Do You Think "DARK BROTHERHOOD" is Last Chance of ZOS

Anzriel · April 2016

Lysette wrote: »

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

FatKidHatchets wrote: »

The content from DLC's is weak writing at best. The bugs are abundant. The playerbase on PvP becomes dumber everyday. Folks could care less about winning a campaign long as they get to fight for 6 ours straight.

The playerbase is shrinking and fast, think of all the campaigns closed due to inactivity. The DLC is do or die, it will make or break the elder scrolls name for me. As in, never play another elder scrolls again.

Just urks me, I have never wanted my money back on any game but Thieves guild is completely crap.

If everyone left PvP, I don't think it would kill ESO. It would be a shame, but I don't see how it would kill the game.

It would kill ESO!!!!
For this game was best known for its PvP( you see the intro, right? the three alliance war.)

You underestimate the amount of people, who never engage in PvP at all. They would not even recognize that pvp is gone and those are the majority. What would happen is, we would request to make Cyrrodil into a PvE zone and add some more detail to it and make it pretty - and that's it. this has nothing to do with that we would not like the war, but when all warriors have left, the war is over.

Unfortunately this is true. I think the game would be hurt more than Lysette thinks if the pvp community died, but it would survive. Quite a large part of the pvp community has honestly already seemingly left and I wouldn't be shocked if they did, at some point, add a pve-only or pve toggle Cyrodiil. Also the game isn't really known for it's pvp anymore, and hasn't been for a while. Cyrodiil has been a mess for a year and it's pretty well known just how borked it really is.

Mojmir · April 2016

Anzriel wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

FatKidHatchets wrote: »

The content from DLC's is weak writing at best. The bugs are abundant. The playerbase on PvP becomes dumber everyday. Folks could care less about winning a campaign long as they get to fight for 6 ours straight.

The playerbase is shrinking and fast, think of all the campaigns closed due to inactivity. The DLC is do or die, it will make or break the elder scrolls name for me. As in, never play another elder scrolls again.

Just urks me, I have never wanted my money back on any game but Thieves guild is completely crap.

If everyone left PvP, I don't think it would kill ESO. It would be a shame, but I don't see how it would kill the game.

It would kill ESO!!!!
For this game was best known for its PvP( you see the intro, right? the three alliance war.)

You underestimate the amount of people, who never engage in PvP at all. They would not even recognize that pvp is gone and those are the majority. What would happen is, we would request to make Cyrrodil into a PvE zone and add some more detail to it and make it pretty - and that's it. this has nothing to do with that we would not like the war, but when all warriors have left, the war is over.

Unfortunately this is true. I think the game would be hurt more than Lysette thinks if the pvp community died, but it would survive. Quite a large part of the pvp community has honestly already seemingly left and I wouldn't be shocked if they did, at some point, add a pve-only or pve toggle Cyrodiil. Also the game isn't really known for it's pvp anymore, and hasn't been for a while. Cyrodiil has been a mess for a year and it's pretty well known just how borked it really is.

History will repeat itself, UO pvp died to cause of neglect.now all we need is cyrodiil environment to appear barren like felluca

Trikfut · April 2016

I really love this game even though i've only been on it a short while and can see that the ps4 community is growing each day. I don't think it will die anytime soon but I can say there is one thing I hope will improve in thw future specially on console. The solo gameplay is great, but as someone mentioned before for an online game it is lacking in the party play area. Specially PvE and on console I contribute this highly to the fact that there isn't any form of open area text chat. People don't really get to socialize with others from the moment game starts. So, if you're like me and know no one that plays the game on ps4 then you kinda just feel like you're in another elder scrolls game and not in an actual online game. Yea there is people rushing around that ain't npc's but it still doesn't give the full online effect until.mucch later in the game. If anything this is what will kill the console version for a lot of people.

Justice31st · April 2016

I decided to go free to play when Thieves Guild dropped and it was the best decision I ever made in this game so far. I will only resubscribe when they fix the PvP lag, release crafting bags, and remove veteran ranks.

