than just the pure game, it's part of TES universe of games and this one is so constrained as far as player impact, it hardly lives or breathes at all. If you can have the option to participate or be completely untouched, why not let the world breathe more?

JD2013 · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

I like this idea. To a point.

I like the idea of creating books and journals from my characters (I RP a little, and would love to write up some of their scholarly findings and adventures!) but I don't think players should create lore about the world and Tamriel in itself. Bethesda and ZOS have carte blanche on the lore of the Elder Scrolls world, and it should stay that way. They own the property. That's not to say we have to take everything as written, but still.

Maybe we could create some storybooks too (Like the charming "Goodnight Mundus") but all lore falls to Bethesda and ZOS. Canon or otherwise.

How would that be regulated without being a HUGE task @JD2013 ?

This is the whole reason for the "Canonization" submission. I think players are smart enough to know that the books they are collecting and finding are not official lore, and as I said before:

gidorick wrote:

ZOS could even have a pop up when a player opens a community lore book stating that the book is a community creation and that ZOS is not to be held liable for the content... blah blah so on and so forth. The pop up would obviously have to have a "do not show this again" check box so as to not be annoyingly there every time you open a book.

It is basically saying yes to the concept, but for personal books that maybe you can share with people as opposed to books that show in the world.

If there were to be a share in the world option, again like you say it should be submitted to ZOS and appear in only certain areas (like maybe in player housing options etc?? idk just riffing ideas)

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

idk · May 2016

Player created content is great for a 2nd tier game but has no place in ESO. Played created content lacks the refinement and complexity expected in a game of ESO's stature.

Fortunately Zos has not entertained this idea for the same reasons. They do not want to reduce the quality of this game in this manner.

If you want to create content for the game you play I suggest Neverwinter. Nice little F2P game though not near the quality of ESO, and what I posted above puts it all in context.

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The Player Created Lore would be segregated between servers and I think it would be kind of great to find lore that isn't in my own native tongue!

First of all, the correct term for "player-created lore" is fan fiction.
Secondly, on our server (EU), not everyone can play the game in their native tongue... And also, if other languages would be supported, who (and how) would review reported books?

In the context in which I'm speaking player-created-lore is a very specific way of dealing with those writings which includes digital items and their distribution so no, fan fiction is not the same thing. Perhaps what is contained within the player created lore could be considered fan fiction but the just referring to it as fan fiction isn't really relaying the scope of this very specific concept.

As for languages and reporting books... you're talking about a situation where a book written in a language ZOS community team doesn't speak gets reported? I dunno... how do they handle those situations on the forum @KoshkaMurka ? However they handle that on the forums... same way.

Well, if you want these books to instantly become "canon", then its a big no-no from me. Like many other people I love TES world the way its created, and I dont want it to be infested with unique races and ***. You seem to be very idealistic or very unfamiliar with fic writers community if you think it will work.
Also, you didnt reply to the rest of my points, about ratings, content tags and such.
The way they handle other languages on forums... They dont allow posting in those languages.

You seem to be a very passionate person, @Gidorick, and you have some interesting ideas, but the problem is, many of them would utterly destroy ESO as it is now, as TES game. And TES universe is the main selling point of this game.

k9mouse wrote: »

I am not against player made lore per say... Lore is the reason I play TES / ESO after all, but I have some DEEP, DEEP concerns about player made lore... Some players will go off the deep end with stupid ideas like flying camels mounts or make some people too powerful and God like or put the known events in the wrong time line. I do not want player made lore in MY game.

I have no problem if your RP make up some lore, (aka fan fiction); it is YOUR RP, not mine. BGS and ZOS both have some goals and rules that us players do not know about to make lore in the 1st place. Therefore, it is best to let them make and keep the lore in the game, not players.

This.

@KoshkaMurka , as I've stated many times before... these books would not be canon. They wouldn't be official lore. Never has there been player created ANYTHING that has automatically been given the rubber stamp of approval from the parent company.

As for the tags and filters and such... I honestly don't think it would be needed here. If a player wants to partake in this part of the community part of the experience would be the ambiguity of the search. This wouldn't be a fan-fiction platform... it would be a player created lore platform. It doesn't need to be a feature-for-feature recreation of the mechanics of fan-fic websites to be effective.

How does ZOS moderate the languages. What if I decided to post a thread in some unsupported language. Their system isn't sophisticated enough to auto-detect language, is it?

