Calling All DC and EP to Kick AD from Haderus

kyle.wilson · May 2016

This is how I feel when I'm playing on trueflame. I saw 60+ ep zerg a resource at bloodmayne.
No ad around, with everybody spamming aoes with proxy counting.

Delsskia · May 2016

@kyle.wilson

Awesome gif. We were on TF last night and almost every fight was like that. Our group of 16 was constantly going up against groups of 40+. We did make some excellent AP, but eventually the zergs and the ping got too big to handle. TF lag is still outrageous, it's why so many people went to Haderus.

Ghostbane · May 2016

Distillateur wrote: »

AD is truly representing the best qualities of PvP in Had at the moment (since morning EST). Cheers and bravo to the profound execution. It must require a very sober and consistent application of your tribe's knowledge - nay, your very vibrant and indomitable spirit - to accomplish what is occurring at the moment.

Truly in awe,
Said No One. Ever. In Haderus NA.

More and more coming over to TF again, still Zergfest over there?

rfennell_ESO · May 2016

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

antihero727 · May 2016

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

rfennell_ESO · May 2016

antihero727 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

I'm not saying anything about them other than they exist.

I didn't think there was a really big (somewhat) org group on the AD side.

I was just correcting what I said earlier with up to date info.

Rylana · May 2016

antihero727 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

The issue.

DC and EP zergs are on Trueflame
AD zerg is on Haderus
There are not enough EP and DC on Haderus to support that transitional zerg that came from trueflame.
That AD zerg needs to go back to trueflame to balance Haderus.

Now do you see it?

That being said, EP and DC can farm yellow all day, but gain ground? No chance, because even if we go deep, there are still enough AD on the server to not only lock us up in full at one keep, but take others at the same time. Locked pop vs 2 bars.

Good example of this, just last night. BRK, my 22 vs about 40 AD, possibly two full raids. During the siege drakelowe lights up 16/20 and Aleswell which is blue at the time, is also being hit 10/20

AD can just send bodies everywhere, there is no counterplay when they have five or six groups to work with, and the other factions combined have 2 maybe 3.

We did some crazy stunts yesterday to pull the zerg apart, running scrolls into fish, running scrolls backwards, taking faregyl four different times, hitting both fare and blackboot simultaneously, but still the stubborn AD zerg stayed on BRK until it was gone, and then swarmed us south will full numerical advantage. How you cant see this as being *** is beyond me.

We are forced to either defend with everything we have, vs overwhelming numbers every single fight, or attack and leave everything undefended while token AD groups take keeps and the real zerg defends every little thing we touch. Catch 22, cant get any traction because AD zergs so goddamned hard.

antihero727 · May 2016

Rylana wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

The issue.

DC and EP zergs are on Trueflame
AD zerg is on Haderus
There are not enough EP and DC on Haderus to support that transitional zerg that came from trueflame.
That AD zerg needs to go back to trueflame to balance Haderus.

Now do you see it?

That being said, EP and DC can farm yellow all day, but gain ground? No chance, because even if we go deep, there are still enough AD on the server to not only lock us up in full at one keep, but take others at the same time. Locked pop vs 2 bars.

Good example of this, just last night. BRK, my 22 vs about 40 AD, possibly two full raids. During the siege drakelowe lights up 16/20 and Aleswell which is blue at the time, is also being hit 10/20

AD can just send bodies everywhere, there is no counterplay when they have five or six groups to work with, and the other factions combined have 2 maybe 3.

We did some crazy stunts yesterday to pull the zerg apart, running scrolls into fish, running scrolls backwards, taking faregyl four different times, hitting both fare and blackboot simultaneously, but still the stubborn AD zerg stayed on BRK until it was gone, and then swarmed us south will full numerical advantage. How you cant see this as being *** is beyond me.

We are forced to either defend with everything we have, vs overwhelming numbers every single fight, or attack and leave everything undefended while token AD groups take keeps and the real zerg defends every little thing we touch. Catch 22, cant get any traction because AD zergs so goddamned hard.

Why don't you talk to some of your EP friends and tell them to stop Zerging TF? Why is it AD's responsibility to fix an issue EP caused in the first place? I am just pointing to the mirror for you to take a look at YOUR beloved EP mega zergs that drove AD to our campaign. I would love the AD pugs to go back home too but they are having fun giving EP a spoonful of the way they felt in TF. AD is not going back to TF to face the 60+ Big E, seige emp mega zergs, sounds familiar? We both can't have what we want till other factions play nice.

Armitas · May 2016

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

antihero727 · May 2016

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

Never said it made sense but that's how it has been working out for a few weeks now.