Lysette · April 2016

LelaBenet wrote: »

I really love this game even though i've only been on it a short while and can see that the ps4 community is growing each day. I don't think it will die anytime soon but I can say there is one thing I hope will improve in thw future specially on console. The solo gameplay is great, but as someone mentioned before for an online game it is lacking in the party play area. Specially PvE and on console I contribute this highly to the fact that there isn't any form of open area text chat. People don't really get to socialize with others from the moment game starts. So, if you're like me and know no one that plays the game on ps4 then you kinda just feel like you're in another elder scrolls game and not in an actual online game. Yea there is people rushing around that ain't npc's but it still doesn't give the full online effect until.mucch later in the game. If anything this is what will kill the console version for a lot of people.

Just talk to people and get them known - I am as well not that long in ESO, but I have already a couple of friends, where we as well communicate outside of the game with each other and talk about all kind of things or show each other pictures of where we live and what we do in our spare time and stuff like this. It does not have to be limited to the game. But you have to make a start and not wait until others approach you - they might not do that and then you are left alone.

Vaoh · April 2016

Eshelmen wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

I think financially they're doing pretty well (though I don't really know that, it's just based on my impressions in the game).
What worries me a bit is that there is currently very little content announced for the future. Dark Brotherhood has been announced as the next big update and DLC (Update 10). We know there will be crafting bags and that veteran ranks will be removed. From what I gathered it's not certain that the barber shop will be released at the same time. And that's pretty much all the concrete info I have about future updates of ESO (please tell me if I missed something). I assume Murkmire or Clockwork City will come after Dark Brotherhood, and at some point housing or arenas (but no sneak peek on any of those things) so not certain if or when those things will be released. I hope they post some more info about the Dark Brotherhood update soonish.

Edit: Speaking about the gameplay/game design perspective, I still think the game's main flaw is that it's mostly a single-player game with lots of one-time completion content, still too little repeatable stuff and meaningful reward systems for endgame (bind on pickup item rewards systems have too much randomization, players have too little control over what they get [Veteran Maelstrom Arena, Undaunted Shoulders, Wrothgar Dailies], there's not enough rare item rewards that are tradable; there's no near infinite time sink gear-wise in ESO [for example a system that adds random attributes to an item which you can reroll if you spend certain rare materials, or an over-enchant system]). There's no item reward mechanic that keeps someone who's reached Champion Rank 501 (and many long-time players on PC have reached it by now) and who has the gear they want playing. Having a few new motifs to grind out in every new DLC is not enough to keep every long-term player interested in the game.
The 2nd major flaw (that I consider to be a flaw but I know that some players like that about ESO) is that there's very little need to work together with other players in almost any area of the game. No mechanic that incentivizes joining a guild and working together on a common goal (there could be levels/ranks/or leaderboards for guilds, or at least an ingame guild database that shows how active a guild is in different areas of the game; there could also be special guild quests, guild passive skills, active skills that work only on guild members, etc.). There are also no dedicated crafting or material gathering classes in ESO, everyone can be a master of all professions and almost all skill lines at the same time. World boss quests in Wrothgar are pretty much the only non-instanced PvE content where you see random players do something together in PvE (because the game incentivizes it here: most players aren't strong enough to solo these bosses, you can only do all 6 quests if someone else shares them with you, you have a better chance to get loot from the boss, and you can finish the quest faster while in a group).

You do realize this game has a majority of solo players, right? You also know that there are some people still playing Skyrim today, repeating it over and over and over with new characters. You seem to approach this game as if it is a 'traditional' MMO, when Matt Firor came straight out and said that it is NOT a traditional MMO

I'm still not seeing how this game isn't an MMO. In fact this game is nothing but an MMO.
The only reason Zeni denies this game is actually an MMO, is for obvious marketing purposes. More people cringe/oppose the idea of playing an MMO, versus those who actually do enjoy playing one.
It's just propaganda.
Calling it an Online RPG just makes it easier for new players to be pulled in.

Zeni can try and sugar coat it all they want, but calling it an RPG and not an MMORPG, is moronic.

You realize ESO isn't the only MMO that offers a ton of solo content, right? Nearly any MMOs main story quests can be completed solo.