The destruction of TES through this concept is a bit of an over reaction. TES isn't nearly as fragile as you seem to think.

idk · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The Player Created Lore would be segregated between servers and I think it would be kind of great to find lore that isn't in my own native tongue!

First of all, the correct term for "player-created lore" is fan fiction.
Secondly, on our server (EU), not everyone can play the game in their native tongue... And also, if other languages would be supported, who (and how) would review reported books?

In the context in which I'm speaking player-created-lore is a very specific way of dealing with those writings which includes digital items and their distribution so no, fan fiction is not the same thing. Perhaps what is contained within the player created lore could be considered fan fiction but the just referring to it as fan fiction isn't really relaying the scope of this very specific concept.

As for languages and reporting books... you're talking about a situation where a book written in a language ZOS community team doesn't speak gets reported? I dunno... how do they handle those situations on the forum @KoshkaMurka ? However they handle that on the forums... same way.

Well, if you want these books to instantly become "canon", then its a big no-no from me. Like many other people I love TES world the way its created, and I dont want it to be infested with unique races and ***. You seem to be very idealistic or very unfamiliar with fic writers community if you think it will work.
Also, you didnt reply to the rest of my points, about ratings, content tags and such.
The way they handle other languages on forums... They dont allow posting in those languages.

You seem to be a very passionate person, @Gidorick, and you have some interesting ideas, but the problem is, many of them would utterly destroy ESO as it is now, as TES game. And TES universe is the main selling point of this game.

k9mouse wrote: »

I am not against player made lore per say... Lore is the reason I play TES / ESO after all, but I have some DEEP, DEEP concerns about player made lore... Some players will go off the deep end with stupid ideas like flying camels mounts or make some people too powerful and God like or put the known events in the wrong time line. I do not want player made lore in MY game.

I have no problem if your RP make up some lore, (aka fan fiction); it is YOUR RP, not mine. BGS and ZOS both have some goals and rules that us players do not know about to make lore in the 1st place. Therefore, it is best to let them make and keep the lore in the game, not players.

This.

@KoshkaMurka , as I've stated many times before... these books would not be canon. They wouldn't be official lore. Never has there been player created ANYTHING that has automatically been given the rubber stamp of approval from the parent company.

As for the tags and filters and such... I honestly don't think it would be needed here. If a player wants to partake in this part of the community part of the experience would be the ambiguity of the search. This wouldn't be a fan-fiction platform... it would be a player created lore platform. It doesn't need to be a feature-for-feature recreation of the mechanics of fan-fic websites to be effective.

How does ZOS moderate the languages. What if I decided to post a thread in some unsupported language. Their system isn't sophisticated enough to auto-detect language, is it?

The destruction of TES through this concept is a bit of an over reaction. TES isn't nearly as fragile as you seem to think.

I am not saying this will cause the destruction of Tamriel but it would degrade and diminish the value of ESO as player created content is usually of lower quality.

At that, Zos doesn't want to be in the business of revising played created content for quality in the chance someone may create something worthy of being added to the game. Zos doesn't want to have to tell tons of their player base their work doesn't measure up.

Neverwinter may be a game for you to explore. They have played created content but their game as a whole is of lower quality than ESO

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Daraugh wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

I actually find the reverse to be true. TES games have been modded by players extensively without the mods becoming canon.
A quick look on just Nexus will show about 4 thousand files for Morrowind, 28 thousand for Oblivion and 47 thousand for Skyrim. Skyrim mods have 912 million downloads. So players having an impact on TES games has been pretty well established. It's also something you can ignore entirely and @Gidorick provided a method to prevent player made books becoming lore, thus enabling a player to keep non-canon out of her game if she should choose to.

It's more than just the pure game, it's part of TES universe of games and this one is so constrained as far as player impact, it hardly lives or breathes at all. If you can have the option to participate or be completely untouched, why not let the world breathe more?

Yes, modding is an important part of TES community, but there's one thing: it never affected your game if you didnt want that. It's your choice to use or not to use mods. In mmo, the game client is the same for everyone.

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The Player Created Lore would be segregated between servers and I think it would be kind of great to find lore that isn't in my own native tongue!

First of all, the correct term for "player-created lore" is fan fiction.
Secondly, on our server (EU), not everyone can play the game in their native tongue... And also, if other languages would be supported, who (and how) would review reported books?

