4 Man Dungeon Nerf?

Kcttocs · April 2016

I've heard the 4 man dungeons are being nerfed in the next update. I do not want this, I enjoy hard content. Difficulty is reward!

KPC13 · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

TBF Vet city of ash is ridiculous on random group finder, I've yet to complete it with random groups because it's so difficult. Not saying it should be nerfed but it is pretty damn hard to do unless your with a group of good players who know what their doing. Unlike some of the easier vet dungeons where you can muddle through it if one or two in the group aren't great.

x_Nathan_F · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

They're fine and completeable as long as you have good communication.

phaneub17_ESO · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

I voted no, but I rarely do Vet dungeons anyway so my vote is kind of moot; I'll stick to normal mode. I can see things coming at me and know what I have to do to get out of the **** way, but I'm not quick enough for a lot of vet dungeon mechanics. Sometimes the animation doesn't register on my end and I die to an invisible blast.

notimetocare · April 2016

Yes please Nerf

3 dungeons are getting nerfed to be more inline with other vet dungeons. IO see no issue with it, thought the difficulty will be missed when running with good groups.

Kcttocs · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

notimetocare wrote: »

3 dungeons are getting nerfed to be more inline with other vet dungeons. IO see no issue with it, thought the difficulty will be missed when running with good groups.

It's a shame. White Gold Tower and ICP are difficult, but not with good players and VCOA can be completed with pugs as long as one or two players know what they are doing.... I guess if anyone wants a challenge then it's Maelstrom, which I don't enjoy doing.

Lightninvash · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

I mean if they nerf them more I could probably solo some vet dungeons on my healer.... and I don't even want to talk about how easy it would be for my sorc. I think they should stay the same imo

kadar · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

Completing Content is not fun. The satisfaction we get from completing content IS fun. If content is too easy, there is no satisfaction for a challenge overcome. ZOS, you must understand this...

emily3989 · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

KPC13 wrote: »

TBF Vet city of ash is ridiculous on random group finder, I've yet to complete it with random groups because it's so difficult. Not saying it should be nerfed but it is pretty damn hard to do unless your with a group of good players who know what their doing. Unlike some of the easier vet dungeons where you can muddle through it if one or two in the group aren't great.

I went in there last week in random and got the gold key. Sad that this is the pinnacle of the game aside from one single V16 trial in regards to PvE endgame.

I would be for making it easier if they would create solo versions of group dungeons that scaled to a decent difficulty level. I mean, you gotta have something in PvE that requires more than spamming a couple of skills, don't you?

xblackroxe · April 2016

notimetocare wrote: »

3 dungeons are getting nerfed to be more inline with other vet dungeons. IO see no issue with it, thought the difficulty will be missed when running with good groups.

Well I get it that many players haven't finished the IC dungeons and I get why ZOS nerfs. But still its ridiciulous. I've heard from people that already soloed all the 3 dungeons easily on pts with 300 CP templates.
The nerf is so hard that there is no reason to do mechanics even with low dps as you can stand in every aoe that would have oneshotted you before. They just took the nerf too far imo.

GeertKarel · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

normal, veteran and expert dungeon difficulty, make expert a lot more challenging and make it so you have more chance to get items so the more unexperienced people can have their items and people who are good/decent in the game can have their fun plus more chance on a good item as reward.

bloodenragedb14_ESO · April 2016

Yes please Nerf

im mostly a solo'er, been that way since early access, and ill admit that im being selfish in saying so, but im happy with any nerf given to group content

every time i get up the courage ((yes courage, i suffer from pretty severe social anxiety, even game/net interaction is a tad tricky at points)) nearly every time i get the courage to find a group to play a dungeon, i get blasted for not rolling this or that build. I know of those builds, i know their power, but i do not enjoy playing them

If these nerfs make it easier for players to use the group finder without getting blasted by other players for not subscribing to the cookie cutter builds, im all for it. ESO has already started to paint itself as a more casual experience, i see nothing wrong with taking it a step further

If you dont like it, i can personally suggest a few mmo's that are far far more challenging than ESO.