*An online open world full of players? Check
*An open world with an abundance of MMO cliche level based zones? Check
*Fetch quests galore? Check
*Shared quest locations? Check
*Public activities with in the open worldfor players to freely partake in? Check
*Hundreds and hundreds of hour long grinds with many different(yet same as all players) angles of playstyles available? Check
*Everyone is playing the same story? Check
*Players have zero impact on the world compared to a protagonist in actual SP RPGs like TW3, DA, TES, etc.. have? Check
*Open World PVP with essentially hundreds of players? Check
*Guilds? Check
*In game communication tools(Mail, chat, voice)? Check
*A shared in game buy/sell/trade economy with all players? Check

So many variables in this game that scream MMORPG all over it. Zeni covering up what their game actually is, which is an MMO, is an insult to us all. It's quite funny too.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the game. But I will never just label this game as an RPG. It's clearly an MMO.
And what's this "Not a traditional MMO" talk?

That's like saying Tesla vehicles aren't actually cars. Huh?
"They're revolutionary!"
"They don't run on gas!"
But it's still a car and it holds the same purpose as my Honda Pilot.

This is no different with ESO and its competitors. Each of them have a lot of differences, but their core is still the same. Online only, Main story,side activities, open world, shared experiences, fetch quests, open world, endless of things to do, etc.... same crap with a different title.

TG added new things to this game and I'm all for it, as I love having new things to do in this game. All I know is this, when DB comes out and the few months afterwards, this game is going to change drastically. And I am all for it.

GameCentral interviewed Matt Firor:
GC: "How do you feel The Elder Scrolls Online has performed since launch and what are you most pleased with? What do you think were the biggest mistakes at launch and what do you think ESO offers that other MMOs do not?"

MF: "....To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. ...."

Just saying

Pangnirtung · April 2016

Alcast wrote: »

What makes you think Thieves Guild is not successful?

After doing the quests there, there is no reason to return.

The loot from daily quests is useful only for deconstructing and selling.

Unlike Wrothgar where at least I can get in six world bosses and a daily and get reasonable experience, Thieves Guild has nothing to offer me once the quests are done. There simply is no reason to return.

hoaxburnrwb17_ESO · April 2016

Ra'Shtar wrote: »

To be completely honest its the last chance many people are giving this game, they need to improve performance when DB comes or they are are seriously going to loose a lot of pvp players, there is also the issue of the hundreds of bugs this game has some of them from launch like the mailing one.

EDIT: It also does not help that if it ends being bad the gaming websites out there are not going to be kind with ESO because they have never been, bad reviews ruined the rep of this game and can do it again.

Lmao they can loose those 2 year old pvp'ers and gain a couple thousands of returning players like me

Mojmir · April 2016

Pangnirtung wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

What makes you think Thieves Guild is not successful?

After doing the quests there, there is no reason to return.

The loot from daily quests is useful only for deconstructing and selling.

Unlike Wrothgar where at least I can get in six world bosses and a daily and get reasonable experience, Thieves Guild has nothing to offer me once the quests are done. There simply is no reason to return.

i find the drops in hews bane to be better than wrothgar. that curse armor is underrated

Eshelmen · April 2016

Doncellius wrote: »

Eshelmen wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

I think financially they're doing pretty well (though I don't really know that, it's just based on my impressions in the game).
What worries me a bit is that there is currently very little content announced for the future. Dark Brotherhood has been announced as the next big update and DLC (Update 10). We know there will be crafting bags and that veteran ranks will be removed. From what I gathered it's not certain that the barber shop will be released at the same time. And that's pretty much all the concrete info I have about future updates of ESO (please tell me if I missed something). I assume Murkmire or Clockwork City will come after Dark Brotherhood, and at some point housing or arenas (but no sneak peek on any of those things) so not certain if or when those things will be released. I hope they post some more info about the Dark Brotherhood update soonish.