PenguinInACan · May 2016

Rylana wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

The issue.

DC and EP zergs are on Trueflame
AD zerg is on Haderus
There are not enough EP and DC on Haderus to support that transitional zerg that came from trueflame.
That AD zerg needs to go back to trueflame to balance Haderus.

Now do you see it?

That being said, EP and DC can farm yellow all day, but gain ground? No chance, because even if we go deep, there are still enough AD on the server to not only lock us up in full at one keep, but take others at the same time. Locked pop vs 2 bars.

Good example of this, just last night. BRK, my 22 vs about 40 AD, possibly two full raids. During the siege drakelowe lights up 16/20 and Aleswell which is blue at the time, is also being hit 10/20

AD can just send bodies everywhere, there is no counterplay when they have five or six groups to work with, and the other factions combined have 2 maybe 3.

We did some crazy stunts yesterday to pull the zerg apart, running scrolls into fish, running scrolls backwards, taking faregyl four different times, hitting both fare and blackboot simultaneously, but still the stubborn AD zerg stayed on BRK until it was gone, and then swarmed us south will full numerical advantage. How you cant see this as being *** is beyond me.

We are forced to either defend with everything we have, vs overwhelming numbers every single fight, or attack and leave everything undefended while token AD groups take keeps and the real zerg defends every little thing we touch. Catch 22, cant get any traction because AD zergs so goddamned hard.

The biggest issue here/what has been an issue for a year now, is what incentive do the AD on Had have to move away from it? Everyone knows TF has horrible issue with performance during prime time and while things may be capped in the off hours that still leaves the majority of the population with very few choices. Fight lag v. zerg or zerg v. less lag.

This was a non-issue when we had 9 campaigns. Sure we had total faction control of certain campaigns, but it was so much more fun to invade a campaign for a weekend and meet players you may never have met on your local server. This isn't the case anymore. You fight the same people every night and if you are lucky you do it with the least amount of server degradation. Or you move to the only other CP-enabled vet campaign and fight horribly outnumbered or you are the one on the overwhelming side.

I know everyone was mostly pro-getting rid of campaigns, but honestly having so much of population spread across several servers was so much more fun. I haven't run across a group of players and though "crap, i have no idea who these guys are and they are way out of my league" in a long long time. And that was what I thought made PvP so dynamic.

Telel · May 2016

Telel has a wonderful super khajiit plan to help the downtrodden but boastfully superior pacters and daggets of the haderus.

1) Come over to True Flame.

2) type "/zone Our guild is recruiting any and all who want constant groups, easy AP, and wish to learn how to PVP. Any and all are welcome. Even Telel."

3) Take the many many many people who are certainly there wishing they could have a good fight instead of just suicidally being farmed at Alessia Farm, and gate camping AD, and get them in your guild.

3b) Go back to Haderus with your new army of recruits who aren't just going to run off and hide on a server where they don't have to do much to 'win'.

4) Teach them to PVP instead of being observably worse than all the bad players mentioned in this thread already.

5) Do the "I did something useful instead of blaming Telel' dance over the corpses of your enemies.

6) Receive accolades, and maybe part of a moon sugar brownie, from Telel.

Xexpo · May 2016

I would like to mention that Haderus. while still not really ideal, is in a much better state nowadays than when this thread started.
Thank you to all the DC and EP (and halfbreeds like @Telel) that came to help balance things a little better.
Still mostly AD but, much better balance recently, esp during primetime.

Rylana · May 2016

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Telel · May 2016

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

PrinceFabious · May 2016

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Humphie · May 2016

PrinceFabious wrote: »

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Nah, he been a good kitty last night and was on TF with his group. I saw him at sejanus and Alessia a few times.

PrinceFabious · May 2016

Humphie wrote: »

PrinceFabious wrote: »

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Nah, he been a good kitty last night and was on TF with his group. I saw him at sejanus and Alessia a few times.

Yay

)))

Armitas · May 2016

Humphie wrote: »

PrinceFabious wrote: »

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Nah, he been a good kitty last night and was on TF with his group. I saw him at sejanus and Alessia a few times.

I tried to pet her...but she bit me. It hurt, it hurt really bad.

Humphie · May 2016

Armitas wrote: »

Humphie wrote: »

PrinceFabious wrote: »

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Nah, he been a good kitty last night and was on TF with his group. I saw him at sejanus and Alessia a few times.

I tried to pet her...but she bit me. It hurt.

One word: Catnip! He will be a soft and sleepy kitty...purr purr purr

Anazasi · May 2016

Rylana wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Inarre wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Where are the AD zergs? The answer is there aren't any.