I apologize if you will not, or can not, find enjoyment in the group content after the nerf, i really do, but im glad its happening, and will offer no resistance

Humatiel · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

im mostly a solo'er, been that way since early access, and ill admit that im being selfish in saying so, but im happy with any nerf given to group content

every time i get up the courage ((yes courage, i suffer from pretty severe social anxiety, even game/net interaction is a tad tricky at points)) nearly every time i get the courage to find a group to play a dungeon, i get blasted for not rolling this or that build. I know of those builds, i know their power, but i do not enjoy playing them

If these nerfs make it easier for players to use the group finder without getting blasted by other players for not subscribing to the cookie cutter builds, im all for it. ESO has already started to paint itself as a more casual experience, i see nothing wrong with taking it a step further

If you dont like it, i can personally suggest a few mmo's that are far far more challenging than ESO.

I apologize if you will not, or can not, find enjoyment in the group content after the nerf, i really do, but im glad its happening, and will offer no resistance

Such an interesting outlook, would you not say that the "non vet" version of these dungeons already provides a way for less serious/knowledgeable players to complete the content? Or is your view that all content should be able to be completed by those not taking advantage of there class/race/gear?

AtraisMachina · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

Honestly I cant even believe were having this conversation. For example^ catering towards players who have social anxiety IN A FREAKIN MMO!!!!! I hope there doing this because there will be more challenging stuff after db.

Bars · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

but who cares zo$$ will do what they want!!

Shunravi · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

im mostly a solo'er, been that way since early access, and ill admit that im being selfish in saying so, but im happy with any nerf given to group content

every time i get up the courage ((yes courage, i suffer from pretty severe social anxiety, even game/net interaction is a tad tricky at points)) nearly every time i get the courage to find a group to play a dungeon, i get blasted for not rolling this or that build. I know of those builds, i know their power, but i do not enjoy playing them

If these nerfs make it easier for players to use the group finder without getting blasted by other players for not subscribing to the cookie cutter builds, im all for it. ESO has already started to paint itself as a more casual experience, i see nothing wrong with taking it a step further

If you dont like it, i can personally suggest a few mmo's that are far far more challenging than ESO.

I apologize if you will not, or can not, find enjoyment in the group content after the nerf, i really do, but im glad its happening, and will offer no resistance

If there is a chapter of lone wolf help on your platform, I would strongly recommend joining them. They are for soloers, and dedicate themselves to a kind and friendly helpful environment. If you want to do these type of things, they have people who are capable and will help you out without puting you on blast. Or you can join up and never have to do anything. Your choice.

frethopper · April 2016

Yes please Nerf

I see I'm in a minority here

It's a personal thing, I just don't relish the extreme difficulty. For me it takes some of the fun away. Different strokes I guess.

Shunravi · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

frethopper wrote: »

I see I'm in a minority here

It's a personal thing, I just don't relish the extreme difficulty. For me it takes some of the fun away. Different strokes I guess.

Different strokes different folks

Do what ya like, but I don't approve of the way ZOS handles these things or rng....

redspecter23 · April 2016

I'm not saying I agree with the upcoming nerfs, but if ZoS were to nerf anything, it surprises me that VMSA and VMOL weren't the first two that came to mind. With the nerf to 4 man dungeons, we have a difficulty divide so large, it's crazy. Player progression is somehow supposed to magically teleport from the new easy mode 4 man dungeons to VMSA? How? There is nothing left to do for those players that are good, but not quite elite and there are probably a ton of players in that skill group.

Nightingale1176 · April 2016

No Please do not nerf.

I voted No, only on vCoA, vIPC, vWGT do we even bring a tank. So 97% of the other 4 man dungeons we just 3 DPS/1healer them. and walk right through them. They are getting almost to easy with our V16 builds. Sure maybe help CP 110 and below but CP120+ should be left be.

(and yes we all have min/maxed builds)

bloodenragedb14_ESO · May 2016

Yes please Nerf

Humatiel wrote: »

Such an interesting outlook, would you not say that the "non vet" version of these dungeons already provides a way for less serious/knowledgeable players to complete the content? Or is your view that all content should be able to be completed by those not taking advantage of there class/race/gear?

the concept of the 'cookie cutter' builds being the only build viable for this dungeon or that should always be something fought against,

Shunravi wrote: »

If there is a chapter of lone wolf help on your platform, I would strongly recommend joining them. They are for soloers, and dedicate themselves to a kind and friendly helpful environment. If you want to do these type of things, they have people who are capable and will help you out without puting you on blast. Or you can join up and never have to do anything. Your choice.

