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CP should not replace VR as equip requirement....it should determine difficulty and gear drops

NewBlacksmurf
NewBlacksmurf
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@ZOS I've not seen how you all decided to remove VR but I've seen thought so I want to share this....all content should be based off no CP and using CP.

Difficulty types apply to dungeons, trials, msa, etc. (Cyrodil seems to not need this but maybe IC can use it somehow)
-any phased content that won't seperate player base but is accessed via a loading screen phase with only group members or solo players

1. "normal" should be using CP. (for folks who don't have CP they will always be under "without cp" for increased drops like your cp catch up concept)
2. "Normal without Cp" slightly increases drop rate and quality chances (for those who do have CP but want to turn it off without paying 3k and those without cp)
3. "veteran" with cp ....increases chance of purple and yellow drops and higher drop rate than normal without cp
4. "Veteran without cp" same as #3 but higher drop rates and this will be for elite players.

1-2 are the normal version today
3-4 is the vet version. I'm not suggesting to change anything that exists but only use this so you don't have to nerf things and allow players to be casual, elite, normal and this doesn't interrupt development that has occurred and follows the format for the future.

So for questing ...it's always normal with or without Cp in regular or scaled environments.

There would be drop downs just like today. Normal and veteran but each player within those can select veteran with CP or veteran without cp and the same for normal. I'd imagine for groups, the leader will determine the encounter difficult but if we queue for something like a random, we pick our own and so the queue is still normal or vet. The difference is the %drop rate and quality so if in a group you have 1/4 on without cp, there is a 75% increase drop rate. I'm thinking loot is specific to the player in scaled environments so the player with cp is not getting the 75% boost.

Think of it as 25% per player for simple math that applies to the calculations that exist. Keeping it simple.
In trials it will be 8.33% per player.

That's how you offer content for all and not create crazy walls which is why @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert and @ZOS_KaiSchober it's important that you not use Cp as any means to determine what gear we wear once VR is removed.

CP is best used as a difficulty factor and the catch up CP then continues to make sense.
If not then as you raise Cp, you're doing the same as what VR has done. Regardless of the catchup calculations....you're separating ppl for no reason.

Let us seperate ourselves within our chosen difficulty and social interactions. We don't need another forced separating feature like VR. Please let this logic die with the removal of VR and move to offer the same encounter with Cp and without.
Now you can drastically raise drop and quality based on this and not some other calculation.

Thoughts...feedback or anything I'm overlooking?
Edited by NewBlacksmurf on April 17, 2016 2:40PM
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • CyrusArya
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    Nah, I'm totally OK and support gear being gated by CPs. It has to be gated by something, and CP seems to be most logical metric.

    All I'm saying is, my legendary v16 gears better be exactly as relatively powerful and exclusive after the removal of vet ranks as it is now. Cus otherwise I'd feel like ZOS stole and wasted my time.

    Also opposed to all the other wacky ideas you have here. Im all for more difficulty but what you're suggesting seems far fetched and in direct opposition to character progression, and when progression dies so does the MMO.

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  • Function
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    I think all gear should be accessible once level 50 then as you gain more champion points your gear scales up respectively.
  • NewBlacksmurf
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    CyrusArya wrote: »
    Nah, I'm totally OK and support gear being gated by CPs. It has to be gated by something, and CP seems to be most logical metric.

    All I'm saying is, my legendary v16 gears better be exactly as relatively powerful and exclusive after the removal of vet ranks as it is now. Cus otherwise I'd feel like ZOS stole and wasted my time.

    Also opposed to all the other wacky ideas you have here. Im all for more difficulty but what you're suggesting seems far fetched and in direct opposition to character progression, and when progression dies so does the MMO.

    Well...here is the issue with using CP.
    my level 25 should be able to use CP501 gear cause I earned CP 501. Valid argument

    Someone will say, no you should only be able to use it after level 50 is achieved cause that's how I earned mine....
    Yeah but I earned it under the new system OR I earned on my main so why can't my alt use it?
    I had to hit 50 and then VR16 so no all 50's shouldn't get access
    ....these are resolved in this idea. ...but it doesn't change the equip requirement at 50. It changes gear progression based on player desire and not limit it to cp only and the same walls that some ppl complain about as well as the bigger topic of RNG.