In the context in which I'm speaking player-created-lore is a very specific way of dealing with those writings which includes digital items and their distribution so no, fan fiction is not the same thing. Perhaps what is contained within the player created lore could be considered fan fiction but the just referring to it as fan fiction isn't really relaying the scope of this very specific concept.

As for languages and reporting books... you're talking about a situation where a book written in a language ZOS community team doesn't speak gets reported? I dunno... how do they handle those situations on the forum @KoshkaMurka ? However they handle that on the forums... same way.

Well, if you want these books to instantly become "canon", then its a big no-no from me. Like many other people I love TES world the way its created, and I dont want it to be infested with unique races and ***. You seem to be very idealistic or very unfamiliar with fic writers community if you think it will work.
Also, you didnt reply to the rest of my points, about ratings, content tags and such.
The way they handle other languages on forums... They dont allow posting in those languages.

You seem to be a very passionate person, @Gidorick, and you have some interesting ideas, but the problem is, many of them would utterly destroy ESO as it is now, as TES game. And TES universe is the main selling point of this game.

k9mouse wrote: »

I am not against player made lore per say... Lore is the reason I play TES / ESO after all, but I have some DEEP, DEEP concerns about player made lore... Some players will go off the deep end with stupid ideas like flying camels mounts or make some people too powerful and God like or put the known events in the wrong time line. I do not want player made lore in MY game.

I have no problem if your RP make up some lore, (aka fan fiction); it is YOUR RP, not mine. BGS and ZOS both have some goals and rules that us players do not know about to make lore in the 1st place. Therefore, it is best to let them make and keep the lore in the game, not players.

This.

@KoshkaMurka , as I've stated many times before... these books would not be canon. They wouldn't be official lore. Never has there been player created ANYTHING that has automatically been given the rubber stamp of approval from the parent company.

As for the tags and filters and such... I honestly don't think it would be needed here. If a player wants to partake in this part of the community part of the experience would be the ambiguity of the search. This wouldn't be a fan-fiction platform... it would be a player created lore platform. It doesn't need to be a feature-for-feature recreation of the mechanics of fan-fic websites to be effective.

How does ZOS moderate the languages. What if I decided to post a thread in some unsupported language. Their system isn't sophisticated enough to auto-detect language, is it?

The destruction of TES through this concept is a bit of an over reaction. TES isn't nearly as fragile as you seem to think.

They would technically be a part of the game client. Thus, I pointed on legal issues.
And just like I thought, you dont know anything about fanfiction, its themes and most importantly, etiquette. Why do you think that this etiquette shouldnt apply to stories written by ESO players? Because its very naive to think that these stories will be not higher than PG-13...
And well, from my experience, if you write something in unsupported language, mods tell you that its against forum rules.

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Gidorick · May 2016

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The Player Created Lore would be segregated between servers and I think it would be kind of great to find lore that isn't in my own native tongue!

First of all, the correct term for "player-created lore" is fan fiction.
Secondly, on our server (EU), not everyone can play the game in their native tongue... And also, if other languages would be supported, who (and how) would review reported books?

In the context in which I'm speaking player-created-lore is a very specific way of dealing with those writings which includes digital items and their distribution so no, fan fiction is not the same thing. Perhaps what is contained within the player created lore could be considered fan fiction but the just referring to it as fan fiction isn't really relaying the scope of this very specific concept.

As for languages and reporting books... you're talking about a situation where a book written in a language ZOS community team doesn't speak gets reported? I dunno... how do they handle those situations on the forum @KoshkaMurka ? However they handle that on the forums... same way.

Well, if you want these books to instantly become "canon", then its a big no-no from me. Like many other people I love TES world the way its created, and I dont want it to be infested with unique races and ***. You seem to be very idealistic or very unfamiliar with fic writers community if you think it will work.
Also, you didnt reply to the rest of my points, about ratings, content tags and such.
The way they handle other languages on forums... They dont allow posting in those languages.

You seem to be a very passionate person, @Gidorick, and you have some interesting ideas, but the problem is, many of them would utterly destroy ESO as it is now, as TES game. And TES universe is the main selling point of this game.

k9mouse wrote: »

I am not against player made lore per say... Lore is the reason I play TES / ESO after all, but I have some DEEP, DEEP concerns about player made lore... Some players will go off the deep end with stupid ideas like flying camels mounts or make some people too powerful and God like or put the known events in the wrong time line. I do not want player made lore in MY game.

