SeptimusDova wrote: »

Odin I can handle discussions just fine. You seem to not like the answers you are being given. I detest cheating and exploits. On that page we share. Just remember zenimax's statements do not always match up with what is going on behind the scenes inside the company.

The only definitive proof of it being an exploit is to be able to reproduce the skill and show the steps. And that isn't going to happen. Because well intended actions have unintended consequences. And none of us are famous streamers with a get out of jail free card.

When you resort to profanity you have already lost a merit in a debate/discussion.

So we will not know if it is a real exploit unless someone comes forth with an admission and that is not going to happen. Or it becomes more widespread.

My segue into this discussion was because of post #6

here in it's entirety
"I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video (make it unlisted so only those with a link can see it) and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.
Edited by OdinForge on April 16, 2016 1:14PM "

Poppycock. Circumstantial evidence is definitive and frequently used to send people to lethal injection. Of course, this case is different because the dodge rate apparently cannot be reproduced by anyone, including ZoS, and the whole mess is just a L2P issue.

Tonight I spammed crippling grasp repeatedly on every amazing player out there. My strategy was to observe and see what drove their recent rise to greatness. I wanted to know what unbelievable rotation or combination they had come up with to flip the tables so resoundingly. I turned on a few addons to help in my quest to L2P.

With respect to one person (for his anonymity let's call him Maiq II) I was astounded in every way by his skill! His group mates, a mer or two bearing jewels, were not nearly as skilled as Maiq II. I am sure, however, that they were grateful he could carry them to victory as they attended him throughout the evening.

In my favorite encounter tonight with Maiq II, I was only able to hit him once in over 20 casts, with a best run of 15 consecutive misses in 20sec!!! I observed his amazing play closely and the conclusion I have reached is that he probably pulled it off with well placed dodge rolls. All two of them!!! Maiq II was so skilled that he dispatched both my group mates, one of which was our main assist, who registered an identical inability to hit this amazingly skilled player!

Just so we are clear, if each dodge change is independent, the odds of 15 consecutive dodges at 20% is 30,517,578,125, which is 100x the odds of winning Powerball (1 in 292,000,000). Keeping that dodge rate against three players? Wow, just wow!

@ZOS_GinaBruno, I read your post describing how your team has found no issues with shuffle. I am quite relieved that your team has as much amazing skill as Maiq II and we can all look elsewhere for the problem. Perhaps the time stamped screenshots of my logs, which I submitted in-game, might help you to reward these players in some way, for example, by making sure they don't miss a minute of game time. I am pretty that is the ZoS way of rewarding this type of play.

As a NB I don't use blur or any of its morphs as i get WAAAY more times than i do when i use shuffle....

They apparently have the same dodge chance????

Egonieser wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.

Have you never encountered a person, who dodges your attacks 100% without even doing a single rolldodge? I have, many times in fact. It's not common, but there's definitely something off about it.
Only way to kill them is use undodgable attacks like channeled skills, curse, streak, agony etc.
It may be an accusation, but I've encountered it several times by same individuals every time to know something is a bit iffy there, 20% chance is not permanent 100% chance.

What you are seeing is not Major Evasion stacking with itself, but instead some combination of the 3 different dodge/miss effects:

Major Evasion (20% dodge chance from Shuffle, Blur, Hist Bark or Spectre's Eye)
Akatosh Blessing (100% miss chance debuff on attacking enemy for 5 seconds)
Dodge Roll (100% dodge chance for a short time, can be further extended by Crusader Set)

For example, someone dodge rolls frequently while using shuffle, you are going to miss a lot of your attacks. Can be slightly more if they are also wearing crusader set or akatosh blessing.

The dodge roll fatigue cost of subsequent dodge rolls is extremely high right now, this certainly does not need any more nerfs. If someone is dodge rolling several times in a row, they are making a lot of sacrifices to do it.

Waffennacht wrote: »

If it was bugged... wouldn't everyone be beating vMA right now? I mean with an 80% dodge rate you could walk right through that

Used to be able to stack the various morphs of Ash Cloud, Cinder Storm, Eruption with Shuffle, Blinding Flashes, Sparks and Spectre's Eye. It was possible to get close to 100%, and then stand in the middle pouring ground oils on everybody.

boundsy88 wrote: »

just tried to gank a guy with a fully charged heavy bow attack into ambush, tried this 4 times in a row on the same guy using shuffle. not one of my abilities hit him out of the 4 attempts.