    CP also is account wide so just using that....there is not vet and non vet cause we all are level 1-50
    Group content is scaled so either you end up with 50 only+CP in legacy content and anyone in scaled content.

    Progression however is not only within CP and in levels but CP requirement to equip gear has absolutely nothing to do with progression because account progression is not player progression. In your comment you regard your vr16 gear should be the same.....I agree....but if it's CP based, so you feel that any CP X should be able to wear CP gear?

    I think that's silly but if it's level 50+CP only, then anyone can wear it at 50 and there is no progression in content.
    If it's my idea, then gear progression occurs at all levels and the cp gear requirement isn't of much concern in all the BoE or BoP drops.

    I think the CP requirement is a mistake and it will remove the progression that you want.
    I'm not saying my idea is the best but my idea does offer resolution to the difficulty feedback and feedback on drops or nerfs to encounters as well as offering logic to the VR removal

    Edited by NewBlacksmurf on April 17, 2016 3:23PM
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • Khamira
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    Function wrote: »
    I think all gear should be accessible once level 50 then as you gain more champion points your gear scales up respectively.

    Dis.

    I want to run in certain set because it feels nice and unique, not because I need to grind X levels and I'm locked from anything but ol' good Hunding.

    When they introduced "Orsinium sets" I should be able to play with those sets, not grinding my eyes over to just wear them and use one week because new DLC came out.

    Progression stage should be 1-50 when you learn how to play your character and make progress through questlines etc.

    Then you hit endgame where -
    • You can run in Set of the Sun because it's not 4lvl under "endgame" like it's now.
    • There are so many awesome sets giving you awesome abilities that you can spec in almost every direction - from turtle-heal-tank to a sniper.
    • There are 100's of sets to mix and match, not 10 because all others are not at level cap.
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  • NewBlacksmurf
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    Khamira wrote: »
    Function wrote: »
    I think all gear should be accessible once level 50 then as you gain more champion points your gear scales up respectively.

    Dis.

    I want to run in certain set because it feels nice and unique, not because I need to grind X levels and I'm locked from anything but ol' good Hunding.

    When they introduced "Orsinium sets" I should be able to play with those sets, not grinding my eyes over to just wear them and use one week because new DLC came out.

    Progression stage should be 1-50 when you learn how to play your character and make progress through questlines etc.

    Then you hit endgame where -
    • You can run in Set of the Sun because it's not 4lvl under "endgame" like it's now.
    • There are so many awesome sets giving you awesome abilities that you can spec in almost every direction - from turtle-heal-tank to a sniper.
    • There are 100's of sets to mix and match, not 10 because all others are not at level cap.

    I like this idea too...a lot
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • Samadhi
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    CyrusArya wrote: »
    ...
    All I'm saying is, my legendary v16 gears better be exactly as relatively powerful and exclusive after the removal of vet ranks as it is now. Cus otherwise I'd feel like ZOS stole and wasted my time.
    ...

    ZOS is sure to find some way to ensure your gears are only worth a deconstruct after the update.
    "If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion." -- the 14th Dalai Lama
    Wisdom is doing Now that which benefits you later.
  • Farorin
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    The only problem I have with gear scaling with CP is that I hate grinding, that includes grinding for a whole new set of armour, jewellery and weapons, every time the CP cap is raised, just so that I can play PVP without being disintegrated.
  • DaveMoeDee
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    Farorin wrote: »
    The only problem I have with gear scaling with CP is that I hate grinding, that includes grinding for a whole new set of armour, jewellery and weapons, every time the CP cap is raised, just so that I can play PVP without being disintegrated.

    That isn't really the fault of CP since the same thing was happening but worse with VR.
    Edited by DaveMoeDee on April 18, 2016 1:34AM
  • Lylith
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    i think they should leave it the hell alone.

    jmo.

    i suspect it will break much more than it 'fixes' and it, like movement speed and jumping abilities and magelight (among others), does NOT need to be 'fixed.'