I have no problem if your RP make up some lore, (aka fan fiction); it is YOUR RP, not mine. BGS and ZOS both have some goals and rules that us players do not know about to make lore in the 1st place. Therefore, it is best to let them make and keep the lore in the game, not players.

This.

@KoshkaMurka , as I've stated many times before... these books would not be canon. They wouldn't be official lore. Never has there been player created ANYTHING that has automatically been given the rubber stamp of approval from the parent company.

As for the tags and filters and such... I honestly don't think it would be needed here. If a player wants to partake in this part of the community part of the experience would be the ambiguity of the search. This wouldn't be a fan-fiction platform... it would be a player created lore platform. It doesn't need to be a feature-for-feature recreation of the mechanics of fan-fic websites to be effective.

How does ZOS moderate the languages. What if I decided to post a thread in some unsupported language. Their system isn't sophisticated enough to auto-detect language, is it?

The destruction of TES through this concept is a bit of an over reaction. TES isn't nearly as fragile as you seem to think.

I am not saying this will cause the destruction of Tamriel but it would degrade and diminish the value of ESO as player created content is usually of lower quality.

At that, Zos doesn't want to be in the business of revising played created content for quality in the chance someone may create something worthy of being added to the game. Zos doesn't want to have to tell tons of their player base their work doesn't measure up.

Neverwinter may be a game for you to explore. They have played created content but their game as a whole is of lower quality than ESO

I told ya I would be told "Go play a different game" again @Taisynn.

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

idk · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

And the solution to this problem is to not use played created content in the game. Create a website to collect this. Perfect solution.

I win. Zos isn't going to add played created content.

rotaugen454 · May 2016

"Farming Netches for Fun and Profit"

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

Yea, I noticed the forum censored my copy-paste from the ESRB site.... I would very well see a player-created-lore editor having similar censors. Perhaps even stricter.

I'm tired of having to repeat the same thing over and over.

If this kind of feature was added, it could be moderated in a way to discourage players from adding inappropriate material. Other games include player content and don't have these issues so there are ways to include this kind of material "legally". If a player isn't interested in this kind of content they could just ignore it.

By saying "you clearly don't know" or "you clearly don't understand" to one point or another doesn't change the fact that these types of content additions exist in other games and could also exist in ESO.

Gidorick · May 2016

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

And the solution to this problem is to not use played created content in the game. Create a website to collect this. Perfect solution.

I win. Zos isn't going to add played created content.

Uhm... you're kind of missing the point of the concept @Giles.floydub17_ESO... but you're right. ZOS will never add player created content, so rest easy that your and everyone else's sensitive eyes will be free from lewd influences. Well, except from naked fountain parties.

Gidorick · May 2016

"Argonian Eggs: A Dozen Bosmer Breakfast Recipes "

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

Yea, I noticed the forum censored my copy-paste from the ESRB site.... I would very well see a player-created-lore editor having similar censors. Perhaps even stricter.

I'm tired of having to repeat the same thing over and over.

If this kind of feature was added, it could be moderated in a way to discourage players from adding inappropriate material. Other games include player content and don't have these issues so there are ways to include this kind of material "legally". If a player isn't interested in this kind of content they could just ignore it.

By saying "you clearly don't know" or "you clearly don't understand" to one point or another doesn't change the fact that these types of content additions exist in other games and could also exist in ESO.

Auto-censors are not that good though. In-game chat censors certain word and number combinations, for example "put a", "900k", that do not mean anything bad.

I keep saying that you dont understand some things, because fan fiction has an established community already, and you're trying to invent a bicycle. It would be more productive to discuss the ways to give roleplayers a way to share their char stories without interfering with other player's immersion, for example, I mentioned char's profiles. But you are not open to discussions it seems. Well... What can I say. Its counter productive to bring something on a "General discussion" forums, and refuse to actually discuss. Any idea has its pros and cons.

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

Yea, I noticed the forum censored my copy-paste from the ESRB site.... I would very well see a player-created-lore editor having similar censors. Perhaps even stricter.

I'm tired of having to repeat the same thing over and over.

If this kind of feature was added, it could be moderated in a way to discourage players from adding inappropriate material. Other games include player content and don't have these issues so there are ways to include this kind of material "legally". If a player isn't interested in this kind of content they could just ignore it.