I thank you for your suggestion, and i may search them out someday, but as of current i have all i need from the roleplaying community, as i have carved out a decent niche of people i am comfortable with for now, thank you for your suggestion though.

Attackopsn · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

I would really appreciate it if everyone that cares about this topic would read my post belowww

*Warning, my post is really long and messy*

Please don't nerf this content, it isn't even remotely difficult. Just because a high percentage of the community can't complete it doesn't mean it is too hard, it instead says more about the community than the difficulty of the content. Especially City of Ash, that dungeon is already a joke. If the majority of the community is struggling to complete this content I think many would agree in this instance that you shouldn't as a developer feel at blame for the lack of completion! The dev team needs to stop looking at this data as an accurate assessment of difficulty, please, never see this high rate of incompletion as evidence of being overly-difficult! Yes, I understand that it was even stated that 'it wouldn't be reduced by 25%', and would be receiving only moderate modifications. The reality however, is that this content in its current state is actually underwhelming, and by reducing the difficulty any further, you are cheating the player-base out of (apparently much-needed) character progression and development. I can remember being a noob, feeling hopeless in City of Ash, dying over and over to meteorites and the occasional sword-swing from Skoria. I also remember how much it helped me progress as an individual player after completing it that first time! You see, if you take out these little road blocks, you cause more harm than good to the newer community. Jumping from cake-walk dungeons to VMoL and VMA (vma being a cake-walk even after practice) will be an extreme increase in difficulty leading to more absurd nerf cries for all current end-game content and future content. This kind of content will at first actually require players to think, something that they will absolutely never have to do should content become increasingly less difficult. Players who cannot complete this content need to understand that they are cheating themselves out of their own game by asking and advocating this variety of nerfing to current and future content. I would consider this post only a few of the plethora of reasons why this content absolutely does not need to be nerfed, and I hope that the developers in charge of this decision see why it is so imperative for them to avoid the announced changes.

@ZOS_Finn, you have a really great thing going here, I have never had this much fun playing an MMO to date, please don't go this direction!

In my opinion, the greatest reason newer players reach max level with no idea how to play the game is because during all early to late game stages, players are never required to complete even remotely complicated tasks. The most obvious solution, in my own completely disputable opinion, would be to create mini-road blocks in the levelling process where players need to think just a little bit. Whether it be more oriented towards the player's build or the mechanics of the encounter doesn't matter as much as that it can't be completed by light attacking while completely naked with your fists and no passives equipped. Yes, this is an Elder Scrolls game, and we do have a portion of the community that may be described as 'less dedicated' or worried about being a min-maxed end game player, but this does not justify the utter lack of thought required to complete any tier of content before the very final tier of content. Please don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to start some kind of developer witch hunt, or flame noobs, I'm just a player that genuinely cares about the game and the community that plays it. I really hope that everyone here will agree that nerfing this content isn't just making it less fun, it's eliminating some of the only content this game has left requiring players to apply themselves.

@Zos_Mattfiror please don't do this!

MissBizz · May 2016

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Humatiel wrote: »

Such an interesting outlook, would you not say that the "non vet" version of these dungeons already provides a way for less serious/knowledgeable players to complete the content? Or is your view that all content should be able to be completed by those not taking advantage of there class/race/gear?

the concept of the 'cookie cutter' builds being the only build viable for this dungeon or that should always be something fought against,

Shunravi wrote: »

If there is a chapter of lone wolf help on your platform, I would strongly recommend joining them. They are for soloers, and dedicate themselves to a kind and friendly helpful environment. If you want to do these type of things, they have people who are capable and will help you out without puting you on blast. Or you can join up and never have to do anything. Your choice.

I thank you for your suggestion, and i may search them out someday, but as of current i have all i need from the roleplaying community, as i have carved out a decent niche of people i am comfortable with for now, thank you for your suggestion though.

Hey @bloodenragedb14_ESO

just wanted to let you know I'm guildmaster of LWH on PC NA and you can reach out any time. We recently had a dungeon night where multiple people who normally don't play in groups came out and it even gave some of them the courage to use the group finder

Safe travels in Tamriel!

As for dungeons being nerfed.. Aggghhh... I really think by this point the IC dungeons should be, BUT I also figured there would be new dungeons out to fit the role of difficult content. It's a tough call. I wish they didn't add these to the vet pledge. I think if they didn't, a lot less people would be unhappy about their difficulty. I think the amount they were nerfed will make the call for me. I plan on running them on the PTS tomorrow.