Edit: Speaking about the gameplay/game design perspective, I still think the game's main flaw is that it's mostly a single-player game with lots of one-time completion content, still too little repeatable stuff and meaningful reward systems for endgame (bind on pickup item rewards systems have too much randomization, players have too little control over what they get [Veteran Maelstrom Arena, Undaunted Shoulders, Wrothgar Dailies], there's not enough rare item rewards that are tradable; there's no near infinite time sink gear-wise in ESO [for example a system that adds random attributes to an item which you can reroll if you spend certain rare materials, or an over-enchant system]). There's no item reward mechanic that keeps someone who's reached Champion Rank 501 (and many long-time players on PC have reached it by now) and who has the gear they want playing. Having a few new motifs to grind out in every new DLC is not enough to keep every long-term player interested in the game.
The 2nd major flaw (that I consider to be a flaw but I know that some players like that about ESO) is that there's very little need to work together with other players in almost any area of the game. No mechanic that incentivizes joining a guild and working together on a common goal (there could be levels/ranks/or leaderboards for guilds, or at least an ingame guild database that shows how active a guild is in different areas of the game; there could also be special guild quests, guild passive skills, active skills that work only on guild members, etc.). There are also no dedicated crafting or material gathering classes in ESO, everyone can be a master of all professions and almost all skill lines at the same time. World boss quests in Wrothgar are pretty much the only non-instanced PvE content where you see random players do something together in PvE (because the game incentivizes it here: most players aren't strong enough to solo these bosses, you can only do all 6 quests if someone else shares them with you, you have a better chance to get loot from the boss, and you can finish the quest faster while in a group).

You do realize this game has a majority of solo players, right? You also know that there are some people still playing Skyrim today, repeating it over and over and over with new characters. You seem to approach this game as if it is a 'traditional' MMO, when Matt Firor came straight out and said that it is NOT a traditional MMO

I'm still not seeing how this game isn't an MMO. In fact this game is nothing but an MMO.
The only reason Zeni denies this game is actually an MMO, is for obvious marketing purposes. More people cringe/oppose the idea of playing an MMO, versus those who actually do enjoy playing one.
It's just propaganda.
Calling it an Online RPG just makes it easier for new players to be pulled in.

Zeni can try and sugar coat it all they want, but calling it an RPG and not an MMORPG, is moronic.

You realize ESO isn't the only MMO that offers a ton of solo content, right? Nearly any MMOs main story quests can be completed solo.

*An online open world full of players? Check
*An open world with an abundance of MMO cliche level based zones? Check
*Fetch quests galore? Check
*Shared quest locations? Check
*Public activities with in the open worldfor players to freely partake in? Check
*Hundreds and hundreds of hour long grinds with many different(yet same as all players) angles of playstyles available? Check
*Everyone is playing the same story? Check
*Players have zero impact on the world compared to a protagonist in actual SP RPGs like TW3, DA, TES, etc.. have? Check
*Open World PVP with essentially hundreds of players? Check
*Guilds? Check
*In game communication tools(Mail, chat, voice)? Check
*A shared in game buy/sell/trade economy with all players? Check

So many variables in this game that scream MMORPG all over it. Zeni covering up what their game actually is, which is an MMO, is an insult to us all. It's quite funny too.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the game. But I will never just label this game as an RPG. It's clearly an MMO.
And what's this "Not a traditional MMO" talk?

That's like saying Tesla vehicles aren't actually cars. Huh?
"They're revolutionary!"
"They don't run on gas!"
But it's still a car and it holds the same purpose as my Honda Pilot.

This is no different with ESO and its competitors. Each of them have a lot of differences, but their core is still the same. Online only, Main story,side activities, open world, shared experiences, fetch quests, open world, endless of things to do, etc.... same crap with a different title.

TG added new things to this game and I'm all for it, as I love having new things to do in this game. All I know is this, when DB comes out and the few months afterwards, this game is going to change drastically. And I am all for it.

GameCentral interviewed Matt Firor:
GC: "How do you feel The Elder Scrolls Online has performed since launch and what are you most pleased with? What do you think were the biggest mistakes at launch and what do you think ESO offers that other MMOs do not?"

MF: "....To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. ...."