By saying "you clearly don't know" or "you clearly don't understand" to one point or another doesn't change the fact that these types of content additions exist in other games and could also exist in ESO.

Auto-censors are not that good though. In-game chat censors certain word and number combinations, for example "put a", "900k", that do not mean anything bad.

I keep saying that you dont understand some things, because fan fiction has an established community already, and you're trying to invent a bicycle. It would be more productive to discuss the ways to give roleplayers a way to share their char stories without interfering with other player's immersion, for example, I mentioned char's profiles. But you are not open to discussions it seems. Well... What can I say. Its counter productive to bring something on a "General discussion" forums, and refuse to actually discuss. Any idea has its pros and cons.

I'm not talking about transposing fan-fiction into ESO. Would it happen? Sure... but that's not what this concept is suggesting. It's larger in scope than just putting fan fiction into ESO.

I still don't see how would these stories interfere with a player's immersion @KoshkaMurka ? If you're not interested, you could just ignore it. The books aren't going to auto-add themselves to your inventory or open up for you to read if you don't want them to.

As for the profiles, I am 100% for that! I just think that's a different topic providing a different feature to players. There have been other posts about that very thing and I always throw my support in for that. I think that would be a great addition to ESO!

Anyway, could a player not put lews actions in their profiles? Could they not put non-canon material in there too? How are all of your arguments against my lore look ideas not applicable to the idea of adding player written profiles?

LadyNalcarya · May 2016

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

Yea, I noticed the forum censored my copy-paste from the ESRB site.... I would very well see a player-created-lore editor having similar censors. Perhaps even stricter.

I'm tired of having to repeat the same thing over and over.

If this kind of feature was added, it could be moderated in a way to discourage players from adding inappropriate material. Other games include player content and don't have these issues so there are ways to include this kind of material "legally". If a player isn't interested in this kind of content they could just ignore it.

By saying "you clearly don't know" or "you clearly don't understand" to one point or another doesn't change the fact that these types of content additions exist in other games and could also exist in ESO.

Auto-censors are not that good though. In-game chat censors certain word and number combinations, for example "put a", "900k", that do not mean anything bad.

I keep saying that you dont understand some things, because fan fiction has an established community already, and you're trying to invent a bicycle. It would be more productive to discuss the ways to give roleplayers a way to share their char stories without interfering with other player's immersion, for example, I mentioned char's profiles. But you are not open to discussions it seems. Well... What can I say. Its counter productive to bring something on a "General discussion" forums, and refuse to actually discuss. Any idea has its pros and cons.

I'm not talking about transposing fan-fiction into ESO. Would it happen? Sure... but that's not what this concept is suggesting. It's larger in scope than just putting fan fiction into ESO.

I still don't see how would these stories interfere with a player's immersion @KoshkaMurka ? If you're not interested, you could just ignore it. The books aren't going to auto-add themselves to your inventory or open up for you to read if you don't want them to.

As for the profiles I am 100% for that! I just think that's a different topic providing a different feature to players. Anyway, could a player not put lews actions in their profiles? Could they not put non-canon material in there too? How are all of your arguments against my lore look ideas not applicable to the idea of adding player written profiles?

But your "player-created lore" is fan fiction.

Wikipedia wrote:

Fan fiction or fanfiction (also abbreviated to fan fic, fanfic, or fic) is fiction about characters or settings from an original work of fiction, created by fans of that work rather than by its creator. It is a popular form of fan labor, particularly since the advent of the Internet.

It has been a thing for decades, and fanfic writers already developed their etiquette and rules. Those rules are time-proven, and so is their nessesity.
As for putting explicit materials and other questionable content in profiles, those would be visible for everyone and more easily checked than limited edition books would be. Offensive names, for example, are taken down quickly if reported. Though, would be nice to discuss these issues as well.

rotaugen454 · May 2016

"A Bosmer Ate My Baby!" - by Lindy Chamberlain

Gidorick · May 2016

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Taisynn wrote: »

I really don't like so many of your ideas. It would break what is an Elder Scrolls game. There are many games that came before this that created and set the lore for this game. This, like in many RPGs, is what people live and breathe when they play. And to break that, even for gameplay's sake, breaks the world.

It's like God deciding air was too boring and suddenly replacing it with hydrogen gas because it was more amusing. It may have made things interesting, but it made the environment unhospitable and fundamentally changed.

