Argonians

Llilium · May 2016

didn't argonians used to have a +bonus to healing? it was like +4% or something like that wasn't it? what happened to that, and why was that changed? i don't see a whole lot of usefulness to their current passives.

why not change the +9% healing recieved to healing going out. this would pretty much fix the racial imo. it would benefit both the argonian and also the people they are trying to heal.

Sogreth · May 2016

I was literally just thinking about this.

It would be nice to see Quick to Mend changed to a lower % but add in extra healing.

Maybe something like:
1/3 - Increases the effectiveness of healing on you by 2%, and increasing your healing done by 1%
2/3 - Increases the effectiveness of healing on you by 4%, and increasing your healing done by 2%
3/3 - Increases the effectiveness of healing on you by 6%, and increasing your healing done by 3%

So, technically, you still get the 9% on yourself, but also a small increase to outgoing heals.

Did it used to have extra healing to begin with? It must have been before I started playing.

I do like the 12% HP/Stam/Mag from potions though. I pop potions like crazy, and the extra healing is fantastic. But QtM does seem rather bland.

Rohamad_Ali · May 2016

I don't remember that .

Toc de Malsvi · May 2016

I think that was a misnomer caused by a poor tool tips, I seem to remember it used to say "Increase your healing by 2%", then they fixed the tool tip. I could be confusing this with something else but I thought it was the argonian passive.

NateAssassin · May 2016

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Dracan_Fontom · May 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Yea just keep saying to yourself, can't wait to kill you on the battlefield.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Today's slaves will be tomorrow's masters.
All Empires topple and fall eventually.
It's no different for the weak, who'll become strong.

susmitds · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Today's slaves will be tomorrow's masters.
All Empires topple and fall eventually.
It's no different for the weak, who'll become strong.

Not always.

Duiwel · May 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

I died...

Lynx7386 · May 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Well, lucky us the dunmer are built for dying in cyrodiil

stewhead2ub17_ESO · May 2016

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

lol well played

Ch4mpTW · May 2016

What I find interesting is that Argonians as a whole don't really bring/offer anything of significance... Yet in VMSA on Stage 7, they're a whole handful. I mean, I'd roll an Argonian if I had some benefits to: Archery, poison damage increase, and melee-based damage. That'd be superb.

Rohamad_Ali · May 2016

I will say this . Lizards need love . Swimming passive cmon . At least make the immune to slaughter fish . Somethimg on par with their race but not op . Leveling staff is meh . Natural mending passive ... Something .

Junkogen · May 2016

ZOS doesn't agree. They think the passives are just fine. I've been fighting this fight since launch and they refuse to do anything beyond increase percentages slightly. I guess that's better than nothing, but still not getting to the root of the problem. Also, every time they've "buffed" them, they've removed something else that benefitted them such as the glyphs of potion speed and the potion CP star. They really go the extra mile to keep Argonians from being a top choice for anything.

I just try not to think about it too much. It makes me want to quit playing. I'm so pissed at the devs for how they've handled this.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · May 2016

I don't know. I just finished Vaults of Madness with an Argonians tank and healer. There were at least two spots in there when Argonians seemed pretty op.

Silver_Strider · May 2016

I still don't get why ZOS is so insistent on making Argonians a tank race.

Lore wise, Argonians have always had lackluster health but were fairly capable at recovery. The healing received bonus plays to this part of lore while the extra health portion does not. Argonians were always a hybrid race, being equally capable at magic/fighting/stealth but ESO doesn't overly support any of this either. The only things ESO really supports is their resistance to Disease and Poison as well as their swimming capabilities but since the majority of the water in this game is slaughterfish infested death traps, this is entirely a wasted passive that's only redeeming quality being the potion passive tied to it, which I'd imagine is a loss interpretation of Argonians being skilled Alchemist, which is somewhat supported in past games with their increased bonuses to Alchemy.

ZOS just sort of skimmed Argonians over as far as Lore goes and half-a**ed it, giving us some really crappy passives as a result. I'd be fine if they'd remove the increased health and/or potion passive for something more in tune with the majority of their lore such as increases to stamina/magic regen or even if they made them the magic stealth counterpart of Khajiit/Bosmer with extra magic crit and stealth buffs.

phaneub17_ESO · May 2016

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/260022/argonian-swim-racial

My suggestion to Argonians.