Just saying

Nobody including a developer says "Oh we're releasing a traditional MMO" anyways.
So I'm not really sure what you're saying here. He called it an "Online RPG" in that same interview and blatantly refuses to call it what it really is.
It's not really a big deal. I'm just clarifying Zenis reason to not call ESO a standard MMO.
It's propaganda at best.

STEVIL · April 2016

Mojmir wrote: »

i find the drops in hews bane to be better than wrothgar. that curse armor is underrated

I agree about the curse armor, however, they seem to only drop during the main quest lines? maybe they drop from the heists if you beat the clock sometimes.

I like that set as well. Better than Trinimac valor, better than pariah and on par with briars in orsinium IMO from my playstyles.

As for the OP: I think Db is simply the NEXT CHANCE for ZOS to deliver the next installment in the enjoyable products they have been delivering.

Since I, like others, dont care about playing PVP the vast majority of my in game experience is nothing like the majority of the spamming ranters here in the general forum who dont find dedicated PVP forums sufficient to vent their emotions.

me, I am looking forward to Db and have no reason to doubt it will be less than fun and mayhem.

Scheneighnay · April 2016

It's buy-to-play; if I don't like a DLC, I'm not going to buy that DLC.

If a DLC is trash, just don't buy it. If everyone keeps up with that, and ZOS doesn't put out anything worthwhile to make up for it, they're finished.

It's not as simple as "this DLC is bad, so we'll all leave the game" it's "this DLC is bad, so ZOS lost money on it"

Tryxus · April 2016

tbh...

I do and I don't look forward to DB update.

I always enjoyed the new content from the DLC: IC, Wrothgar and TG were each amazing in their own ways. But with the TG update, a lot of bugs got introduced on top of the old ones that still needed fixing.

And just in case you forgot: with the DB update comes the removal of Vet Ranks, which is a massive update if you think about it since it requires a lot of changes under the hood.

As usual in MMOs: with new updates come new bugs. But in this case I fear that if ZOS rushed it like they did with TG, the result could actually be a broken game

bowmanz607 · April 2016

Yes. It has always been my deadline for this game. Imo, an a tes game is not complete until all guilds are in the game. I have always considered this game in beta until they were all in. This is why I have put up withuch of the nonsense. Dark brotherhood is there last shot for me.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

DB is going to be about the size of TG. So if you are expecting some massive area or any form of pvp involved you are going to be disappointed.

bowmanz607 · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

DB is going to be about the size of TG. So if you are expecting some massive area or any form of pvp involved you are going to be disappointed.

Wrobel and the crew are working on skills for this update. With a balanced champ tree now, hopefully they get the skills back to some semblance of balance. This will go a long way for me personally.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

bowmanz607 wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

DB is going to be about the size of TG. So if you are expecting some massive area or any form of pvp involved you are going to be disappointed.

Wrobel and the crew are working on skills for this update. With a balanced champ tree now, hopefully they get the skills back to some semblance of balance. This will go a long way for me personally.

Thats not part of the dark brotherhood expansion tho. Thats base game stuff everyone gets.

GreenSoup2HoT · April 2016

TheHsN wrote: »

I think if the Dark Brotherhood DLC is unsuccessful, Zos will lose many players...and i believe this new DLC will make or break the future player base. The Thieves Guild DLC in my opinion was a failure. Do you think the next DLC will be your breaking point if unsuccessful? Thank you.

Revised because poorly written.

There is a couple things i would like to touch on that kinda pushed me the wrong way. Your initial argument is that the Thieves Guild DLC was unsuccessful. I disagree.

-We got a new trial.
-Monster Helm vendor. Great for pvp only players.
-Changes to AP required for Alliance war skills. Great for pve players.

TG DLC did accomplish what i expected. A zone all about stealing. The quests were fun, getting master thief title was fun (for the ones who actually looked for the items, no guides). I have done 5 of the heists and they were gimmicky but were in the end fun. Overall the DLC did satisfy that Thieves Guild atmosphere.

Cryodill balance was tweaked, we got some broken things and fixed things. Overall Cryodill is still laggy and cheese. I don't personally run a Viscous Death build but i'm fine with people who do. However i am not fine with the lag. This is not something that 1 dlc will fix.