And fan fiction creators like to add new races, break the boundaries, and change whatever they want. If they are allowed to become canon, suddenly our world becomes unhospitable and unrecognizable. It becomes something other than an Elder Scrolls game.

I did not come here for fanfiction. I came here for the pure and true Elder Scrolls universe, and if some fanboys decide they want to write their own stories, fine by me, but I shouldn't have to acknowledge it as fact nor would I want to. It is not Elder Scrolls. It's fan fiction. End of story. And this is someone who does roleplay, but I know my roleplay will not affect te bigger picture. It won't break TES, because I make my character adhere to the lore and accept she is not Godlike. Nor is my fanplaying anything more than miniscule in the grand scheme of things.

If God suddenly replaced air with Hydrogen gas,it would have made the environment not "inhospitable",which means very unfriendly,..but rather uninhabitable,..which means not being able to live.
Calling people "fanboys" just because they want to write books for the game,and saying that you shouldnt have to acknowledge it as fact seems kind of self centered. Others might enjoy such a thing.If you dont like fanfiction (which all the books ingame really are.Fiction written by fans of Elder Scrolls games) ,just ignore it.Nothing is fact in a game anyway. It's ALL fiction.
As you said,..End of Story.

Thing is... We love TES universe (I assume). And forcing the perspective of your character (and hundreds of other characters) would change the universe to something, like you said, uninhabitable for those of us who love it as is.
Don't get me wrong, fanfiction and fanart can be awesome things. But it doesnt mean everything should be made canon. A game that is filled with this kind of texts and this kind of characters wouldnt be a TES game that we all know and love.
You are free to roleplay anything you want, but you cannot force your perspective on anyone else. For example, you can make a character that is a son of Sheogorath, but you cant claim that its canon. Adding everyone's stories as a part of canon would break immersion for many players, especially considering that fanons can (and will) contradict official story and each other.

You win the award of non-reading for today @KoshkaMurka !

No where did I say that player created lore would be canon. In fact, I explicitly state that there should be a way for players to submit lore for canonization consideration, meaning that all of the player created lore would be non-canon.

The fact that all of this would be non-canon would be the reasoning behind their removal after the events of ESO.

You win an award for picking my words and not replying to my actual points. -_-

You're the one who keep calling fan fiction "lore" and want to add it in game. People already can read and write fanfics, but adding them to game would have a lot of issues.
For example, all pictures and fictional settings have an owner. So if someone uses images or characters from another game, for example, Dragon Age, and those images would be technically added to Zos' game, it might cause issues.
Or another example: themes. Many fanfics have erotic scenes or competely erotic based (this forum censors the correct word for this kind of content). These parts might be too hardcore for a game with M rating and should be rated AO - adults only. This is a legal issue actually, just like copyrighted content, and I dont think Zos wants something like that old GTA hot coffee story.
Also, speaking of immersion, not everyone wants tons of daedric playboy books everywhere. And without proper content filters (they are a MUST for any half-decent fanfiction sites), there will be a lot of dissatisfied players who wanted to read adventure story, but bought some hardcore *** with argonian maidens or super awesome Mary-Sue, or other themes they find inappropriate.

By the divines @KoshkaMurka... I NEVER said players should be able to use outside images in the books. In fact I explicitly stated that images should be in game assets and collectible in-game.

Why doesn't the fan-fic section of this forum have the kinds of fiction you're mentioning? Why isn't that section of the forum lousy with adult material? I think people, as a whole, are a bit more mature than you give them credit for.

However, what you are describing would absolutely exist.... and that kind of stuff DOES exist in the world. Many of us have come across players "emoting" with one another in the world and on console it's worse because of the open mics. Why is THIS ok for ESO but written depictions aren't?

Either way, the ESRB of ESO is "Blood and Gore, Sexual Themes, Use of Alcohol, Violence " and the summary includes "Text descriptions or dialogue sometimes contain references to sexual material and/or innuendo (e.g., “She...*** the men as cruelly as Bal had ravished her”; “In his mind, she would be the sheath to every knight's blade”; “No sweetmeat for you”; But it is huge! It could take me all night!”). "
I think player created naugty stories would fall well within this umbrella. Include the aforementioned "Online Interactions Not Rated by the ESRB" I think ZOS is covered.