Sorry, this cannot be reproduced by anyone including ZoS. Perhaps you should reboot your router?

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Egonieser wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.

Have you never encountered a person, who dodges your attacks 100% without even doing a single rolldodge? I have, many times in fact. It's not common, but there's definitely something off about it.
Only way to kill them is use undodgable attacks like channeled skills, curse, streak, agony etc.
It may be an accusation, but I've encountered it several times by same individuals every time to know something is a bit iffy there, 20% chance is not permanent 100% chance.

What you are seeing is not Major Evasion stacking with itself, but instead some combination of the 3 different dodge/miss effects:

Major Evasion (20% dodge chance from Shuffle, Blur, Hist Bark or Spectre's Eye)
Akatosh Blessing (100% miss chance debuff on attacking enemy for 5 seconds)
Dodge Roll (100% dodge chance for a short time, can be further extended by Crusader Set)

For example, someone dodge rolls frequently while using shuffle, you are going to miss a lot of your attacks. Can be slightly more if they are also wearing crusader set or akatosh blessing.

The dodge roll fatigue cost of subsequent dodge rolls is extremely high right now, this certainly does not need any more nerfs. If someone is dodge rolling several times in a row, they are making a lot of sacrifices to do it.

Waffennacht wrote: »

If it was bugged... wouldn't everyone be beating vMA right now? I mean with an 80% dodge rate you could walk right through that

Used to be able to stack the various morphs of Ash Cloud, Cinder Storm, Eruption with Shuffle, Blinding Flashes, Sparks and Spectre's Eye. It was possible to get close to 100%, and then stand in the middle pouring ground oils on everybody.

I used Akatosh back when it was worth it. If Akatosh has anything to do with it, the sparkle effect is no longer apparent. I highly doubt that Akatosh is involved because its chance to proc is off of block, and is 5 seconds with 10sec cooldown. I have recorded 15 dodges in a 20 sec period

As to crusader, the .3 seconds permits you to chain dodging with dodge rolls, that's it. In other words, there is a .3 second hard delay between dodge times, dodge roll to dodge roll. Crrusader bridges that gap so you remain untouched while chain rolling. However, the people being complained about that are "chain rolling" are in fact not doing that, they find ways to pause and have stam regen kick in.

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

boundsy88 wrote: »

just tried to gank a guy with a fully charged heavy bow attack into ambush, tried this 4 times in a row on the same guy using shuffle. not one of my abilities hit him out of the 4 attempts.

Sorry, this cannot be reproduced by anyone including ZoS. Perhaps you should reboot your router?

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Egonieser wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.

Have you never encountered a person, who dodges your attacks 100% without even doing a single rolldodge? I have, many times in fact. It's not common, but there's definitely something off about it.
Only way to kill them is use undodgable attacks like channeled skills, curse, streak, agony etc.
It may be an accusation, but I've encountered it several times by same individuals every time to know something is a bit iffy there, 20% chance is not permanent 100% chance.

What you are seeing is not Major Evasion stacking with itself, but instead some combination of the 3 different dodge/miss effects:

Major Evasion (20% dodge chance from Shuffle, Blur, Hist Bark or Spectre's Eye)
Akatosh Blessing (100% miss chance debuff on attacking enemy for 5 seconds)
Dodge Roll (100% dodge chance for a short time, can be further extended by Crusader Set)

For example, someone dodge rolls frequently while using shuffle, you are going to miss a lot of your attacks. Can be slightly more if they are also wearing crusader set or akatosh blessing.

The dodge roll fatigue cost of subsequent dodge rolls is extremely high right now, this certainly does not need any more nerfs. If someone is dodge rolling several times in a row, they are making a lot of sacrifices to do it.

Waffennacht wrote: »

If it was bugged... wouldn't everyone be beating vMA right now? I mean with an 80% dodge rate you could walk right through that

Used to be able to stack the various morphs of Ash Cloud, Cinder Storm, Eruption with Shuffle, Blinding Flashes, Sparks and Spectre's Eye. It was possible to get close to 100%, and then stand in the middle pouring ground oils on everybody.

I used Akatosh back when it was worth it. If Akatosh has anything to do with it, the sparkle effect is no longer apparent. I highly doubt that Akatosh is involved because its chance to proc is off of block, and is 5 seconds with 10sec cooldown. I have recorded 15 dodges in a 20 sec period

As to crusader, the .3 seconds permits you to chain dodging with dodge rolls, that's it. In other words, there is a .3 second hard delay between dodge times, dodge roll to dodge roll. Crrusader bridges that gap so you remain untouched while chain rolling. However, the people being complained about that are "chain rolling" are in fact not doing that, they find ways to pause and have stam regen kick in.