OP in my eyes is leading his argument towards PVP in cryodill. Thieves Guild DLC, a PVE DLC has failed to fix the issues of PVP. So yes, this DLC was a failure to fix Cryodill... it was never released to do so. Will Dark Brotherhood be the breaking point if pvp is not addressed? Well i have endured long enough to not leave so far. I have taken weekly/monthly breaks but I still love this game and the community behind it.

I will stay. I do however hope Cryodill does get some big attention next dlc.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

If by unsuccessful you mean sold 100s of 1000s of copies and brought 1000s into the game then ya I suppose. I dont know that ZOS sees that as unsuccessful tho.

DaveMoeDee · April 2016

swirve wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

swirve wrote: »

It depends.

I feel performance is the key, not content.

If they make things worse with bugs and lag then yes this will excaberate things and if coupled with other games could create an issue.

I dont see a destiny style issue as much, as the content is > x10 that of Destiny. If ESO performance was great then 99% players would always have useful content to run unlike Destiny which has tanked massively with the likes of The Division.

I feel ff14 has better content and performance delivery than ESO on the PS4.

And I feel performance is insignificant and it is all about content. Different players get different things out of the game.

Destiny, FF14, and The Division are irrelevant from my perspective since other online games aren't competition for my attention. Games like FO4, The Witcher 3, and Dark Souls are the games I have been neglecting due to all the time I spend in ESO.

Good for you. So when did you beat v16 maw? Do you have all achievements so on and so forth.

I can tell you i beat all destiny content very quickly i still have a ton to do on ESO.

If DB just gave us a new trial that would be great content.

Also the games youve not played are irrelevant to me and most others, if you feel you are missing out by not playing those, guess what go play...jeez

I think you missed the point. There are plenty of players like me that want more DLC. Chasing achievements like fishing is not much of a game for me. We enjoy new content, which DB would provide. The game performance is fine for what I do, so I disagree about focusing on performance and not releasing content.

People like to compare ESO to MMOs, which feels irrelevant to me and many other players who don't care about other MMOs but loyally play ESO because we enjoy it. The amount of content in Destiny is not a barometer for acceptable amounts of content for ESO. Destiny is a very different kind of game.

As I said, "different players get different things out of the game". I'm not sure why that bothers you. You can't force everyone to think of the game the way you do. I'll leave it to ZOS to figure out how large those market segments are. If ZOS decides to focus on PvP performance and shelves DLC, you won't see me complaining here. I can accept it if that is what they feel they need to do for business reasons. But personally, I prefer the quarterly DLC model that they are already doing. I see no reason to change that.

DaveMoeDee · April 2016

Pangnirtung wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

What makes you think Thieves Guild is not successful?

After doing the quests there, there is no reason to return.

The loot from daily quests is useful only for deconstructing and selling.

Unlike Wrothgar where at least I can get in six world bosses and a daily and get reasonable experience, Thieves Guild has nothing to offer me once the quests are done. There simply is no reason to return.

I don't really want to keep returning to the same content. Give me more new content.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

It takes months and months to create content you guys burn through in a day. So expecting them to be able to push out content that fast is nuts. Im shocked they are sticking to this every 3 months deal. They must have a lot already done on future updates. Three months is usually the time it takes to polish and test new stuff.

Florial · April 2016

I think that expectations are very high for Dark Brotherhood so if this is executed poorly, I believe it will definitely have a negative impact.

I'm a pretty flexible player who is currently straddling two games right now--ESO and BDO. Both games certainly have their positives and negatives. Not playing BDO right now because I'm getting disconnected every few minutes. Haven't had this problem much in ESO so switched over to ESO for my play session today.

I've enjoyed the DLC updates quite a bit. I'm a slow poke player in any MMO so I haven't even tackled the TG stuff yet aside from the opening quests. Very much looking forward to Dark Brotherhood.

bowmanz607 · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

DB is going to be about the size of TG. So if you are expecting some massive area or any form of pvp involved you are going to be disappointed.

Wrobel and the crew are working on skills for this update. With a balanced champ tree now, hopefully they get the skills back to some semblance of balance. This will go a long way for me personally.