Marktoneth3 · May 2016

Yes please Nerf

Nerf everything that I want to

Attackopsn · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Humatiel wrote: »

Such an interesting outlook, would you not say that the "non vet" version of these dungeons already provides a way for less serious/knowledgeable players to complete the content? Or is your view that all content should be able to be completed by those not taking advantage of there class/race/gear?

the concept of the 'cookie cutter' builds being the only build viable for this dungeon or that should always be something fought against,

Shunravi wrote: »

If there is a chapter of lone wolf help on your platform, I would strongly recommend joining them. They are for soloers, and dedicate themselves to a kind and friendly helpful environment. If you want to do these type of things, they have people who are capable and will help you out without puting you on blast. Or you can join up and never have to do anything. Your choice.

I thank you for your suggestion, and i may search them out someday, but as of current i have all i need from the roleplaying community, as i have carved out a decent niche of people i am comfortable with for now, thank you for your suggestion though.

What you will come to understand in time, is that learning and understanding mechanics is significantly more important than having the most min/maxed set up. You do not need even half functioning builds to complete these dungeons, you just have to respond to the mechanics. Please don't fall into this trap! These nerfs will not magically make you able to complete this either, at most, the npcs will see a -15% to -20% reduction and will still require that you understand how to play the game (sorta).

Wrecking_Blow_Spam · May 2016

Yes please Nerf

Made the wrong vote lol....

The thing with these online votes is that the majority of people who take part in forums are normally the "better" player or more experienced. The "casual" player normally isn't on here they're a minority. Most on here IMO are end game, multiple vr16 players.
My point is that all these polls will have been answered by mostly the "better" players and not the casual player.

obscure7 · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

Don't nerf difficulty. Nerf the grind.

Buff drop rates.

flguy147ub17_ESO · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

Hit vet 16 just the other day, have 248 CP as of last night, zero gold gear and i waited until i hit vet 16 to try WGT. So i go in last night expecting it to be tough. We totally facerolled until the last boss where i did die a couple times due to not knowing the mechanics that well but my group rezzed me and we finished. Was disappointed that it was suppose to be much tougher than it actually was. I understand it can be tough for some players but that is why there is normal and vet versions.

Attackopsn · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

EquinoxS wrote: »

Made the wrong vote lol....

The thing with these online votes is that the majority of people who take part in forums are normally the "better" player or more experienced. The "casual" player normally isn't on here they're a minority. Most on here IMO are end game, multiple vr16 players.
My point is that all these polls will have been answered by mostly the "better" players and not the casual player.

10 people would disagree with this statement according to the poll above

Shunravi · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

flguy147ub17_ESO wrote: »

Hit vet 16 just the other day, have 248 CP as of last night, zero gold gear and i waited until i hit vet 16 to try WGT. So i go in last night expecting it to be tough. We totally facerolled until the last boss where i did die a couple times due to not knowing the mechanics that well but my group rezzed me and we finished. Was disappointed that it was suppose to be much tougher than it actually was. I understand it can be tough for some players but that is why there is normal and vet versions.

Do not fear the dungeon young grasshopper.

when we say its hard, its in comparison to the rest of the game.

Morimizo · May 2016

No Please do not nerf.

emily3989 wrote: »

KPC13 wrote: »

TBF Vet city of ash is ridiculous on random group finder, I've yet to complete it with random groups because it's so difficult. Not saying it should be nerfed but it is pretty damn hard to do unless your with a group of good players who know what their doing. Unlike some of the easier vet dungeons where you can muddle through it if one or two in the group aren't great.

I went in there last week in random and got the gold key. Sad that this is the pinnacle of the game aside from one single V16 trial in regards to PvE endgame.

I would be for making it easier if they would create solo versions of group dungeons that scaled to a decent difficulty level. I mean, you gotta have something in PvE that requires more than spamming a couple of skills, don't you?

This would be very welcome. I think they should keep the difficulty the way it is and increase it for the others that are not currently considered hard. The change would come with the addition of solo, 2-person, and 3-person levels of difficulty of the dungeons. Even if it's just tweaking number of opponents and some stats, or closing off some areas that only get seen by the best groups, would include all and exclude none from the content.

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