Stamina regen doesn't stop when you dodge roll the way it does when you block. The cost of successive rolls are just a lot higher, especially 3rd and 4th. You can dodge roll twice, wait a few seconds for the fatigue debuff to expire, roll again and if you have shuffle up during this time, many attacks will miss.

As for Akatosh debuff, you will see "MISSED" instead of "DODGED" in the combat text - otherwise, there is no visual effect.

I've wondered what causes that occasional miss. But there are players out there who dodge nearly everything. They aren't dodge rolling, they are just jumping around and everyone misses almost every attack. And those players have no fear even when fighting a bunch of players right up until you cast radiant destruction on them and then they try running away. I can't complain though, I get a lot more killing blows against those guys since others in the group can't hit them consistently.

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

SeptimusDova wrote: »

Odin I can handle discussions just fine. You seem to not like the answers you are being given. I detest cheating and exploits. On that page we share. Just remember zenimax's statements do not always match up with what is going on behind the scenes inside the company.

The only definitive proof of it being an exploit is to be able to reproduce the skill and show the steps. And that isn't going to happen. Because well intended actions have unintended consequences. And none of us are famous streamers with a get out of jail free card.

When you resort to profanity you have already lost a merit in a debate/discussion.

So we will not know if it is a real exploit unless someone comes forth with an admission and that is not going to happen. Or it becomes more widespread.

My segue into this discussion was because of post #6

here in it's entirety
"I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video (make it unlisted so only those with a link can see it) and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.
Edited by OdinForge on April 16, 2016 1:14PM "

Poppycock. Circumstantial evidence is definitive and frequently used to send people to lethal injection. Of course, this case is different because the dodge rate apparently cannot be reproduced by anyone, including ZoS, and the whole mess is just a L2P issue.

Tonight I spammed crippling grasp repeatedly on every amazing player out there. My strategy was to observe and see what drove their recent rise to greatness. I wanted to know what unbelievable rotation or combination they had come up with to flip the tables so resoundingly. I turned on a few addons to help in my quest to L2P.

With respect to one person (for his anonymity let's call him Maiq II) I was astounded in every way by his skill! His group mates, a mer or two bearing jewels, were not nearly as skilled as Maiq II. I am sure, however, that they were grateful he could carry them to victory as they attended him throughout the evening.

In my favorite encounter tonight with Maiq II, I was only able to hit him once in over 20 casts, with a best run of 15 consecutive misses in 20sec!!! I observed his amazing play closely and the conclusion I have reached is that he probably pulled it off with well placed dodge rolls. All two of them!!! Maiq II was so skilled that he dispatched both my group mates, one of which was our main assist, who registered an identical inability to hit this amazingly skilled player!

Just so we are clear, if each dodge change is independent, the odds of 15 consecutive dodges at 20% is 30,517,578,125, which is 100x the odds of winning Powerball (1 in 292,000,000). Keeping that dodge rate against three players? Wow, just wow!

@ZOS_GinaBruno, I read your post describing how your team has found no issues with shuffle. I am quite relieved that your team has as much amazing skill as Maiq II and we can all look elsewhere for the problem. Perhaps the time stamped screenshots of my logs, which I submitted in-game, might help you to reward these players in some way, for example, by making sure they don't miss a minute of game time. I am pretty that is the ZoS way of rewarding this type of play.

My guess is the cabal of exploitdom will just deny everything and say you are crazy.

Most are members of a certain guild anyways, you know a cross faction "dueling" guild led by a guy pretending to be honorable.

So anything that remotely questions their skill will be attacked.

Facts are facts though... and the fact is most of them aren't quite so good and are helped by exploits to achieve anything. They have their excuses... usually in the vein of "how am I supposed to survive these zergs, I want small scale pvp"... which acts an excuse for behavior masquerading as victimdom.

I'll happily point out that most of them exploit something (anything really), but post here like they are saving children.

Oh my, this is pure skill, not cheating. Don't confuse great play with exploiting. That is very unfair and bad. I mean, ZoS would ban true cheaters and they would disappear for at least three consecutive days. Therefore, my first evidence of the absence of cheating is that they clearly login every day!