Thats not part of the dark brotherhood expansion tho. Thats base game stuff everyone gets.

It is part of the dark brotherhood update. The op is unclear on whether he is simply talking about the content or the update. I took it as the uplate as a whole.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

Answer to not being disappointed is do not over hype it. The DLC will be similar is size and scope to thieves guild. I dont know what exactly people think they will get with this. Just dont get your hopes up too high and expect more than you should.

Resipsa131 · April 2016

I'll be playing until Mass Effect Andromeda comes out in 2017

nimander99 · April 2016

Who said TG was a failure? Just wondering cause I never saw that...

Vaoh · April 2016

Eshelmen wrote: »

Doncellius wrote: »

Eshelmen wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

I think financially they're doing pretty well (though I don't really know that, it's just based on my impressions in the game).
What worries me a bit is that there is currently very little content announced for the future. Dark Brotherhood has been announced as the next big update and DLC (Update 10). We know there will be crafting bags and that veteran ranks will be removed. From what I gathered it's not certain that the barber shop will be released at the same time. And that's pretty much all the concrete info I have about future updates of ESO (please tell me if I missed something). I assume Murkmire or Clockwork City will come after Dark Brotherhood, and at some point housing or arenas (but no sneak peek on any of those things) so not certain if or when those things will be released. I hope they post some more info about the Dark Brotherhood update soonish.

Edit: Speaking about the gameplay/game design perspective, I still think the game's main flaw is that it's mostly a single-player game with lots of one-time completion content, still too little repeatable stuff and meaningful reward systems for endgame (bind on pickup item rewards systems have too much randomization, players have too little control over what they get [Veteran Maelstrom Arena, Undaunted Shoulders, Wrothgar Dailies], there's not enough rare item rewards that are tradable; there's no near infinite time sink gear-wise in ESO [for example a system that adds random attributes to an item which you can reroll if you spend certain rare materials, or an over-enchant system]). There's no item reward mechanic that keeps someone who's reached Champion Rank 501 (and many long-time players on PC have reached it by now) and who has the gear they want playing. Having a few new motifs to grind out in every new DLC is not enough to keep every long-term player interested in the game.
The 2nd major flaw (that I consider to be a flaw but I know that some players like that about ESO) is that there's very little need to work together with other players in almost any area of the game. No mechanic that incentivizes joining a guild and working together on a common goal (there could be levels/ranks/or leaderboards for guilds, or at least an ingame guild database that shows how active a guild is in different areas of the game; there could also be special guild quests, guild passive skills, active skills that work only on guild members, etc.). There are also no dedicated crafting or material gathering classes in ESO, everyone can be a master of all professions and almost all skill lines at the same time. World boss quests in Wrothgar are pretty much the only non-instanced PvE content where you see random players do something together in PvE (because the game incentivizes it here: most players aren't strong enough to solo these bosses, you can only do all 6 quests if someone else shares them with you, you have a better chance to get loot from the boss, and you can finish the quest faster while in a group).

You do realize this game has a majority of solo players, right? You also know that there are some people still playing Skyrim today, repeating it over and over and over with new characters. You seem to approach this game as if it is a 'traditional' MMO, when Matt Firor came straight out and said that it is NOT a traditional MMO

I'm still not seeing how this game isn't an MMO. In fact this game is nothing but an MMO.
The only reason Zeni denies this game is actually an MMO, is for obvious marketing purposes. More people cringe/oppose the idea of playing an MMO, versus those who actually do enjoy playing one.
It's just propaganda.
Calling it an Online RPG just makes it easier for new players to be pulled in.

Zeni can try and sugar coat it all they want, but calling it an RPG and not an MMORPG, is moronic.

You realize ESO isn't the only MMO that offers a ton of solo content, right? Nearly any MMOs main story quests can be completed solo.