That being said, the Scribes Code of Ethics could very well contain means by which players who create that kind of literature could be banned from the game if their offence contains more than "innuendo".

All problems have solutions.

Online interactions are not rated, yes. But in-game content is.
Sorry, but it looks like you dont know how ratings work. M rating doesnt mean "everything is allowed". And those desriptions you posted are much more tame than lot of fanfiction works.
And btw, this forum has very strict censorship, so any R-rated fanfics (and higher) would be removed.

Yea, I noticed the forum censored my copy-paste from the ESRB site.... I would very well see a player-created-lore editor having similar censors. Perhaps even stricter.

I'm tired of having to repeat the same thing over and over.

If this kind of feature was added, it could be moderated in a way to discourage players from adding inappropriate material. Other games include player content and don't have these issues so there are ways to include this kind of material "legally". If a player isn't interested in this kind of content they could just ignore it.

By saying "you clearly don't know" or "you clearly don't understand" to one point or another doesn't change the fact that these types of content additions exist in other games and could also exist in ESO.

Auto-censors are not that good though. In-game chat censors certain word and number combinations, for example "put a", "900k", that do not mean anything bad.

I keep saying that you dont understand some things, because fan fiction has an established community already, and you're trying to invent a bicycle. It would be more productive to discuss the ways to give roleplayers a way to share their char stories without interfering with other player's immersion, for example, I mentioned char's profiles. But you are not open to discussions it seems. Well... What can I say. Its counter productive to bring something on a "General discussion" forums, and refuse to actually discuss. Any idea has its pros and cons.

I'm not talking about transposing fan-fiction into ESO. Would it happen? Sure... but that's not what this concept is suggesting. It's larger in scope than just putting fan fiction into ESO.

I still don't see how would these stories interfere with a player's immersion @KoshkaMurka ? If you're not interested, you could just ignore it. The books aren't going to auto-add themselves to your inventory or open up for you to read if you don't want them to.

As for the profiles I am 100% for that! I just think that's a different topic providing a different feature to players. Anyway, could a player not put lews actions in their profiles? Could they not put non-canon material in there too? How are all of your arguments against my lore look ideas not applicable to the idea of adding player written profiles?

But your "player-created lore" is fan fiction.

Wikipedia wrote:

Fan fiction or fanfiction (also abbreviated to fan fic, fanfic, or fic) is fiction about characters or settings from an original work of fiction, created by fans of that work rather than by its creator. It is a popular form of fan labor, particularly since the advent of the Internet.

It has been a thing for decades, and fanfic writers already developed their etiquette and rules. Those rules are time-proven, and so is their nessesity.
As for putting explicit materials and other questionable content in profiles, those would be visible for everyone and more easily checked than limited edition books would be. Offensive names, for example, are taken down quickly if reported. Though, would be nice to discuss these issues as well.

This seems like an issue of being unable to see the forest for the trees.

Fan-fiction doesn't involve things like... collecting in-game images, iconography, and artifacts to write a book then gathering materials to make a blank book, then using a different set of skills to copy the original book into a new book and then possibly even enchanting the new book. Nor does it involve the books being able to have limited print runs and hard to find. There being multiple editions, or multiple parts to a book that needs to be tracked down and found in order to read it.

Fan-fiction is much less tactile than Player Created Lore would be @KoshkaMurka .

I do think there would be players who write, distribute and control more adult-themed material, and for them, that would be part of the fun! The "will I get caught" nature would be exciting to those players. All the while they are risking reprimand and/or banning. The idea of a someone writing texts like... "50 Shades of Green" and having a small community build up around that "secret" publication sounds amazing to me, even if I wouldn't be interested in reading it.

I do agree that the rating of "M" shouldn't include anything and everything under the sun but I do think it should mean that ZOS can assume the player base is made up of adults, and should be able to treat us as such.

Now, that being said. Although I think ZOS would be missing out on having fan-fiction in the game, if we were to separate the concepts here and have all the binding, scribing, and enchanting of books in game, but only allow the in-game official lore to be used to create books... I'd be completely on board with that. Players could still have a collection of lore to collect, could still seek out editions of books they don't have, the whole gamification of lore would still be there.

There is a whole set of concepts being presented here and you're stuck on shielding yourself from fanfiction. Thanks for reminding me why posting these collection of related concepts together is a bad idea on these forums. People get too hung up on one aspect and can't see the larger concept as a whole.