Sogreth · May 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'd be fine if they'd remove the increased health and/or potion passive

I really like that passive

I'd much rather them buff the swim speed to at least 75%. I mean....if we can't breath underwater like other ES games, at least let us swim faster than 50%.

But I really like the 12% extra healing from potions. Maybe because I use HP/Stam/Mag potions all the time, but, it just feels really nice. I'm only sitting at 16k HP and the extra 12% turns into 1900+ added on to my potion, PLUS I get an extra 9% healing off of that.

NateAssassin · May 2016

Dracan_Fontom wrote: »

NateAssassin wrote: »

Argonians are meant to be slaves, they are useless beyond doing petty slave work, even ZOS reinforces this by giving them passives that are not useful for fighting, but useful as a slave.

I'd rather my slaves have a higher health so I can beat them longer, and have them take in more heals so I can heal them back and beat them more. I'd rather my slaves be able to get knee deep in poisonous areas, or areas with disease ridden material, and not get sick so I can beat them more. I'd also like my slaves to be able to swim fast underwater so that they can clean out my septic chambers faster, so's not to have them clog up.

Yea just keep saying to yourself, can't wait to kill you on the battlefield.

Have fun hunting, don't PvPvL.

Junkogen · May 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I still don't get why ZOS is so insistent on making Argonians a tank race.

Lore wise, Argonians have always had lackluster health but were fairly capable at recovery. The healing received bonus plays to this part of lore while the extra health portion does not. Argonians were always a hybrid race, being equally capable at magic/fighting/stealth but ESO doesn't overly support any of this either. The only things ESO really supports is their resistance to Disease and Poison as well as their swimming capabilities but since the majority of the water in this game is slaughterfish infested death traps, this is entirely a wasted passive that's only redeeming quality being the potion passive tied to it, which I'd imagine is a loss interpretation of Argonians being skilled Alchemist, which is somewhat supported in past games with their increased bonuses to Alchemy.

ZOS just sort of skimmed Argonians over as far as Lore goes and half-a**ed it, giving us some really crappy passives as a result. I'd be fine if they'd remove the increased health and/or potion passive for something more in tune with the majority of their lore such as increases to stamina/magic regen or even if they made them the magic stealth counterpart of Khajiit/Bosmer with extra magic crit and stealth buffs.

Also, they created these passives when the game was completely different, at launch. They changed the game, but left the passives essentially the same. I think a big part of the problem is that they don't want to spend time designing a new passive. Maybe they have too much work and don't have the time, maybe they don't care. Passives didn't really matter much until the removal of soft caps. The max Stam/magicka races really benefitted from soft cap removal whereas the other races took it on the chin.

At this point, I think their actions are saying "deal with it or reroll because we've done all we're going to do."

Whatzituyah · May 2016

My Argonians disagree about being only good for slaves. You don't have too min max damage/magicka/stanima/regen to be good! What about their passives bending towards more what a tank needs too survive and be successful? Quick to Mend makes it easier on you and the healer since you have that much more chance too survive. Argonian resistance also makes it easier on the healer and you because you have more health with poison both disease resistance that are things that make it harder to survive with their effects. You also have the potion passive in turn giving more resources back per potion of course with a cool down. But theirs also swim speed and restoration staff Argonians have to be unique somehow.

In conclusion they could be better but they seem decent to tank with.

Nords can make good tanks too but they have different passives that make it different aswell.

fatemoe · May 2016

Orc got huge buff on racial passive.
While argonians are just ugly hated slaves lol....

Junkogen · May 2016

Whatzituyah wrote: »

My Argonians disagree about being only good for slaves. You don't have too min max damage/magicka/stanima/regen to be good! What about their passives bending towards more what a tank needs too survive and be successful? Quick to Mend makes it easier on you and the healer since you have that much more chance too survive. Argonian resistance also makes it easier on the healer and you because you have more health with poison both disease resistance that are things that make it harder to survive with their effects. You also have the potion passive in turn giving more resources back per potion of course with a cool down. But theirs also swim speed and restoration staff Argonians have to be unique somehow.

In conclusion they could be better but they seem decent to tank with.

Nords can make good tanks too but they have different passives that make it different aswell.