*An online open world full of players? Check
*An open world with an abundance of MMO cliche level based zones? Check
*Fetch quests galore? Check
*Shared quest locations? Check
*Public activities with in the open worldfor players to freely partake in? Check
*Hundreds and hundreds of hour long grinds with many different(yet same as all players) angles of playstyles available? Check
*Everyone is playing the same story? Check
*Players have zero impact on the world compared to a protagonist in actual SP RPGs like TW3, DA, TES, etc.. have? Check
*Open World PVP with essentially hundreds of players? Check
*Guilds? Check
*In game communication tools(Mail, chat, voice)? Check
*A shared in game buy/sell/trade economy with all players? Check

So many variables in this game that scream MMORPG all over it. Zeni covering up what their game actually is, which is an MMO, is an insult to us all. It's quite funny too.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the game. But I will never just label this game as an RPG. It's clearly an MMO.
And what's this "Not a traditional MMO" talk?

That's like saying Tesla vehicles aren't actually cars. Huh?
"They're revolutionary!"
"They don't run on gas!"
But it's still a car and it holds the same purpose as my Honda Pilot.

This is no different with ESO and its competitors. Each of them have a lot of differences, but their core is still the same. Online only, Main story,side activities, open world, shared experiences, fetch quests, open world, endless of things to do, etc.... same crap with a different title.

TG added new things to this game and I'm all for it, as I love having new things to do in this game. All I know is this, when DB comes out and the few months afterwards, this game is going to change drastically. And I am all for it.

GameCentral interviewed Matt Firor:
GC: "How do you feel The Elder Scrolls Online has performed since launch and what are you most pleased with? What do you think were the biggest mistakes at launch and what do you think ESO offers that other MMOs do not?"

MF: "....To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. ...."

Just saying

Nobody including a developer says "Oh we're releasing a traditional MMO" anyways.
So I'm not really sure what you're saying here. He called it an "Online RPG" in that same interview and blatantly refuses to call it what it really is.
It's not really a big deal. I'm just clarifying Zenis reason to not call ESO a standard MMO.
It's propaganda at best.

I'm not saying a whole lot in my post. Simply linking you the exact words of the Dev. Even included a smiley face....

Were all playing ESO and understand the issues. PvP is getting as close to being gutted as it can possibly get.

However, Dark Brotherhood is bound to be a success because they're removing Veteran Ranks, the terrible grind. It's a PvE success already. That propaganda brings the PvE and Elder Scrolls fans back since they clearly don't care about PvP in the slightest.

I play PvE and PvP equally. If I only played PvP I would have found another game, despite the Elder Scrolls franchise being my favorite. Props to the long-time PvP players still here!

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Tyrac wrote: »

What isnt helping are the people who claim everything is fine and we should stop complaining, check your connection, hardware etc...

Agreed. There's so many "go-along-to-get-along people" on this forum, it's sad. In one of my polls which had shown over 60% of people wouldn't buy another ZO$ game, some people were honestly saying that the game hadn't experienced any lag of any kind. I've read from threads that claimed how the drop-rates were fine, VMA was balanced and not biased to any class, etc. And how most of the people complaining were just known complainers and whiners... It's pretty bad here in the forums, man...

But, to answer OP's question — yes. I definitely think that the Dark Brotherhood DLC is their last chance to numerous players. Including myself. I am currently on a break of sorts from this game, after experiencing absolutely horrendous drop-rates and other issues, and personally feel that if ZO$ doesn't start showing that they genuinely care about their consumers? I'm going to not only drop my ESO Plus sub, but probably delete my account entirely. I'm tired of giving these people a chance, and trying to give benefit of the doubt. And I've been playing TESO since beta days. So I'm really on my whit's end with these people.

Lysette · April 2016

My reason why I do not like PvP in the way it is done in this and many other MMOs is, that it is pointless. You kill someone but he does not stay dead, he will be resurrected or is back a few minutes later. This is as exciting as rolling a barrel uphill and before you get there, it will roll down and you have to roll it up again - Sisyphus comes to mind here. They do not even loose something, they do not have to repair their stuff, and for what do they fight?- For pointless things which last minutes and has no impact on the game whatsoever. The new emperor, pointless thing, it is not even announced in the rest of the world. There is no other reason to fight than to make the life of others miserable. If I want to pvp, I go to EVE, where it has at least purpose and where is something to gain to conquer and keep it for a common purpose. In ESO this is just a pointless farce.