These are amazing players who are on the list of great players (which couldn't ever include cheaters). I came to this forum to applaud their prowess on the field of battle! We should hold them up, as ZoS does all similar players, as paragons of skill and virtue!

I have more evidence of their great performances using pure skill and not cheating! My second evidentiary offering is that when a couple of them were congratulated on their really, really great performance, there was a brief discussion about an issue talked about on these boards with respect to dodge rate. They did not even know the issue existed! No clue! And they frequent these boards more than I do! My goodness, that is CLEAR proof of the absence of cheating. And I have more evidence! Not only did they not know about this exploit, each of them explained the elements of their great play that have absolutely nothing to do with dodge rate! Wow, they can totally improve their game play with completely unrelated mechanics!!! I am awed and humbled by their abilities! Yet more evidence is the fact that each had exactly the same thing to say, even the one that is to stupid to pronounce all the words being used, let alone spell them! So, I don't know where you get off making these accusations, it's very low class.

I am not aware of whether they currently belong to the guild you reference, but pretty much all of the amazing players were on Trueflame last night.

Smolt wrote: »

A friend and I tested this, and tried quite a few times using different methods to test this. We tried to stack shuffle using the rumored methods and found no bug. He dodged 4 attacks in a row once, and the longest hit steak was 12. This isn't done comprehensive test, but it's allot more than some claiming "some guy dodged 4 attacks in a row he must be cheating". Please, test this and make videos, provide some evidence to your assertions. If not this is merely ranting about someone who you thought you should have killed, not unlike demanding a nerf on whatever you see on your death recap.

I think RNG really could be the case here. Say you flip a coin 50 times and it lands on heads every time. What are the odds of the next flip landing on heads?

That's immaterial. Probability applies not only to the next chance but to sequences. The answer to your question is 50%. However, had you asked what the odds are of landing on heads 51 consecutive flips, the answer would be 1 in 2251799813685248.

Edit: I would post screenshots here but @ZOS_GinaBruno asked us to suppress all evidence and only send it to ZoS.

Immaterial? Please, share the test results that count as material.

So quick to dismiss anything that would contradict your theory lol... At least I actually tried to do some testing. Have you?

I play as, with, and against stamina builds all the time and I have never once encountered what some people claim to encounter regarding shuffle. To be quite honest, it seems like yall simply don't understand how the dodge mechanics function in this game and are raging over the fact that some stamina builds can be very slippery if played right. Seems like a lot of the anti-shuffle commentary is coming from the type of people who are quick to pull the exploit card.

For example

Facts are facts though... and the fact is most of them aren't quite so good and are helped by exploits to achieve anything.

people who think unfounded opinions are facts, or define 'exploit' as whatever they please. Why would anyone take this crowd's input seriously? Like a hypochondriac on Web MD, these people will see what they want to see and then regurgitate their half baked conclusions on the forums.

I actually tested shuffle with a random AD last night, worked as intended down to the decimal with 20% dodge chance.

I'm not denying that an exploit may exist, but it is one that you cannot exploit without actively trying to exploit it. The vast majority of people complaining bout shuffle or calling exploit have never actually encountered the actual exploit (if it exists at all) and are actually just raging about skillfully played stamina builds.

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

SeptimusDova wrote: »

Odin I can handle discussions just fine. You seem to not like the answers you are being given. I detest cheating and exploits. On that page we share. Just remember zenimax's statements do not always match up with what is going on behind the scenes inside the company.

The only definitive proof of it being an exploit is to be able to reproduce the skill and show the steps. And that isn't going to happen. Because well intended actions have unintended consequences. And none of us are famous streamers with a get out of jail free card.

When you resort to profanity you have already lost a merit in a debate/discussion.

So we will not know if it is a real exploit unless someone comes forth with an admission and that is not going to happen. Or it becomes more widespread.

My segue into this discussion was because of post #6

here in it's entirety
"I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video (make it unlisted so only those with a link can see it) and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.
Edited by OdinForge on April 16, 2016 1:14PM "

Poppycock. Circumstantial evidence is definitive and frequently used to send people to lethal injection. Of course, this case is different because the dodge rate apparently cannot be reproduced by anyone, including ZoS, and the whole mess is just a L2P issue.

Tonight I spammed crippling grasp repeatedly on every amazing player out there. My strategy was to observe and see what drove their recent rise to greatness. I wanted to know what unbelievable rotation or combination they had come up with to flip the tables so resoundingly. I turned on a few addons to help in my quest to L2P.