    Edited by Lylith on April 18, 2016 3:27AM
  • NewBlacksmurf
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    Lylith wrote: »
    i think they should leave it the hell alone.

    jmo.

    i suspect it will break much more than it 'fixes' and it, like movement speed and jumping abilities and magelight (among others), does NOT need to be 'fixed.'

    VR is already broken so it does need to be fixed (removed).
    Skill lines and such don't go past 50 which is a big issue of your leveling past 50 with VR and CP.
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • NewBlacksmurf
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    Or just this

    Take for example crafting. There should be 10 tiers just like the Passives.
    Mats of all types should follow this and consumables.

    Tier 1 (level 1-10)
    Tier 2 (level 11-20)
    Tier 3 (level 21-30)
    Tier 4 (level 31-40)
    Tier 5 (level 41-50)
    Tier 6 (level 51)
    Tier 7 (level 52)
    Tier 8 (level 53)
    Tier 9 (level 54)
    Tier 10 (level 55)

    NPCs should follow this tiers as well

    Silver zones should be 50-53
    Gold zones should be 54-55
    Craglorn and all DLC should be level 55
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • ComboBreaker88
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    Listen guys. This is happening. GET OVER IT. Seriously your not going to undo what they have spent years planning. Its just not going to happen. So if you really don't like it, send your stuff to me.
  • NewBlacksmurf
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    Listen guys. This is happening. GET OVER IT. Seriously your not going to undo what they have spent years planning. Its just not going to happen. So if you really don't like it, send your stuff to me.

    @ComboBreaker88

    Seriously, they spent about 4 hours on this and it's not even done yet.
    It's definately the time to give feedback.

    They have yet to change anything VR wise. They just remove the VR code to cp.

    Hardly 2 years of work
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • clayandaudrey_ESO
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    This has been discussed by them for 2 years.
  • NewBlacksmurf
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    This has been discussed by them for 2 years.

    @clayandaudrey_ESO
    No one guy announced it at Quakecon 2 years ago and no work had started.
    A year later it was asked about and no work had started.

    The end of the holidays they committed to doing it this year.


    Go back and read. It started that CP would replace VR.
    Then literally staff comments that CP was not going to replace VR
    Then we had a period of we will increase VR to better allow us to remove VR.

    Ok...that was late last year.

    Then they cancelled raising VR to 18 and confirmed no more VR would come. But during a recent PTS we had vr18 things left and datamined new mats as recent as 90 days ago.

    Not to come off as rediculous but this VR to CP thing is a late night lets just remove VR for now as the indicator and buy time ...cause we don't know how to remove VR.

    They literally last year told us that they underestimated how intertwined VR was to the game and we're having a lot of challenges removing them. Then ppl left the company. Spell...cxld, DLC delayed, VR removal delayed.

    Now we get VR as CP.
    they didn't remove a thing. They just slapped a 0 on VR levels and coded them to CP is all

    -ASK YOURSELF THIS-

    -How do scaled zones work now and what are they scaled off of?
    -why on PTS do gold zones still have vr14 max nodes
    -why do we have no testing of the skill/stat points on non vr16's on PTS?
    -Why is Craglorn set below gold zones all of a sudden?
    -What info determines the CP of any NPC?
    -Why is there a penalty of exp in silver and Craglorn zones for a CP difference of 40 CPs?
    -Why are ppl getting a max of 40 CPs per account but those who need to catch up get far less?
    -Why is the CP cap 160 for NPCs and gear requirements but the CP use cap still 501?


    Have you realized nothing has changed yet but other than what u see on the screen?
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • MissBizz
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    They did remove VR. VR progression was based on a single character.

    They have previously added account wide progression (CP). This will take over once you hit max level now.

    They changed what type of progression we have. They didn't remove our ability to progress.
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  • NewBlacksmurf
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    MissBizz wrote: »
    They did remove VR. VR progression was based on a single character.

    They have previously added account wide progression (CP). This will take over once you hit max level now.

    They changed what type of progression we have. They didn't remove our ability to progress.

    Sorry but respectfully that's not what they did.

    The only change was the stat and skill points.

    They literally programmed the VR code to CP and that's it.

    This why no other info is available cause if they actually changed things then questions about scaling and such would be in notes.
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
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