This was the best post I have ever red (pun intended). Hats off to you my friend!

Well, to be honest... I didn't know there was one.

I know now there is the nk zerg. I don't know who they are. But... I have noticed them up to nk4 or 5 in zone and most the time at least nk2. I don't follow them or join them, but I now know what people are talking about. I don't even know what nk stands for or who is even a member or who even leads them. It's a pug no ts required (as far as I know) zone chat type thing.

I tend to avoid dealing with zergs as much as possible, but yes this one exists and it's becoming bigger.

I play AD and know who they are. I personally think even though they are running crazy big zergs that this guild does not gate camp. It's a good thing that a guild is rounding up all the pugs and giving directions as there will be less gate camping and other pugish things going on. Everyone learns somewhere and NK is a good group to show newer players how to act in Cyrodiil. DC and EP are running those same numbers in TF so I don't see the issue.

The issue.

DC and EP zergs are on Trueflame
AD zerg is on Haderus
There are not enough EP and DC on Haderus to support that transitional zerg that came from trueflame.
That AD zerg needs to go back to trueflame to balance Haderus.

Now do you see it?

That being said, EP and DC can farm yellow all day, but gain ground? No chance, because even if we go deep, there are still enough AD on the server to not only lock us up in full at one keep, but take others at the same time. Locked pop vs 2 bars.

Good example of this, just last night. BRK, my 22 vs about 40 AD, possibly two full raids. During the siege drakelowe lights up 16/20 and Aleswell which is blue at the time, is also being hit 10/20

AD can just send bodies everywhere, there is no counterplay when they have five or six groups to work with, and the other factions combined have 2 maybe 3.

We did some crazy stunts yesterday to pull the zerg apart, running scrolls into fish, running scrolls backwards, taking faregyl four different times, hitting both fare and blackboot simultaneously, but still the stubborn AD zerg stayed on BRK until it was gone, and then swarmed us south will full numerical advantage. How you cant see this as being *** is beyond me.

We are forced to either defend with everything we have, vs overwhelming numbers every single fight, or attack and leave everything undefended while token AD groups take keeps and the real zerg defends every little thing we touch. Catch 22, cant get any traction because AD zergs so goddamned hard.

You are so full of yourself, I blew coffee and a little pee this morning reading your fabulous tale. This player is a zerg magnet for EP and will spew falsehoods at every corner. Last night on Had my group of 12 wiped her group of 22 three times till she/he called in 40 EP to retake the Arius Lumber mill. You must feel really proud of yourself when you can come to Had with 40 to 50 EP and roll small groups of organized players. And for the Record I have never run with NK but guess what they run maybe 1 raid of 24 and when you see NK+ a number did it ever occur to you it might be a different group leader. I know at one point Misfitz group leaders all had their own codes like 222 or 444. And you should also remember AD is always fighting on two fronts because DC and EP are bed buddies on every campaign. SO if you see NK and thing they are zerging you need to watch the map they are fighting 2 fronts all the time because of the PURPLE ALLIANCE. I have a great idea EP wants to blob role well keep it on TF stay out of Had. You are probably not even part of the solution to the issues ZOS and the players are facing. Oh and yeah EP is the ZERG BAD faction. If you cant win with even numbers easy fix bring more. What a waste of pixels.

Anazasi · May 2016

Now that I have cleaned myself up I will say that all these problems are not the fault of any player, group or faction. The issue of zergs, bad server performance and poor PVP conditions have been created and allowed to continue by ZOS. The fact that any player can enter any campaign whether guested or homed is outrageous. The fact that you can have one account with 3 different factions on it and all be in the same campaign is ridiculous. The fact that practically ever campaign on the weekends or during primetime is locked is simply poor management. All these issues are allowed by ZOS and therefore ZOS takes full responsibility for the failures and poor conditions of PVP. ZOS needs to step up and fix these issues before more players leave.

Yeah I'm not even mentioning the bugs and exploits like Bombard and SHUFFLE that every blob or small group tends to use. Yeah you know who I'm talking about and yeah everyone is doing it because it's a simple I win button. The fact that ZOS has done nothing about it only adds more salt to the players complaints over the lack fixing broken mechanics.

I have a great idea ZOS get on your dev team characters. Have one character slot bombard and spam it at a target. Have another character get on and spam encase or talons and watch what happens to the target. When you are satisfied with the results FIX THE BROKEN mechanic.