With respect to one person (for his anonymity let's call him Maiq II) I was astounded in every way by his skill! His group mates, a mer or two bearing jewels, were not nearly as skilled as Maiq II. I am sure, however, that they were grateful he could carry them to victory as they attended him throughout the evening.

In my favorite encounter tonight with Maiq II, I was only able to hit him once in over 20 casts, with a best run of 15 consecutive misses in 20sec!!! I observed his amazing play closely and the conclusion I have reached is that he probably pulled it off with well placed dodge rolls. All two of them!!! Maiq II was so skilled that he dispatched both my group mates, one of which was our main assist, who registered an identical inability to hit this amazingly skilled player!

Just so we are clear, if each dodge change is independent, the odds of 15 consecutive dodges at 20% is 30,517,578,125, which is 100x the odds of winning Powerball (1 in 292,000,000). Keeping that dodge rate against three players? Wow, just wow!

@ZOS_GinaBruno, I read your post describing how your team has found no issues with shuffle. I am quite relieved that your team has as much amazing skill as Maiq II and we can all look elsewhere for the problem. Perhaps the time stamped screenshots of my logs, which I submitted in-game, might help you to reward these players in some way, for example, by making sure they don't miss a minute of game time. I am pretty that is the ZoS way of rewarding this type of play.

My guess is the cabal of exploitdom will just deny everything and say you are crazy.

Most are members of a certain guild anyways, you know a cross faction "dueling" guild led by a guy pretending to be honorable.

So anything that remotely questions their skill will be attacked.

Facts are facts though... and the fact is most of them aren't quite so good and are helped by exploits to achieve anything. They have their excuses... usually in the vein of "how am I supposed to survive these zergs, I want small scale pvp"... which acts an excuse for behavior masquerading as victimdom.

I'll happily point out that most of them exploit something (anything really), but post here like they are saving children.

Oh my, this is pure skill, not cheating. Don't confuse great play with exploiting. That is very unfair and bad. I mean, ZoS would ban true cheaters and they would disappear for at least three consecutive days. Therefore, my first evidence of the absence of cheating is that they clearly login every day!

These are amazing players who are on the list of great players (which couldn't ever include cheaters). I came to this forum to applaud their prowess on the field of battle! We should hold them up, as ZoS does all similar players, as paragons of skill and virtue!

I have more evidence of their great performances using pure skill and not cheating! My second evidentiary offering is that when a couple of them were congratulated on their really, really great performance, there was a brief discussion about an issue talked about on these boards with respect to dodge rate. They did not even know the issue existed! No clue! And they frequent these boards more than I do! My goodness, that is CLEAR proof of the absence of cheating. And I have more evidence! Not only did they not know about this exploit, each of them explained the elements of their great play that have absolutely nothing to do with dodge rate! Wow, they can totally improve their game play with completely unrelated mechanics!!! I am awed and humbled by their abilities! Yet more evidence is the fact that each had exactly the same thing to say, even the one that is to stupid to pronounce all the words being used, let alone spell them! So, I don't know where you get off making these accusations, it's very low class.

I am not aware of whether they currently belong to the guild you reference, but pretty much all of the amazing players were on Trueflame last night.

I like the tone of this.

It must be true, that by inaction a select few are so powerfully skilled that they can distort reality. Truly their greatness circumvents even the laws of probability, so much so that their sheer presence in front of a computer monitor with a Razer keyboard and Razer naga bends time and space and makes the impossible possible.

Or maybe they hit their keys really hard and that reverberation of courage and skill translates electrically though the internet and forces fantasy to meet the reality of the superiority of skilled.

I saw a guy, nay a deity in human form, a true member of the skilled elite, last night at a keep. He was in his bags, so I figured... cheap kill is still AP and attacked this towering figure of gaming. Not even paying attention he dodged, then he dodged again... then when I hit him finally his amazing skill led to a rapid regeneration of his health bar as he randomly and while not even glancing at me (or his monitor) did nothing. After a number of attacks on this defenseless being of true skill... I figured, wow he's dodging most attacks and those he doesn't he regenerates his health nearly faster than I can damage him... if he comes back to the mortal world from where his obviously skilled beyond belief conscious currently is... I will probably not last very long.

My favorite part of it was I said something to my fellows, wow that guy with the ALL CAPS name sure is tough... "he's a beast" they said... and I took a screenshot or two to document how truly awesome a player that could create a suppression field of taking damage so powerful that it extended to while he was checking his map. Oh, he's a beast all right.