There is not one passive that Argonians have that I wouldn't trade for another race's...not...one. That's how bad they are. People can try and play devil's advocate all day and defend their passives, but the fact is they're the worst. They just don't work well with how the game is designed. Tanks don't matter in this game except for maybe a handful of dungeons. The devs know this. I read @Wrobel comments and wonder how he can justify keeping these passives the way they are. He has eliminated or changed things in the game for precisely the same reasons why Argonian passives are weak, but still we have our passives. Case in point, how can you eliminate the potion CP star but retain a potion passive? The reason no one took the CP star is the same reason why the potion passive stinks. It's mind-boggling the level of cognitive dissonance that is present in this game's design when it comes to these passives.

Aisle9 · May 2016

Roehamad_Ali wrote: »

I will say this . Lizards need love . Swimming passive cmon . At least make the immune to slaughter fish . Somethimg on par with their race but not op . Leveling staff is meh . Natural mending passive ... Something .

Waterbreathing \o/

Vildebill · May 2016

If i'm remembering correctly argonians had an increase in healing given in the beta, but they removed it since it was pretty op. Not sure here though, a long time ago

ankhor8 · May 2016

As it is with life, what we do with our cards is more important than what we were dealt. It may require more intelligence and or intuition to integrate our Saxhleel (Argonian) into the type of combatant we want, yet it is doable.
@NateAssassin : I like my targets arrogant. It helps me close the gap for close quarter kills when they assume my approach lacks the ability to send their essence flowing with the current. Your the type of carcass who's head we'll keep to mark our territory.
To my Marsh kin, Stay Moist +Seth Salute
Kota-Sax-Blood

NateAssassin · May 2016

ankhor8 wrote: »

@NateAssassin : I like my targets arrogant. It helps me close the gap for close quarter kills when they assume my approach lacks the ability to send their essence flowing with the current. Your the type of carcass who's head we'll keep to mark our territory.
To my Marsh kin, Stay Moist +Seth Salute
Kota-Sax-Blood

Again, have fun trying to kill me, I haven't reset my home/guest campaign in forever, you can endlessly search through PvPvL for me all you like.

C0wrex · May 2016

Only good Argonian is an enslaved Argonian.

Jar_Ek · May 2016

My concern is how the poison resistance works in db. Will the class passive make any difference at all? Oh and I'm with junkogen, the Argonian passives are still pretty poor.

NateAssassin · May 2016

C0wrex wrote: »

Only good Argonian is an enslaved Argonian.

QFT

Whatzituyah · May 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Whatzituyah wrote: »

My Argonians disagree about being only good for slaves. You don't have too min max damage/magicka/stanima/regen to be good! What about their passives bending towards more what a tank needs too survive and be successful? Quick to Mend makes it easier on you and the healer since you have that much more chance too survive. Argonian resistance also makes it easier on the healer and you because you have more health with poison both disease resistance that are things that make it harder to survive with their effects. You also have the potion passive in turn giving more resources back per potion of course with a cool down. But theirs also swim speed and restoration staff Argonians have to be unique somehow.

In conclusion they could be better but they seem decent to tank with.

Nords can make good tanks too but they have different passives that make it different aswell.

There is not one passive that Argonians have that I wouldn't trade for another race's...not...one. That's how bad they are. People can try and play devil's advocate all day and defend their passives, but the fact is they're the worst. They just don't work well with how the game is designed. Tanks don't matter in this game except for maybe a handful of dungeons. The devs know this. I read @Wrobel comments and wonder how he can justify keeping these passives the way they are. He has eliminated or changed things in the game for precisely the same reasons why Argonian passives are weak, but still we have our passives. Case in point, how can you eliminate the potion CP star but retain a potion passive? The reason no one took the CP star is the same reason why the potion passive stinks. It's mind-boggling the level of cognitive dissonance that is present in this game's design when it comes to these passives.

You don't have to agree with me but wouldn't that make Imperials and Orcs useless aswell? Just for the fact most of their passives are meant for tanking? Just using your logic here. @Wrobel wants to make every race unique in their own way. But if everything was the same you realize how boring that would be? We would all be the same with different skins do you want that? Next logical step instead of making Argonians passives stronger why not nerf other racial passives?