When you get done with that little test try this one. Get on a character and press SHUFFEL about 5 times in a row. Then have someone try and hit them. When you are done ask yourself why you even bothered to add dodge roll back into the game because obviously its not needed with this wonderful BUG.

mchermie · May 2016

Anazasi wrote: »

If you cant win with even numbers easy fix bring more.

Im pretty sure youre talking about AD on Had, right?:) Because thats exactly how it feels to be DC there

Telel · May 2016

Humphie wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Humphie wrote: »

PrinceFabious wrote: »

Telel wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Wait wait wait.... People left TF because of the zerging... to go to Haderus so that they can zerg....

That is exactly what AD is doing.

Nopes.

Dont try and deny that Telel...I see you contributing to the mega zerg

Nah, he been a good kitty last night and was on TF with his group. I saw him at sejanus and Alessia a few times.

I tried to pet her...but she bit me. It hurt.

One word: Catnip! He will be a soft and sleepy kitty...purr purr purr

Telel is always soft and squishy. This is why they die so easily when facing off against a modest solo player composed of eight to fifty pacter totallynotzergingbads.

Anazasi · May 2016

mchermie wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

If you cant win with even numbers easy fix bring more.

Im pretty sure youre talking about AD on Had, right?:) Because thats exactly how it feels to be DC there

I run small groups sometimes as small as 8 other times we get to 18 but never have I ran a full raid. I have been very selective about where I take my group and I have, when asked, by other factions to make a fight as even as possible. I have even taken my group to IC so the fights could be even. I can not control what a faction does, I can only control what my group does and sometimes that's a challenge. I don't know what times you play but my group always seem to be outnumbered by both DC and EP.

PrinceFabious · May 2016

Anazasi wrote: »

mchermie wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

If you cant win with even numbers easy fix bring more.

Im pretty sure youre talking about AD on Had, right?:) Because thats exactly how it feels to be DC there

I run small groups sometimes as small as 8 other times we get to 18 but never have I ran a full raid. I have been very selective about where I take my group and I have, when asked, by other factions to make a fight as even as possible. I have even taken my group to IC so the fights could be even. I can not control what a faction does, I can only control what my group does and sometimes that's a challenge. I don't know what times you play but my group always seem to be outnumbered by both DC and EP.

Outnumbered to an AD prolly means even numbers

Anazasi · May 2016

I don't have issue with even numbers. We win or loose depending on how the fight unfolds. I have no issue fighting 2 to 1 odds either. As you probably know from the last couple of days at Glad Mine. I have issues when even numbers become 3 to 1 or 4 to 1 because DC and EP are at prime time and have more players due to TF being locked. Don't think all AD players are quantity over quality. We are not those players.

PrinceFabious · May 2016

No matter how you like to say " only 8 in my group" there are still 20-30 and sometimes 40-50 in the same area or even attacking another part of the map. So that "DC/EP" force you are talking about has already been split up. AD outnumbers on Haddy because they dont want to fight in TF. Until then, you have to deal with this harsh reality that you are quantity>quality

Anazasi · May 2016

Our realities, as you like to see it, is predicated only by our perceptions. When you accept the reality of what you can control and accept the limits of your individual abilities you can become wise. If you want to place the shoe on the other foot. What does K-hole say. "We run small group 12 to 16, and cant control what others do." Am I to understand that its ok for DC to have a small quality group with another 20 to 40 DC running around them and that's acceptable? The fact is both sides, all sides, zerg. The game is open world PVP and numbers will ALWAYS trump quality. You perceive a zerg only because the camera is pointed in a forward direction. And when a faction looses a fight the always return with more until they win. If you think I'm wrong look at your own ZONE chat and watch what happens when a small group gets wiped. More arrive till the odds are tipped in your favor, then you justify what just happened (zerging) by some irrelevant emotional validation. This Reality is the basis of 3 faction open PVP. Take a look at TF if you need a clearer picture. Its 11AM EST time and I'm thinking TF is pop locked by EP DC is probably 2 or 3 barred and AD is simply 1 bar trying to find a fair fight where a chance to have a good fight and win may exist.

antihero727 · May 2016

PrinceFabious wrote: »

No matter how you like to say " only 8 in my group" there are still 20-30 and sometimes 40-50 in the same area or even attacking another part of the map. So that "DC/EP" force you are talking about has already been split up. AD outnumbers on Haddy because they dont want to fight in TF. Until then, you have to deal with this harsh reality that you are quantity>quality

What about that 50+ DC blob at als? The one we got the 21k tick from. DC and EP tried to dethrone hard last night but failed and cried once again. If you add the EP and DC bars AD is outnumbered because the Barney Zerg was in full force last night.