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

Smolt wrote: »

Immaterial? Please, share the test results that count as material.

So quick to dismiss anything that would contradict your theory lol... At least I actually tried to do some testing. Have you?

Nobody cares what the chance to dodge the next attack is. Dodge happens. What people want to know is the odds of dodging X attacks in a row, or x attacks out of Y attacks when the chance to dodge is 20% each attack. You didn't ask that.

If your chances are on the order of 1 in a billion, like it is here, there is a problem. That's way, way harder than winning the lottery. Then they do it all night long? The odds start to approach 1 in infinity.

Essentially, your question is not connected to the sentence before it. You may have wanted to ask for the odds of getting heads 51 times in a row, but that is not what you asked. You asked, "What are the odds of the next flip landing on heads?"

So... I take it you have done some testing then? Will you are least before dismissing out of hand anything that goes against your theory? I haven't encountered this phenomena once against anyone I've fought. Dying to see your numbers, the ones that count.

BTW your logic will serve you well in a casino. Go win big, you just have to get onto a machine that hasn't paid out all night. After all, it's not about the odds of the next spin but rather the odds of losing 100 times in a row right? You're sure to hit the big one.

Just to be clear, I tested because I thought the bug might exist. I am still open to this possibility, however I've seen no convincing evidence at all. So far I've only seen vague anecdotes and typical forum shouting. Seriously, it you have evidence, please let's have it because I'd really like to know.

Lucius_Aelius wrote: »

Chori wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

I don't personally think there is a bug, I never did. But too many people are just tossing out accusations and not giving enough proof, if you think the bug is real make a detailed video (make it unlisted so only those with a link can see it) and PM me the way to locate it on YouTube.

Then why dont you make a video proving its not bugged? lol. Go out and play with it, as a stamina nightblade the dodge chance its outrageous and most of the time I'm asking myself how the hell I got alive out of some situations. There is definitely something wrong with shuffle if you can dodge more than 80% of the attacks and not just "a RNG of 20% for each attack".

It doesn't work that way, if you claim it's bugged then the burden of proof is on you, not on the people who ask you to prove your assertion, seriously that's just stupid and makes absolutely no sense to suggest.

More importantly, it's practically impossible to prove a negative. Only takes one instance to prove a positive.

AddictionX wrote: »

keep it under the radar they say so the select few can abuse said bug for longer is the way i look at it. Mostly due to the fact that they can get away with it. Nothing will happen to them. Thats how most of these bug survive .... patch after patch after patch.

Until threads like this are made and its all he said she said. Then counter this by saying "ZoS says they're working on fix" when lets be real and cut the crap before it comes out...

You know they're not getting the full information on said bug because as a community there would be a crack down on said people.... They're giving out just enough so it can get back under the radar again and those can do it another way- the not so common knowledge way so people could stop abusing one way but not the other.

An example of this happening is the mundus stone exploit- Yes it got fix with the knowledge provided that became common knowledge after it was made public but guess what it was only "partly" fixed so that those select few could continue to abuse said bug even after it got fixed one way but not the other and feed into peoples false belief that it was 100 percent fixed.

Thats the problem with the system in place, its so easy to manipulate and exploit it and choose what information goes out and what information you choose to keep hidden.

If there is one way to produce this bug then there must be another way to it as well.

Since it's been brought up... Is the bug still active where I can maintain a mundus boost even after I take off the divines equipment?

I know there's the multiple mundus thing, but I don't want to get into that.

Thanks.

No idea what shuffle stacking is so how bout some truffle shuffle?

QuebraRegra wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

So if ZOs fixes the shuffle stacking can they fix the shield stacking problem too then ? No ? Then leave shuffle how it is divines know stamina users need all the help they can get.

Stacking dodge chance is a bug. Stacking shields is not. Though I'm not denying that it is stupid.

and animation canceling is intentional in a system where delays to cast is part of the balance mechanism which can be ignored.

STUPID.. with assertions of working as intended.

If you are implying abilities with a cast time can be animation cancelled to ignore the cast time, you don't understand animation cancelling enough to comment on it. You cannot animation cancel wrecking blow or snipe to be instant abilities, for example. Too many people think they understand animation cancelling just off the name when they don't really know anything. Cancelling doesn't let you ignore or negate an animation sequence, the name isn't entirely accurate. It's more like cancelling removes the 'fluff' in between casts to make abilities hit as soon as they possibly can within the established cast time of the skill.